Am I still married?

[SenorJorge]

Hello,

 

I made the foolish mistake of getting married this year.  Which basically ruined Thailand for me.  I found out when it was far too late that my wife was playing me.  I won't get too far involved here.  Typical shenanigans for an Esan girl based somewhere near Jomtien Beach.  Four facebook profiles, two phones, money disappears, you know the score.  She had a "real job" but eh, nobody is fooling anybody anymore.  She conned me.  Found all of this out way too late.

 

Things got so out of hand that I had to leave the country.  If I go back into Thailand I worry she may cause some problems for me there.  Or perhaps friends or family of hers.  They have the resources to do who knows what.  She has no visa to enter the USA.  She's just sort of "stuck" there in the land of frowns right now. 

 

From my understanding, I have no legal avenues here to end the marriage from the USA.  It looks like I am going to have to wait the 12 months for her to file for a divorce (if she even does it?).  Many of you may be asking, why do you care?  I certainly never want to marry again.  That's the second mistake for me, and one I won't make again.  However, government agencies and private companies are aware of the fact that I am "married".  I don't think we lived together even a total of one month, and this doesn't seem right, or fair.  How can I check to see if I am still married over in Thailand?  Will I have to hire a law firm to do this?  We don't talk.  We hate each other now.  Communication is futile.

 

Another weird thing.  She is posing on all of her social media as if we are still together.  Is this another con she is pulling?  What is this about?  Saving face?  I'm really concerned.  She tells me she hates me, yet does this.

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

[Tagged]

You sound delusional!

 

 

[SenorJorge]

Just now, Tagged said:

You sound delusional!

 

 

Inform me, what am I deluded about?  If you're going to offer criticism, which I am not sure I need right now, I have been beaten up enough about this, at least make the criticism constructive.  Thanks.

[Tagged]

3 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

Inform me, what am I deluded about?  If you're going to offer criticism, which I am not sure I need right now, I have been beaten up enough about this, at least make the criticism constructive.  Thanks.

It is all about growing up, take your responsibillity, and cry on out TV. You expect we are going to pet your back? 

 

Learn from your mistakes and move on. You are still alive right? Still got a life to live, and a future to do better than before.

[SenorJorge]

1 minute ago, Tagged said:

It is all about growing up, take your responsibillity, and cry on out TV. You expect we are going to pet your back? 

 

Learn from your mistakes and move on. You are still alive right? Still got a life to live, and a future to do better than before.

I came here asking for answers to specific regulatory and legal questions.  I know many aren't lawyers, but you have experience with this kind of thing.

[Tagged]

1 minute ago, SenorJorge said:

I came here asking for answers to specific regulatory and legal questions.  I know many aren't lawyers, but you have experience with this kind of thing.

Where is your marriage papers? If you married her, your are still married if you have not been back to a ampur and annulated the marriage. It takes both of you to sign and each one ned two witnesses to sign the oapers ro. You will also need to bring the original papers, if not you need to go back to the same ampur you married. 

[Small Joke]

I am reasonably certain, you can initiate a divorce in your citizenship country, regardless of where you got married.

I can't speak to the US family court system, but in Australia, you can do it all yourself, online, so long as both parties agree to the divorce (asset divisions, if any, are handled separately, later).

You'll need your marriage certificate or certified copy. Proof of your Citizenship, and affidavit proof your wife as been served the divorce papers, she dosnt need to consent, just you need proof of service.

 

This is generic advice, the family court website in your country/state can give you more guidance YMMV and being Thailand, who knows what crap you'll be dealing with legally at this end, try to minimize her involvement in the proceedings.

 

Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated. 

 

Don't start any proceedings from within Thailand! Go home and sort it out.

[SenorJorge]

2 minutes ago, Small Joke said:

Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated. 

 

This is the exact kind of nightmare I am trying to avoid.  She and her family have never been on the "up and up" with me.  She's heisted thousands from me since the outset of our relationship.  They aren't getting ANY MORE money from me - the whole marriage was a sham from the start.  I know, my fault for getting involved.  I was outsmarted.  But this is precisely why I won't go back to Thailand.

