Government hospitals price increase up to almost 400% from 30. 9. 2019

[ratcatcher]

47 minutes ago, Chivas said:

Probably the most ludicrous post I have ever seen on Thaivisa in 14 years.

Possibly one of the more aggressive responses to one of my posts in my 15 years on TVF. The guy was complaining about the increases in hospital fees and citing it as another reason to avoid Thailand in future. I am fully aware of the high costs in western countries like the U.K. and can fully understand why you chose to have your cosmetic dentistry done here. Dental work here is usually very good quality performed by well trained dentists. Well done.

 

Quote (Don't worry, they will swiftly apply the same % increases to their current prices. Goodbye to yet one more reason to visit Thailand.)

[TeaMonkey]

This was no doubt prompted by the Dutch guy successfully suing Hua Hin hospital for overcharging. This is another reason why some people are saying complaining about the TM30 is not going to help matters.

[Chivas]

10 minutes ago, ratcatcher said:

Possibly one of the more aggressive responses to one of my posts in my 15 years on TVF. The guy was complaining about the increases in hospital fees and citing it as another reason to avoid Thailand in future. I am fully aware of the high costs in western countries like the U.K. and can fully understand why you chose to have your cosmetic dentistry done here. Dental work here is usually very good quality performed by well trained dentists. Well done.

 

Quote (Don't worry, they will swiftly apply the same % increases to their current prices. Goodbye to yet one more reason to visit Thailand.)

lol lol lol fella "aggressive".......I said the most "ludicrous" post I had seen in 14 years and frankly completely bizarre. What possible part of "ludicrous" do you not understand here ??

You put an outrageous stupid post over dentistry that anyone who has had any work done here would disagree with and are now completely moving the goalposts and back peddaling.....comedy gold

[Momofarang]

Is there a dentist, or retired dentist, here who could explain the link between the cost of a root canal treatment and the ethnic origin or type of visa of the patient?

[EricTh]

Are the dentist at government hospitals as good as the private dentist?

 

I found that private dentist charge exorbitant prices with mediocre work. 

[Trollmann]

27 minutes ago, Dnyy said:

What the hell?! Why are they making differences for Thais and non-Thais with different types of visa. That's another step backwards. I am Thai, but this is a real shame! So my wife would need to pay more than me and more than someone with a ED/B visa?

 

That's <deleted> really, let the stupid foreigner pay....

When your wife must go to the hospital she and pay double price she is not stupid. It is not about intellect of the people that are forced (maybe because of life thretening illness) and dont have better options to choose. Eventually maybe you have to pay or let your wife die

[worgeordie]

They must have ditched the thought of becoming a medical hub,

if the story is true and prices have actually risen by 400 %,with

prices increased that much ,I am sure Doctors,nurses and other

medical staff will be going to get a big pay rise.....not.

regards Worgeordie

[Satcommlee]

What about tax-paying foreigners, I wonder?  Not sure what this will achieve, could every foreigner now be whisked through the hospital as a fast track case because of the extra money available, with the average poorer Thai having to wait longer as a result?

Many public hospitals give excellent care but waiting lists are long.. will the additional revenue go to improving the public healthcare system?

 

Why the outrage, many countries complain of "immigrants sponging off their healthcare systems" - why should Thailand be any different.

 

 

 

 

 

[HeyHeyHey]

11 minutes ago, Satcommlee said:

Why the outrage, many countries complain of "immigrants sponging off their healthcare systems" - why should Thailand be any different.

Because it's totally different?

 

You get work/relationship or similar visa in Europe, pay one payment for the state health insurance and from that moment any and all procedures are "free" for you.

 

Nothing is free in Thai system anyway even if you live there 20 years with family and pay taxes.

[Trollmann]

Everyone that stays more than 180 days in thaiand have to pay taxes of the money they bring into thailand in one year. So most retirees pay tax to thailand but still have to pay the highest possible rates

[Sheryl]

Everyone that stays more than 180 days in thaiand have to pay taxes of the money they bring into thailand in one year. So most retirees pay tax to thailand but still have to pay the highest possible rates

This is inaccurate.

Money brought into Thailand is taxable only if brought in the same year as it was earned. Savings from prior earnings are not taxable.

In addition Thailand has Double Taxation treaties with most countries. Its agreement with the US explicitly exempts any Thai tax on Social Security and I suspect other countries' agreements contain similar language.

You would be hard pressed to find a single retiree who pays tax (other than VAT) in Thailand.

