TransferWise and Bangkok Bank

[wgdanson]

I am re-thinking my strategy for doing my extension in December after the disastrous fall again, down to 37.2, and even less at Bkk Bank.

I was Transferwising Bht 65k every month since January, all as FTT until last month, so not wanting to temp fate and as

I already have Bht 400,000 in an FCA, in October I shall make that up to Bht 800,000 by liquidizing some UK assets. Extension sorted.

Only needing 40 - 45k Bht a month to live on, that's what I shall do each month, via T'wise as it is cheapest way.

In March, when my first 90 days is up, I shall use GBPs from my FCA to live on for 6 months = 270k max. so still leaving well over 400k. Top the FCA up in October back to over 800k from my UK in one SWIFT transaction, 20 quid . Anyone see any flaws in this please. 

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

I called Nationwide again today and they assure me that the maximum I pay will be 20 quid. 

They told me the same.

Then when I complained because another £20 Intermediary bank charge was levied to my account, they stated they couldn't comment on other banks charges as they varied and referred me to their site, where it states;

Fees

Usually you are charged a fee for international payments and these will differ according to the service used and the bank or building society that is providing the service.

There may also be fees charged by any agent banks involved in the payment transmission before a payment reaches its final destination account

https://www.nationwide.co.uk/guides/understanding-the-basics/sending-money-abroad

 

It has to go through a clearing bank due to regulations and they charge an additional fee.

By all means try it and find out for yourself.

 

Better still send a secure mail, advising you want to make an International transfer to Bangkok Bank Thailand and have been advised by their customer services, that the only fee charged is £20 for the SWIFT transaction and their will be no intermediary bank charges. (BKK receiving fee excepted).

Then you have the reply in writing.

[Tanoshi]

27 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

I already have Bht 400,000 in an FCA, in October I shall make that up to Bht 800,000 by liquidizing some UK assets. Extension sorted.

If that is an option, then probably the best solution.

 

27 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

In March, when my first 90 days is up, I shall use GBPs from my FCA to live on for 6 months = 270k max. so still leaving well over 400k. Top the FCA up in October back to over 800k from my UK in one SWIFT transaction, 20 quid . Anyone see any flaws in this please.

Yes, personally I'd leave the 800K untouched and just transfer monthly as needed.

If you spend down to 400K, with the Brexit uncertainty, it could be 32 or less at a later date.

You'd also need to top it up in September next year for a December application, unless you know for sure, or can confirm your IO will accept 2 months.

Some IO's are insisting on 3 months.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Tanoshi

[wgdanson]

 

##- Please type your reply above this line -## Sandor S (TransferWise) Jul 30, 12:49 CEST Hi William, I completely understand your situation and I would go with the more expensive method if I were you. I hope you'll use our services for other regular transfers in the future! Have a nice day! Sandor from Transferwise   William George Danson Jul 30, 12:38 CEST Thanks Sandor, but for me and many expats living in Thailand, the transfer MUST be seen as a foreign transfer into my Bangkok bank. no, good going thru an intermediary Thai bank as it then shows as a local transfer. If I do not show 12 consecutive transfers, I do not get permission to stay. I shall have to use another, more expensive, but 100% sure method. William G Danson.     Sandor S (TransferWise) Jul 30, 12:31 CEST Hey William, I hope this email finds you well! Regarding to your question we can force to send the payment through Bankok Bank but we can't guarantee it. If you choose to send the money with us, you need to set up the transfer as usual. Before you send the money to us form your local bank account, you need to make a call to us. During the call we will add a tag to your transfer which will try to force the system to send the money out through Bankok Bank. It usually works but we can't guarantee for 100% If you have more questions, please feel free to email us -- we're happy to help! Wishing all the best, Sandor from Transferwise   William George Danson Jul 29, 09:19 CEST Tomorrow I must do my monthly £1700 transfer to my Bangkok bank for Immigration purposes, which MUST show as a foreign transfer. Last month you sent it via Kasikorn Bank so I showed as a local transfer when it hit my Bkk Bank. Are transfers to Thailand now going directly to Bkk Bank please, or shall I have to find another company to do my regular transfer? Thanks.

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Recent emails and replies from Transferwise. When THEY advise I use another method, that's enough for me. Bye bye Transferwise.

[geoffbezoz]

Strangely just over a month ago I was forced into stop using TW due the very fact transfers to my Thai bank were no longer designated as an international transfer.

