Health Insurance: Non-Imm O-A

[Max69xl]

20 hours ago, royalmice said:

Great, thank u

He's not correct. If you arrived on a Non-Immigrant O Visa and then extended your stay 1 year based on retirement,it's still based on the O Visa. If you arrived on an O-A Visa,the A doesn't go away just because you extend your stay 1 year. 

Edited November 1, 2019 by Max69xl

[Max69xl]

5 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Two more additional advantages of an OA Visa:

1. During the 1 year validity of the OA Visa no re-entry permits are required, so during that period you are free to leave/enter Thailand as much as you want.

2. No need to visit the Immigration Office during the first 2 years.  You do need to do the 90 day reports if you are staying 90 days consecutively in Thailand (but if you leave and re-enter the teller is put back on 0), and you can do these on-line (just like your TM30s).

> So you have almost 2 years of minimal IO hassle with the OA Visa.

The new health insurance requirement makes it of course more costly and/or difficult (and maybe even impossible) to apply for an OA Visa in your home-country.

So as an OA holder I might want to switch to O Visa in future, when the health insurance requirement proves to cumbersome and outweighs the benefits of the OA Visa initial 2 years. 

We don't know yet if the second year of an O-A Visa will be hassle free as before. They might require an insurance the second year even if the visa was issued before October 31 this year.I read the police order and it isn't really clear. 

[Peter Denis]

24 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

We don't know yet if the second year of an O-A Visa will be hassle free as before. They might require an insurance the second year even if the visa was issued before October 31 this year.I read the police order and it isn't really clear. 

I don't think so.  You are stamped in for an additional year from the date you re-enter Thailand during the 1 year validity of your Non Imm OA Visa. 

Immigration officers at the border are instructed to look for embassy notes re the health insurance on OA Visas.

Since there are none - when the Visa was issued before Oct 31 - it's only logical that they will simply stamp you in according to the rules.

However, when someone with a Non Imm OA Visa issued after Oct 31 will enter/re-enter Thailand the health insurance note on his Visa will be checked and he will only be stamped in for the period of validity of the health insurance.

Note: I will be able to provide proof of the pudding end of this month, as I am planning to make a trip to Laos.  I do not have any thai approved health insurance, but on re-entering I am quite confident to be stamped in for another year.  Any other procedure would be totally illogical.

Will keep TVF members posted of the outcome.

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, wgdanson said:

And AETNA will not renew over 70 yearts old. Been there.

 

Actually AETNA,  like BUPA Thailand before them,. guarantee lifetime renewal if you purchase before age 60. It is only when you don't take out the policy before that age that they cut you off at 70.

 

There are a couple of  insurers on the Imm  list that guarantee renewal for life or til age 99, though.

[LivinLOS]

8 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Any other procedure would be totally illogical.

Will keep TVF members posted of the outcome.

The idea that some people will arrive and need insurance, and yet others may arrive months after them, on the exact same visa class.. but not need it... Seems even more illogical. New rules generally get blanket applications going forward unless specifically grandfathered in the law. 

Lets face it, no one knows, maintaining strong opinions on this one way or another is kind of silly. We just need to see what if any consistency IOs at the borders do. 

[wgdanson]

3 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Actually AETNA,  like BUPA Thailand before them,. guarantee lifetime renewal if you purchase before age 60. It is only when you don't take out the policy before that age that they cut you off at 70.

 

There are a couple of  insurers on the Imm  list that guarantee renewal for life or til age 99, though.

But BUPA/AETNA or my broker,  did not tell me until I had had the policy for 10 years, starting when I was just 61.

I am with Cigna now as Pacific Cross had too many exclusions and waiting periods. 

[GeorgeCross]

5 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Actually AETNA,  like BUPA Thailand before them,. guarantee lifetime renewal if you purchase before age 60. It is only when you don't take out the policy before that age that they cut you off at 70.

 

There are a couple of  insurers on the Imm  list that guarantee renewal for life or til age 99, though.

 

hypothetically and saying one makes it, what happens to our 100 year old retiree?

packed off to IDC while he waits for his letter from the queen?

 

[oslooskar]

4 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Anyway, in course of coming weeks we will know for sure when the first OA holders will visit their provincial IO's for extensions of stay. 