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[Sheryl]

What about tax-paying foreigners, I wonder?  Not sure what this will achieve, could every foreigner now be whisked through the hospital as a fast track case because of the extra money available, with the average poorer Thai having to wait longer as a result?

Many public hospitals give excellent care but waiting lists are long.. will the additional revenue go to improving the public healthcare system?
 
Why the outrage, many countries complain of "immigrants sponging off their healthcare systems" - why should Thailand be any different.
 
 
 
 
 

If you read prior posts, both Thais and foreigners have long been paying more than the rates in this document which appears to have little connection to actual pricing in government hospitals in practice.

So I would not assume that anything is going to change. Wait and see.

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[Trollmann]

14 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

This is inaccurate.

Money brought into Thailand is taxable only if brought in the same year as it was earned. Savings from prior earnings are not taxable.

In addition Thailand has Double Taxation treaties with most countries. Its agreement with the US explicitly exempts any Thai tax on Social Security and I suspect other countries' agreements contain similar language.

You would be hard pressed to find a single retiree who pays tax (other than VAT) in Thailand.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I pay tax to thailand from pension from my home country brougt into thailand. I pay that tax to thailand but in thailand it has absolutely no benefit, i get nothing back for this money in thailand so it gives my absolutely no benefit to pay tax to thailand. But I get tax deduction in my home country for the part of the pension i pay tax for in thailand. 

[undercover]

This will be the biggest blow to the expat community in years , The TM 30 was a big inconvenience but this hits you in the pocket , The strength of the Thai baht , the out of control inflation rate in the supermarkets , and now this one , the land of smiles is fast becoming the land of gloom and doom .

[samran]

5 hours ago, Satcommlee said:

What about tax-paying foreigners, I wonder?  Not sure what this will achieve, could every foreigner now be whisked through the hospital as a fast track case because of the extra money available, with the average poorer Thai having to wait longer as a result?

Many public hospitals give excellent care but waiting lists are long.. will the additional revenue go to improving the public healthcare system?

 

Why the outrage, many countries complain of "immigrants sponging off their healthcare systems" - why should Thailand be any different.

 

 

 

 

 

If you are a tax payer here - ie working - then you've likely got a social security insurance card which covers medical at hospitals in the network.

[MikeN]

While scrolling through the pdf price list, most of the procedures were a mystery to me, but 1 that I did see was female circumcision ! I guess that must be allowed for the Muslims ?...a bargain at 3000 /6000 baht, and which was the same price as a toe or thumb amputation !

[NightSky]

On 9/1/2019 at 10:49 PM, Trollmann said:

making a comment like this without any detailed examples makes it difficult for other People to verify that you actually have done Your homework correct. Please give further details of exaclywhat has decreased in price with old and New price. Did you compare with the prices from the green book published by the MOPH in 2017? 

 

The information you are sharing is all good although if I may mention its unfair to doubt Sheryl on these matters since she has a lot of credibility, mainly..

 

- a global moderators tag

- Over 18,000 likes on ThaiVisa

- Over 27,000 posts on ThaiVisa

- history of helping everyone out with medical questions an concerns

- years of history of generally helping people

 

The fact that you only have about 70 likes and your ThaiVisa name is 'Trollman' I tend to trust Sheryl's judgement ????

 

Good post though, very interesting. Although because I am unable to read Thai, Sheryl's comments have made me feel a lot better knowing someone with lots of experience has looked over the document.

 

[NightSky]

 

35 minutes ago, samran said:

If you are a tax payer here - ie working - then you've likely got a social security insurance card which covers medical at hospitals in the network.

 

I paid taxes in Thailand for many years and I'm not allowed a social fund card. I was owner and director of a Thai company. Only employees can get the social fund. Another ridiculous rule.

[NightSky]

5 hours ago, Trollmann said:

I pay tax to thailand from pension from my home country brougt into thailand. I pay that tax to thailand but in thailand it has absolutely no benefit, i get nothing back for this money in thailand so it gives my absolutely no benefit to pay tax to thailand. But I get tax deduction in my home country for the part of the pension i pay tax for in thailand. 

What you have described is a duel tax treaty so you don't pay tax twice but only once, If you didn't pay tax in Thailand on that income which you say is liable then you would still be liable to pay the source country.

[Selatan]

Am I reading it correctly? 6,800 bahts for root canal treatment, 950 bahts for tooth filling? And those rates are for Thais at a Thai gov hospital? Unbelievable.

 

As a Malaysian, I am charged 1 ringgit (7.26 baht) for a tooth extraction, 2 ringgits for scaling or filling and 4 ringgits for root canal treatment at a Malaysian gov dental clinic.

