Retirement extension (800k) at Prachinburi Imm: new requirements

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

59 minutes ago, Pib said:

Bangkok Bank can do a Balance Forward transaction....fancy name for a forced update. 

 

When I was using a Bangkok Bank fixed account for my annual retirement extension of stay that what the bank branch would do.  Did if for a couple of years.  That would print the balance with today's date.  Then the teller proceeded to prepare the bank letter for immigration....that way both the letter and passbook reflected the same amount.

 

Pib, is there an issue with BKK Bank giving you a new account number every time you renew/extend a fixed deposit account with them?  Especially now under the new rules for retirement extensions, that there's a requirement to keep a balance in THE account yearround...

 

[tandor]

20 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

Not SCB. Kasikorn.

 

It's a 24 month deposit so will still be there next year.

 

And I really do nto want the hassle of having accounts at 2 different banks. Plus after all the hullaballoo about linking this FD account to my ordinary savings account (because that was what I had used the year before) I shudder to think what they'd make of yet another new account and a a different bank at that.

 

IO is fine with FD, in fact prefers it. They just wanted to see an update. I will try the "add 0" idea next year though not sure they can with an account that doesn't allow further deposits. If not, will call the HQ as I am sure there is some kind of statement they can issue that would satisfy Imm. Probably just a clueless bank staff member.

 

 

..seems like they're crossed up with a marriage extension..maybe a photo of you sitting on your bed holding your bank book tenderly.

[rwill]

A fixed deposit account still has to allow you to make withdrawals to be valid for immigration.  Just take a little out if you are above the amount needed.  You should just lose interest on the amount taken out.

[Sophon]

1 hour ago, Guderian said:

Presumably you could also have just given them 100 Baht and asked them to pay it into your account and that would have worked too?

No, it was a special promotion type of account that was no longer open for deposits. Even if it had been a normal FD, I don't believe Kasikorn Bank lets you add to the account, hence why Sheryl is having a problem. A FD account runs for a set period of time e.g. six months, so adding to it mid way through would constitute a new, separate Fixed deposit with different start and end date. With Bangkok Bank you can (I believe) have several fixed deposits under the same account number, but with Kasikorn Bank a new fixed deposit would be in a new book under a new account number.

 

Sophon 

[Pib]

56 minutes ago, AsiaCheese said:

There seem to be some Immigration officials who don't grasp the concept of a fixed deposit account, plus the fact that such accounts don't come with an ATM card.

 

"Fixed" means its interest rate will not change over the chosen deposit duration. A withdrawal before that time can be made, but you will forfeit all interest.

Well, it really means the account has a "fixed" duration of say 6 months, 12 months, etc...a future "maturity" date.  And some banks like Krungsri refer to them as Time Deposits.  But yea, the interest rate is usually fixed also but I have seen a few variable rate fixed accounts because the fixed part really applies to the length of time until it reaches maturity.

Edited July 10, 2019 by Pib

[Sophon]

4 minutes ago, rwill said:

A fixed deposit account still has to allow you to make withdrawals to be valid for immigration.  Just take a little out if you are above the amount needed.  You should just lose interest on the amount taken out.

I don't know the rules for all banks, but with the banks I have used you can't make partial withdrawals. 

 

Sophon

[malibukid]

thank you comrade.

[natway09]

The bank can update a fixed deposit with current date on it.

Did you assume you can't or the bank being silly ?

[ignis]

HSBC you do not even get a Book, you get statements every month, also have to ask them for the letter for Immigration 3 days before you go,  every year the Extension get harder they want a copy of the ATM card, NO do not have one, It is a Fixed Rate = NO ATM card..  They want all 12 months Statements + Copies of and signed !! 

[Pib]

41 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Pib, is there an issue with BKK Bank giving you a new account number every time you renew/extend a fixed deposit account with them?  Especially now under the new rules for retirement extensions, that there's a requirement to keep a balance in THE account yearround...

 

With Bangkok Bank (and probably most Thai banks) when you go rollover a matured traditional fixed account to another fixed/regular account they will close the old account number.  For the half dozen of so Bangkok Bank fixed accounts I had several years ago when my current fixed account matured I would immediately go in a pick a new fixed account to roll the money into (pick the best deal/highest interest being offered at the time)...old account was closed while money is also rolled over....new account number and passbook issued.  

 

Now if you do not go in when the fixed account matures the bank will automatically roll it over into a 90 day fixed account or an identical term fixed account paying XYZ (probably a lower interest rate than you had).  Which way it automatically rolls over depends on the terms of the original fixed account.

