OA insurance - the issues

[Captain Monday]

400k/40k is a very low coverage level. People with good foreign insurance will need the expensive redundant Thai insurance. Nobody is getting this form signed by two company directors.  A 50 year old who just qualified for an O-A needs insurance, no argument from me. Now a 78 year old who has been here on extensions for years doesn't need insurance. Who is more likely to have health issues? The same 50 year old could theoretically come here on a visa exempt change to O then get an extension. Meanwhile tourists will still be crashing motorbikes falling off bungee towers and racking up huge bills with no insurance. Cant solve any problem I can think of other than a cash grab by the Thai insurance industry.

[SpokaneAl]

I think that if one reads the police report part concerning the expiration of the visa as of the date of the annual expiration of the insurance, it could be difficult, going forward, to actually get one year out of a one year visa.

In that one must have the necessary insurance in force prior to applying for the non imm o-a, which could be a short period, or a more significant time frame prior to the actual departure/arrival date, there seems to be no way to time and match the insurance with the arrival date.

And if, at some point, this insurance requirement expands, it could mean the end of virtually every extension of stay etc in achieving the one year term that was promised and paid for.


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[wisperone]

18 hours ago, oznomad said:

This is a constructive list that hopefully will be read by, or forwarded to, the decision makers.

Yeah...don't forget the TM30 sitdown between civilians and the authorities.  Look how well that worked. Thailand cares about one thing...how much money this will generate for the junta. Self funding, money in ones bank, offshore policies, credit card policies, etc etc, don't feed the buddha.

[Captain Monday]

2 hours ago, SpokaneAl said:

I think that if one reads the police report part concerning the expiration of the visa as of the date of the annual expiration of the insurance, it could be difficult, going forward, to actually get one year out of a one year visa.

In that one must have the necessary insurance in force prior to applying for the non imm o-a, which could be a short period, or a more significant time frame prior to the actual departure/arrival date, there seems to be no way to time and match the insurance with the arrival date.

And if, at some point, this insurance requirement expands, it could mean the end of virtually every extension of stay etc in achieving the one year term that was promised and paid for.


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The companies should sell 1 yr policies that start on day 1 of arrival.

[Tanoshi]

5 hours ago, Huckenfell said:

I was issued (sold) my O-A visa on certain conditions, i.e Unlimited entries for  the first 12 months with a further 12 months extension provided i left and returned before it expires. If i want to exit and re enter during the 12 month extension, a re entry visa must be bought before leaving. Nothing including health insurance  was required. So will immigration honour the terms of my O-A visa as issued to me. 

Just to be clear, you don't get an 'extension' if you leave and re-enter just before the Visa expires, you get another 1 year entry.

You didn't state the 'issue' or 'expiry date (enter before date), but if you were to leave and re-enter after 31st October, on a valid O-A Visa, you will certainly need proof of medical Insurance.

 

If you do a border run on 30th October, you'll be granted another 1 year permission of stay, without proof of medical Insurance.

[jacko45k]

10 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

If I arrive Visa exempt, pray tell what I'm extending as I didn't enter with a Visa.

Your Permission of Stay. That is always the case, a Visa cannot be extended. 

[Tanoshi]

12 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I disagree. You are extending your original visa. No original visa and you have nothing to extend.

 

6 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Your Permission of Stay. That is always the case, a Visa cannot be extended. 

I know Jacko, I was replying to Jingthings above post, who thinks otherwise.

[Momofarang]

11 hours ago, Sheryl said:

3 - applies to extension of stay for everyone whose initial permission of stay was under an O-A.

 

#1 makes no sense to me given the wording of the police order which specifically includes a revision to the section on extensions of stay.  I can see a case to be made for both #1 and #2.

How about marriage based extensions of stay? The police order doesn't show (yet?) any new requirement. I came under Non O-A, but have always extended under "Thai Wife".

[saengd]

12 minutes ago, Momofarang said:

How about marriage based extensions of stay? The police order doesn't show (yet?) any new requirement. I came under Non O-A, but have always extended under "Thai Wife".

Is it possible to transfer from an O-A visa to a marriage extension, in country or do you have to go out and obtain an O visa first and then come back extend under marriage when you return?

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, saengd said:

Is it possible to transfer from an O-A visa to a marriage extension, in country or do you have to go out and obtain an O visa first and then come back extend under marriage when you return?

You would be simply extending the permission to Stay, whether based on Retirement or Marriage you simply have to meet the requirements stipulated for each. 

[spiekerjozef]

No issues, you don't need a travel insurance anymore

[saengd]

5 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

You would be simply extending the permission to Stay, whether based on Retirement or Marriage you simply have to meet the requirements stipulated for each. 