 

Unfortunately, in order for me to divorce her from my state in America, she needs to have been at least a previous 6-month resident of the state.  She's never been here before.  Never set foot in America.  So I'd be perjuring myself if I tried to divorce her by publication, which is the only way to divorce with one spouse in absentia, or even if both spouses sign.

 

I don't really feel any strong desire to live in Thailand again.  I just want my name cleared from this horrendous marriage.  Thank you

[KhaoYai]

21 minutes ago, Tagged said:

It is all about growing up, take your responsibillity, and cry on out TV. You expect we are going to pet your back? 

 

Learn from your mistakes and move on. You are still alive right? Still got a life to live, and a future to do better than before.

The man is fully aware of the mistakes he made - he didn't ask for any 'petting' - he explained his position and asked specific questions. Is there any need to be nasty?  If you've heard it all before a thousand times and are tired of it - just don't read or reply.

[Small Joke]

15 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

 

This is the exact kind of nightmare I am trying to avoid.  She and her family have never been on the "up and up" with me.  She's heisted thousands from me since the outset of our relationship.  They aren't getting ANY MORE money from me - the whole marriage was a sham from the start.  I know, my fault for getting involved.  I was outsmarted.  But this is precisely why I won't go back to Thailand.

 

Unfortunately, in order for me to divorce her from my state in America, she needs to have been at least a previous 6-month resident of the state.  She's never been here before.  Never set foot in America.  So I'd be perjuring myself if I tried to divorce her by publication, which is the only way to divorce with one spouse in absentia, or even if both spouses sign.

 

I don't really feel any strong desire to live in Thailand again.  I just want my name cleared from this horrendous marriage.  Thank you

Can't you divorce her in another state? Federal family court?

Better call Saul.

Good luck!

[KhaoYai]

SenorJorge,

 

Calm down a little, you have very little to worry about as far as I can see. I understand that you want to be divorced but there isn't any rush.  What kind of problems do you anticipate?  Did you buy anything of significance like a house or a car AFTER you were married? That is possibly the only form of problem you could face but even then I doubt it - the marriage wasn't long enough.

 

Stop reading her social media, block her on yours and cut all ties - put it down to experience. If you don't do that, you are simply stoking whatever fires are burning. It will all calm down soon when she finds another victim.

 

If you want to return to Thailand there should be no problems unless there is something you haven't disclosed.  The Thai authorities are not interested in people's personal squabbles. Obviously, if you want a peaceful life, don't go anywhere near where she might be. There are many other places to visit rather than Pattaya and Jomtien - if there are personal problems between you and you do visit those places - well you will be asking for problems and you'll have to take the consequences. Otherwise, how would she know you're in the country?

 

As for the divorce itself - I can't advise you on that as my divorce was done by agreement and took 20 minutes - doesn't sound as if you're going to be so lucky and contact with your wife will probably be counter-productive.  I'm not even sure that a divorce in the US would be recognised in Thailand - I'm sure I read somewhere that you will have to divorce in Thailand.  If that is true and no-one else can advise you, visit an Amphur on your next trip and ask them how to go about a divorce without contact with your wife - I'm sure its possible but I think a certain amount of time has to pass first.

[KhaoYai]

27 minutes ago, Small Joke said:

Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated. 

What legal entanglements do you envisage? He's been married a matter of months, there are no kids and he owes her nothing. Unless he has failed to disclose something there are no legal avenues his wife cant take.

 

To my mind this is being blown out of proportion - its simple.  The main thing he needs to do is cut all ties - let things calm down.  His wife will already be looking for her next victim.

[KhaoYai]

One thing I forgot - you will probably ignore my advice to cut all contact but don't get drawn into a divorce for cash.  If you do that the price will go up the moment you enter the country and again when you arrive at the Amphur. As far as I can see, you owe her nothing and she has no claims on you. There is no need to rush - you maye have to wait anyway (for a no contact divorce) - just get on with your life.

[Tagged]

29 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

The man is fully aware of the mistakes he made - he didn't ask for any 'petting' - he explained his position and asked specific questions. Is there any need to be nasty?  If you've heard it all before a thousand times and are tired of it - just don't read or reply.

