Power Cuts, Power Cuts, Power Cuts.

[EL159]

I live at Mae Hia area, close to Canal Road and now we re suffering from an ever increasing number of power cuts. Many more than when I arrived here about twelve years ago. Then we got the kind of expected power cuts when there was a big storm, but now we get them on average two or three times a week, and at all hours of the day, sometimes only for 30 minutes or so, but more often lasting for between two to four hours at a time.

 

Does anybody have any idea whats going on and why? Can the infrastructure no longer cope as the city continues to grow, or is there some other explanation? Big road building project on the Canal Road ( Samoeng junction) but cant see why that should be causing all these power problems?

[NotEinstein]

The strain on the power supply is growing in alignment with development and population.

We lost power for 18 hours from Friday evening because, when the power came back from the big storm related cut, the village water system exploded, taking out a transformer, the replacement for which needed to come from Lampang, but the electricity company dragged their feet. Most of the power issues we have are associated with 'human error' such as construction shorts, and tipsy drivers using electricity poles as bowling pins.

Get used to it, it is part of the Thai Life Experience.....

[Dante99]

2 hours ago, NotEinstein said:

the village water system exploded

Please do let us know what happened in more detail.  We do not have water systems exploding often and it is an interesting phenom.

[NotEinstein]

I don't know any more than I heard - quite bomb-like, and the village head-man telling the woeful tale the next morning over the village speaker system. I assume there is no form of breaker/fuse between the supply and the system - maybe the rain penetrated, it was raining sideways at one point, and shorted out the motor, or control system. The electricity returned at 11, but there was no water until the evening.

[donnacha]

If the outside infrastructure is bad, get your own, buy an Uninterruptible Power Supply.

A UPS is a big battery through which you run your power supply. If there is a power cut it smoothly switches to supplying your devices from the battery, which recharges when the power returns.

Definitely worth it if you are getting them weekly and for periods of several hours.

[worgeordie]

Expletive !!!,a reliable electrical supply,we want to buy tanks,helicopters,

submarines,more guns, they are more important....right.

 

It's the same in our Moo Baan,if it rains,sometimes even when it looks

like rain,when the wind blows,off goes the electricity, and it's been this

way for years.....now about the water supply....

regards worgeordie

[NaamGin]

I live in Mae Hia in a Land & House moobaan and have been experiencing power cuts once or twice a week, sometimes more often than that. When asking the moobaan office about it, they defer to the Suthep power authority and say it is an under-capacity problem. They have no answer when I ask why the power goes out whenever a strong wind comes by or when it rains. The only place I have lived here that had worse electrical problems was in a Nai Fan moobaan out in Mae On. 

[NaamGin]

9 hours ago, donnacha said:

If the outside infrastructure is bad, get your own, buy an Uninterruptible Power Supply.

A UPS is a big battery through which you run your power supply. If there is a power cut it smoothly switches to supplying your devices from the battery, which recharges when the power returns.

Definitely worth it if you are getting them weekly and for periods of several hours.

Having a UPS for you home computer is one thing, but having one for an entire house is a different animal entirely. 

[PatOngo]

15 hours ago, EL159 said:

Many more than when I arrived here about twelve years ago.

That's 12 years of progress for you!

[Crossy]

15 minutes ago, NaamGin said:

Having a UPS for you home computer is one thing, but having one for an entire house is a different animal entirely. 

 

Indeed, although they do exist ($$$ if you want long run times), all the BTS and MRT stations have 2 x 50KVA UPS's good for 2 hours, the batteries have their own room.

 

A genset with auto-start is a cheaper option and no worry about running out of battery (just ensure the fuel is topped up after a cut). Lights go out (our TV has it's own UPS so Madam's soaps are not interupted) 30 seconds later genset starts, life goes on as normal (a tank of fuel is good for about 12 hours).

 

Even here just north of BKK we get regular outages, mostly weather related but the occasional "incident" with a power pole and truck. The last one was when someone decided to clear their land of scrub with a match (they want to sell). The resulting conflagration burned up the power lines and (worse) the phone and internet connections.

 

 

[donnacha]

22 minutes ago, NaamGin said:

Having a UPS for you home computer is one thing, but having one for an entire house is a different animal entirely. 

I was describing one for your entire house. I don't think anyone mentioned a home computer. In any case, most people use laptops these days, laptops already have batteries. The phrase I used was "devices".

Important devices in a typical home in Thailand might include a fridge freezer, air conditioners, fans, a microwave, a water pump, an electrical shower, a television, a Hitachi Magic Wand, a broadband router, home security cameras etc.

Losing access to any of those for several hours, several times a week would be a serious problem. Simply having an old-style desktop computer UPS would be pointless if it is too hot to work without aircon and the food in your fridge is going off.