Thanks, it's just that I'm reading currently in other threads that it's not possible to use an O-A for marriage extension, an O visa must be obtained first. Am unsure who or what is correct at this point.

 

EDIT: Scratch this, I was mistaken, I misread the other post.

Edited October 15, 2019 by saengd
Correction of understanding

[MalandLee]

20 hours ago, gearbox said:

This is incorrect. I'm here on travel insurance too, which is valid for 6 months, then I can go back to Australia and come back to Thailand and the 6 months period starts again. I have unlimited medical coverage. The insurance policy does not require any specific type of visa to be valid. I've read the insurance policy very carefully and asked the insurers a few questions as well. 

 

One can get also worldwide 1 year travel insurance from World Nomads for around 1K AUD.

 

Any of the offered O-A visa insurance policies would give me way less coverage.

You need to change the highlighted text to THOSE UNDER 70 can get travel insurance from World Nomads for around 1K AUD.

[saengd]

4 minutes ago, MalandLee said:

You need to change the highlighted text to THOSE UNDER 70 can get travel insurance from World Nomads for around 1K AUD.

No, the insurer MUST be one of the eight or nine approved Thai insurance companies ONLY, overseas insurers are not permitted.

[MalandLee]

17 minutes ago, saengd said:

No, the insurer MUST be one of the eight or nine approved Thai insurance companies ONLY, overseas insurers are not permitted.

The "correction" was referring to travel insurance, not health insurance. I understand what you are saying, however, it is out of context, as regards my correction.

[UKresonant]

5 hours ago, Captain Monday said:

400k/40k is a very low coverage level. People with good foreign insurance will need the expensive redundant Thai insurance. Nobody is getting this form signed by two company directors.  A 50 year old who just qualified for an O-A needs insurance, no argument from me.

Considering the situation for a new applicant of the O-A, the condition of the insurance is that they must be in Thailand more than 6 months, how is that compatible with a new applicant, and which overseas companies said they would sign that certificate they have put up. As you say it's not going to happen.

[Lovethailandelite]

49 minutes ago, saengd said:

Is it possible to transfer from an O-A visa to a marriage extension, in country or do you have to go out and obtain an O visa first and then come back extend under marriage when you return?

No. You cannot go from an 0-A to an extension for being married. Some people have said they have, I believe that was a mistake by the immigration office and they should never of allowed it. An O-A is a visa class of it's own for being over 50 years old. The original entry on the O-A will be noted.

[Momofarang]

10 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

No. You cannot go from an 0-A to an extension for being married. Some people have said they have, I believe that was a mistake by the immigration office and they should never of allowed it. An O-A is a visa class of it's own for being over 50 years old. The original entry on the O-A will be noted.

Utter BS.

[Olmate]

13 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

No. You cannot go from an 0-A to an extension for being married. Some people have said they have, I believe that was a mistake by the immigration office and they should never of allowed it. An O-A is a visa class of it's own for being over 50 years old. The original entry on the O-A will be noted.

What the heck ?

[Tanoshi]

4 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

No. You cannot go from an 0-A to an extension for being married. Some people have said they have, I believe that was a mistake by the immigration office and they should never of allowed it. An O-A is a visa class of it's own for being over 50 years old. The original entry on the O-A will be noted.

The only requirement to obtain an extension based on marriage or retirement in terms of Visa class is that it must be of the Non Immigrant type.

Quote

2.18 In the case of being a family member
of a Thai national (applicable only to
parents, spouse, children, adopted
children, or spouse’s children):
(1) The alien must have been granted a nonimmigrant
visa (NONIM).

Orders don't define whether that be an 'O' 'O-A' 'B' or 'ED' Visa and it is quite often down to Immigrations discretion to decide whether to grant an extension from other than the standard Non 'O' type Visa class. 

[Lovethailandelite]

Just now, Momofarang said:

Utter BS.

No it isn't, it isn't allowed. Now here's thing. You have managed it. Your original O-A visa is noted in your passport and on likely on your extension. It hasn't up until now been a problem. The next time you extend or enter the country after the 31st October it may well be.

[Lovethailandelite]

11 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

The only requirement to obtain an extension based on marriage or retirement in terms of Visa class is that it must be of the Non Immigrant type.

Orders don't define whether that be an 'O' 'O-A' 'B' or 'ED' Visa and it is quite often down to Immigrations discretion to decide whether to grant an extension from other than the standard Non 'O' type Visa class. 

The O-A is for a specific reason, that is for being over 50 years old. Go and check at an immigration office. If this was allowed, it would be mentioned in the police order. It isn't mentioned in the order regarding the extending of entry's from an O-A to marriage as it isn't allowed. An O-A is a visa class of its own.