 

I learned this fine print (which really isn't fine print....just a condition I didn't read/ignored) when I rolled over my first matured fixed account with Bangkok Bank approx two months before my annual retirement extension of stay was due several years ago.  I almost crapped my pants when they handed me my new passbook with new account number and my old cancelled passbook with previous account number.   I was not expecting that.

 

The bank rep did their best to calm my nerves by sayings just show the immigration officer the old and new passbooks with different account numbers which shows the rollover occurring same day....showing I never dropped below Bt800K....all will be fine. 

 

About a month later when I applied I initially only included the new passbook in the application which did not show 3 months worth of transactions...I wanted to see if the immigration officer would even spot that...spot the passbook was less than 3 months old....and the immigration officer spotted it in about 3 milliseconds.  I then handed the officer the old, cancelled passbook with different account number and explained what had happened....that is, the same day rollover from a matured fixed account to a new fixed account. 

 

The immigration officer had no issue with that but I had to provide copies of that old cancelled passbook also just to prove there was no period I dropped below Bt800K for the 3 months before the application date.  I know it's a 2 month seasoning period now, but before it was 3 months.   This occurred at the Chaengwattana/Bangkok immigration office.

 

I continued to use fixed accounts for another extension or two but decided if any fixed account matured during the seasoning period I would just let it automatically rollover so I kept the same passbook and account number until "after" I got my next extension approved.  Then I would go pick the best deal of day to roll my money over into.  Didn't want to take any chance the next immigration officer might not accept the rollover/new account number....just wanted to play it super safe.   But fortunately the new fixed accounts I picked never had a maturity date occurring 3 months before my next extension application date.  Just take into consideration the maturity date and your next application date if wanting to play it super, super safe.

 

However, even now a person can prove the Bt800K from funds in multiple accounts in their name....does not have to be just one bank account. Of course this may drive multiple bank letters...a letter for each account especially if the accounts are at different banks.

 

[Thingamabob]

I didn't encounter any of these problems this year at CW, or in previous years at CW and, before that, Sathorn.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 minutes ago, Pib said:

 

However, even now a person can prove the Bt800K from funds in multiple accounts in their name....does not have to be just one bank account. Of course this may drive multiple bank letters...a letter for each account especially if the accounts are at different banks.

 

 

Pib, just sayin', your story above predates the new rule for retirement extension bank deposits that says the applicant must keep at least 400K balance yearround, in addition to the 800K requirement around the application time. In the past, what you did with your money in the off cycle period, didn't matter. But now it does.

 

Whether any particular Immigration Office is going to be accepting when they see one account closed out and another opened during the year period when your balance isn't supposed to drop below 400K is a question I wouldn't especially want to leave to the whims of IOs who make stuff up as they go along, office to office...

 

It strikes me as simply creating an unnecessary risk and point of potential friction, at a time of many uncertainties when I'd prefer to not to have any unnecessary exposure with Immigration.

 

 

[khunPer]

22 hours ago, Sheryl said:

How I can do this I do not know as my bank is adament that they can't update a bankbook if there have been no transactions, and does not allow additional deposits to a fixed account. Nor will they pay the interest into the account, it has to come into my other savings account (this I went through when I opened the FD account).

Sounds like you have a "promotion", and not a normal fixed account.

 

In SCB I've experienced same problem that they cannot update a bank book, when there is no transaction. The cashier would normally deposit one baht to make an update; however you cannot do that with a "promotion", I also used that kind of account a couple of times for my retirement extension.

 

You could consider a normal 12-month fixed account, and withdraw the annual interest the day after – or a few days after – the interest is deposit into the account. Bangkok Bank for example offers 1.5% p.a., and SCB 1.4%. I've used that for years without any problem with "my" immigration office, and that is considered as probably one of the most strict in the nation; with both Google map, and hand-drawn map, on separate papers; and hospital only health check within a week before application; and signatures to the forms you mentioned; proof of TM30 registration stapled in passport; and home visit by police taking photos in front of house with open passport, and visible house number; all for a number of years now for retirement extension. 

 

Almost every year a little more has been added to the list, and is something had been dropped, another surprise-item replaced it...????

[LivinLOS]

21 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Great tip Sophon, Thanks!

 

Now if any of you could PM me the instruction to do a zero credit transaction written in Thai I'll be evermore in your debt.

deposit 20b.. problem solved.. 

[Captain 776]

I just did my Retirement Renewal yesterday in Chiang Mai.