 

Moving on with crazy SWIFT charges I emailed TW yet again, must have been the 8th time. My reply this past Monday was that they had "tagged" my account and all subsequent transfers to Thailand would be to Bangkok Bank. So as a trial yesterday I sent £ 200. Today it arrived in my Bangkok bank account as an international transfer. Wonder if it will continue ?

[Pib]

55 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Wonder if it will continue ?

I think a good answer to your question was in a TW response to wgdanson in the post just above yours.  Partial quote of TW's response follows:

 

Quote

If you choose to send the money with us, you need to set up the transfer as usual. Before you send the money to us form your local bank account, you need to make a call to us. During the call we will add a tag to your transfer which will try to force the system to send the money out through Bangkok Bank.

It usually works but we can't guarantee for 100%

 

[geoffbezoz]

3 minutes ago, Pib said:

I think a good answer to your question was in a TW response to wgdanson in the post just above yours.  Partial quote of TW's response follows:

 

 

Actually not an answer to my post. I did email them and their response was that it was no longer required to advise them in advance as my account was already "tagged", as per my earlier post stated. My question was, if your had read it,  "wonder if it will continue".

[Pib]

3 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Actually not an answer to my post. I did email them and their response was that it was no longer required to advise them in advance as my account was already "tagged", as per my earlier post stated. My question was, if your had read it,  "wonder if it will continue".

In various related threads and posts people have been told by TW their future transfers have been tagged to go thru Bangkok Bank....no need to call again.  But some of their transfers still did not get the International Transfer coding because they were routed thru K-bank or TMB.   Like TW has said....no 100% guarantee.

[Tanoshi]

You'd think with all the communications between TW and clients transferring to Thailand, someone would instruct all the employees "For transfers to Thailand, if it's to Bangkok Bank use our BKK partner. If it's to Kasikorn, use our KK partner. If it's to TMB use our TMB partner.

If it's to any other bank use any partner branch.

 

Save them a fortune in labour costs dealing with e-mails and telephone calls.

[geoffbezoz]

3 minutes ago, Pib said:

In various related threads and posts people have been told by TW their future transfers have been tagged to go thru Bangkok Bank....no need to call again.  But some of their transfers still did not get the International Transfer coding because they were routed thru K-bank or TMB.   Like TW has said....no 100% guarantee.

Fully aware of that hence my question "wonder if it will continue". Tomorrow I will test the system again with a further transfer.

[geoffbezoz]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

You'd think with all the communications between TW and clients transferring to Thailand, someone would instruct all the employees "For transfers to Thailand, if it's to Bangkok Bank use our BKK partner. If it's to Kasikorn, use our KK partner. If it's to TMB use our TMB partner.

If it's to any other bank use any partner branch.

 

Save them a fortune in labour costs dealing with e-mails and telephone calls.

That's logical but their customer services is not based in the UK so hence may be employing people who have little concept of logic.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 7/26/2019 at 9:22 AM, mfd101 said:

Apart from all that, easily the CHEAPEST way to transfer cash to Thailand is Citibank atm in Asoke;

 Not necessarily... Different CitiBank countries appear to have different policies on this... For example, for U.S. accounts unless you're a CitiGold customer, they're going to charge a 3% foreign currency fee to use their ATMs in Thailand.

 

For whatever reason, I've heard in the past that Aussies with Aus. Citibank accounts aren't hit with that same fee here.

 

Edited July 30, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Our Man in the Tropics]

Thus far I have read only page 1 of this thread ;

So,- I hope that I am not being tautologous by suggesting that ur funds arrive to u directly as "cashier's cheque / check" in foreign currency that matches the foreign currency deposit account which u would have opened prior at Thai bank.

I presume that the overseas cashier's cheque / check will be recorded as foreign transfer transaction.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Our Man in the Tropics

[geoffbezoz]

3 minutes ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

Thus far I have read only page 1 of this thread ;

So,- I hope that I am not being tautologous by suggesting that ur funds arrive to u directly as "cashier's cheque / check" in foreign currency that matches the foreign currency deposit account which u would have opened prior at Thai bank.

I presume that the overseas cashier's cheque / check will be recorded as foreign transfer transaction.

Think you need to read all the thread before making assumptions

 

[wgdanson]

34 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Actually not an answer to my post. I did email them and their response was that it was no longer required to advise them in advance as my account was already "tagged", as per my earlier post stated. My question was, if your had read it,  "wonder if it will continue".

That contradicts the email I got from them.

[geoffbezoz]

Just now, wgdanson said:

That contradicts the email I got from them.

yes aware of that. There have been many contradictions in the various TW feedback posts. The  very reason I posted my update.

