Thinking about making the move!

[pt1001]

1 minute ago, NCC1701A said:

Op, tell us about Spain. Must be great there. You must have some really great wine.

And Mediterranean food and weather. 

Are the streets clean? How is the driving, safe? Clean air? 

 

Spain is brilliant. Has it's ups and downs. Weather and food and people are all amazing hot and dry summers (down south) and mild winters. Driving can be a bit mad at times, although not nearly as chaotic as thailand having said that i have had 0 close calls in thailand on motorbike and i lost count how many times i have almost been killed on my bike in Spain haha. Air quality is brilliant my only gripe in spain is getting stuff done..the red tape and bureaucracy here are still in the dark ages. You need a 1000 copies of everything they all need to be folded and certain way and stapled ahahah and dont expect to get things done on times, very relaxed here everything is always manana manana (tomorrow tomorrow) kind of similar to thai in a way but each country has its perks and the females....words cant describe

[Leaver]

On 7/18/2019 at 2:10 AM, NCC1701A said:

a lot of people will be along in a few minutes to tell you not to come. "Its so over. you are too late. they hate us. impossible. you will be killed."

 

 

Or offer a better alternative.  ????

[mike787]

14 hours ago, Neeranam said:

To the OP, I came here in my 20's,  25 years ago, before bitter pensioners discovered thailustlives.com to marry an ex cashier from the pink pussy bar, joined internet forums complaining about everything from their lumbago to medical insurance they don't even need for their visa.

Vietnam is crap compared to Thailand.

 

Just come, it's great, as you know, and there have always been hoops to jump through, which is very easy when you don't have your piles, or house you've been forced to buy to worry about.

Neeranam is right, listen to him he has the answers, just come over.  Quick!  Vietnam is terrible.

[mlmcleod]

I suggest that you try to get accommodations as close to an immigration office as possible since you will be visiting there frequently as an ex-pat.  The easiest way to get a retirement visa is to put 800,000 in a Thai bank and forget about it forever.  Right now there is no prohibition on online work however please keep tuned since the immigration rules change here frequently and not necessarily logically. 

 

I am curious?  Why not Portugal or Spain for retirement?  They are both top 10 places for retirement.

[ThomasThBKK]

13 minutes ago, mlmcleod said:

I suggest that you try to get accommodations as close to an immigration office as possible since you will be visiting there frequently as an ex-pat.  The easiest way to get a retirement visa is to put 800,000 in a Thai bank and forget about it forever.  Right now there is no prohibition on online work however please keep tuned since the immigration rules change here frequently and not necessarily logically. 

 

I am curious?  Why not Portugal or Spain for retirement?  They are both top 10 places for retirement.

He's not retiring, he's 29 or so....

[Martyp]

15 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

He's not retiring, he's 29 or so....

And he is already living in Spain . . .

[Dnyy]

I am around the same age as you and living here as a digital nomad but I would not recommend to relocate to Thailand especially with visa issues. Most likely you will also not be in much contact with Thais anyway and only get in touch with the farang community as they seem to be much more relaxed than these stiff Thais in most co-working spaces. 

[Jingthing]

6 minutes ago, Dnyy said:

I am around the same age as you and living here as a digital nomad but I would not recommend to relocate to Thailand especially with visa issues. Most likely you will also not be in much contact with Thais anyway and only get in touch with the farang community as they seem to be much more relaxed than these stiff Thais in most co-working spaces. 

You're the kind of person he needs to hear from. It's obvious to me he's asking for big headaches or worse moving here with his intentions, I do understand why he doesn't think retirement age people have anything of value to say to him. But he's wrong. We do and so do you. Why not go to a place that will TREAT HIM BETTER and not put him through a Kafkaesque immigration game that very likely may end at a detention center trying to enter Thailand on a so called visa run. 

What may have been easy peasy years ago is not now. Things change. 

Edited July 19, 2019 by Jingthing

[pt1001]

3 hours ago, Dnyy said:

I am around the same age as you and living here as a digital nomad but I would not recommend to relocate to Thailand especially with visa issues. Most likely you will also not be in much contact with Thais anyway and only get in touch with the farang community as they seem to be much more relaxed than these stiff Thais in most co-working spaces. 

hi mate i have messaged you

[Nakmuay887]

If you want good advice make sure you lay things out clearly and in a cohesive way on here and try and use the search function before asking questions that may have be answered ten x over by the folks here. 