There was NONE OF WHAT YOU DESCRIBE......NONE.

I was in and out in 40 minutes which was remarkable.

 

Did you do a Retirement Visa?

Or

A Family / Marriage Visa

 

They do similar to what you describe for Family / Marriage Visa and actually physically came to the house to view for themselves the guy lived in that house.

[Captain 776]

I did Retirement and Multiple Entry in Chiang Mai yesterday.

 

This is ALL  that was required:

 

What you need to bring:
2-Copy Passport Page.
1-Copy old Retirement Visa.
1-Copy New Retirement Visa
2-Copy Arrival Card.
1-Copy TM-30.
TM-7 Form.
TM-8 Form.
2- 4cm x 6cm Pictures.
Bank Book (not copies).
Letter from Bank meeting financial req.
1900 BHAT Retirement Visa.
3800 BHAT Multiple Entry stamp.

 

NOTE:
If you need copies after arriving at Immigration, cross the street in Gas station left side.
Pretty much any Immigration Form you download from Internet is outdated and you will be handed the correct one to go fill out.
I recommend swinging by before you go and get a few each of each required Form
Get a few TM-47 also, you need that for 90 day checks.
If you print a Form from the internet and it prints 2 pages, they typically won’t accept it.  Print Page 1, put that back in printer and print Page 2 on the back of Page 1.

Hope that helps

Thanks

Edited July 10, 2019 by Captain 776

[Sheryl]

28 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

deposit 20b.. problem solved.. 

As I already explained, not possible to make any additional deposit with this type of Fixed Account.

[Sheryl]

10 minutes ago, Captain 776 said:

I just did my Retirement Renewal yesterday in Chiang Mai.

There was NONE OF WHAT YOU DESCRIBE......NONE.

I was in and out in 40 minutes which was remarkable.

 

Did you do a Retirement Visa?

Or

A Family / Marriage Visa

 

They do similar to what you describe for Family / Marriage Visa and actually physically came to the house to view for themselves the guy lived in that house.

 

A RETIREMENT visa.

 

And indeed, until this year never asked for pictures etc.

[marcusarelus]

11 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

As I already explained, not possible to make any additional deposit with this type of Fixed Account.

I updated my FD from Bangkok bank.  Just put it in the machine and it printed out.  No deposit.  

[1DegreeN]

I've done 3 extensions at Prachinburi, the last in February. The map is not a new requirement, I've had to submit one every year. I only needed photos on the first extension but I do submit a TM30 each year and a copy of the blue tabien baan (my wife is the owner) so photos may be superfluous. For funds I have a 12 month FD with Bangkok Bank and I drop into the main branch (just a couple of minutes away from immigration) to get the letter and the passbook updated before I get to immigration. Full marks to the staff at BBL, they are always very helpful.

 

But next year I'll take along a photo of me smiling gormlessly beside the gate, just in case.

[Chaspul]

My experience  with Bangkok Bank and Immigration.

 

On my last 90 day asked Hua Hin Immigration about my 2 year fixed account (orange book) maturing 1st July 1.75%. I understand that after this date it reverts to 0.5% the same as blue book savings account.

IO told me that as long as I had both the old and new fixed account books there would be no problem. 

 

Silly me went into Hua Hin 2 (next to Market Village) on the 1st and told to come back the next day.

 

The manager was manning one of the admin desks. Told him that when I was in yesterday and after many phone call was offered 2 year fixed at 1.5%.  Asked to have the past 2 years interest transferred into my blue book keeping 800,000 in fixed account.

 

To my surprise he did not open a new account all transactions appear in original book, so will be able to show money in same account.

 

He also provided forms to reclaim tax for the past 2 years as it falls below the 20,000 on interest threshold.  Haven't tried it yet seems like a lot of hassle.

 

In my experience when it comes to extension time there is never a problem updating the books with the date on the letter.

Regards Chas

 

[Captain 776]

14 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

A RETIREMENT visa.

 

And indeed, until this year never asked for pictures etc.

You need a pic for the TM-7 and 8 Forms.......absolutely, always have

[mike787]

WOW!  Thai immigration is turning up the heat slowly but painfully.  I see because the galaxy lined up for you, renewal went well.  Got to love it! Next year it will be like Russian roulette all over again.  Guessing, hoping, praying, chancing stars and moon will line up again so all goes smooth and you can continue to remain in Elysium.  Good luck! 