Edited October 15, 2019 by Lovethailandelite

[chrisinth]

12 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

No it isn't, it isn't allowed. Now here's thing. You have managed it. Your original O-A visa is noted in your passport and on likely on your extension. It hasn't up until now been a problem. The next time you extend or enter the country after the 31st October it may well be.

How do you arrive with this when the reason for extension has changed?

[Lovethailandelite]

3 minutes ago, chrisinth said:

How do you arrive with this when the reason for extension has changed?

Because an O-A visa is a totally separate class of visa and is issued for only one purpose. That is for being over 50 years old and the only extension allowed is for retirement. A Non 'O' visa is issued for a number of purposes. It isn't how I arrive at it, it's how immigration and the MFA arrive at it. The majority of Immigration offices would never allow it to happen.

[saengd]

Siam Legal says, You must obtain a 90-day visa or a 1-Year Non-Immigrant O visa from your home country or country of residence prior to your application for the Thai marriage visa. (The 90-day Non-Immigrant visa may be obtained from nearby countries in Thailand.)

 

They also say: Additionally, the foreigner on a Visa Exemption stamp or a tourist visa can still apply for a marriage visa given that the foreigner has already met the requirements for the non-immigrant O visa and for the one year extension visa applications. This can be done at the immigration office in Thailand.

 

There is no mention of an O-A option which I am sure there would be, if it existed.

 

https://www.siam-legal.com/thailand-visa/Thailand-Marriage-Visa.php

 

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

The O-A is for a specific reason, that is for being over 50 years old. Go and check at an immigration office. If this was allowed, it would be mentioned in the police order. It isn't mentioned in the order regarding the extending of entry's from an O-A as it isn't allowed

The O-A is specific to long stay and being over 50 agreed, the proof of which is submitted to a Thai Embassy/Consulate to obtain the Visa.

The Non O can also be issued specific for being over 50.

The only difference between an 'O' and 'O-A' is the permitted length of stay.

'O' is for 'other', 'A' is for 'annual'.

 

Annual Extensions are also issued for specific reasons.

Retirement - must be over 50 and granted a Non Imm class Visa.

Marriage - must have been granted a Non Imm class Visa

 

Police orders do not state a specific Visa class, other than Non Imm type.

 

[Lovethailandelite]

Just now, Tanoshi said:

The O-A is specific to long stay and being over 50 agreed, the proof of which is submitted to a Thai Embassy/Consulate to obtain the Visa.

The Non O can also be issued specific for being over 50.

The only difference between an 'O' and 'O-A' is the permitted length of stay.

'O' is for 'other', 'A' is for 'annual'.

 

Annual Extensions are also issued for specific reasons.

Retirement - must be over 50 and granted a Non Imm class Visa.

Marriage - must have been granted a Non Imm class Visa

 

Police orders do not state a specific Visa class, other than Non Imm type.

 

The Police order relates to an O-A visa and extensions 'of'. At the end of the day, it can be spun how people care to look at it. Cold reality, is the fact that an O-A isn't allowed to be extended for any reason other than retirement. If it was, section 2.18 would be included alongside section 2.22. I would say with 99% certainty that those people that have managed to get an extension of marriage on an O-A, will have a problem after the 31st October when entering the country and the annotation of the original 0-A is seen.
Lets see if I am right.

[Tanoshi]

7 minutes ago, saengd said:

There is no mention of an O-A option which I am sure there would be, if it existed.

There's no mention of an 'O' option either.

[Peterw42]

2 minutes ago, Lovethailandelite said:

The Police order relates to an O-A visa and extensions 'of'. At the end of the day, it can be spun how people care to look at it. Cold reality, is the fact that an O-A isn't allowed to be extended for any reason other than retirement. If it was, section 2.18 would be included alongside section 2.22. I would say with 99% certainty that those people that have managed to get an extension of marriage on an O-A, will have a problem after the 31st October when entering the country and the annotation of the original 0-A is seen.
Lets see if I am right.

What rubbish, I entered on an OA then switched to a marriage extension. You extend your stay not the visa you arrived on. Immigration does not and cannot extend a visa.

NO VISA is ever extended.

[Lovethailandelite]

Just now, Peterw42 said:

What rubbish, I entered on an OA then switched to a marriage extension. You extend your stay not the visa you arrived on. Immigration does not and cannot extend a visa.

NO VISA is ever extended.

I never said that some offices haven't done it. What I said is they shouldn't of done it. Read the police order an understand what it means regarding an O-A visa and extensions of. You can shout rubbish as much as you care too. Fact is, an O-A cannot be used for an extension for marriage. The Insurance will be needed for the O-A and extensions 'of'. Marriage extensions aren't mentioned because they simply shouldn't be allowed to happen from an O-A visa