 

I was asking a similar question a few weeks back and got tons of great information 

[Nakmuay887]

Here's my original thread and it's got a ton of responses that cover most everything you are asking 

 

 

[orchidfan]

On 7/17/2019 at 10:57 PM, DrJack54 said:

At 29 there are only 2 options if you really want move here and stay here.

One is elite visa that is not cheap for young fella. 500k baht for 5 yrs.

If your coming here for love then that's your business. I would not.

If for love if Asia then choose other country. My choose if I young would be Vietnam. 

You can live there ongoing.

Please elaborate on living in Vietnam "ongoing". I'm curious because on my recent trips there and talking with local business people, it seems far from easy to live there unless sponsored by a business.

Maybe there's something I'm missing ?

[orchidfan]

On 7/18/2019 at 5:15 PM, nickmondo said:

without a job there, no bloody chance

Correct. Exactly what I said earlier.

Vietnam is NOT easy to move to as a long term tourist

[cerox]

I am looking at Vietnam too. I would be interested why Vietnam is difficult for the long-term tourist?

I see they have 1y easy "business" visa which I could get online (visa on arrival confirmation letter) and then repeat. Also very cheap.

Are there any restrictions that I do not know about?

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, orchidfan said:

Please elaborate on living in Vietnam "ongoing". I'm curious because on my recent trips there and talking with local business people, it seems far from easy to live there unless sponsored by a business.

Maybe there's something I'm missing ?

You can get a business visa. Agents will arrange letter on your behalf. Bit like agents doing extensions in Thailand. My post was directed to OP, who is digital nomad and does not need wp here or in Vietnam.

As for tourist visas. For those looking to stay ongoing, can obtain 3 month multiple entry. These require no money in bank etc. You obtain "invitation letter" online. Then visa on arrival at airport. Cost all up ~70usd. I personally obtain 4 per year. 

USA pp holders can obtain 12 month muti. 

 

Edited July 20, 2019 by DrJack54

[DrJack54]

37 minutes ago, cerox said:

I am looking at Vietnam too. I would be interested why Vietnam is difficult for the long-term tourist?

I see they have 1y easy "business" visa which I could get online (visa on arrival confirmation letter) and then repeat. Also very cheap.

Are there any restrictions that I do not know about?

If you intend to work, meaning work that would require work permit then business visa would be best. Many (op for eg) would not need business visa. The cost per year using 3month multi tourist visa X4

would be about 280usd.

Business visa prob about same. I have never obtained business visa but friends have. 

Edited July 20, 2019 by DrJack54

[ThomasThBKK]

25 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

You can get a business visa. Agents will arrange letter on your behalf. Bit like agents doing extensions in Thailand. My post was directed to OP, who is digital nomad and does not need wp here or in Vietnam.

As for tourist visas. For those looking to stay ongoing, can obtain 3 month multiple entry. These require no money in bank etc. You obtain "invitation letter" online. Then visa on arrival at airport. Cost all up ~70usd. I personally obtain 4 per year. 

USA pp holders can obtain 12 month muti. 

 

 

Sure but basing your future life on "agent payments" is dangerous and when people here warn about the Visa mess in Thailand, mentioning Vietnam as beeing better is hilarious in my view.

At least here there ARE fitting visas available and that for a long time already and they are unlikely to go away.

Vietnam can change tomorrow, it's after all a communist country far less open than Thailand to foreigners.

 

Not to mention that Vietnam has taxation on all worldwide income streams which is another big problem many people here seem to overlook because it's cheaper there, it's for sure not cheaper if you life there legally and pay taxes.

 

https://home.kpmg/xx/en/home/insights/2011/12/vietnam-income-tax.html

 

Quote

Communication between immigration and taxation authorities

 

Do the immigration authorities in Vietnam provide information to the local taxation authorities regarding when a person enters or leaves Vietnam? 

The current practice is that there is no proactive communication between the tax authorities and the immigration authorities in relation to the tax status of someone in Vietnam.

However, the tax authorities will work with the Immigration Department to check the number of residing days in Vietnam of individuals for purposes of assessing a tax exemption under the double tax treaty and can request the Immigration Department to confirm/provide the details of entry/exit dates of a person, if necessary.

Moreover, individuals wishing to leave the country but who have an outstanding tax debt, have been known to have been denied leaving the country by the Immigration Department until they settle their tax liability.

 

Is salary earned from working abroad taxed in Vietnam? If so, how?

Residents in Vietnam have to pay tax on their worldwide income at progressive tax rates. Therefore, salary earned from working abroad is taxable in Vietnam.