Message taken and understood. 

 

If she is a con lady, he can just wait her out, and with for her move.  Im sure she will be in hurry to end the marriage, to continue to con others, and therefor want the marriage to be annulated as soon she meet a new one. 

 

So he just have to relax, and wait. Breathe and wait. 

[KhaoYai]

10 minutes ago, Tagged said:

 

So he just have to relax, and wait. Breathe and wait. 

Correct, I don't understand the rush.

 

I also hadn't thought about her wanting to marry again so she can trap her next victim - all the more reason to sit back and wait.

 

OP, contact her, tell her your deleting all social media etc. as far as you're concerned the marriage is over and that you've left one line of contact open (open a new email account for her only and block her on your existing accounts) - tell her when she's ready for a divorce to let you know.  However, I wouldn't be in any rush to get divorced right now - let things calm down a bit.

[RichardColeman]

1 hour ago, SenorJorge said:

Another weird thing.  She is posing on all of her social media as if we are still together.  Is this another con she is pulling?  What is this about?  Saving face?  I'm really concerned.  She tells me she hates me, yet does this.

Of course, but I doubt she is doing it on every different social media profile !

[SenorJorge]

 

29 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

One thing I forgot - you will probably ignore my advice to cut all contact but don't get drawn into a divorce for cash.  If you do that the price will go up the moment you enter the country and again when you arrive at the Amphur. As far as I can see, you owe her nothing and she has no claims on you. There is no need to rush - you maye have to wait anyway (for a no contact divorce) - just get on with your life.

She absolutely could not be trusted for a in-person meeting at any amphur.  She would definitely pull some games for more money. Right after I arrived in Bangkok to get married I caught her on her phone looking at used jewelry stores to pawn off the jewelry I gave her (which she did eventualy).  She's out to make any fast cash she can.

 

I told her to email me once she has a divorce.  I deleted my facebook, skype, and line accounts.  The only thing left open as of today is the email.  There's no real rush to divorce.  I just hate being known by my government and companies I'm involved with as a "married" man when I lived with a Thai girl for a few weeks who took all my money.

 

Hopefully she gets a farang drunk in Pattaya and takes him to get a freedom to marry affidavit soon.

[Tim K]

If the spouses were not married in Thailand and/or they do not consent to a divorce or cannot reach an agreement on all the issues surrounding a divorce,

then the only alternative would be a court divorce. 

However, jurisdiction for a court divorce has several conditions.  First, at least one of the spouses must have a lawful residence in Thailand. 

Secondly, there must be lawful grounds for the divorce.  A “grounds for divorce in Thailand”, means a reason for the divorce that is allowed by Thailand law.

Grounds for Divorce in Thailand

Grounds for Divorce are normally required in court ordered divorce.  The basic grounds for divorce in Thailand include the following:

1. One spouse has committed adultery, had regular intercourse with another person, or honored another person as a husband or wife.
2. One spouse is guilty of misconduct (including criminal offenses and causing physical or psychological harm).
3. One spouse has caused serious harm to the body or mind of the other, or has seriously insulted them or their parents.
4. One spouse has deserted the other for more than one year.
5. One spouse has failed to provide proper maintenance or support.
6. One spouse has had incurable insanity for three years continuously.
7. One spouse has left the marital home for more than three years.
8. One spouse has broken a bond of good behavior.
9. One spouse is suffering from a dangerous communicable disease which may cause injury to the other.
10. One spouse has a physical disability, causing them to be permanently unable to cohabit as husband and wife.

I have a similar problem, but my wife is just super jealous and has episodes of being crazy and angry. Still loves me but I had to return back home to recover mentally. 

When asked for divorce she says no! you have other lady!, sure sure. I'll keep you until I die.

My country doesn't know that I'm married, I will have to translate thai certificate and validate in Thai embassy and so on for Russia to acknowledge it, but of course I'll never do it. Better wait 3 years or show tons of screenshots from chat-apps with angry jealous messages from her. She also tried to fight with policemen at the police station. Chief of police has never laughed so hard. I think they'll give me a statement or something. They are on my side and said sorry man, but until you married we can't do anything.

