TM30: “It’s really not that hard”, immigration official tells foreigners

[jamesbbkk]

3 hours ago, gunderhill said:

CRAP 100%    try  crossing a  road  here or  going on a minibus,  if  i have my tm 30  with me like a lucky amulet is  it going to keep me safe? no it  might help identify my  corpse  if the death wagon doesnt catch fire and incinerate me  first.

This is the sort of nonsense  poor  Thais  have to put up with year after year, the whole  corrupt  lot need  booting  out, theyd  need  so  many jails theyd  have to buy  up land in Myanmar to keep them all in

Sounds like you might be happier as a guest in some other country or back in your home country.

[kellersphuket]

3 minutes ago, TG911 said:

What took you so long? ????

 

well as this was posted 5 hours ago I was doing what most normal people would be doing at that time.

 

Drinking! 

[thaibeachlovers]

Just now, Orton Rd said:

It should be 'not that hard' for clarity and constancy for all the other immigration requirements. Why is it so hard for them to have every immigration office enforcing the same rules in the same manner, or even the officer in the same office doing so? Why do some offices not bother with TM30's, why do some not do postal 90 day reports, why do some offices want 5 pp pages copied just to do  90 day report never mind all the unforeseen obstacles they can throw your way fishing for a bribe or just if in a bad mood. 

LOL. If you knew the answer to that you'd understand Thainess, and no farang will ever understand Thainess.

[Peterw42]

9 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Sorry but you are wrong. A TOURIST is not responsible for doing a TM 30, a TOURIST is NOT breaking the law by not doing one.

TM 30 is and always has been the responsibility of the dwelling owner. Where expats are involved is when they live in their own or the family dwelling. If an expat lives in an hotel, they are not required to do TM 30 as that is the responsibility of the hotel.

Yes thats right but a large percentage of tourists rent condos, stay airbnb etc, then its not a hotel responsability.

 

TM30 is "owner, house master or possessor" , says so right there on the form. 

 

People need to let go of this idea that its the owner or landlords responsibility, its just not the case. possessor is anyone who occupies a place.

[jamesbbkk]

4 minutes ago, tcp7 said:

@Wiggy May I kindly ask how did you manage as a foreigner to have your name added to a Chanote? Thanks.

It is a usufruct which is similar to a life estate. It is not a sufficient notice for these purposes though one might think it could be recognized for efficiency. More efficiency might reduce government jobs though.

[gunderhill]

2 minutes ago, jamesbbkk said:

Sounds like you might be happier as a guest in some other country or back in your home country.

 I can bitch even more there  but  not over gross  stupidity, why dont  you just say "go  home"  dont beat about the bush so  much...give it me straight. The  old ones are always the best although lack imagination. D- (try harder)

[Bob12345]

3 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

How many criminals in say 30 million tourists have been caught due to - or on - tm30 reporting ? 

I dont think thats the goal.

 

The idea is that criminals go shopping for a country to stay, and of course they have international law firms and experts to tell them where to go. Thailand looks like a good option until they are told of the TM30, meaning they are continuously monitored where they at. The criminals will then decide to go ot another country instead. 

Its not so much a way of finding a criminal, its more to avoid getting them in.

[baboon]

9 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's not up to us to say what is or is not necessary in Thailand. How would you like it if foreigners in your country started bitchin' about some law?

It would depend on what the law was. If they were in the country otherwise legally, they could and should object to nonsense like TM30 and the natives should get behind them.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, jamesbbkk said:

Sounds like you might be happier as a guest in some other country or back in your home country.

LOL. So many westerners move to Thailand and then start trying to make it just like the <deleted> hole they came from. I put up with the BS which occupied no more than 4 or 5 days a year, because I liked living in LOS more than where I came from.

Had I had enough of a problem with it, I'd have gone home.

Talk about making huge mountains out of a molehill regulation that does not cause most of us any problems at all because we don't even have to do it.

[overherebc]

33 minutes ago, kotsak said:

 You can leave your hat on.. ????

 

 

And tell Kim I forgive her and still love her even if she didn't didn't do the TM30 when I stayed there.

[gunderhill]

1 minute ago, Bob12345 said:

I dont think thats the goal.

 

The idea is that criminals go shopping for a country to stay, and of course they have international law firms and experts to tell them where to go. Thailand looks like a good option until they are told of the TM30, meaning they are continuously monitored where they at. The criminals will then decide to go ot another country instead. 

Its not so much a way of finding a criminal, its more to avoid getting them in.

Criminals  with  money will easily skirt  all this just  look at the "corruption minister"  they just cant help themselves

[gunderhill]

8 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

TM 30 was easy. TM 28 was impossible ( the officer didn't know what one was and started threatening me, so I left ).

thats no excuse for him to be "ignorant of the law"

[Nickymaster]

Thousands of Airbnb rooms in Bangkok.  Mostly owned by Chinese who are not in Thailand. Rooms are rented out by so called "agents" who advertise them online. Do you really think the owners do the TM30 reporting?? So there will always be a large group of house owners who never do any reporting. 

 

Good guys do the reporting, bad guys rent through Airbnb. Therefor TM30 reporting is only a hassle for good guys and won't be effective in catching criminals. 

[gunderhill]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

that does not cause most of us any problems at all because we don't even have to do it.

Just wait theyre  gonna  roll it  out everywhere.

