Morch Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 23 hours ago, Traubert said: It's common knowledge and not even denied in these parts. A couple of hundred thousand safety helmets and gas masks didn't come down with the rain. Look up NED and Joshua Wong's award ceremony after the Umbrella protests. They aren't even hiding it. 20 hours ago, Traubert said: Did you look it up? Obviously not. The fact that there's as many anti-protestors as there are protestors is rarely reported. Even the protest leaders aren't shy about admitting their funding comes from the CI....sorry...the NED. Case in point, where did the Hong Kong Free Press newspaper spring up from? Just about the time that Jack Ma bought the SCMP? 8 hours ago, Traubert said: Well, a million as alleged by the protest leaders, 230k as estimated by the police, who you might think are better equipped to estimate. I'm in no way implying that the HKFP is a month old. When did Jack Ma buy the SCMP? December 2015. Around the same time, right? How does that imply what you allege? How did HKFP reach it's crowdfunding target within 48 hours and why was it's target so low? A front is a front whatever colour you paint it. You keep insinuating a whole lot of stuff, and making a bunch of outright claims as well. Support for any of these is not provided. And they all seem to echo the mainland's party line. These are pretty much constant feature in your posts on related matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTuner Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 9 minutes ago, Sydebolle said: See the enclosed clip by Channel 4 on the subject, a most brisant interview leaving absolutely nothing unclear about where China is heading! Britains role in Hong Kong.mp4 Says it all. Chinese are not going to honor the one country, two systems agreement. Now the remaining question is, how long will it take before foreign companies and capital start fleeing HK. Not long is my guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traubert Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Morch said: You keep insinuating a whole lot of stuff, and making a bunch of outright claims as well. Support for any of these is not provided. And they all seem to echo the mainland's party line. These are pretty much constant feature in your posts on related matters. That would be a result of my thirteen years living in China I guess. I dont echo the Party Line, I dont even know what it is, what I do echo is the word on the street and the word on the street flies fast here. There are pictures of Joshua Wong receiving an award from the NED on the internet. That's not a claim or an insinuation. If the NED were involved in 2015, is it outrageous to believe that they're involved now? That the HK Police estimated 230k protestors was a published fact. Where do (insert claimed number) protestors get hard hats and gas masks? Makro? Maybe they do. Where do they get crash barriers? Hundreds of them. How do they know how to triangulate them for strength? Why do these protests always happen during University recess? This is surely too organised for a bunch of students and if you think the NED don't have previous, well there's not much I can say. Read up on Peter Dahlin if you so desire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traubert Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 1 hour ago, DrTuner said: Says it all. Chinese are not going to honor the one country, two systems agreement. Now the remaining question is, how long will it take before foreign companies and capital start fleeing HK. Not long is my guess. Not even as long as you think. They're all fleeing to Shanghai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydebolle Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 3 hours ago, DrTuner said: Says it all. Chinese are not going to honor the one country, two systems agreement. Now the remaining question is, how long will it take before foreign companies and capital start fleeing HK. Not long is my guess. Indeed, and that's what should (and most likely will) happen. Then Beijing will start scratching for answers as the companies (foreign as well as Chinese with a Western understanding) will pack up their capital and leave. Will it teach PR China a lesson? Don't think so, as it would involve a non-acceptable loss-of-face ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arithai12 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 13 hours ago, ncc1701d said: There most certainly is NOT as many Hong Kong anti protestors as there are protesters. That is not even close to being true. A million protestors hit the streets a few weeks ago - anti protestors would be be in the thousands if that. I’ve been living in hkg since 1987 and you are blatantly wrong. The only locals have in common with mainlanders is a common written language. Anything else is as foreign to them as it would be to any other western country. The HKFP has been around for the last 4 years. It is new - but not in he last month new as you are implying. To claim that the written language is the same as mainland is a bit strange. As for main traditions and culture, there is a LOT in common, to equate HKG to any other western country is even stranger. Are you sure you have been living there the last 30 years? By the way, protesters on the street does not equal people's opinions. Not everybody would go out and demonstrate. There is no doubt that the young generations are very much against reuniting with mainland China, I wish them the best but as tragic as it is for them the treaty is clear. I don't see how to avoid that unless an extension of the current policy is negotiated. Certainly having Mr Joshua as a leader is not the best way. Not that I condone the mainland China methods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arithai12 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 56 minutes ago, Sydebolle said: Indeed, and that's what should (and most likely will) happen. Then Beijing will start scratching for answers as the companies (foreign as well as Chinese with a Western understanding) will pack up their capital and leave. Will it teach PR China a lesson? Don't think so, as it would involve a non-acceptable loss-of-face ........ the agreement has a time limit (2046) and clearly many foreign companies will leave before then. Some will leave sooner if they fear things are becomng unstable. Not sure about a lesson for China though, it's not that HKG is that important in their global economy anymore. Loss of face yes, and this is why the "we want it all today" attitude of the young generations is not going to work imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 Off-topic post removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 10 hours ago, Traubert said: That would be a result of my thirteen years living in China I guess. I dont echo the Party Line, I dont even know what it is, what I do echo is the word on the street and the word on the street flies fast here. There are pictures of Joshua Wong receiving an award from the NED on the internet. That's not a claim or an insinuation. If the NED were involved in 2015, is it outrageous to believe that they're involved now? That the HK Police estimated 230k protestors was a published fact. Where do (insert claimed number) protestors get hard hats and gas masks? Makro? Maybe they do. Where do they get crash barriers? Hundreds of them. How do they know how to triangulate them for strength? Why do these protests always happen during University recess? This is surely too organised for a bunch of students and if you think the NED don't have previous, well there's not much I can say. Read up on Peter Dahlin if you so desire. You can "guess" whatever you like. But for a long term stay in China, it would be odd to claim not being aware of "party line". Similarly, the repeated denials of almost any criticism raised against China, or the acceptance of government narrative on most topics discussed seems a bit much. Laying it rather thick. As for the post above - same observations hold. You do not provide actual support for your claims and insinuations. What you claim is "the word on the street" is not verifiable. And it would depend on which street one hangs out and who one listens to. Receiving awards is a factual, what you insinuate it implies is not. As for authorities claiming lower figures regarding protests - pretty much routine all over the world is such situations. Adopting the authorities version and narrative without question is a choice. Not like they do not have vested interests, but eh. Going on about the equipment is bizarre, all the more so considering the "13 years" claim. It wouldn't be much hassle getting these, and I'm pretty sure that at least a few of these protestors are connected enough to swing such thing. And for the last line deflection, what's your point? The guy confessed under duress. There could very well be US involvement in current events. Wouldn't be surprised. But what you push is a bad attempt at substantiating such claims. And yeah, it's pretty much the "party line" regardless of what you pretend to be aware of. Maybe would read a tad less propagandist if you'd qualify some of this nonsense. In turbulent Hong Kong, conspiracy theories point West https://www.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg-hong-kong-conspiracy-20141008-story.html Peter Dahlin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Dahlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 On 7/23/2019 at 8:04 PM, Puchaiyank said: "The Black Hands"...the most feared ninja paramilitary group in the world... Be afraid...be very afraid! ???? Black hands is old Chinese communist nomenclature, often referencing traitors or agents of the "West". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 10 hours ago, Traubert said: Not even as long as you think. They're all fleeing to Shanghai. China scrambles to stem manufacturing exodus as 50 companies leave https://asia.nikkei.com/Economy/Trade-war/China-scrambles-to-stem-manufacturing-exodus-as-50-companies-leave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animalmagic Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 21 hours ago, Traubert said: Well, a million as alleged by the protest leaders, 230k as estimated by the police, who you might think are better equipped to estimate. Yet again you are selective in what you read and believe. The HKP make estimates based on sections of a crowd passing through an area at a certain point in time and then correlate this to a projected amount; to my best information from sources in HK this is usually well below the actual figure. The Govt would not like the people to think that there is strong public opinion against them! The organisers generally present the more accurate depiction of numbers based on their attempts to marshal and direct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lannarebirth Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 The irony of course, is, that not only is the US not the Black Hands here but that the US president would gladly betray these brave people if it could somehow change the news cycle away from his own ongoing despicable behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTuner Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Those who have a lot of time in their hands might find these fellas living in China and doing videos about it interesting: https://www.youtube.com/user/churchillcustoms/videos?view=0&sort=dd&shelf_id=1 Especially when it comes to domestic propaganda. Chinese are masters in brainwashing and that's why my conclusion is: once a commie, always a commie. Spend too much time in there and it'll take hold and be irreversible. Here's something on topic: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redline Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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