Accept pattaya for why the city was created or lose the $£€

[RoadWarrior371]

3 hours ago, LennyW said:

It's quite amazing from all the replies on here...people still dont understand there is much more to the Pattaya area than beach road, walking street and Soi 6!!

A lot of posters here could not survive in Thailand or live in Pattaya for financial reasons, and just hang around the forum as some kind of face saving attempt.  Who says they didn't learn something from the Thais.  ????

[Isaan sailor]

Many diversified groups can lay claim to founding Pattaya through the years.  And the way I see it, it’s the bar girls who built up this town. Without them, what would Pattaya have become?

[shdmn]

7 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Go again. The one on the seaside is all dug up due to the drainage project. On the land side they are all blocked by hawkers, tarts and confused looking people. I perhaps need to ask if you have ever visited... as you don't seem to know. 

So you are complaining about the flooding while simultaneously complaining about the dug up streets to fix the flooding.  And you somehow think people will find this contradictory whining credible?

[kingofthemountain]

12 hours ago, shdmn said:

...But there are probably more beer bars and gogos than ever now....

 

Things are more spread out now because Pattaya has grown....

Obviously you was not here 20 years ago, nor 10 years ago

i can assure you more than half of the bar have disappeared in the period

(All the sois beetwen second road and beach road was beer bar zones, from walking street to Naklua

and same thing for all the sois between second road and soi bukhao)

and nope the bars have not spread, on the contrary the play areas have been reduced.

 

But yes we can still have fun

[newnative]

5 hours ago, LennyW said:

It's quite amazing from all the replies on here...people still dont understand there is much more to the Pattaya area than beach road, walking street and Soi 6!!

    Thank you and well said.  That's it in a nutshell.  There is much more to Pattaya than Soi 6 and Walking Street--and it's all much more important, as well.  Pattaya can and will still have its adult entertainment areas but the real growth is coming from a new tourist demographic that is sustaining big projects like Terminal 21--and the new ones on the drawing boards.

      Yes, Pattaya is a mess right now with all the roadwork and flood prevention work being done but it will, hopefully, go towards making Pattaya a better place to visit and live.   I do like that so many Thai Visa posters are ambidextrous--on the one hand viciously criticizing Pattaya when it floods (why can't they DO something!) and then, on the other hand, being just as critical when any work is being done.

[Hanuman2547]

6 hours ago, LennyW said:

It's quite amazing from all the replies on here...people still dont understand there is much more to the Pattaya area than beach road, walking street and Soi 6!!

That's right!  There's Soi Buakhao, Soi Lengkhee, and LK Metro.

[kingofthemountain]

11 hours ago, shdmn said:

Ah yes the Thailand can't do anything right narrative. What exactly is a semi-failure about the new beach?  Btw, they planned for the washouts in select areas, hench why the sidewalk is shaped like a spillway in those areas or have you not noticed that?  Have you also not noticed how they fill that back in the next day?  So most people don't even notice.  Hardly a failure. 

 

If it sucks so bad here why not move to the Philippines?  It's cheaper and the infrastructure sucks much more there, so you will have even more things to enjoy complaining about.

 

Were you also one of the many serial whiners here saying the Pattaya Klang tunnel was totally going to be a failure and will flood every time it rains?  Or how T21 will totally be a failure.  Or how everything else they are doing will totally be a failure.

Obviously you didn't know the old walk along beach road and how it was nice to sit on the benches

in the middle of the flowers. And the new walk pavement is already broked in a lot of place, dur to the bad quality work and the flood, have you noticed?  And for the beach yes it was necessary, but not with such a width and at this abusive price, anyway we have already the sand going again into the sea at every heavy rain with a large gradient all along, have you noticied it also? 

 

A lot of things sucks here, i have not reason to paint it pink, but a lot of good times too and nice people, so i do not going to move in the phil or anywhere, and i am not give in to your injuction junta style ''shut up or move out'', sorry if you are not happy with that. 

Pattaya klang tunnel is a good thing, even if the building was an endless nightmare.

I don't know what T21 is doing here in your post, it's a private building and have nothing to do with the authorities,

But yes it's a success too, even if i am not a big fan of the mails, shopping in pricey places is not one of my hobbies.

[kingofthemountain]

20 minutes ago, newnative said:

 ....but the real growth is coming from a new tourist demographic that is sustaining big projects like Terminal 21--and the new ones on the drawing boards....

hoo yeahhhh

millions of tourists are flooding soon in Pattaya to discouver the fabulous new mail T21

 

seriously do you work for TAT of something like that?

 

What the ''new ones on the drawing boards'' are?

 

(Sound a little bit for me like the Hitler's secrets weapons to win the war when all is lost)

[kingofthemountain]

6 hours ago, LennyW said:

It's quite amazing from all the replies on here...people still dont understand there is much more to the Pattaya area than beach road, walking street and Soi 6!!