I just had a thought that I have a new passport now, and its number is not same as written in the marriage certificate.

Does it mean I'm not married anymore?

 

When passport expires how do happily married folks prove to immigration that they're still married (trying to get extension for example)?.

[Tim K]

From another thai law firm website
 

Can spouses living outside of Thailand file for a divorce in Thai Court?

If the divorce is administrative, both parties will still need to appear at the District office to register the divorce. A contested divorce however requires a judgment from the Court. If you are now living abroad, the Thai Court may, potentially, still have jurisdiction over a divorce action under some circumstances. Therefore an attorney may still be able to file a divorce complaint on your behalf although you may not currently be located in Thailand. However, normally a plaintiff (the spouse who files the divorce complaint) must appear in person at least one time during the court process to provide testimony that establishes the grounds for the divorce.  A divorce attorney can normally assist with reserving a convenient date with the court.

[Seth1a2a]

Marriage and divorce
Topics relating to marriage and divorce in Thailand.

 

Seems like you are posting in the correct forum but someone confused it with a new forum called "kick me please".

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Here are the basics (see the full list below) . You do have some light at the end of the time tunnel if you can wait it out. Easiest is to just stay completely out of touch with her. After 1 year and she can file (without your permission) or after 3 years you can file (without her permission). Change your phone number(s), internet addresses,  Home address ( get a P.O. box) or any legal way she can prove contact and just sit it out.

Example : Since you have no plans to remarry and she might run into another "Hansum Man" who wants to, she can file after one year. 

 

"#4) One spouse has deserted the other for more than one year, the latter may enter a claim for divorce;

#4.2) the husband and wife voluntarily live separately because of being unable to cohabit peacefully for more than three years, or live separately for more than three years by the order of the Court, either spouse may enter a claim for divorce;"

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Section 1516, Title I of the Civil and Commercial Code of Thailand provides that “Grounds for divorce”

1. The husband has given maintenance to or honored such other woman as his wife, or the wife has committed adultery, the other spouse may enter a claim for divorce;
2. One spouse is guilty of misconduct, notwithstanding whether such misconduct is a criminal offense or not, if it causes the other:
   1. to be seriously ashamed;
   2. to be insulted of hated or account of continuance of being husband or wife of the spouse having committed the misconduct; or
   3. to sustain excessive injury or trouble where the condition, position and cohabitation as husband and wife are taken into consideration; the latter may enter a claim for divorce;
3. One spouse has caused serious harm or torture to the body or mind of the other, or has seriously insulted the other or his or her ascendants, the latter may enter a claim for divorce;
4. One spouse has deserted the other for more than one year, the latter may enter a claim for divorce;
   1. one spouse had been sentenced by a final judgment of the Court and has been imprisoned for more than one year in the offense committed without any participation, consent or in the knowledge of the other, and the cohabitation as husband and wife will cause the other party sustain excessive injury or trouble, the latter may enter a claim for divorce;
   2. the husband and wife voluntarily live separately because of being unable to cohabit peacefully for more than three years, or live separately for more than three years by the order of the Court, either spouse may enter a claim for divorce;

       

5. One spouse has been adjudged to have disappeared, or as left his or her domicile or residence for more than three years and being uncertain whether he or she is living or dead;
6. One spouse has failed to give proper maintenance and support to the other, or committed acts seriously adverse to the relationship of husband and wife to such an extent that the other has been in excessive trouble where the condition, position and cohabitation as husband and wife are taking into consideration, the latter may enter a claim for divorce;
7. One spouse has been an insane person for more than three years continuously and such insanity is hardly curable so that the continuance of marriage cannot be expected, the other may enter a claim for divorce;
8. One spouse has broken a bond of good behavior executed by him or her, the other spouse may enter a claim for divorce;
9. One spouse is suffering from a communicable and dangerous disease which is incurable and may cause injury to the other, the latter may file a claim for divorce;
10. One spouse has a physical disadvantage so as to be permanently unable to cohabit as husband and wife, the other may enter a claim for divorce.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Puchaiyank]

Become invisible to her...disappear into your own private world and block her out...do not communicate with her on any level..

