EU, Britain enter intense Brexit talks as UK departure date looms

[rooster59]

EU, Britain enter intense Brexit talks as UK departure date looms

By Gabriela Baczynska and Jonas Ekblom

 

Anti-Brexit protesters hold British and European Union flags outside the EU Commission headquarters in Brussels, Belgium October 11, 2019. REUTERS/Francois Lenoir

 

BRUSSELS (Reuters) - The European Union agreed on Friday to enter intense talks with Britain to try to break the deadlock over Brexit, lifting financial markets with a sign that a deal could be done before the Halloween deadline.

 

A flurry of activity has brought the fraught bargaining process to a new level as Britain's scheduled departure date of Oct. 31 grows ever closer, but it is still uncertain whether the two sides can make a breakthrough before then.

 

The move came at the end of a tumultuous week which started with a public row between London and Brussels.

 

By Thursday British Prime Minister Boris Johnson and his Irish counterpart Leo Varadkar said they had found "a pathway" to a possible deal, and by Friday some officials were expressing guarded optimism.

 

"I think both of us can see a pathway to a deal, but that doesn't mean it's a done deal," Johnson said on Friday. "There's a way to go, it's important now our negotiators on both sides get into proper talks about how to sort this thing out."

Ireland is crucial if a deal is to be done to avert a potentially disorderly Brexit that would hurt global growth, roil financial markets and could even split the United Kingdom.

 

Dublin will have to consent to any solution to the toughest problem of all: how to prevent the British province of Northern Ireland from becoming a backdoor into the EU's markets without having border controls.

 

A diplomat and an EU official said EU negotiator Michel Barnier had told member states that Britain had changed its position and now accepted that its proposed replacement of the so-called "backstop" cannot involve a customs border between EU member Ireland and Northern Ireland.

 

The backstop is an insurance policy that was designed to ensure no customs or regulatory checks on the border between Ireland and Northern Ireland after Brexit.

 

Separately, two senior EU diplomats told Reuters the possible solution could include two elements: keeping Northern Ireland inside the UK's customs regime while also carrying out any customs and regulatory checks together.

 

Under a recent UK proposal, the regulatory border would run down the Irish Sea between Northern Ireland and Britain.

The sources said they understood that customs checks could be carried out there as well under the plan now under discussion.

 

But in a sign of the precarious nature of the talks, the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP), the small Northern Irish party which supports Johnson's government in parliament, warned it would only compromise so far.

 

"The DUP has always indicated that the United Kingdom must leave the EU as one nation and in so doing that no barriers to trade are erected within the UK," leader Arlene Foster said, without rejecting the proposal outright.

 

Johnson declined to give a direct answer when asked by reporters if Northern Ireland would leave the EU customs union.

 

"LIKE CLIMBING A MOUNTAIN"

 

Barnier, who held "constructive" talks with Britain's Brexit minister Stephen Barclay on Friday, said the Europeans would take stock again on Monday.

 

Barnier told reporters as he left his meeting with Barclay: "Brexit is like climbing a mountain. We need vigilance, determination and patience."

 

Other EU officials agreed the challenge remained huge.

 

One European diplomat indicated to Reuters that there was not too much hope on the EU side that a divorce deal could be sealed before the end of the month.

 

"It's a tunnel with a very small light at the end of it," a second diplomat said.

 

In Paris, French President Emmanuel Macron, asked by a Reuters reporter if there was a "glimmer of hope" regarding a Brexit agreement, replied: "Let us wait for the next few hours."

 

EU ministers convene in Luxembourg on Tuesday for a last meeting before an EU summit next Thursday and Friday.

 

Johnson said there was still a long way to go and if negotiators fail to reach agreement "then we have to be ready, as this country is and will be, to come out with no deal if we absolutely have to".

 

To get a deal done, he must also sell any deal to the British parliament, which he suspended unlawfully last month and where his Conservative Party has no majority.