Non-residents in Vietnam have to pay tax on their Vietnam-sourced income only, at the flat rate of 20 percent. Salary earned from working abroad is not taxed in Vietnam.

 

Are investment income and capital gains taxed in Vietnam? If so, how?

Income from capital investments and capital assignment are treated as non-employment income and taxed under the personal income tax regime from 1 January 2009 at the tax rates indicated above.

 

Stuff like this make sure i stay faaaar away from Vietnam.

 

[cerox]

Thank you guys.

For me Vietnam is a good alternative to Thailand. Immigration wise (I use ED visa in TH) it is so easy:

- no yearly embassy visits / trips and much cheaper

- no tm30, no reporting, no reentry permits needed

- no 90 day extensions, no risk of being denied at certain airports

 

You are right that they could change everything overnight too. So for Vietnam my approach would be the same as Thailand; do not invest much money, do not buy a car etc. Keep life simple and assets in your home country.

 

The taxation I would not worry much as a foreigner / tourist. I highly doubt they care, and proving it would be even more difficult if you do online work in another country. Just transfer money step by step for monthly expenses as in Thailand seems to be safe.

 

Any other experiences, please share - I am no expert on Vietnam at all.

[JackThompson]

On 7/17/2019 at 11:12 PM, pt1001 said:

ahah never a truer word said! i have had nothing but amazing and warm hospitality in Thai. Hence the reason i choose to move there!

There are "Thai People," who are great for the most part, and there is "Immigration," which varies wildly from one office or entry-point to the next - with some clearly hating our guts, unless in a stay-scheme which has a high probability of involving a payoff to immigration to avoid "problems" getting the extension. 

 

Starting with a METV is a good plan, if you can meet the qualifiations and apply in your passport or "legal residence" country.  After that, you will need to get Tourist Visas from neighboring countries or another METV or SETV from your passport-country every 3 months (60-days on entry + 30-day extension). 

 

After you have been here 90+ days, avoid all the bad entry-points where they enforce non-existent rules on how much time you can spend here.  So, forget flying in to any airport except maybe Chaing Mai (and there, only with a Tourist Visa), and don't enter at the Poipet entry point under ANY conditions. 

 

If entering from Malaysia by land, you may need to show everything you showed to get your Tourist Visa, but have the 20K worth of Baht in cash or travelers checks, instead of a bank-statement.  This policy may be spreading to other land entry-points.  I carry almost that much in travelers checks (refundable if lost or stolen) on every trip, so those plus my cash is always well over 20K Baht.

 

Anything can change at any time w/o notice, so always be prepared to have your stuff in Thailand sent to you by a friend here on every trip out.  Always be prepared to move your primary-location to Vietnam or another country (Cambodia, Philippines, or most in Latin America) whose immigration is happy to have you spend your foreign-sourced money there. 

 

On 7/18/2019 at 1:09 AM, pt1001 said:

i just see it as being a bit suspect have multiple visas more or less sequential to each other in ones passport...

Immigration have your full history when they scan your passport.  At entry points that follow the law as written, there is no issue with, "Was here a lot before," because there is No Rule allowing them to deny entry For That Reason.  At the bad entry-points, they don't care what the law says, and will lie and claim they know you cannot support yourself after entering, even if your track-record proves you can.

 

You can get a new passport from your embassy to clear out old Visas, which will allow you to apply for more at nearby Thai consulates - For Now (could change in the future).

 

METV would be a good way to start, then get an ED Visa - but be aware that to extend the ED every 3 months will likely involve a 3K to 5K payoff to immigration, whether you attend classes or not.  If in Chaing Mai, there is a "self defense" school run by ex-Army guys, who get their way with immigration.

 

Re:

On 7/19/2019 at 12:45 PM, Jingthing said:

... very likely may end at a detention center trying to enter Thailand on a so called visa run.

Only if he tries to fly in after the first stretch of time here, which is a newbie mistake.  Even if he was denied entry by land (unlikely if keeping tabs on things), can just walk back and cancel your exit stamp from the other country.

 

 

Edited July 20, 2019 by JackThompson

[JackThompson]

On 7/18/2019 at 6:59 AM, LivinLOS said:

Not true if you work under the umbrella of a BOI registered tech company. 

 

Has a cost of course, as does being legal and paying tax anywhere. 

Iglu offers this, but the cost is around 260K Baht/yr - many times more than the income-taxes on the income you have to pass through the company actually cost. 