[Pib]

5 minutes ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

I presume that the overseas cashier's cheque / check will be recorded as foreign transfer transaction.

Highly, highly doubtful.  It would a local domestic transaction....the cashing of a cheque.  No different than going into a Thai bank to do a counter withdrawal/cash advance with your foreign card and having the withdrawal deposited directly into your Thai bank account---it's coded as a domestic deposit....not a foreign transfer of any type.

[Our Man in the Tropics]

20 minutes ago, Pib said:

Highly, highly doubtful.  It would a local domestic transaction....the cashing of a cheque.  No different than going into a Thai bank to do a counter withdrawal/cash advance with your foreign card and having the withdrawal deposited directly into your Thai bank account---it's coded as a domestic deposit....not a foreign transfer of any type.

I appreciate ur doubts ;

Because,- I implicitly have them too about what I suggest.

But,- I am more inclined to believe that it would at "first" instance, even, be classed as a "foreign" transfer transaction were the Thai based bank to pay their customer this typical sum that Falangs receive monthly into their Thai bank a/c's, ahead of this Thai based bank actually being settled for it with clearing at end of whatever is their applicable period.

A cashier's cheque / check from a main bank at a Falang country is surely a much easier document to confirm [ than non-cashier's cheque / check ] by the Thai bank.

Anyway, when the cashier's cheque / check is finally cleared by that Thai bank it should be recorded as a foreign transfer into that Thai bank, ... I proffer as reasoning.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Our Man in the Tropics

[Pib]

6 minutes ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

Anyway, when the cashier's cheque / check is finally cleared by that Thai bank it should be recorded as a foreign transfer into that Thai bank, ... I proffer as reasoning.

Several years ago I cashed & deposited a US traveler's cheque at Bangkok Bank....it was coded as a regular deposit....not foreign.

[Our Man in the Tropics]

20 minutes ago, Pib said:

Several years ago I cashed & deposited a US traveler's cheque at Bangkok Bank....it was coded as a regular deposit....not foreign.

Useful information ;

I trust that categorising by banks is correct

Thus,- this very recording by Bangkok Bank was correct to do so

 

Maybe there is an agent in Thailand for the main brands of traveler's cheques /checks responsible for settling them with the Thai based banks only.

 

Re ; Categorisation by Thai bank of foreign cashier's cheque / check ;

I hope to make some direct enquiries this week with the bank pretties, & then return to this thread with feedback.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Our Man in the Tropics

[Pib]

Immigration is looking for "electronic" transfers into Thailand; not the exchange/deposit of foreign cash, not the cashing/deposit of foreign cheques, etc.  

[Our Man in the Tropics]

Above preference by Thailand Immigration Department does not necessarily mean that monthly social security, & / or private, payments from foreign countries, issued as cheques / checks to Falang payees will not be recognised for calculation of monthly income ?

A bankable country -- ref. overall positive Moody's Fitch ratings for Thailand that feature as new thread tonight on this forum -- one would expect to so accept.

Ditto per "foreign cashier's cheques / checks".

Edited July 30, 2019 by Our Man in the Tropics

[geoffbezoz]

22 hours ago, geoffbezoz said:

yes aware of that. There have been many contradictions in the various TW feedback posts. The  very reason I posted my update.

And a further update is that this morning I did a further transfer that arrived in my Bangkok bank account this afternoon denoted as an international transfer. Maybe the "tagging" on my account to direct it directly into BKB by TW will continue hopefully.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

21 hours ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

Above preference by Thailand Immigration Department does not necessarily mean that monthly social security, & / or private, payments from foreign countries, issued as cheques / checks to Falang payees will not be recognised for calculation of monthly income ?

 

 

If that's your strategy for meeting Immigration's monthly foreign transfers requirement for extensions of stay.... good luck with getting Immigration to sign off on that, especially beyond the 2019 "leniency" year!!!  Hope you've got your suitcases ready to be packed....

 

[mfd101]

21 hours ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

Above preference by Thailand Immigration Department does not necessarily mean that monthly social security, & / or private, payments from foreign countries, issued as cheques / checks to Falang payees will not be recognised for calculation of monthly income ?

They want to see (1) 65K minimum coming into a Thai bank every month, as evidenced by Thai bank docos (2) possibly, but not necessarily, in addition your English (or other)-language docos that show the source or sources of your income MIGHT be helpful. Or not. Given that they most likely can barely if at all read English or any other falang language, they will not want a mountain of different & complicated docos. KISS

[Our Man in the Tropics]

I cannot open up CIMB website on my browser ;

My internet sercurity software is blocking access ;

Although,- I think that the various url's that I tried are genuine.