I did my third 90-day report last week and was told by two immigration officers that I would need proof of health insurance when I applied for an extension of my O-A visa in February. They told me my Kaiser plan was unacceptable. Draw your own conclusions.

[LivinLOS]

2 minutes ago, oslooskar said:

I did my third 90-day report last week and was told by two immigration officers that I would need proof of health insurance when I applied for an extension of my O-A visa in February. They told me my Kaiser plan was unacceptable. Draw your own conclusions.

Report from Chiang Rai yesterday (probably the day before visit) was same. 

[Max69xl]

31 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Actually AETNA,  like BUPA Thailand before them,. guarantee lifetime renewal if you purchase before age 60. It is only when you don't take out the policy before that age that they cut you off at 70.

 

There are a couple of  insurers on the Imm  list that guarantee renewal for life or til age 99, though.

Do you think people older than 60 have a crystal ball at home? How would they know about the mandatory health insurance and insurance policies? 

[domdom]

Hello,

 

Yesterday a french guy made his extension of stay in Jomtien (some years ago he had a OA visa he extended).. Came back as told today to get his passport back..

This morning they told him his extension won t be made unless he has a thai health insurance (he has a french one covering 100%)..

Otherwise they told him to change for O visa..

So, it appears both different officers who told me last week we were non concerned if already on extension of stay, told BS

Have a nice evening

[LivinLOS]

1 minute ago, domdom said:

Hello,

 

Yesterday a french guy made his extension of stay in Jomtien (some years ago he had a OA visa he extended).. Came back as told today to get his passport back..

This morning they told him his extension won t be made unless he has a thai health insurance (he has a french one covering 100%)..

Otherwise they told him to change for O visa..

So, it appears both different officers who told me last week we were non concerned if already on extension of stay, told BS

Have a nice evening

Crucially was the ability to 'convert' an O-A class permission of stay to an O class permission of stay offered ? 

 

Or was the suggestion to 'change' meaning leave the country and reapply / start again (hardly change !!). 

 

[domdom]

He doesn t know, as he rushed out to check about insurances as he just has one week before his extension expiry date..

This is also what I would like to know..

I will go back to ask next week.. but as they told me last week it was not needed and it is.. I wonder what can be trusted in what they say...

Have a nice evening

[TorquayFan]

I obtained a NON-IMM 'O' Visa in Cardiff UK in 2015 and have obtained 'Extensions of Permission to Stay" since.

 

It seems these Health Insurance requirements only apply to 'OA' Visa.

 

Simple question please . . . what is the factor or the difference or the need to apply for 'OA' instead of the 'O' ?

 

Your help appreciated . . .

[Jip99]

12 minutes ago, TorquayFan said:

I obtained a NON-IMM 'O' Visa in Cardiff UK in 2015 and have obtained 'Extensions of Permission to Stay" since.

 

It seems these Health Insurance requirements only apply to 'OA' Visa.

 

Simple question please . . . what is the factor or the difference or the need to apply for 'OA' instead of the 'O' ?

 

Your help appreciated . . .

 

OA is multiple entry - and you can get two years out of it.

[TorquayFan]

Thank you JIP99 !

 

So why not apply for 'O' Visa not 'OA' - isn't it then possible to get a Multiple Re-entry Permit at ImmiG in Thailand - B 2900 ?

 

No need (atm) for Health Insurance that route . . . . ?

 

ATB

[Pib]

1 hour ago, LivinLOS said:

Crucially was the ability to 'convert' an O-A class permission of stay to an O class permission of stay offered ? 

 

Or was the suggestion to 'change' meaning leave the country and reapply / start again (hardly change !!). 

 

You can not convert an OA to an O. 

 

You must either leave Thailand and get a Non O in another country. 

 

Or leave Thailand "without" a reentry permit which then causes your OA to die upon leaving Thailand and then reenter Thailand on a exempt entry.  Then start the process to convert the exempt to a Non-O within Thailand.

[Exploring Thailand]

8 minutes ago, Pib said:

Or leave Thailand "without" a reentry permit which then causes your OA to die upon leaving Thailand and then reenter Thailand on a exempt entry.  Then start the process to convert the exempt to a Non-O within Thailand.

Do you mean leave Thailand without insurance? As I understand it OA is multi-entry. You don't need an additional permit.

[Pib]

6 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

Do you mean leave Thailand without insurance? As I understand it OA is multi-entry. You don't need an additional permit.