Far from being "a different animal entirely", a UPS for your house works in exactly the same way as a UPS for your desktop computer, only the scale is different.

So, you fit a nice big UPS at your fuse box, you no longer even notice the power cuts, problem solved. Alternatively, you could install a good solar panel system with a nice big battery.

 

 

31 minutes ago, Crossy said:

they do exist ($$$ if you want long run times),

Well, for most people, paying a lot is fine if, in return, you are getting a lot of convenience.

Living in a cheaper, undeveloped country naturally comes with certain disadvantages. Lousy infrastructure is one of them. You simply take the money you are saving on rent and invest it in things that make your family more comfortable. I see a lot of westerners making the mistake of enjoying the cost-savings but not understanding the need to invest those savings elsewhere.

 

 

[NaamGin]

3 minutes ago, donnacha said:

I was describing one for your entire house. I don't think anyone mentioned a home computer. In any case, most people use laptops these days, laptops already have batteries. The phrase I used was "devices".

Important devices in a typical home in Thailand might include a fridge freezer, air conditioners, fans, a microwave, a water pump, an electrical shower, a television, a Hitachi Magic Wand, a broadband router, home security cameras etc.

Losing access to any of those for several hours, several times a week would be a serious problem. Simply having an old-style desktop computer UPS would be pointless if it is too hot to work without aircon and the food in your fridge is going off.

Far from being "a different animal entirely", a UPS for your house works in exactly the same way as a UPS for your desktop computer, only the scale is different.

So, you fit a nice big UPS at your fuse box, you no longer even notice the power cuts, problem solved. Alternatively, you could install a good solar panel system with a nice big battery.

 

 

Well, for most people, paying a lot is fine if, in return, you are getting a lot of convenience.

Living in a cheaper, undeveloped country naturally comes with certain disadvantages. Lousy infrastructure is one of them. You simply take the money you are saving on rent and invest it in things that make your family more comfortable. I see a lot of westerners making the mistake of enjoying the cost-savings but not understanding the need to invest those savings elsewhere.

 

 

You never used the term "devices" in your original post. Go read it, again.

 

I am well aware of what it takes to install and maintain a building UPS and yes, it IS a completely different animal than a standalone UPS. 

 

A full building UPS system may rely on the same concept as a standalone UPS, but the implementation is completely different. It entails banks of batteries and inverters which are spec'd on power requirements during an outage, along with generators to recharge the battery banks, switching devices that monitor power coming from the grid and switches to facilitate the failover to backup power when necessary. In most cases, the only things that are powered in a complete power outage is the data center, telephones and the HVAC systems due to costs. The cost of a full building UPS systems can run into the millions of $$$. Even for a home it can run into the thousands of $$$. On top of that, unless maintained with regular inspections and service, a building UPS is useless. The batteries have a finite lifespan and must be replaces regularly, thus increasing you cost of ownership. The generators must be maintained and cycled regularly to assure that will work when you need them.  I have never witnessed a seamless cut-over to backup power without an interruption in service in a building UPS.

 

As you may be able to tell from my response, my experience in this area is a bit deeper than reading a brochure or repeating a sales pitch. A home UPS is a novel concept, although far from cost effective or efficient in a home setting. 

 

[donnacha]

22 minutes ago, NaamGin said:

You never used the term "devices" in your original post. Go read it, again.

Yes, I did. Second paragraph.
 

 

22 minutes ago, NaamGin said:

Even for a home it can run into the thousands of $$$.

Sure. Well worth it. Nice things that make your life better cost money.
 

 

22 minutes ago, NaamGin said:

As you may be able to tell from my response, my experience in this area is a bit deeper

Well, I do not mean any offense by this, but the main thing I was able to tell from your response is that you are not too good on detail (for instance, stating categorically that I had "never used the word devices" in my original post when it was right there in the middle of a mere 64-word post. "Go read it, again" ???? ) and your grasp of spelling and grammar is not great either.

So, while neither of those failings mean you are a bad person or anything like that (many countries have bad education systems), if it is okay with you I am not going to place a huge amount of trust in, or assign any credibility at all to, your pronouncements.

 

[NaamGin]

Thank Buddha for the ignore feature on TV.

Buh Bye. 

[donnacha]

4 minutes ago, NaamGin said:

Thank Buddha for the ignore feature on TV.

Buh Bye. 

You were the one who kept making mistakes, I merely pointed them out. 

But, yes. You should probably avoid swimming in the deep end until you can handle yourself a little better ????

 

[DrPhibes]

Power company has been installing new very high voltage line along the second ring road.  I can see power cuts as this new system is brought online.

[Crossy]

Let's do a few sums.

 

Consider an "average" home.