Even the Elite is less of a raw-deal, unless going for citizenship or PR. 

[DrJack54]

13 minutes ago, cerox said:

Thank you guys.

For me Vietnam is a good alternative to Thailand. Immigration wise (I use ED visa in TH) it is so easy:

- no yearly embassy visits / trips and much cheaper

- no tm30, no reporting, no reentry permits needed

- no 90 day extensions, no risk of being denied at certain airports

 

You are right that they could change everything overnight too. So for Vietnam my approach would be the same as Thailand; do not invest much money, do not buy a car etc. Keep life simple and assets in your home country.

 

The taxation I would not worry much as a foreigner / tourist. I highly doubt they care, and proving it would be even more difficult if you do online work in another country. Just transfer money step by step for monthly expenses as in Thailand seems to be safe.

 

Any other experiences, please share - I am no expert on Vietnam at all.

In your situation I would just use 3 month tourist visas for Vietnam. Another advantage is that you can take breaks to other Asian countries. 

As far as Vietnam goes, Saigon is my favourite as its quick and cheap flight from bkk. 

This opinion is also aimed at the OP. Sounds like he is single and could travel around easily. For the op spending time out of los for a period of time few months... Will help manage living in los on tourist visas.

[ThomasThBKK]

37 minutes ago, cerox said:

Thank you guys.

For me Vietnam is a good alternative to Thailand. Immigration wise (I use ED visa in TH) it is so easy:

- no yearly embassy visits / trips and much cheaper

- no tm30, no reporting, no reentry permits needed

- no 90 day extensions, no risk of being denied at certain airports

 

You are right that they could change everything overnight too. So for Vietnam my approach would be the same as Thailand; do not invest much money, do not buy a car etc. Keep life simple and assets in your home country.

 

The taxation I would not worry much as a foreigner / tourist. I highly doubt they care, and proving it would be even more difficult if you do online work in another country. Just transfer money step by step for monthly expenses as in Thailand seems to be safe.

 

Any other experiences, please share - I am no expert on Vietnam at all.

Not true, they have a tm30 system, it's just called differently: 

http://documents.worldbank.org/curated/en/158711468188364218/Vietnam-s-household-registration-system

 

If you would have read the vietnamese expat forums they have the EXACT same issue we have here: https://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=283684

 

Quote

I am newly arrived in Vietnam and I have just signed a lease for an apartment in Phu My Hung. People tell me I'm a bit of a worry-wart, and they say in Vietnam you don't need to worry, things can always be worked out, albeit sometimes expensively. I still worry.

After signing and handing over the deposit, I asked about registering with the police, the landlord said he didn't want to do that. If he did that, I would need to pay more money (invoice fees, or something).

From what I understand, these are the facts
(registration)
1. Anyone staying at a property must be registered with the local police (Cong An?)
2. This is the landlord's responsibility
3. If the police check, it is the landlord that is fined
(tax/invoice fees)
4. The tax/invoice fees are 10%
5. The landlord is legally allowed to retrieve these fees from the tenants
(temporary residence card)
6. I will need to modify my temporary residence card to change to my new address

 

 

----

 

1. Anyone staying at a property must be registered with the local police (Cong An?)

Yes, it is absolutely obligatory !

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

2. This is the landlord's responsibility

Correct. The Owner must ask your visa and go to the police to declare you live i his house.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. If the police check, it is the landlord that is fined(tax/invoice fees)

Yes, but with police, we dont know exactly,if the smell money,because they see you are alone, dont know a lot,mayby they will ask you some meony to help you.

 

Doesn't this EXACTLY sound like a ThaiVisa thread? 

 

Then you have all the Internet issues there like content restrictions: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-facebook-security-vietnam/facebook-increased-vietnam-content-restrictions-by-500-during-2018-report-idUSKCN1SU0YU

 

There are reports of people who cannot leave the country anymore because of TAXES, and you guys tell him taxes are no problem?? Did you ever hear this in Thailand?? I didn't.

https://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=642940

Quote

I have a no-exit on my passport due to an ex employer not paying the personal income tax they deducted from my pay in Vietnam.
It appears to be a very convoluted and difficult process. i understand the tax department wants its money, but this was a company responsibility not my responsibility as there was no method by which we could pay the tax.
This has the potential to impact over 60 ex employees of this company.
The first person has been denied access.
Our previous employer is not providing sufficient confidence that this is being dealt with so I need to get some advice or assistance with this and would appreciate any advice from someone that has experienced this before.

