Expats worries: What's next?

[wgdanson]

21 hours ago, ivor bigun said:

Nothing to do with not being able to afford it,its MY money why should i tie it up permanantly,its mine if i want to spend it ,up to me.

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And if you do the 65k per month transfer, you CAN spend every last satang of it.

[wgdanson]

5 hours ago, BritManToo said:

All my income is taxed in the UK before I get it.

Same as all other Brits.

ALL?

[wgdanson]

2 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I can live quite comfortably on 15,000 a month, including running a pickup, feeding a wife and five dogs, having aircon, internet and worldwide tv, and going out for dinner once a week.

Please tell me how, and I have only one dog.

[Mike Teavee]

20 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

ALL?

Excluding Income in Tax efficient vehicles (e.g. ISAs) all income in the UK is taxed, it's just the 1st 12,500 or so is taxed at 0%, so effectively it's tax free, but the distinction matters when it comes to Dual Taxation Agreements as it is considered to have already been taxed (at Zero Rate) 

 

[rascalman]

Good, honest people are being Forced out. They just do not have that $25,000 in the bank. This is sad and must be fixed at once. 

[emptypockets]

2 minutes ago, rascalman said:

Good, honest people are being Forced out. They just do not have that $25,000 in the bank. This is sad and must be fixed at once. 

Agreed. Get the money in the bank ASAP.

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, PerkinsCuthbert said:

And some don't have any vices and live happily and modestly on a fraction of that. So what? What's your point?

I think the point is Thai Immigration does not care if you are frugal or not.  The want 800k in the bank.  

[madmen]

The big 4 embassies destroyed expat dreams yet they still continue blaming Thailand the country. What will happen next is most them will be forced back home where they will continue to spread false news about being 'shaken out" instead of just admitting they told porkies for a decade and made babies along the way based on fraud ..nobody to blame but their mother lands and themselves so expect to see hundreds of these thread until they are pushed into suvarnabhumi this time next year at the latest.

[gearbox]

5 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

I think the point is Thai Immigration does not care if you are frugal or not.  The want 800k in the bank.  

This is not that bad. Hopefully they won't do the same as the MM2H Malaysian visas, they require more money in the bank. The Thai system is good for people who are not sure whether they would want to stay here long time.

[RocketDog]

On 7/24/2019 at 2:02 AM, NCC1701A said:

if they want us out, us meaning all non Thais from all over the world, why don't they just cancel the retirement one year extension of stay?

or the Elite Visa? and why give tourists up to six months to stay now?  

why do ED visas?

 

I know this is a incredibly unpopular thing to hear on this forum, but if I didn't check for any changes in retirement extension of stay requirements, I would have no indication that anything has changed at all. I just did my retirement renewal. Nothing has changed. Same extremely short list of docs. 

 

Nothing has changed in almost 6 years for me.

I guess I am lucky. I feel sorry for everyone who is having so much trouble. I hope you all can work in out.

Agreed.

 

Also, many countries, including USA, have a double taxation treaty with Thailand, and many other countries, that already allows THAILAND to tax NEWLY EARNED INCOME.

It is not currently enforced, but certainly could be. If you read the treaty, and I have, the HUGE loophole is that if you have enough in the bank to prove that each month's income to your account is less than your current balance, then it's not new money. This treaty applies to money that is not taxed in your home country already.

 

So....... if they "wanted us out" this would be the fast/legal/easy way to do it.

 

As for Occam's Razor, the simplest explanation is that Thailand just wants long stay people to be able to provide for themselves on a daily basis and in emergency situations. That is common in many countries and I don't view it as a sinister portent.

 

The wailing and whinging is coming principally from two groups of expats: those who see every change in immigration law as a move to harm expats and those who truly don't have the cash to cover emergency Healthcare, regardless of why they don't have it.

 

The only true victims of recent changes are those who have been here many years and whose pension payments and/or savings simply don't meet the new requirements. I think these folks should be grandfathered, but alas, the Thai government very seldom consults me on policy changes.

 

Finally, Life Isn't Fair, and, The Only Constant Is Change.

 

Welcome to Planet Earth, a galactic backwater run by a species of insane apes.

 

I could be wrong about everything though, except for the insane apes part.