For "keep us alive" use we would probably expect to run something like :-

1. 12,000 BTU aircon = 1,200W maybe 3:1 duty cycle
2. PC = 200W continuous
3. TV = 100W continuous
4. Fridge-freezer = 60W maybe 3:1 duty cycle
5. Lights = 50W (using LEDs)
6. Water pump = 200W occasional use.

Ignoring the water pump the other kit is going to use about 800 Watt/hours for each hour of use.

 

Your average 100Ahr, 12V deep-cycle lead acid battery (like you use for off-grid solar) will store about 600 Watt/hours (at 50% discharge).

 

So I'll need 1.3 batteries for each hour of autonomy I need, two batteries will give me about 1.5 hours (let's say 6,600 Baht per battery).

https://www.amornsolar.com/product-page/แบตเตอร-เจล-deep-cycle-ร-นtgel-12v-100ah

 

A suitable auto-switching (UPS) pure-sine inverter (motors do not like modified or pseudo sine power) is going to be 5.5kVA (it's got to start and run the aircon), something like this beast https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32830059187.html 

Note that this unit is 48V, so you'll need 4 batteries but get 3 hours runtime.

It costs USD 455 + 190 shipping + VAT and duty = About USD 750 total (check out https://www.simplyduty.com/import-calculator/)

 

So for 3 hours autonomy that's:-

26,400 Baht for the batteries

23,000 Baht for the inverter

 

Total = 50k bar the shouting.

 

After 3 hours you have no power and it will take about an hour to re-charge the batteries (this unit has a 70A 48V charger).

 

The big plus of the UPS is that it's almost completely silent in operation and has instant switch-over.

 

 

For a similar amount of money you can get a 5.5kVA diesel "silent" generator and the associated gubbins to make it auto-start plus a few tanks of diesel (a lot of diesel if you go DIY on the auto start / transfer switch stuff).

 

The big plus of the generator is that it makes power for as long as it has fuel and takes a few minutes to re-fuel (assuming you have stock of course).

 

In Conclusion

It really depends upon your lifestyle, available space, how long your power failures are and whether you are prepared to sit in the dark/hot once the batteries are finished.

 

Our little genset powers the whole house except the water heaters (just one A/C at a time) for as long as it has to (12 hours on a tank of fuel). I don't like sitting in the hot / dark and I can make a pot of tea without worrying that the batteries will go flat before the juice returns. But that's our choice of course, you may choose the alternative or even a hybrid solution.

 

 

[elektrified]

We were without power for almost 48 hours after the storm (with two freezers full of stuff)!!

 

Really no excuse for this with the technology and manpower available. Poor management IMO.

[robblok]

We in Nothaburi on the edge of BKK are getting less and less power problems. Seems the money is invested in BKK and its surrounding area. That is my guess anyway as it is a lot better in this area as before. Also flooding has decreased in my area. 

 

Perhaps the distribution of funds is not really equal or more is lost to corruption in your area. Can only say in my area things are constantly improving (internet / power / and roads)

 

I do have power cuts but lasting less then a minute once every month or so.

[Crossy]

7 minutes ago, robblok said:

We in Nothaburi on the edge of BKK are getting less and less power problems. Seems the money is invested in BKK and its surrounding area. That is my guess anyway as it is a lot better in this area as before. Also flooding has decreased in my area. 

 

Perhaps the distribution of funds is not really equal or more is lost to corruption in your area. Can only say in my area things are constantly improving (internet / power / and roads)

 

Meanwhile just upstream and on the other bank we seem to be getting more cuts. There's a lot of new development going on around the village which I suspect is causing some issues although PEA are stringing several new 66kV runs.

 

[robblok]

Just now, Crossy said:

 

Meanwhile just upstream and on the other bank we seem to be getting more cuts. There's a lot of new development going on around the village which I suspect is causing some issues although PEA are stringing several new 66kV runs.

 

There is a lot of new development going on here too, ever since we got a BTS and a big shopping mall. So they are building around in my area too. Still the power seems to be better than before. 

 

I wonder how often these thing happen because funding is pillaged by those in charge. I can't imagine that they don't get more money if more buildings are completed. (could be totally wrong)

[thequietman]

12 hours ago, worgeordie said:

Expletive !!!,a reliable electrical supply,we want to buy tanks,helicopters,

submarines,more guns, they are more important....right.

 

It's the same in our Moo Baan,if it rains,sometimes even when it looks

like rain,when the wind blows,off goes the electricity, and it's been this

way for years.....now about the water supply....

regards worgeordie

A gecko farted in my village and the power went off!

 

True story. ????

[NotEinstein]

Looking at my log over the last year, our IT reboots on average once a week, with this month being the worst by far after just 11 days....