 

Johnson, the face of the 2016 Brexit referendum campaign, insists the country will leave on Oct. 31 with or without an agreement but he has not explained how that will be possible without defying parliament, which passed a law saying Britain cannot leave the bloc without a deal.

 

Nigel Farage, the leader of the Brexit Party, showed the challenge Johnson will face if he tries to move too far to accommodate Brussels.

 

"I don't know what Boris Johnson has given away, but he sounds very defensive," he said on Twitter. "Let us hope that this is not a surrender."

 

The Brexit issue has deeply polarised the country and many businesses fear they will be hit badly by a disorderly break with the EU.

 

Big investment banks said on Friday they had become more optimistic on the prospects for a deal, pushing sterling to a three-month high, taking its rally since Thursday to more than 3%, its biggest two-day gain since mid-June 2016, before the Brexit referendum. Shares in companies exposed to Britain's economy also surged, with Royal Bank of Scotland joining housebuilders such as Persimmon, Barrett and Taylor Wimpey in rising about 10%. The yield on 10-year British government bonds was on track for its biggest three-day rise since 2017.

 

(Additional reporting by Guy Faulconbridge, Costas Pitas, Elizabeth Howcroft, Josephine Mason and David Milliken in London, Amanda Ferguson in Belfast and Michel Rose in Paris, Writing by Angus MacSwan and Kate Holton; Editing by Jon Boyle and Gareth Jones)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-10-13

Follow Thaivisa on LINE for breaking Thailand news and visa info

 

 

[Bluespunk]

20 minutes ago, rooster59 said:

But in a sign of the precarious nature of the talks, the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP), the small Northern Irish party which supports Johnson's government in parliament, warned it would only compromise so far.

 

"The DUP has always indicated that the United Kingdom must leave the EU as one nation and in so doing that no barriers to trade are erected within the UK," leader Arlene Foster said, without rejecting the proposal outright.

The tories, even with DUP support, no longer have a majority. Without it then any deal johnson achieves will probably fail to get through Parliament. The no deal zealots will most likely vote against anything the DUP opposes. Labour won’t bail him out. 
 

Second referendum may be johnson’s only way out...Ah the irony. 

[Basil B]

Boom day for flag makers... as NI gets sold down the river.

 

Pity most flags are now imported.

[steve187]

19 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

The tories, even with DUP support, no longer have a majority. Without it then any deal johnson achieves will probably fail to get through Parliament. The no deal zealots will most likely vote against anything the DUP opposes. Labour won’t bail him out. 
 

Second referendum may be johnson’s only way out...Ah the irony. 

how can there be another referendum, they ( the glorious MP's) haven't sorted or respected the result of the first after 3 years.

[Chomper Higgot]

18 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

The tories, even with DUP support, no longer have a majority. Without it then any deal johnson achieves will probably fail to get through Parliament. The no deal zealots will most likely vote against anything the DUP opposes. Labour won’t bail him out. 
 

Second referendum may be johnson’s only way out...Ah the irony. 

The ERG have already said they will follow the DUP wrt support or otherwise of ‘Johnson’s deal’.

 

 

[el torro]

This can't possibly be true, as various members of the EU have made it very clear that there is no reason to negotiate! ????

 

Not that it matters, as it's very obvious that any agreed deal will be a fudged version of the EU/May 'surrender treaty' .

 

Consequently, it will be very quickly approved by UK MPs as their best option (in their own interests....) at the moment....

[Bluespunk]

54 minutes ago, steve187 said:

how can there be another referendum, they ( the glorious MP's) haven't sorted or respected the result of the first after 3 years.

Because the consequences and price to pay are clear now, people should have all the facts.

 

However I didn't say there should be another one, only that it may be johnson's only way out of the ditch he has dug...

[el torro]

20 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Because the consequences and price to pay are clear now, people should have all the facts.

 

However I didn't say there should be another one, only that it may be johnson's only way out of the ditch he has dug...

