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Video: TM30: Thailand’s controversial immigration laws and their consequences - FCCT event

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33 minutes ago, Psimbo said:

I seem to remember years ago the police in france used to go around all the hotels at night and collect copies of the registration cards- no one ever seemed to have a problem with that, I don't know if it still happens- one would think it is computerised if they do. Reporting is hardly a drama unless you make one out of it. 

hotels in Thailand supposedly report when you stay and they are supposed to.  No problems with that.  The problem is when somebody moves around, returns to their own rented or owned condo from visiting another province, or if a person goes and stays at a friend's house as some locals or expats do.  And there are other situations where the technicals get iffy.  Many landlords of smaller places don't want to go to immigration with you or give you letters or copies of their ID and leases etc.  And the individual IOs some of which seem to make up stuff can get frustrating

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I remember my first trip to real Burma back in 1987.. I think a tourist could only stay for 7-10 days and all your travel by bus (or songthaew) or train had to be booked and paid through a government tourism office, as well as recording all your accommodation which had to be approved.. You also had to bring in a minimum of USD for each day which had to be exchanged into local Kyat at official rates.. Any excess and you could change on the black market at about a 10x better exchange rate.. The former government knew every tourist's moves, itinerary and accommodation from arrival.. 

But today's Myanmar is free of most restrictions, unlike Thai's TM30.. 

 

The same year 1987 visited the former USSR for 10 days, part of an organised tour through former Leningrad, Moscow, Minsk and Smolensk.. A local guide accompanied the tour 24/7, usually a university student, and would have to make a daily report. All hotels had gated security with uniformed guards to prevent any westerners from leaving the hotel solo after hours.. I remember then, going to Gorky Park, seeing an undercover agent in a trench coat reading a newspaper observing our group.. He appeared at 2 other locations that day.. Paranoia plus.. 

Today's Russia, as free and liberal as most European countries.. 

 

I'm thinking that Thailand's current immigration and TM30 reporting would be amongst the toughest worldwide, with perhaps the exception of North Korea.. 

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37 minutes ago, Psimbo said:

I seem to remember years ago the police in france used to go around all the hotels at night and collect copies of the registration cards- no one ever seemed to have a problem with that, I don't know if it still happens- one would think it is computerised if they do. Reporting is hardly a drama unless you make one out of it. 

Years ago we owned slaves in the USA.

 

Times change. It’s the digital age and their apps and websites are terrible.  There are better ways. Besides, they already have their forms from our entry and 90 day check in.

 

That said, just pay the damn fine. You all probably spend much more per month in beer, smokes, and other useless garbage.

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1 hour ago, Jonathan Fairfield said:

 

Last week I was told that the idea of TM30 originates from Russia. They have or had something very similar which required foreigners to report whenever they stayed somewhere other than their registered address overnight. 

Everything is copied from the commies, the resident registration book (blue book) is similar to the chinese one, you wouldn't be able to get out from your province without that. I remember end of '90 was touring south china and our tour guide got panicked when realized he was not carrying that with him during a police check. I can't remember how that ended up for him though.. 🤔

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12 minutes ago, bipper said:

I wonder just wonder would a terrorist stay anywhere a TM30 was a requirement? Rocket science 🤔

No but they will need to apply for a terrorist visa. 

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3 minutes ago, owenm said:

I remember my first trip to real Burma back in 1987.. I think a tourist could only stay for 7-10 days and all your travel by bus (or songthaew) or train had to be booked and paid through a government tourism office, as well as recording all your accommodation which had to be approved.. You also had to bring in a minimum of USD for each day which had to be exchanged into local Kyat at official rates.. Any excess and you could change on the black market at about a 10x better exchange rate.. The former government knew every tourist's moves, itinerary and accommodation from arrival.. 

But today's Myanmar is free of most restrictions, unlike Thai's TM30.. 

 

The same year 1987 visited the former USSR for 10 days, part of an organised tour through former Leningrad, Moscow, Minsk and Smolensk.. A local guide accompanied the tour 24/7, usually a university student, and would have to make a daily report. All hotels had gated security with uniformed guards to prevent any westerners from leaving the hotel solo after hours.. I remember then, going to Gorky Park, seeing an undercover agent in a trench coat reading a newspaper observing our group.. He appeared at 2 other locations that day.. Paranoia plus.. 

Today's Russia, as free and liberal as most European countries.. 

 

I'm thinking that Thailand's current immigration and TM30 reporting would be amongst the toughest worldwide, with perhaps the exception of North Korea.. 

I don't think it is the toughest worldwide but Thais always have been xenophobic to the extreme in order to keep their ultra corrupt society to themselves maybe.

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Electronic monitoring is just a step away.  Did you buy and register a Thai SIM card?  If so, it is trivial for them to be able to figure out what cell tower and consequently where your phone is located.  Of course that does not mean that you are where your phone is

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1 hour ago, SammyT said:

Pretty much just here to see the ranting of angry expats. My TM30 reporting takes up a few hours each year. It's not ideal, but it is what it is. 

It’s not a great system but I agree. I don’t think the majority of expats move around that much and as much as it’s a nuisance, it’s not a regular nuisance. I’d wildly guess that it severely affects less than 10% of expats.

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Arrival card has your address on it

Every time you extend your visa you give your address

Every 90 days you have to report you give your address

Every hotel you stay in reports your stay

And now you have to make sure to report it again when you arrive home after you probably already gave them your address on the arrival card

 

Totally makes sense 🙂

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Wow! Interesting assemblage. Wasn’t there another controversial thai enactment article introduced declaring; no gatherings of 5 or more people can take place anywhere? Perchance powers that be, could bring it into effect again and swoop in and stop club meetings such as this event?

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47 minutes ago, Psimbo said:

I seem to remember years ago the police in france used to go around all the hotels at night and collect copies of the registration cards- no one ever seemed to have a problem with that, I don't know if it still happens- one would think it is computerised if they do. Reporting is hardly a drama unless you make one out of it. 

 It is not a drama at all, but  personnaly I do not know how to do it!
I downloaded the TM 30, it seems I cannot fills it myself, I am only a tenant, my Thai owner is now far away, I see her once a year when I pay for the coming year.
I will go on Monday to Samui immigration trying to find the explanation I did not find on TV. 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, bipper said:

I wonder just wonder would a terrorist stay anywhere a TM30 was a requirement? Rocket science 🤔

They would have a fake or stolen passport. I don't have a problem with businesses like hotels and guest houses being required to report, as has been the norm for years, but all this new reporting is pointless as if a criminal is staying with friends, they will never be reported anyway.

As well as being fined for going through an amber light, TM30 is why we are about to go to Mauritius instead of Thailand for our summer holidays. Years ago they would have been small inconveniences but now holidays in Thailand are past their sell by date and Googles Alexa keeps my son in touch with his grandparents.

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What does one do when they take a night train or bus somewhere?

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3 minutes ago, Zack61 said:

What does one do when they take a night train or bus somewhere?

Make sure it's heading for the border!

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