[Captain 776]

Why....

 

.so many make a mystery of all this is beyond me.

[1FinickyOne]

5 hours ago, newnative said:

What a bunch of nonsense. 

I agree totally. I do pretty much the same thing, year after year, the biggest change is that I get a year older each time. 

[oznomad]

3 hours ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

allready now thai law says that a tax resident in thailand MUST DECLARE AND PAY tax

on all his income worldwide.

Incorrect. Ignore this statement.

[Searat7]

6 hours ago, Isaan sailor said:

Thai government floated the idea of taxing Social Security income.  State Department strongly advised not to proceed—since retired Americans have already paid taxes to fund it (100% of their tax, BTW).  If Thai govt ever pushed it through as a new tax...goodbye LoS...

Many of us already pay tax on much or most of our Social Security income in USA 

[Bangkok Barry]

2 hours ago, wgdanson said:

Please tell me how, and I have only one dog.

 

Electric is 4000 max, tv 500, internet 600, petrol for the pickup 2000, 500 or so for an evening out which includes two beers at a place near me that does excellent English food. That leaves around 7500 a month for food.

 

I spend 100 baht a week on bread for breakfast toast, baked by my restaurant owner friend. I have noodle soup or my wife cooks masaman chicken or green chicken curries for lunch. Almost all evening meals cost around 50 baht, be it beef mince, pork loin/belly or roast chicken, or a toasted bacon sandwich. The only 'extravagance' is salmon which might cost up to 150 a couple of times a month. The food bill includes an average of 1000 a month on English food that a supplier puts on a bus for me to collect - meat pies (steak/pork) at around 65 each, large English bacon slices, fish fingers.

 

My wife mostly has noodle dishes and fish bought from the market, or cooks from stuff in the garden. I'll have a couple of beers and a snack while watching the football at the weekend. Used to do that each evening but stopped it and lost a few kilos as a result. I favour Siam Weizen and Tapper.

I do also now pay 7500 for the pickup, but that finishes soon. No rent, as I bought the house for 600,000 when the exchange rate was at its best, and spent double that on doing it up and extending it. Four bedrooms, two bathrooms, two lounge areas, one up one down, on one rai of land. I'd guess the house is worth around 3.5 million now.

[wgdanson]

15 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

Electric is 4000 max, tv 500, internet 600, petrol for the pickup 2000, 500 or so for an evening out which includes two beers at a place near me that does excellent English food. That leaves around 7500 a month for food.

 

I spend 100 baht a week on bread for breakfast toast, baked by my restaurant owner friend. I have noodle soup or my wife cooks masaman chicken or green chicken curries for lunch. Almost all evening meals cost around 50 baht, be it beef mince, pork loin/belly or roast chicken, or a toasted bacon sandwich. The only 'extravagance' is salmon which might cost up to 150 a couple of times a month. The food bill includes an average of 1000 a month on English food that a supplier puts on a bus for me to collect - meat pies (steak/pork) at around 65 each, large English bacon slices, fish fingers.

 

My wife mostly has noodle dishes and fish bought from the market, or cooks from stuff in the garden. I'll have a couple of beers and a snack while watching the football at the weekend. Used to do that each evening but stopped it and lost a few kilos as a result. I favour Siam Weizen and Tapper.

I do also now pay 7500 for the pickup, but that finishes soon. No rent, as I bought the house for 600,000 when the exchange rate was at its best, and spent double that on doing it up and extending it. Four bedrooms, two bathrooms, two lounge areas, one up one down, on one rai of land. I'd guess the house is worth around 3.5 million now.

Well done. My electric is never more than 2000, and I have 'discovered' Tapper @ 53 baht a can! 

What about car insurance, maybe 12000 a year, road tax @ 5000, health insurance????

 

 

[Bangkok Barry]

4 hours ago, Henricus said:

It`s so simple If you don`t feel welcome anymore, OR if you don`t follow the requirements to stay in Thailand go somewhere else to life the freedom you have here.

Thailand is not a prison and you have all-day the possibility to leave.

 

What nonsense. Many, many expats have Thai family and can't leave without tearing their wife away from her family. How is that simple?