We have all the facts re. our politicians - they have no respect for the electorate - but are extremely concerned about hiding this essential 'fact'.

 

'Facts' re brexit ?????  We have nothing other than biased opinions and biased forecasts to substantiate their opinions based on self interest!

 

As much as remainers pretend otherwise - there are no actual 'facts' - as it's impossible to predict the future.

 

[oldgit]

We are constantly being told by the experts, that the Houses of Parliament is a microcosm of the division within the UK populace over Brexit. Well, lets put that to the test. When a negotiated deal, between Johnson's team and the EU, returns to Parliament for ratification, have a secret ballot. No Whips involved but just MP's voting on the basis of their own opinion and conscience. It would be a whole lot quicker that calling for another referendum.

[el torro]

5 minutes ago, oldgit said:

We are constantly being told by the experts, that the Houses of Parliament is a microcosm of the division within the UK populace over Brexit. Well, lets put that to the test. When a negotiated deal, between Johnson's team and the EU, returns to Parliament for ratification, have a secret ballot. No Whips involved but just MP's voting on the basis of their own opinion and conscience. It would be a whole lot quicker that calling for another referendum.

Why bother to hold a secret ballot amongst MPs, as it's already obvious that they are desperately looking for a BRINO result that will not result in them losing their seats?

 

As for your comment "We are constantly being told by the experts, that the Houses of Parliament is a microcosm of the division within the UK populace over Brexit" - I doubt even your "experts" have been silly enough to come out with this line of argument! ????

[evadgib]

Nothing less than full umbilical severance should be accepted. Anything less will result in taxpayers money free-flowing outwards & EU rules/regs/laws flowing in UK's direction while the electorate are duped into believing otherwise. 

 

To quote Maggie; "No!, No!, No!"

[OneMoreFarang]

36 minutes ago, steve187 said:

how can there be another referendum, they ( the glorious MP's) haven't sorted or respected the result of the first after 3 years.

They promised you unicorns and you still don't have them. Now that is obviously sad. I am sure with no deal they will all come out from their hiding places - or maybe not?

 

Recently I read this wonderful comment which seems to be a fair summary:

"We should have a referendum on whether the EU should give each British citizen £10,000. When we win by a landslide the EU will have to give us the money because it is the WILL OF THE BRITSH PEOPLE. They cannot refuse. 
The EU may say that they cannot do that, but we will insist because we voted for it and it is our will. 
In the end, we may need to reach a compromise and accept £5,000 instead. It will be the EU’s fault if this leads to acrimonious relations and bad blood between the EU and the UK, because the UK will be sensible and ready to compromise to get just £5,000 for each of its citizens instead of the £10,000 initially proposed."

 

from: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/08/the-guardian-view-on-faltering-brexit-talks-a-no-deal-election-is-on-the-cards#comments

 

 

[stephenterry]

13 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Nothing less than full umbilical severance should be accepted. Anything less will result in taxpayers money free-flowing outwards & EU rules/regs/laws flowing in UK's direction while the electorate are duped into believing otherwise. 

 

To quote Maggie; "No!, No!, No!"

I'm a taxpayer and nothing the EU has been accused of has affected me in any shape or form. On the contrary, the UK government has done nothing but make me poorer by imposing this, that and the other on their citizens, including freezing my pension. 

 

So, in a nutshell you can stuff this opinion where it belongs - in the garbage along with Brexit. 

[evadgib]

6 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

I'm a taxpayer and nothing the EU has been accused of has affected me in any shape or form. On the contrary, the UK government has done nothing but make me poorer by imposing this, that and the other on their citizens, including freezing my pension. 

 

So, in a nutshell you can stuff this opinion where it belongs - in the garbage along with Brexit. 

There's a separate thread for that & I rather suspect they (thread contributors along with the consortium) have never heard of you...

 

("I'm Brian and so is my wife!" ???? )

[stephenterry]

14 minutes ago, evadgib said:

There's a separate thread for that & I rather suspect they (thread contributors along with the consortium) have never heard of you...