Are you here for the temples or the scuba diving?

[newnative]

21 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

hoo yeahhhh

millions of tourists are flooding soon in Pattaya to discouver the fabulous new mail T21

 

seriously do you work for TAT of something like that?

 

What the ''new ones on the drawing boards'' are?

 

(Sound a little bit for me like the Hitler's secrets weapons to win the war when all is lost)

   Actually, it's the other way around.  The 'fabulous mall T21' was built because of the 'millions of tourists' already coming to Pattaya.  And, no, you don't need to work for TAT--you just need a pair of eyes and get out and about and see what's going on away from Soi 6 and Walking Street.

    It will be interesting to see what goes in on the big, empty Chang lot on Beach Road, as well as the property next to Gran Solare Hotel and the redevelopment of the Imperial Hotel.  If you get out to Wong Amat near Cape Dara, some old low-rise resorts have recently been leveled, creating a rather large land plot. Several new, nice boutique hotels have gone in and are being built on some of the side sois.

     We're seeing lot of old and tacky being replaced by new and nicer--just look at the Pattaya Second Road area by T21 as a good example.  Amazing what it was like just a few years ago.  Now we have T21, a remodeled Central Marina, a new addition to Tiffany's, Siam@Siam, Mytt Hotel, a new Amari addition, a new Ozo Hotel nearing completion, and lots of smaller redevelopment.  All for the good, I think.

[kingofthemountain]

49 minutes ago, newnative said:

   Actually, it's the other way around.  The 'fabulous mall T21' was built because of the 'millions of tourists' already coming to Pattaya.  And, no, you don't need to work for TAT--you just need a pair of eyes and get out and about and see what's going on away from Soi 6 and Walking Street.

    It will be interesting to see what goes in on the big, empty Chang lot on Beach Road, as well as the property next to Gran Solare Hotel and the redevelopment of the Imperial Hotel.  If you get out to Wong Amat near Cape Dara, some old low-rise resorts have recently been leveled, creating a rather large land plot. Several new, nice boutique hotels have gone in and are being built on some of the side sois.

     We're seeing lot of old and tacky being replaced by new and nicer--just look at the Pattaya Second Road area by T21 as a good example.  Amazing what it was like just a few years ago.  Now we have T21, a remodeled Central Marina, a new addition to Tiffany's, Siam@Siam, Mytt Hotel, a new Amari addition, a new Ozo Hotel nearing completion, and lots of smaller redevelopment.  All for the good, I think.

You enjoy the big and pricey hotels isn't it?

Sorry but i don't get it, big pricey hotels are for people with a lot of money to spend

and if you have a lot of money why do you come in s h i t hole like Pattaya when you have much

more offers all around the world with a much more better value for money? Explain to me please

[IvorLott]

This has been a good thread. Some valid points made on both sides of the fence. Indeed, Pattaya grew through the money bought in by Western tourists, most of whom were there for the crumpet. Now they find themselves not being catered for due to the influx of tourists from North Asia, Russia and India who now seem to be preferred. 

Being a visitor to Thailand (and Pattaya) for many, many years now, I can recall several 'threatened' swings in the tourism 'dynamic'. Back in the nineties it was going to be the Japanese and Koreans 'taking over', then it was the Russians, then the Indians, then the Chinese and back to the start. This 'cycle' was always being touted by tourism 'experts' while the steady demographic of the Western male continued coming regularly throughout this time, seeing off the 'threat'. Now in 2019 (mainly) due to a strong baht against the 'traditional' tourism currencies from Europe, the USA, Australia, Western tourism is genuinely 'down'. On my recent visits one gripe I have regularly heard from the Thais, especially those in small tourism dependent businesses (shops, bars, independent hotels), is that the current demographics being catered for (North Asia, India and Russia) don't seem to spend 'locally', seemingly ferried from spot to spot, from shopping mall to shopping mall, from luxury hotel to luxury hotel, doing little spending on the ground in between.

At the moment the authorities can look with 'pride' at their tourist arrival figures, yet seem oblivious to the Macroeconomics; namely the  'knock on effects' of such tourism behaviour to grass root businesses, and the money trail from there to the rest of the country. While the numbers of tourists may be 'healthy', the fact that the majority of the money they spend will be going into the pockets of the few, not the many, could well have serious consequences to the rest of the nation unless every Thai in Pattaya gets work in a (foreign owned) hotel or Shopping Centre. Something will have to 'give' if there is not to be a serious repercussion from the current trend, if it continues. 

[jacko45k]

12 hours ago, ianezy0 said:

It is the low season which is the correct time to undertake road, drainage works. When else can they do this? 

