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TM 30: immigration didn't ask for it


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42 minutes ago, edwardflory said:

Check the regulations.  YOU are responsible to see that ALL your paperwork is in order.  YES, the landlord, owner, Thai wife or GF you live with is supposed to do..But YOU pay the fine, and there is a ding on YOUR record.  Do a 90 day? File the TM-30 the same day.

Wrong, the TM30 is a form to be filled out by the landlord. They allow the foreigner to do it if you bring the landlords house book, copy of id card, etc but really you're doing it on his behalf.

 

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Went also today to CW office for my extension of stay based on marriage (for the tenth year), not a word was spoken about TM30. What surprised me was the number of people was the lowest I have seen all this years (half of the seats in that waiting section were empty) and also the officer has not requested to see any of the original documents plus no visit to the supervisor desk who usually double checks the documents processed from the receiving officer. Not bad for a Friday the 13th ????

 

Also did a 90 days report while I was there since I wouldn't be able to do it online as my passport had been renewed recently. Again no mention of TM30.

Edited by kotsak
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Have done a 90 day report a couple of months ago and just last week got the marriage extension at Nan Immigration...no TM30 was mentioned. We had the supporting docs ready in case requested but were going to push back on any fine since in March when I got a single re-entry permit they told us it was not required.

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37 minutes ago, kotsak said:

Went also today to CW office for my extension of stay based on marriage (for the tenth year), not a word was spoken about TM30. What surprised me was the number of people was the lowest I have seen all this years (half of the seats in that waiting section were empty) and also the officer has not requested to see any of the original documents plus no visit to the supervisor desk who usually double checks the documents processed from the receiving officer. Not bad for a Friday the 13th ????

 

Also did a 90 days report while I was there since I wouldn't be able to do it online as my passport had been renewed recently. Again no mention of TM30.

Re extension of stay > when the IO checks the TM30 database - which he is supposed to do for approval of an extension of stay - and sees that you are in compliance, he will not mention it (why should he).

If you are not in compliance with TM30 and your application for extension of stay is approved, you are lucky that you have a provincial IO that is not strictly adhering to the book.

Re 90 day report > TM30 compliance is NOT checked when doing a 90 day report, so obviously it is not mentioned. 

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45 minutes ago, BoganInParasite said:

Have done a 90 day report a couple of months ago and just last week got the marriage extension at Nan Immigration...no TM30 was mentioned. We had the supporting docs ready in case requested but were going to push back on any fine since in March when I got a single re-entry permit they told us it was not required.

Same comment as for Kotsak's post

Re extension of stay > when the IO checks the TM30 database - which he is supposed to do for approval of an extension of stay - and sees that you are in compliance, he will not mention it (why should he).

If you are not in compliance with TM30 and your application for extension of stay is approved, you are lucky that you have a provincial IO that is not strictly adhering to the book.

Re 90 day report > TM30 compliance is NOT checked when doing a 90 day report, so obviously it is not mentioned. 

Edited by Peter Denis
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43 minutes ago, Rastaputin said:

So, in my case (Married to Thai, and holder of WP), am I supposed to simultaneously report and non-report my movements now, under the light of some of the interpretations of this published announcement?
#SchroedingersFarang

This announcement is nothing new, it has been like this since 40 years

The landlord / possessor of the place where you stay has to report you with a TM30.

In case you stay in Thailand with a visa/extension based on marriage (in case it's based on working, then you are exempt from this) you have to submit a TM28 every time you stay somewhere else.

Edited by jackdd
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5 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

As long as it is recorded on database no such information has been required at CW - only if there is no report on file for you being at the location you have on the paperwork being submitted are other things required (in order to make a current TM30 report).

 

That's not consistent with my experience at BKK CW back in July....

 

I had filed a TM30 by mail in January 2019, and got the receipt back in the mail, after returning from a trip outside Thailand. I didn't do any domestic or international travel after that until I went to renew my retirement extension at CW in July.