 

("I'm Brian and so is my wife!" ???? )

Could you translate your reply, please.  

[billd766]

15 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

Could you translate your reply, please.  

It is easy. Just highlight the information you are looking for, right click it and select Search Google for ....... and the answer pops up in a new tab.

 

In this care it took me to here.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1385293/Life-of-Brian-wins-the-vote-for-films-best-laughter-line.html

 

In tenth place was the line "I'm Brian and so's my wife", delivered by Terence Bayler, playing Gregory.

[kingdong]

2 hours ago, stephenterry said:

I'm a taxpayer and nothing the EU has been accused of has affected me in any shape or form. On the contrary, the UK government has done nothing but make me poorer by imposing this, that and the other on their citizens, including freezing my pension. 

 

So, in a nutshell you can stuff this opinion where it belongs - in the garbage along with Brexit. 

Glad you,'ve copped nicely out of uks membership to the eu,spare a thought for those who,'ve suffered because of it.

[tebee]

11 minutes ago, kingdong said:

Glad you,'ve copped nicely out of uks membership to the eu,spare a thought for those who,'ve suffered because of it.

and how, pray tell me, have you or anyone you know, suffered from EU membership?

[dunroaming]

So Jacob Rees Mogg has now warned Brexiteers that there will have to be compromises but they can trust Boris not to concede too much ????????????????

[sawadee1947]

5 hours ago, steve187 said:

how can there be another referendum, they ( the glorious MP's) haven't sorted or respected the result of the first after 3 years.

Wrong! 

The first referendum was about stay or leave. 

A second referendum would be about leave with or without contract, isn't it? ????

[brewsterbudgen]

Nothing less than full umbilical severance should be accepted. Anything less will result in taxpayers money free-flowing outwards & EU rules/regs/laws flowing in UK's direction while the electorate are duped into believing otherwise. 
 
To quote Maggie; "No!, No!, No!"

How about letting the people decide?

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[evadgib]

3 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

How about letting the people decide?

Cos they already have.

[Rookiescot]

11 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Cos they already have.

Yes they decided to leave but remain in the single market.

What is being offered now is not that.

[steve187]

1 hour ago, sawadee1947 said:

Wrong! 

The first referendum was about stay or leave. 

A second referendum would be about leave with or without contract, isn't it? ????

the first one was clear, ( there was no mention of a deal) its the good old MP's that want a different result,

any new referendum should be take the deal or no deal, no mention of remain

[puipuitom]

4 hours ago, stephenterry said:

I'm a taxpayer and nothing the EU has been accused of has affected me in any shape or form. On the contrary, the UK government has done nothing but make me poorer by imposing this, that and the other on their citizens, including freezing my pension. 

And what any ordinary taxpayer would have experienced of a lot of EU activities? All medicines are investigated and approved by the EU Medicine Agency. Foor safety is investigated by EFSA, and in case any bad foods are found, it is mentioned in the RASFF database, see  https://webgate.ec.europa.eu/rasff-window/portal/?event=SearchForm&cleanSearch=1  

Also a LOT of items are evaluated if they are safe enough, for instance cars.

From 1 Nov onwards, all has to be done ( and financed) by the British on their own.

State nor private insured pensions have NOTHING to do with the EU, but on national scale only.

[sawadee1947]

22 minutes ago, steve187 said:

the first one was clear, ( there was no mention of a deal) its the good old MP's that want a different result,

any new referendum should be take the deal or no deal, no mention of remain

Thank you for repeating! ????

[beautifulthailand99]

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Cos they already have.

Good to see you are still a no-dealer - that bird has already flown for ever. Though Farige would be glad of your money and vote if you're that way inclined. 

[billd766]

1 hour ago, sawadee1947 said:

Wrong! 

The first referendum was about stay or leave. 

A second referendum would be about leave with or without contract, isn't it? ????