They have come out with the claim that it is the end of the budget year, and the money must be spent, so which is it? They even have all the locals complaining that there are too many areas under construction and it is really making things difficult. My ideal is do it once and do it right... the Beach Rd has been under some project or other every few years. Last time it was widening, then it was the Beach reclamation, now it is drainage. And I feel confident it will be under some construction, or water, again, some time soon.  

High season is a month away, it would have made sense to start earlier. 

[jacko45k]

8 hours ago, shdmn said:

So you are complaining about the flooding while simultaneously complaining about the dug up streets to fix the flooding.  And you somehow think people will find this contradictory whining credible?

Ahhh, diversion is it! Fix the flooding you say, a Newbie's optimism. I tell you now, it will be the same as the previous projects, Beach Road will flood again. After seeing the same thing repetitively for many years, I enjoy a good wine. It is actually worse now that it was many years past. 

[ianezy0]

8 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

They have come out with the claim that it is the end of the budget year, and the money must be spent, so which is it? They even have all the locals complaining that there are too many areas under construction and it is really making things difficult. My ideal is do it once and do it right... the Beach Rd has been under some project or other every few years. Last time it was widening, then it was the Beach reclamation, now it is drainage. And I feel confident it will be under some construction, or water, again, some time soon.  

High season is a month away, it would have made sense to start earlier. 

Keep smiling mate. It’s all good ????

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, ianezy0 said:

Keep smiling mate. It’s all good ????

Thanks mate. Just got out of bed and still grumpy. My sunny side will rise with the sun!

[newnative]

7 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

You enjoy the big and pricey hotels isn't it?

Sorry but i don't get it, big pricey hotels are for people with a lot of money to spend

and if you have a lot of money why do you come in s h i t hole like Pattaya when you have much

more offers all around the world with a much more better value for money? Explain to me please

      I like that big and pricey hotels are building in Pattaya. And Terminal 21.  They are all positives--and lead to more positives.  Popularity breeds more popularity.

     I think you already inadvertently  made my point for me regarding your post.  Holiday Inn builds in Pattaya and, after a few years, finds it needs to build a new addition, doubling its size, to meet demand.  Amari Hotel on Beach Road finds it needs to add an all-suites hotel addition to its property to meet the demand of visitors who want a suite, not just a room. Ozo decides it needs to be in Pattaya, as does Mytt Hotel and Siam@Siam.  Centre Point Hotel opens not just 1 hotel at Terminal 21 but another one out on Sukumvit.  Obviously, none of these projects--and Terminal 21--would have happened without the demand first being there.

      So, the answer to your question is, apparently a lot of people with money to spend who could, as you say, go somewhere else, still choose to come to Pattaya and spend their money here.  Which leads me to the explanation that Pattaya may not be the s++thole that some posters think it is.  They're welcome to continue to have that opinion, of course, but it doesn't seem to be stopping people from coming.

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

They have come out with the claim that it is the end of the budget year, and the money must be spent, so which is it? T

It is more to do with the weather than anything else.

What is the point of trying to repair the damage from torrential rain during the torrential rain.

[jacko45k]

17 minutes ago, newnative said:

Obviously, none of these projects--and Terminal 21--would have happened without the demand first being there

Do you thinks so. Or is it a case of 'build it and they will come'? 

I have always regarded Pattaya more of over supply, than fulfilling the demand. There are 20 massage parlours where 10 would prosper, a big new Mall where there is an empty failing one up the street, yet another market selling plastic rubbish. Another lottery or fake watch seller pestering on the heels of the last one.

As to these 5 Stat Hotels, I am unsure of their occupancy numbers, they are very much available at a reduced, but still excessive (for Pattaya) price on Agoda etc. 

[jacko45k]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

It is more to do with the weather than anything else.

What is the point of trying to repair the damage from torrential rain during the torrential rain.

Or trying to put in drainage  amidst the torrents, as they were doing Monday. 

[Leaver]

9 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Do you thinks so. Or is it a case of 'build it and they will come'? 

I have always regarded Pattaya more of over supply, than fulfilling the demand. There are 20 massage parlours where 10 would prosper, a big new Mall where there is an empty failing one up the street, yet another market selling plastic rubbish. Another lottery or fake watch seller pestering on the heels of the last one.

As to these 5 Stat Hotels, I am unsure of their occupancy numbers, they are very much available at a reduced, but still excessive (for Pattaya) price on Agoda etc. 

I agree, and the funny thing is, all these projects were on the drawing board when the majority of tourists to Pattaya were westerners, not Chinese and Indian.

 

Are they even relevant to the current tourist market????

[sandyf]

13 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Or trying to put in drainage  amidst the torrents, as they were doing Monday. 

Pattaya has been fighting the weather and the sea for years and only time will tell if they ever win.

About 17 years ago I went to Pattaya in April and the water was so low you had walk about 200 metres out to the water, Asian tourists not at all happy with the walk out to the speedboats. I took the ferry over to Koh Larne and had to climb on the roof of the boat to get up on to the pier.