[wealthychef]

4 hours ago, Mango Bob said:

 Just hope other countries will do the same thing to the Thai people as they do to us.

 

What a childish and evil idea.  

[thaibeachlovers]

2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Yes thats right but a large percentage of tourists rent condos, stay airbnb etc, then its not a hotel responsability.

 

TM30 is "owner, house master or possessor" , says so right there on the form. 

 

People need to let go of this idea that its the owner or landlords responsibility, its just not the case. possessor is anyone who occupies a place.

Unless a farang actually owns the place themselves it is the condo owner, air bnb owner, Thai wife/ family responsibility. It is they that get the fine for not doing it.

I did mine because it was easier than having my wife take time off work.

 

The law means the owner, regardless of what your interpretation of "possessor" is. What does it say in Thai, which is the only valid language to use when referring to the law?

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, wealthychef said:

 

What a childish and evil idea.  

Still wearing the saffron coloured glasses then?

[gunderhill]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

What does it say in Thai, which is the only valid language to use when referring to the law?

hey you should  know its  your responsibility to not be ignorant of the law

[pookondee]

17 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Sorry but you are wrong. A TOURIST is not responsible for doing a TM 30, a TOURIST is NOT breaking the law by not doing one.

TM 30 is and always has been the responsibility of the dwelling owner. Where expats are involved is when they live in their own or the family dwelling. If an expat lives in an hotel, they are not required to do TM 30 as that is the responsibility of the hotel.

I think the issue arised from another poster who claims short stay tourists are being fined, and/or needing a TM30 to get an extension of a simple tourist visa the Jomtien immigration office.

 

The same poster also states that long term expats at Jomtien are NOT being asked/fined for TM30 violations.

[smutcakes]

If the online system worked efficiently i would have absolutely no problem registering my guests etc when they come to stay, or registering my return. The problems parts are when visiting friends in other provinces and having to spend/waste time trying to register the stay there. I even thought you may need to the title deed of the house owner which of course creates more and more problems if they themselves rented.

 

In essence i dont mind doing the TM30, but they need to create and efficient system to allow people to do it easily online, with an effective application. They also need to make document requirements realistic and not to burdensome on owners.

[wealthychef]

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

Still wearing the saffron coloured glasses then?

 

I was referring to your idea that revenge is a good idea.  That's a stupid and malicious frame of mind.  

[EricTh]

Of course, it is not that hard because he doesn't need to do it and doesn't see the other point of view.

 

That's just like native English speakers saying 'learning English is easy' or native Thai speaker saying 'learning Thai is easy'.

 

Thai people find learning English difficult and vice versa.

 

[poohy]

4 hours ago, tgw said:

hey, if TM30 is not that hard, then why don't they extend it to Thais ?

 

Because if brain capacity for the average Thai was dynamite it wouldn't blow the wax out of their ears.

And this certainly applies to bunch of **ts running Immigration.. oh and the country in general

[gunderhill]

2 minutes ago, wealthychef said:

 

I was referring to your idea that revenge is a good idea.  That's a stupid and malicious frame of mind.  

see  it  a  lot  in  Thailand often  years  later

[Peterw42]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Unless a farang actually owns the place themselves it is the condo owner, air bnb owner, Thai wife/ family responsibility. It is they that get the fine for not doing it.

I did mine because it was easier than having my wife take time off work.

 

The law means the owner, regardless of what your interpretation of "possessor" is. What does it say in Thai, which is the only valid language to use when referring to the law?

Its not my interpretation, here is what the immigration act says

 

Section 4 “House Master” means any persons who is the chief possessor of a house , whether in the capacity of owner , tenant , or in any other capacity whatsoever , in accordance with the law on people act.

 

Section 38 : The house – master , the owner or the possessor of the residence , or the hotel manager where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed , must notify the competent official of the Immigration Office located in the same area with that hours , dwelling place or hotel, within 24 hours

 

Insert the housemaster definition into section 38 and it reads as follows.

 

any persons who is the chief possessor of a house , whether in the capacity of owner , tenant , or in any other capacity whatsoever , or the hotel manager where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed , must notify the competent official of the Immigration Office located in the same area with that hours , dwelling place or hotel, within 24 hours

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, wealthychef said:

 

I was referring to your idea that revenge is a good idea.  That's a stupid and malicious frame of mind.  

It wasn't my idea, but I agree that Thais should be subject to the same inconveniences in our countries as they visit on us in theirs.

That's hardly revenge. 

I used to get 90 days visa exempt at the Thai border with unlimited back to back entries. Thailand cancelled that when my country cancelled Thai visa exempt entries there. Tit for Tat.

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, jamesbbkk said:

It is a usufruct which is similar to a life estate. It is not a sufficient notice for these purposes though one might think it could be recognized for efficiency. More efficiency might reduce government jobs though.

What the actual fuzz?

[OJAS]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Chris Larkin, director of the Australian Chamber of Commerce, who was also on the panel, suggested that immigration should make the pink ID card more accessible to foreigners and that it could potentially be used as a replacement for TM30, TM28 and TM47 (90 day reporting).

Problem here, though, is that pink ID cards (in common with yellow house books) are issued by amphurs which operate in completely separate organisational structures to immigration offices. "Joined-up government" is a concept which the powers-that-be here in LOS clearly have a considerable struggle in grasping.

[Colabamumbai]

We will go away before it will. Third world thinking. 

[Colabamumbai]

Push the boundaries for change.