 

One of the first things the extensions officer asked me after entering into her cubicle and handing over my application paperwork was whether I had filed a TM30, and once I told her I had, she wanted to see a copy of my TM30 receipt. Which she promptly photocopied onto the same page as my 90-day reporting receipt, and included in my pile of extension paperwork.

 

That was CW back in July. Whether it's the same today, obviously, is anyone's guess.

 

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15 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

That's not consistent with my experience at BKK CW back in July....

 

I had filed a TM30 by mail in January 2019, and got the receipt back in the mail, after returning from a trip outside Thailand. I didn't do any domestic or international travel after that until I went to renew my retirement extension at CW in July.

 

One of the first things the extensions officer asked me after entering into her cubicle and handing over my application paperwork was whether I had filed a TM30, and once I told her I had, she wanted to see a copy of my TM30 receipt. Which she promptly photocopied onto the same page as my 90-day reporting receipt, and included in my pile of extension paperwork.

 

That was CW back in July. Whether it's the same today, obviously, is anyone's guess.

 

Poster was talking about items needed for TM-30 reporting rather than receipt - I added that receipt should be attached to passport and indeed mine was in June when I did extension.  But no new report was required so the mentioned items were not needed.  Believe officer actually did print out a copy of the TM-30 report and have me come back in to sign it after approving paperwork and telling me to wait for passport (things were a bit confused/confusing in June).

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8 hours ago, edwardflory said:

YES, the landlord, owner, Thai wife or GF you live with is supposed to do a ..(edit for clarity).. TM-30

ALSO it is a fact WHAT IO you go to is a MAJOR factor with ANY paperwork required for anything.

Example: one office wanted a friends lease before they would let him do a TM-47 - at SAME address 12 years - a residence hotel.  Nowhere in any law, regulation or police order is this required! ... another friend has not done a TM-30 in 16 years, ... another friend was fined 27000THB ( I've seen the receipt ) because ALL his paperwork was not in order - a condo owner.

 

You did not read what i was replying to or my reply was not clear, see my edit in the box.

 

I have PERSONALLY done TM-30's for every change of address OUT of the IO district with the following paperwork: Passport, rental and deposit receipts, utility receipts stating the START date of service - broadband receipt with INSTALL date. I move on a Friday after 18:00, go to the new IO Monday morning.

I sign the paperwork for the TM-30 as POSSESSOR - strike out the other 2 titles on signature line. I  also file a TM-28 and 47 at the same time. Fastest time 12 minutes in BKK to BKK ( 4 years ago one person all paperwork ) - 1st in the door, longest time about 3 hours.

 

I have never had any problems filing, and have always be treated politely.

 

Again, it is YOUR responsibility to see that YOUR paperwork is up to date, YOU get the fine and ding on YOUR immigration records.

 

Edited by edwardflory
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15 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

No it does not and is really nothing new.

It only applies to these two paragraphs in section 37 of the immigration act for address reporting (TM28).

 

"3. Shall notify the police official of the local police station where such alien resides, within twenty
– four hours from the time of arrival. In the case of change in residence in which new residence is not
located the same area with the former police stations , such alien must notify the police official of the
police station for that area within twenty – four hours from the time of arrival.
4. If the alien travels to any province and will stay there longer than twenty – four hours , such
alien must notify the police official of the police station for that area within forty – eight hours from the time
of arrival."

As shown in this paragraph of section 37.

"The provision of ( 3 ) and ( 4 ) shall not apply to any cases under Section 34 by any conditions as
prescribed by the Director General."

 

 

Thanks Joe. There seems to be a lot of speculation about what this means. Appreciate the insight.

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Funny not this year but last time I got my retirement visa done in CM it was a relieving door. I was fined I think 1800 Baht because the hotel did not file one for me in BKK when I arrived.