The following year the beach had disappeared, the sand was up to the promenade and the deck chairs were at about 30 degrees down to the waters edge.

It is easy to criticise but the elements are against them and it keeps on changing. It must be about 6 years now since the last time our wells went dry during the "dry" season.

[shdmn]

40 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Or trying to put in drainage  amidst the torrents, as they were doing Monday. 

We get it.  Pattaya bad.  Thailand bad.  You can go away now.

[Leaver]

1 minute ago, shdmn said:

We get it.  Pattaya bad.  Thailand bad.  You can go away now.

No need for another pointless "Don't let the door hit you on the way out" post. 

 

What is Pattaya / Thailand doing to compete with other tourist destinations, particularly those in the region?

 

Many issues have existed here for years. 

[NanLaew]

On 9/23/2019 at 7:59 PM, sunnyboy2018 said:

You might glorify poverty and subsistence living because you have never experienced hunger, mindless labour, primitive living and insecurity but those who have prefer wealth, security, salaries,  Air Con, electricity etc etc. 

Yes, I remember the aftermath of tropical storm Allison in Houston in June 2001 when after about 2 days without power and no airconditioning or refrigeration, most gas stations also ran out of fuel. Fridges and freezers full of spoiled food, hungry and hot people and an empty gas tank. On the 3rd day and after some reports of car-jackings, the Department of Public Safety announced that for their own personal safety, if anyone still had gas and was still able to drive, then they'd best stay at home and park the car INSIDE the garage and not on the street. My girlfriend at the time told that two people had been shot at her neighborhood gas station before the gas had ran out.

 

The fragility of civilization as we have grown to know it.

[kingofthemountain]

2 hours ago, newnative said:

      I like that big and pricey hotels are building in Pattaya. And Terminal 21.  They are all positives--and lead to more positives.  Popularity breeds more popularity.

     I think you already inadvertently  made my point for me regarding your post.  Holiday Inn builds in Pattaya and, after a few years, finds it needs to build a new addition, doubling its size, to meet demand.  Amari Hotel on Beach Road finds it needs to add an all-suites hotel addition to its property to meet the demand of visitors who want a suite, not just a room. Ozo decides it needs to be in Pattaya, as does Mytt Hotel and Siam@Siam.  Centre Point Hotel opens not just 1 hotel at Terminal 21 but another one out on Sukumvit.  Obviously, none of these projects--and Terminal 21--would have happened without the demand first being there.

      So, the answer to your question is, apparently a lot of people with money to spend who could, as you say, go somewhere else, still choose to come to Pattaya and spend their money here.  Which leads me to the explanation that Pattaya may not be the s++thole that some posters think it is.  They're welcome to continue to have that opinion, of course, but it doesn't seem to be stopping people from coming.

The big projects have been decided years ago, when the arrival tourists curb was up, particulary the chineses and the tourist profil was far different from now. So not sure at all if they are now so accurate. Anyway the big international groups can handle losses during a long time with minor consequences untill the s hi t hit the fan (Recent example is Thomas Cook, even if it's not the same than hotel, it's still the tourism sector)

T21 has killed Central Pattaya (Central has killed Royal Garden, and before Royal garden has killed Mike shopping) then you can not multiply the customer number if you multiply the mails, it's just a move of the current customers.

And i do not have the answer at my question, Pattaya not a s h i t hole? Come on

what about the crystal clear sea water, the air that smells like jasmine, the beauty of the architecture of the city and its rich historical heritage...

come on dude, come down from your cloud

[jacko45k]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

About 17 years ago I went to Pattaya in April and the water was so low you had walk about 200 metres out to the water, Asian tourists not at all happy with the walk out to the speedboats. I took the ferry over to Koh Larne and had to climb on the roof of the boat to get up on to the pier.

So the tide was out 17 years ago? What is your point? Flooding doesn't affect the height of the sea nor the position of the pier!

Those Asian tourists should not be leaving from the Beach, but from Bali Hai. I have seen them returning, their rubbish pours out onto the beach before they do. 

Are you actually seriously claiming Pattaya has more problems with the elements than the Florida coast or Texas?

[jacko45k]

2 hours ago, shdmn said:

We get it.  Pattaya bad.  Thailand bad.  You can go away now.

You need to learn to read.... the problems are of their own making. They also appear incapable of addressing them. The best so far is I do think the Beach is better. 

I shall go away when I wish, you have zero say in the matter.

[jacko45k]

3 hours ago, Leaver said:

Are they even relevant to the current tourist market????

Probably not. Rather than upgrade the destination they have downgraded the client base. 

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

So the tide was out 17 years ago? What is your point?

Obviously went over your head. The sea levels can change quite significantly and the sea can move the beach about.

But not a lot  can be said to change that Thai bashing sentiment.