(The 0-5 minute outages were mostly just a few seconds.)
Sat Oct 6 17:39:34 +07 2018 4 minutes
Tue Oct 9 07:04:34 +07 2018 1 minutes
Sun Oct 21 13:09:33 +07 2018 4 minutes
Sun Oct 21 16:59:34 +07 2018 3 minutes
Mon Oct 22 00:18:08 +07 2018 16 minutes
Mon Oct 22 15:19:33 +07 2018 759 minutes
Fri Oct 26 13:11:05 +07 2018 116 minutes
Fri Oct 26 21:54:34 +07 2018 5 minutes
Sat Oct 27 08:41:10 +07 2018 0 minutes
Wed Oct 31 11:29:33 +07 2018 0 minutes
Wed Nov 7 08:34:33 +07 2018 3 minutes
Thu Nov 22 18:29:42 +07 2018 69 minutes
Thu Nov 22 20:04:34 +07 2018 8 minutes
Tue Dec 11 21:54:34 +07 2018 40 minutes
Sun Dec 23 15:34:33 +07 2018 5 minutes
Fri Jan 11 14:44:33 +07 2019 2 minutes
Wed Jan 23 11:42:04 +07 2019 600 minutes
Sat Feb 9 10:54:34 +07 2019 0 minutes
Mon Feb 25 09:24:33 +07 2019 0 minutes
Mon Mar 4 17:59:33 +07 2019 4 minutes
Wed Apr 3 01:09:35 +07 2019 4 minutes
Wed Apr 3 16:26:04 +07 2019 4 minutes
Fri Apr 19 17:38:22 +07 2019 3 minutes
Sat Apr 20 22:01:24 +07 2019 0 minutes
Sun Apr 28 21:14:33 +07 2019 5 minutes
Sat May 25 18:07:04 +07 2019 10 minutes
Sat Jun 1 06:24:33 +07 2019 4 minutes
Sat Jun 8 16:33:19 +07 2019 3 minutes
Mon Jun 24 00:09:33 +07 2019 14 minutes
Tue Jul 16 14:34:34 +07 2019 2 minutes
Sun Jul 21 17:34:33 +07 2019 2 minutes
Wed Jul 24 18:24:33 +07 2019 0 minutes
Thu Jul 25 06:54:34 +07 2019 3 minutes
Wed Jul 31 06:29:33 +07 2019 2 minutes
Fri Aug 2 01:53:20 +07 2019 101 minutes
Fri Aug 2 02:24:33 +07 2019 2 minutes
Tue Aug 6 13:44:33 +07 2019 2 minutes
Wed Aug 7 13:52:19 +07 2019 0 minutes
Mon Aug 12 12:36:03 +07 2019 218 minutes
Wed Aug 14 10:44:34 +07 2019 10 minutes
Mon Aug 26 09:44:34 +07 2019 7 minutes
Mon Aug 26 17:23:17 +07 2019 17 minutes
Thu Aug 29 11:04:33 +07 2019 4 minutes
Sun Sep 1 19:14:33 +07 2019 1 minutes
Fri Sep 6 13:29:33 +07 2019 0 minutes
Mon Sep 16 06:29:33 +07 2019 3 minutes
Tue Sep 17 05:59:33 +07 2019 2 minutes
Fri Oct 4 12:29:34 +07 2019 55 minutes
Sat Oct 5 11:08:18 +07 2019 1063 minutes
Tue Oct 8 16:43:19 +07 2019 45 minutes
Tue Oct 8 17:58:18 +07 2019 18 minutes
Thu Oct 10 07:23:19 +07 2019 335 minutes
Thu Oct 10 09:34:33 +07 2019 50 minutes
Total 53 instances for 3628 minutes
10 minutes to 1 hour:10. 1 Hour or more:8

[Liverpudlian]

Its a bloody scam to force you into buying in bulk stocks of yellow temple candles.

[worgeordie]

The Electrical Company,give a report that the electricity would be off,

from 9 -4.30 today Friday, as they were coming to repair the wires in

our Village,as everytime it rains or is windy ,off it goes.good I thought

getting it fixed at last.

 

I thought it was too good to be true,electric not off,nobody turned up

to fix the wiring...

regards worgeordie

 

[canthai55]

3 hours ago, Liverpudlian said:

Its a bloody scam to force you into buying in bulk stocks of yellow temple candles.

Or to get out of the house and stand in line at Rimping

[BritManToo]

On 10/8/2019 at 12:30 PM, elektrified said:

We were without power for almost 48 hours after the storm (with two freezers full of stuff)!!

 

Really no excuse for this with the technology and manpower available. Poor management IMO.

In SanSai, less power cuts than any previous year in my memory.

I loaded up with battery powered LED lamps this year for the monsoon, haven't needed them at all.

Just one 2hr power cut in the day so far..

[rumak]

has anyone found a battery powered (rechargable)  fan at any shop ?    Not a tiny tiny one but just one about 12 inches that will cool enough to survive for an hour or two when electric goes out.