[marcusarelus]

14 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

What nonsense. Many, many expats have Thai family and can't leave without tearing their wife away from her family. How is that simple?

You have made a mistake.  What do you expect anyone to do?  

[geronimo]

On 7/24/2019 at 1:43 AM, RichardColeman said:

Personally I think the next step will be that there be a requirement for you to live in a property you own atleast 6 months a year, or it is confiscated by the state.

Don't be giving them ideas .......

[natway09]

Next, you must keep a minimum of 800,000 Bht in a Thai bank account at all times  or

to get a renewal must have a health policy covering 100,000 Bht as an outpatient & 1mil as an in patient, There Done. Taken the strain off the Thai healthcare system in one foul swoop.

Make sure that all the old farangs at least pay their way

[geronimo]

Well, let's hope that no Thai Immigration officials read this, otherwise they'll have a list as long as your arm on how to extract more money from the farang!!!!

[ivor bigun]

Please tell me how, and I have only one dog.

Please tell ME how we only have a cat.

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[geronimo]

1 minute ago, ivor bigun said:

Please tell ME how we only have a cat.

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Our pets will soon have to do 90-day reporting!!!

[ivor bigun]

Our pets will soon have to do 90-day reporting!!!

No ours is Thai even miows in Thai.

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[Bangkok Barry]

15 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

You have made a mistake.  What do you expect anyone to do?  

 

Trolling again. Sorry, not biting today ????

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

Trolling again. Sorry, not biting today ????

There were many paths you could have chosen.  You chose one that did not work out well with the drop in the value of the pound.  Not my fault nor Thailand's fault.  How on earth is pointing that out trolling?  Are you expecting sympathy?  I put my money in a Thai bank 15 years ago if it had crashed I would move back to America and admit I messed up. 

[Bangkok Barry]

10 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

There were many paths you could have chosen.  You chose one that did not work out well with the drop in the value of the pound.  Not my fault nor Thailand's fault.  How on earth is pointing that out trolling?  Are you expecting sympathy?  I put my money in a Thai bank 15 years ago if it had crashed I would move back to America and admit I messed up. 

 

I guess you don't have a Thai family here then. Where did I write that it didn't work out well? I'm perfectly comfortable, actually.

[RocketDog]

1 hour ago, Searat7 said:

Many of us already pay tax on much or most of our Social Security income in USA 

Yes, it is certainly counted as taxable income. So the tax you pay is dependent on your tax bracket. If your income is low enough, you pay no taxes at all.

 

Approximately, 46% of Americans pay no federal or state income tax. These are basically poverty level folks but also includes people who may have significant savings but very low incomes, such as retired people.

[marcusarelus]

2 hours ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

I guess you don't have a Thai family here then. Where did I write that it didn't work out well? I'm perfectly comfortable, actually.

You wrote, "What nonsense. Many, many expats have Thai family and can't leave without tearing their wife away from her family. How is that simple"

[simon43]

Realistically, nothing will be 'eased' as regards the visa financial requirements.  In fact, the required amounts might increase in the future. That's not being a doomsayer - it's being realistic.

 

No amount of complaints or pleading by those affected by these rules will make the slightest bit of difference to those who decide the rules or implement them.

 

Therefore, one needs to 'man up' and find a solution to the problem, if indeed there is a problem for you, such as not having the required funds.

 

You can go down the agent route of course.  It seems to work right now, but nothing is ever unchanging.  At some point in the future, that option will be removed.

 

Other options:

1) Top yourself.

2) Return to your home country

3) Move to another country where the visa rules are within your means.

 

In my case, I do not have sufficient funds for a retirement visa.  I do earn a healthy online income, but that income cannot be 'proven' or documented, because it comes from teaching online for various Chinese companies.

 

So .... Considering my own options:

1) No thanks.

2) No thanks - I left the UK 18 years ago and currently have no desire to return.

3) Yes, that'll do me ==> relocate to a country where I can fulfill the visa requirements.  So that's what I'm doing right now.

 

OK, it's easier for me because I'm now single with a very 'portable' job.  If you're married to a Thai or have a family here, then some hard decisions will need to be made.  But sticking your head in the sand or moaning/complaining about how unfair life is not going to result in a solution to this problem.