 

Anyway, from what I viewed last night,- I think CIMB bank has some service or 2 which may facilitate electronic payments from neighboring countries to Thailand to arrive into Thailand, & thus be recorded as "foreign transfer transaction" if payee receives from CIMB bank in neighboring country transfer into their CIMB deposit account or whatever account at their Thailand CIMB is suitable to accomplish this record ;

However,- I confess to not having delved deep into their information yet ;

My browser was acting up with too many tabs open.

[Our Man in the Tropics]

Perhaps with certain banks in Thailand foreign the currency account records electronic transfers of the nominated currency into it as "foreign transfer transactions" ?

 

I note a very Interesting post, # 9, some 12 hours ago, from DaRoadrunner on another thread ;

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1114860-euro-pound-sterling-account/?utm_source=newsletter-20190731-1237&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=news

 

Here be DaRoadrunner's post # 9 ;

 

You can have £ or $ or other currency accounts with Bangkok Bank. Known as an FCD account. Not every branch has this facility so you may have to try a couple of branches.

 

You can also link this to a Thai Baht account with the same bank.

 

Unlike Thai Baht, funds in other currencies are NOT guaranteed by the Bank of Thailand.

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by Our Man in the Tropics

[SooKee]

FWIW I also tried a transfer to Bangkok Bank using OFX. I'd seen on another thread that someone was told that OFX transfers would always show up as FTT international transfers.

 

The transfer was quite fast, took about 24 hours to arrive once I'd funded it from my UK account. Only problem is that it showed up as Bahtnet. So that's another option off the list. Did see above that Pib said the Bahtnet will show as International if you get a credit advice but I'd prefer to avoid having to get any more bloody documents than necessary and would rather just have to get a statement and the bank letter. Might ask for a statement next week just to see how the Bahtnet transfer shows up on that.

 

I also tried HSBC again a few days ago and transferred £50 to Bangkok Bank to see if HSBC were still using Intermediary banks. Was pleased to see the whole £50 turned up for conversion. Thought HSBC might be able to go back on the option list. Then today I saw another thread where someone said they transferred £2,000 to Bangkok Bank from HSBC only to find that only £1,965 had turned up. So, not sure my not getting hit with Intermediary fees was just a fluke or whether the other fellow getting charged was just a one off bit of bad luck. Whatever, I don't really want to be paying Russian Roulette with transfers like this.

 

So far for me, TW is still working, if I have one that fails to show as international I think I'll switch to Bangkok Bank and the London branch transfer option, then wait for the next spanner in the works to have to deal with :(

 

 

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, SooKee said:

The transfer was quite fast, took about 24 hours to arrive once I'd funded it from my UK account. Only problem is that it showed up as Bahtnet. So that's another option off the list.

I believe OFX use Citibank, who are members of the Bahtnet system which go through the Bank of Thailand.

It is an International transfer as such, but the proof of foreign transaction would probably need to be supplied by BOT.

 

10 minutes ago, SooKee said:

I also tried HSBC again a few days ago and transferred £50 to Bangkok Bank to see if HSBC were still using Intermediary banks. Was pleased to see the whole £50 turned up for conversion. Thought HSBC might be able to go back on the option list. Then today I saw another thread where someone said they transferred £2,000 to Bangkok Bank from HSBC only to find that only £1,965 had turned up. So, not sure my not getting hit with Intermediary fees was just a fluke or whether the other fellow getting charged was just a one off bit of bad luck. Whatever, I don't really want to be paying Russian Roulette with transfers like this.

When doing bank to bank transfers, their is usually a standard charge by your bank which is charged separately to your account. Thereafter there may also be an additional Intermediary bank charge, which again is charged directly to your account.

The full sum is transferred, but the receiving bank may also charge a receiving fee, which is deducted from the incoming total.

[Issanman]

I just spent some time looking at my TW account online. I found a place where I could specify Bangkok Bank as my priority recipient of Thai baht, which I did, of course. So I decided to do a test transfer of $200 to see if it would work. As the last step in setting up this test transfer, I was asked the reason why I was transferring the money. There was a drop down box with a dozen or so different reasons that I could choose.

 

The interesting part was that the last reason on the list was "transfer funds for long term stay in Thailand". 

 

Thailand was the only country listed on the drop down box.

My test transfer is not scheduled to be completed until Aug 6, but this may be a hopeful sign that TW is finally learning how to fix this.