And of course the democratic way to have a second referendum would be to complete the first one, which at this point in time Boris is trying to do, hobbled or shackled by parliament and the courts.

[billd766]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Yes they decided to leave but remain in the single market.

What is being offered now is not that.

No it isn't but the peoples vote was to leave entirely and not to stay in the single market. At least that is what David Cameron said way back in 2018.

[puipuitom]

5 hours ago, el torro said:

We have all the facts re. our politicians - they have no respect for the electorate - but are extremely concerned about hiding this essential 'fact'.

 

'Facts' re brexit ?????  We have nothing other than biased opinions and biased forecasts to substantiate their opinions based on self interest!

 

As much as remainers pretend otherwise - there are no actual 'facts' - as it's impossible to predict the future.

 

Just wait till 1 Nov, then you will see FACTS: the UK, who has to "enjoy" the fact, they are now a "third country", and will fall under WTO-import duty and other rules for their goods to be imported in the EU. And the British people, when they want to visit the EU to get a Schengen visa. ( inclusive the Northern Irish when entering Eire)  Ask many Thais about their experience with that.

And for many businesses: get an EU approved certification, one-by-one, and not as now: all fall under a UK governmental control. Again… ask Thai companies exporting to the EU... 

For every EU custom officer very simple: 1 Nov 00:00:01 = UK => NON-EU, no treaty, no agreement, nothing.

 

EU import conditions for seafood and other fishery products

https://ec.europa.eu/food/sites/food/files/safety/docs/ia_trade_import-cond-fish_en.pdf

The European Union (EU) is by far the world's biggest importer of fish, seafood and ... questions related to import conditions for seafood and fishery products.

 

• Exporting fish and seafood to Europe | CBI - Centre for the ...

  https://www.cbi.eu/market-information/fish-seafood/
  Europe is an interesting market for fish and seafood exporters. Here you'll find the information you need to help you get fish or seafood products on the European market. ... Data about worldwide import and export of fish and seafood ...

• Import Guidance - Seafish

  https://www.seafish.org/article/import-guidance
  Imports of fish and seafood from outside the EU are very strictly regulated, with requirements for health certification and traceability for all imports and further ...

EU import conditions for fresh meat and meat products - European ...

https://ec.europa.eu/food/sites/food/files/safety/docs/ia_trade_import-cond-meat_en.pdf

philosophy of European Food Law, which forms the basis for our import ... Imports of fresh meat and meat products into the EU are subject to veterinary ...

 

• Non-EU Countries Authorised Establishments | Food Safety

  https://ec.europa.eu/food/safety/international_affairs/trade/non-eu-countries_en
  The Non-EU country (third country) must be approved to export a specific ... The updated list will come into force 10 working days after the publication date.

• Allowed and banned items: product of animal origin - Your Europe

  https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/carry/meat-dairy-animal/index_en.htm
  24 Jan 2019 ... Travelling with meat and dairy – OK to take them from one EU country to another, but most cannot be brought into the EU from outside. ... You are, however, allowed to bring in powdered infant milk, baby food and foods ...

• Animals Products: Trade & Imports | Food Safety - European ...

  https://ec.europa.eu/food/animals/animalproducts_en
  Imports refers solely to the movement of animals or animal products into the EU ... meat, milk and other products of animal origin are traded or introduced into the ...

• Import from countries outside the EU - animal products

  https://www.livsmedelsverket.se/en/production-control-and-trade/import-and-export/importing-animal-products-from-non-eu-countries1/
  2 Aug 2018 ... When importing food of animal origin from a non-EU-country into the EU, the ... Food stuffs of animal origin (meat, fish, milk, eggs and products ...

• European Union (EU) – Export requirements for meat and poultry ...

  http://www.inspection.gc.ca/food/exporting-food/requirements-library/eu-meat-and-poultry-products/eng/1367938786477/1367938835254
  Meat products may be imported into Canada for the purpose of manufacturing meat products for export to the European ...