 

Get on with your life...if you plan to never marry again do not concern yourself with her <deleted>-up world...good luck!  ????

[Seth1a2a]

And if you speak Spanish as your screen name suggests  = SenorJorge

You can have yourself one hell of a good time with shorter and cheaper flights by heading to Central and South America in the meantime.. 

 

 

 

[SenorJorge]

7 minutes ago, Seth1a2a said:

And if you speak Spanish as your screen name suggests  = SenorJorge

You can have yourself one hell of a good time with shorter and cheaper flights by heading to Central and South America in the meantime.. 

 

 

 

Exactamente.  I'm laid up in the hospital until probably December.  As soon as I get out of here, though, the world is an open book to me.  My new passport has a lot of empty pages that are just begging to be used.

[HampiK]

One question to SenorJorge? Why you want hurry to divorce?

If your story is really that bad (I guess you still was lucky as there are many other foreigners who lost millions of baht not only a few thousands). And if you not hurry with divorce you maybe will hear from hear, because she will be in hurry to divorce.

 

Now my last statement, often there are 2 sides of the story. 

[wgdanson]

6 hours ago, SenorJorge said:

I just hate being known by my government and companies I'm involved with as a "married" man when I lived with a Thai girl for a few weeks who took all my money.

 

How would they have known that unless YOU had told them?

[SenorJorge]

1 hour ago, HampiK said:

One question to SenorJorge? Why you want hurry to divorce?

If your story is really that bad (I guess you still was lucky as there are many other foreigners who lost millions of baht not only a few thousands). And if you not hurry with divorce you maybe will hear from hear, because she will be in hurry to divorce.

 

Now my last statement, often there are 2 sides of the story. 

There are legal implications for me being married here.  It effects me greatly.  I do not like to be impacted by what I view as a fraudulent marriage.  I view the marriage as bogus from the outset.

[SenorJorge]

1 hour ago, wgdanson said:

How would they have known that unless YOU had told them?

Irrespective of how my government knows, they do.  When I got married I had no idea things were going to go so badly.  Few people in my situation do.

 

Again, Im not trying to lay any blame on anyone.  I've been in thailand long enough to know not to marry girls who speak good English for no good reason around Jomtien beach.  

 

I'm senile and foolish and I did it anyway.  Now I'm paying for that.  I have no idea what she's capable of legally married to me.  I locked my credit after I left, but I'm sure that's hardly enough.  

[SenorJorge]

Also it's worth saying that she tried to rope me back into supporting her after I left.  After she had already sold all my engagement jewelry.  One of the items was worth over one hundred thousand baht.  She managed to fly home from bangkok to esan.  She was obviously out of money just one month later because she took the bus from udon back to chon buri.  Where did the money go to?  Hmmm.  She did manage to stop at the salon that costs about 1000 baht to have her hair and nails done on the way back.  Thai girls.  Never cease to amaze me.  This will be the last one of them for me.  She really fits the bill for the typical pattaya marriage schemer.  I'm just a total dumbass for falling for it.  Anyway, I think the best advice has already been given.  Wait it out.  Im laid up in a hospital here through at least December anyway.  When I am well enough to go back oconus I am going to give India a try.  I don't think I should involve myself with thailand or Thai affairs again after this.  It's time to move on.

[NCC1701A]

9 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

One of the items was worth over one hundred thousand baht.

wow.

9 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

Where did the money go to?

into buying land. like it all does.

 

9 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

She did manage to stop at the salon that costs about 1000 baht to have her hair and nails done on the way back.

can i have her Facebook please?

 

 

9 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

Im laid up in a hospital here through at least December anyway. 

what happened?

 

relax, i got divorced in California. this shit is nothing compared to that.

it sounds like you are still in love with her and being betrayed can be difficult. 

you need to let some time go by. don't tell anyone you are married. just go about your business. 

if you get back to Thailand you will be bullet proof now.

 

 

[NCC1701A]

11 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

Thai girls.  Never cease to amaze me. 

me too. amazing how many men from the west who can play chess can't win at checkers here.