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16 hours ago, fredob43 said:

Just been to my local IO Kamphaeng Phet 90 day report. Asked about the TM30 and they said only needs to be done once, if I leave the country. After that no need as long as I stay in Thailand. Seems they don't want the aggro of doing it??? 


Exactly what I was told on the same occasion in Nakhon Ratchasima. "Only when leaving the country."

 

 

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13 minutes ago, hkt83100 said:


Exactly what I was told on the same occasion in Nakhon Ratchasima. "Only when leaving the country."

 

 

I assure you that is not true what so ever!  They might of said that but if you move around in Thailand you will get nailed and it is a major headache.

Not only that but I have been refused my 90 day reports because I was traveling?

The information on TV is not very reliable. Don't listen to immigration if you live there and don't travel. Believe me it is a major problem now.

Edited by garyk
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16 hours ago, ukrules said:

As far as I'm concerned they have no business asking any foreigner about a TM30 from anybody who rents.

 

It's the responsibility of the landlord, they should be chasing the landlord, not refusing anything based on something that's not under the foreigners control. This would be different if you own your apartment of course.

 

It's a Thai thing for Thai people. The Thais often refuse to do the paperwork so they should be fined - there should not be any penalty for the person doing the 90 day report - ever.

 

This is the problem with TM30 enforcement - they're enforcing it against the wrong person. They should get off their lazy asses and go out and fine the Thais who fail to adhere to their own dumb law.

If the hotel fails to complete a TM30 for the foreigner, is immigration going to fine the guest?

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25 minutes ago, Longcut said:

If the hotel fails to complete a TM30 for the foreigner, is immigration going to fine the guest?

They fined me in CM. And I saved the receipt from the hotel. Because they told me the online reporting did not work! Did not matter to them what so ever.

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33 minutes ago, Longcut said:

If the hotel fails to complete a TM30 for the foreigner, is immigration going to fine the guest?

Comes down to the office but not usually, they may ask for proof you are staying at the hotel, then in theory they will chase up the hotel.

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17 hours ago, ukrules said:

As far as I'm concerned they have no business asking any foreigner about a TM30 from anybody who rents.

 

It's the responsibility of the landlord, they should be chasing the landlord, not refusing anything based on something that's not under the foreigners control. This would be different if you own your apartment of course.

 

It's a Thai thing for Thai people. The Thais often refuse to do the paperwork so they should be fined - there should not be any penalty for the person doing the 90 day report - ever.

 

This is the problem with TM30 enforcement - they're enforcing it against the wrong person. They should get off their lazy asses and go out and fine the Thais who fail to adhere to their own dumb law.

Its not just the Landlord is responsible, It owner, housemaster or possessor is responsible.

If you are a long term tenant, have a lease in place etc, immigration consider you just as responsible.

 

Nothing in the legislation even mentions the landlord as responsible.

 

Section 38 : The house – master , the owner or the possessor of the residence , or the hotel manager where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed , must notify the competent official of the Immigration Office located in the same area with that house , dwelling place or hotel, within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien concerned.

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2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Comes down to the office but not usually, they may ask for proof you are staying at the hotel, then in theory they will chase up the hotel.

In CM 1.5 years ago they refused my RV because of this. I am sure some of you guys remember. At the old mall, I was told to go up stairs to straighten it out. It was so crowded I had to take a number to get fined. So it happens allot.

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14 hours ago, ukrules said:

Wrong, the TM30 is a form to be filled out by the landlord. They allow the foreigner to do it if you bring the landlords house book, copy of id card, etc but really you're doing it on his behalf.

 

Section 38 : The house – master , the owner or the possessor of the residence , or the hotel manager where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed , must notify the competent official of the Immigration Office located in the same area with that hours , dwelling place or hotel, within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien concerned.

 

“House Master” means any persons who is the chief possessor of a house , whether in the capacity of owner , tenant , or in any other capacity whatsoever , in accordance with the law on people act.