 

 

So you guys think this is a good place for a Digital Nomad? I don't really. Let's keep it real guys...Vietnam isn't the place to be.

 

Edited July 20, 2019 by ThomasThBKK

[cerox]

Thanks for sharing. As I said, I am looking at Vietnam, meaning that I am no expert, so thanks for your help.

 

So Vietnam could still be a good options for in-between stays for below 6 months of the year? As a tourist staying in hotels all that notification stuff would not apply. 2-3 months tourist stays sound about good.

 

Your link mentions an ex employee (working in Vietnam) who could not exit the country. We are talking about people who do not work - how can you know whether or not someone works for other countries from their room.

[DrJack54]

I think Vietnam is excellent choice for DN. As per Thailand keep low profile. 

The "newish" problem for those under 50 living in Thailand is the increasing change of attitude towards too many tourist visas etc.

As I stated earlier....I have so many 3 month multiple continuous tv for Vietnam in my pp its not funny. The deal breaker for the younger crew wanting to remain in los is that apart from elite visa there is nothing much else. You can squeeze out a yr maybe using various tourist visas. Even then entering at bkk airports is off or problematic. 

Edited July 20, 2019 by DrJack54

[BertM]

On ‎7‎/‎17‎/‎2019 at 11:42 PM, pt1001 said:

Well thats the plan really i dont have intentions of telling people i work i just want to come here as a "permanent tourist" i dont care what loopholes i need to jump through to do it...aslong as i dont get busted... managed 5 years in spain under the radar but i need to know the ins and outs....

How do you plan to stay in Thailand as a "permanent tourist" at the age of 29? You really need to get that figured out first and then decide if you're willing to spend the money to do it and if it's possible and if you're willing to take the risks with Thai Immigration. Then, you can worry about where to live, how much rent to pay, how much electricity cost, etc. I'm sure there are plenty of guys on the forum who can advise on different ways to stay here full-time if it's possible. I'm really curious myself on how someone your age can stay here legally... The only ways I know of are buying an Elite visa, getting an ED visa or getting married to a Thai...

Edited July 20, 2019 by BertM

[ThomasThBKK]

28 minutes ago, BertM said:

How do you plan to stay in Thailand as a "permanent tourist" at the age of 29? You really need to get that figured out first and then decide if you're willing to spend the money to do it and if it's possible and if you're willing to take the risks with Thai Immigration. Then, you can worry about where to live, how much rent to pay, how much electricity cost, etc. I'm sure there are plenty of guys on the forum who can advise on different ways to stay here full-time if it's possible. I'm really curious myself on how someone your age can stay here legally... The only ways I know of are buying an Elite visa, getting an ED visa or getting married to a Thai...

The same way an older person stays here basically - you pay for it.

 

Unpopular opinion, but if you don't have enough money then you cannot be an expat. For me it's really that simple.

Retirees also have to stash 800k away or have decent income, or they face the same issues. Don't see why a younger guy couldn't cope with the elite visa costs or Igluu (might make sense if u want to get a PR). 

 

No one would even dream off going to the USA or Canada as an expat without either a job offer or having enough savings to make it there, however for Asia this attitude seems to be usual.

Edited July 20, 2019 by ThomasThBKK

[pt1001]

1 hour ago, cerox said:

Thanks for sharing. As I said, I am looking at Vietnam, meaning that I am no expert, so thanks for your help.

 

So Vietnam could still be a good options for in-between stays for below 6 months of the year? As a tourist staying in hotels all that notification stuff would not apply. 2-3 months tourist stays sound about good.

 

Your link mentions an ex employee (working in Vietnam) who could not exit the country. We are talking about people who do not work - how can you know whether or not someone works for other countries from their room.

mate take your vietnam nonsense somewhere else. I cant say how many times iv said im not interested in vietnam. 

 

Thank you all very much for your amazing responses and genuine knowledge its massively appreciated. How can i mark this thread as resolved?

[BertM]

6 minutes ago, pt1001 said:

mate take your vietnam nonsense somewhere else. I cant say how many times iv said im not interested in vietnam. 

 

Thank you all very much for your amazing responses and genuine knowledge its massively appreciated. How can i mark this thread as resolved?

You can private message Ubonjoe and ask him to close it. Just find one of his replies, click on his profile and send him private message asking him to close this thread.

[ubonjoe]

11 minutes ago, pt1001 said:

Thank you all very much for your amazing responses and genuine knowledge its massively appreciated. How can i mark this thread as resolved?

Topic now