[connda]

50 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Whether any particular Immigration Office is going to be accepting when they see one account closed out and another opened during the year period when your balance isn't supposed to drop below 400K is a question I wouldn't especially want to leave to the whims of IOs who make stuff up as they go along, office to office...

Yeah, I can see it right now.  For those who are seeking yield as well as a fixed rate account for immigration.  The day you close one fixed rate account and roll it to another, you've essentially gone from 400k THB to 0 THB in the account you used to extend you visa.  Technically, you'd be in violation of the police order that was effective March 1, 2019. Which means your visa extension would be null and void as of the date you withdrew the funds (regardless of what you did with them, like rolling them to another fix-term account) and you're actually on over-stay.  Food for thought.  ????

You think the rules have gotten stupid this year 2019?  Just wait for the stories after March 1, 2020! Then the stories will be of the type, "I've been living in Thailand for nn years.  This year when I attempted to renew my retirement extension, I was refused because <enter vague rule that was interpreted as have been violated by your local IO>. I now have dd days to leave Thailand before being tossed into the Immigration Detention Center and deported. My only option now is to return 'home', and obtain a new retirement visa from my home country <or whatever other options are available, like an agent>."  
In this brave new Thailand, I'm expecting retirees may be getting the boot for failure to maintain 'required funding levels' for a variety of different reasons, none of which will be accepted by immigration.  The reasons will not matter.  The head honcho at Immigration will simply repeat his mantra, "We can't bend the rules."

 

Yep - after March 2020, this forum is going to be a sad, sad read, imho.  

[Pib]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Pib, just sayin', your story above predates the new rule for retirement extension bank deposits that says the applicant must keep at least 400K balance yearround, in addition to the 800K requirement around the application time. In the past, what you did with your money in the off cycle period, didn't matter. But now it does.

 

Whether any particular Immigration Office is going to be accepting when they see one account closed out and another opened during the year period when your balance isn't supposed to drop below 400K is a question I wouldn't especially want to leave to the whims of IOs who make stuff up as they go along, office to office...

 

It strikes me as simply creating an unnecessary risk and point of potential friction, at a time of many uncertainties when I'd prefer to not to have any unnecessary exposure with Immigration.

 

 

When doing the rollover "same day" as long as you rollover the amount needed for that specific period in time related to your extension, be it at least Bt800K or no less less than Bt400K, wouldn't make a difference (in a sane immigration office) as long as the old and new accounts confirm you met minimum amounts required....at no time did you violate their income rule....on no day did you violate the extension rules of having the minimum amount.   I'm sure immigration officers know that accounts are closed and new ones immediately/same day opened all the time due to things like fixed accounts rollover, moving from one bank to another, etc.  

[connda]

2 minutes ago, Pib said:

When doing the rollover "same day" as long as you rollover the amount needed for that specific period in time related to your extension, be it at least Bt800K or no less less than Bt400K, wouldn't make a difference (in a sane immigration office) as long as the old and new accounts confirm you met minimum amounts required....at no time did you violate their income rule....on no day did you violate the extension rules of having the minimum amount.   I'm sure immigration officers know that accounts are closed and new ones immediately/same day opened all the time due to things like fixed accounts rollover, moving from one bank to another, etc.  

We will see.  Personally, I'd rather not be on the bleeding edge of that particular gambit.

[ubonjoe]

22 minutes ago, Captain 776 said:

You need a pic for the TM-7 and 8 Forms.......absolutely, always have

Not pics for the forms. Pics of the house.

Go back and read #2 of the OP.

[Pib]

2 minutes ago, connda said:

Yeah, I can see it right now.  For those who are seeking yield as well as a fixed rate account for immigration.  The day you close one fixed rate account and roll it to another, you've essentially gone from 400k THB to 0 THB in the account you used to extend you visa.  Technically, you'd be in violation of the police order that was effective March 1, 2019. Which means your visa extension would be null and void as of the date you withdrew the funds (regardless of what you did with them, like rolling them to another fix-term account) and you're actually on over-stay.  Food for thought.  ????

 

No, technically you are not in violation if the funds are rolled over to a new account and then the old one closed unless the immigration officer wants to say the few milliseconds it took to transfer funds is a sin that can not be forgiven.

[Pib]

2 minutes ago, connda said:

We will see.  Personally, I'd rather not be on the bleeding edge of that particular gambit.

Like in my story....I was on that edge before....no problem.  It was probably only drama in my brain; not the immigration officers.

[Pib]

Also, nowhere in the immigration rules does it say the money has to stay in the "same" account number(s)...the rules only talk not dropping below required minimum amounts.