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3 hours ago, hkt83100 said:
  20 hours ago, fredob43 said:

Just been to my local IO Kamphaeng Phet 90 day report. Asked about the TM30 and they said only needs to be done once, if I leave the country. After that no need as long as I stay in Thailand. Seems they don't want the aggro of doing it??? 

 

3 hours ago, hkt83100 said:

Exactly what I was told on the same occasion in Nakhon Ratchasima. "Only when leaving the country."

I do not doubt that fredob43 & hkt83100 did receive that response from their provincial IO.

But it is at odds with many other posts on the subject.

For info:

- TM30 compliance is NOT checked when doing 90 day reporting.

- TM30 compliance is foreseen to be checked when you apply for an extension of stay at your local IO.

If you are in compliance (i.e. a current TM30 is on file of the place you are presently residing when applying for an extension of stay), you will not be queried about it [TM30: immigration didn't ask for it]. 

If you are not in compliance with your TM30 and still your extension of stay is approved, you are simply lucky that you reside in a province where the IO does not strictly follow the book.

Note: If you know that your are not in compliance with TM30, you could consider bringing a copy of the house-book of the place where you are staying, as well as a front-back copy of the ID card of the owner.  That would allow to do the TM30 there on the spot (actually you are doing it then on behalf of the owner), but be prepared to pay the fine for not being in compliance.

 

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On 9/13/2019 at 2:10 PM, bkkatl said:

Strange how it works isn't it? All this news, money spent promoting us to follow the law and when we do-- sometimes its the immigration people who don't do the "right" thing. To much time looking outward by the government and not enough time looking inward. 

As far as I can tell, it is following the law. From what I can see a lot of foreigners have got their knickers in a twist needlessly over TM30, and the people who keep submitting them over and over again seem to be doing it unnecessary and potentially causing a problem for everyone else by normalising doing something that seems to be usually unnecessary. Where you stay is not where you live, which is your residence.

I have yet to meet anyone who had to keep doing countless TM30s, one every other day, but there seem to be a lot of people going on about it online, who don't seem to have read and understood what the law says.

Edited by CaptainNemo
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23 hours ago, Snackbar said:

Has always been and will always be hurdles to jump through. Same in every country.

 

Observe the dress code and cultural nuances and they’ll leave you in peace.

 

BTW, Paying tea money is a criminal offense.

:blink:

It's like you just beamed down from another planet, clueless about recent events here on Earth.

 

Edited by 55Jay
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7 hours ago, hkt83100 said:


Exactly what I was told on the same occasion in Nakhon Ratchasima. "Only when leaving the country."

Was that the girls in the 90-day report office, or the staff assigned to the two TM30 desks inside the main office?  I can only presume those 2 desks are still there, they were middle of last month.

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22 hours ago, CaptainNemo said:

Where you stay is not where you live, which is your residence.

As I understand it - but please correct me if I am wrong - having a current TM30 filed is only of relevance when you are applying for your extension of stay.  Your provincial IO will then check if a TM30 has been filed from the location where you are currently staying.  And that does NOT need to be your residence (home/condo), but can also be a Hotel. 

 

22 hours ago, CaptainNemo said:

I have yet to meet anyone who had to keep doing countless TM30s, one every other day, but there seem to be a lot of people going on about it online, who don't seem to have read and understood what the law says.

Indeed, when you are doing many trips outside your province, having to update your TM30 each time you return to your residence can be quite a hassle.  And although it is the intention of the law, there is actually no need to file an updated TM30 after each and every trip.  Just ensure that a current TM30 of the place where you are staying is on file, when you visit your provincial IO for extension of stay.

 

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22 hours ago, CaptainNemo said:

Where you stay is not where you live, which is your residence.

Under Thai law people who are allowed to stay in Thailand temporarily only have a place where they currently stay.

A hotel has the same weight as your wife's house or any other place.

Only a permanent resident has a "residence".

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