 

[mommysboy]

17 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

I am not comparing to any books but to what people, in my experience, actually pay.

 

I have been assisting people in using govt hospitals for 2 decades now.

 

For example -- to cite just two :

 

mitral valve replacement in govt hospital 15 years ago was a little over 100,000 baht. The attachment pegs it at only 56,250.

 

appendectomy in government hospital last year 20,000; the attachment lists only 10,000.

 

cataract surgery in govt hospital, less than a year ago, 18,000 (not included pre and post op care); the attachment lists 8,500

 

same true of over a dozen procedures/operations I checked

 

Either actual charges have never followed official lists, or these lists are giving prices that are not all inclusive but rather a surgical fee with separate charges for medications, tests, doctor visits, surgeon fees, room etc etc in which case it tells you very  little about total cost of anything. Or a mixture of the two. I suspect the latter.

 

 

Yes, I concur that a simple appendectomy at Surat Thani Hospital was about 18000 baht 2 years ago, and around 35000 at a private hospital.

[lopburi3]

7 hours ago, Selatan said:

Am I reading it correctly? 6,800 bahts for root canal treatment, 950 bahts for tooth filling? And those rates are for Thais at a Thai gov hospital? Unbelievable.

 

As a Malaysian, I am charged 1 ringgit (7.26 baht) for a tooth extraction, 2 ringgits for scaling or filling and 4 ringgits for root canal treatment at a Malaysian gov dental clinic.

 

The price would be for Thai obtaining service out of area (paid basis) - if a Thai uses their assigned or referred hospital (most cases) there is no charge or max of 30 baht.  

[undercover]

8 hours ago, samran said:

whisked through the hospital as a fast track case because of the extra money available, with the average poorer Thai having to wait longer as a result?

Good luck with that one , Even in 7/11 the Thais are served first.

[undercover]

7 hours ago, Selatan said:

Am I reading it correctly? 6,800 bahts for root canal treatment, 950 bahts for tooth filling? And those rates are for Thais at a Thai gov hospital? Unbelievable.

 

As a Malaysian, I am charged 1 ringgit (7.26 baht) for a tooth extraction, 2 ringgits for scaling or filling and 4 ringgits for root canal treatment at a Malaysian gov dental clinic.

 

Seems a heavy price 950 for a filling , Malaysia on the other hand gets a thumbs up . Whats the two tiered pricing system like over there for foreigners  ?

[soalbundy]

On 9/1/2019 at 12:51 PM, Airalee said:

Colonoscopy is only ฿4000 for foreigners.

 

Would be 30-50x as much in the US.

That's news to me, 10 years ago in CM I was charged 17,000 Baht (Ram 1)

[Sheryl]

Am I reading it correctly? 6,800 bahts for root canal treatment, 950 bahts for tooth filling? And those rates are for Thais at a Thai gov hospital? Unbelievable.
 
As a Malaysian, I am charged 1 ringgit (7.26 baht) for a tooth extraction, 2 ringgits for scaling or filling and 4 ringgits for root canal treatment at a Malaysian gov dental clinic.
 

Under three complementary schemes all Thais have access to free health care (or care for a token 30 baht) though usually at only one designated hospital (or higher level facilty it refers to if unable to provide the needed care). They pay full price only if they choose to go elsewhere without a letter of referral. The vast majority of health care for Thais is thus independent of whatever the hospital's price list says.

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[Sheryl]

That's news to me, 10 years ago in CM I was charged 17,000 Baht (Ram 1)

The discussion concerns only government hospitals not private. Colonoscopy at private hospitals these days runs 22 - 35k.

And at govt hospitals usually around 6000. As explained the prices in this list are less than those currently charged.

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[Sheryl]

That's news to me, 10 years ago in CM I was charged 17,000 Baht (Ram 1)

The discussion concerns only government hospitals not private. Colonoscopy at private hospitals these days runs 22 - 35k.

And at govt hospitals usually around 6000. As explained the prices in this list are less than those currently charged.

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[Airalee]

4 hours ago, soalbundy said:

That's news to me, 10 years ago in CM I was charged 17,000 Baht (Ram 1)

That’s from the linked PDF that the OP posted.

[Airalee]

3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

The discussion concerns only government hospitals not private. Colonoscopy at private hospitals these days runs 22 - 35k.

And at govt hospitals usually around 6000. As explained the prices in this list are less than those currently charged.

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16k out the door for colonoscopy last year at Vichaiyut