Yea, in case of multi entry OA then a re-entry permit is not needed "during the one year validity date of that OA."  

 

But if a person is already past that first year validity date and now in his second year because he left and reentered just before the validity expired then if he left without a reentry permit that would kill off the OA/permission to stay date.  

 

And if the person was really on a Retirement Extension of Stay based off that old OA visa which has expired, if he leaves Thailand without getting a reentry permit then the old OA visa/current extension of stay is killed off.  Like me...I originally entered on a OA in 2008 and now on my 11th Retirement Extension of Stay good under late 2020.  But if I was to exit Thailand tomorrow without a reentery permit to keep my extension of stay alive, I would need to start all over in getting a new Visa.  Like a Non-O visa outside of Thailand...or enter on an Exempt entry and start the process to convert that Exempt entry to a Non-O within Thailand.

 

 

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, domdom said:

Hello,

 

Yesterday a french guy made his extension of stay in Jomtien (some years ago he had a OA visa he extended).. Came back as told today to get his passport back..

This morning they told him his extension won t be made unless he has a thai health insurance (he has a french one covering 100%)..

Otherwise they told him to change for O visa..

So, it appears both different officers who told me last week we were non concerned if already on extension of stay, told BS

Have a nice evening

OK, so we have 2 real-life cases already:

1. The American pre Oct 31 issued OA holder (with no health assurance) who arrived yesterday at Suvarnabhumi Airport, and was stamped in for 1 year without any remarks.

2. The French OA holder going for his extension of stay yesterday in Jomtien, and being denied his extension for having no thai approved health assurance.

Too early to draw conclusions already, but more cases will surely pop-up in course of coming days.

[Mango Bob]

2 minutes ago, Mango Bob said:

If you reenter Thailand on a visa exempt do you not need to show a return airline ticket?  Plus the money requirement?

 

7 minutes ago, Pib said:

Yea, in case of multi entry OA then a re-entry permit is not needed "during the one year validity date of that OA."  

 

But if a person is already past that first year validity date and now in his second year because he left and reentered just before the validity expired then if he left without a reentry permit that would kill off the OA/permission to stay date.  

 

And if the person was really on a Retirement Extension of Stay based off that old OA visa which has expired, if he leaves Thailand without getting a reentry permit then the old OA visa/current extension of stay is killed off.  Like me...I originally entered on a OA in 2008 and now on my 11th Retirement Extension of Stay good under late 2020.  But if I was to exit Thailand tomorrow without a reentery permit to keep my extension of stay alive, I would need to start all over in getting a new Visa.  Like a Non-O visa outside of Thailand...or enter on an Exempt entry and start the process to convert that Exempt entry to a Non-O within Thailand.

 

 

 

Edited November 1, 2019 by Mango Bob

[Exploring Thailand]

1 minute ago, Pib said:

But if a person is already past that first year validity date and now in his second year because he left and reentered just before the validity expired then if he left without a reentry permit that would kill off the OA/permission to stay date.  

I see what you're saying about the Retirement Extension, but I'm not sure about the part above. Say you leave and re-enter just before the end of the first year. You now have another year. Are you saying that if you want exit and re-enter during this second year, you need a re-entry permit?

[domdom]

Hello

For the american guy, it seems normal as his visa was issued before oct 31st..

I read I think on TV that the new visas will mention "health insurance compulsory" and that insurance will be checked by IO at Swampi..

Let s see if someone getting a visa abroad from today onwards can confirm..

Good evening to everybody

[Peter Denis]

8 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

I see what you're saying about the Retirement Extension, but I'm not sure about the part above. Say you leave and re-enter just before the end of the first year. You now have another year. Are you saying that if you want exit and re-enter during this second year, you need a re-entry permit?

Yes, that's correct.  When the original 1 year OA Visa validity date has expired, you will need re-entry permits when leaving and re-entering Thailand to keep your 'permit to stay' alive during the 2nd year.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Peter Denis

[Pib]

15 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

I see what you're saying about the Retirement Extension, but I'm not sure about the part above. Say you leave and re-enter just before the end of the first year. You now have another year. Are you saying that if you want exit and re-enter during this second year, you need a re-entry permit?

Yes, if you are past the one year validity period of an OA visa but exited and reentered before that validity period ended in order to get another year, then you must have a reentry permit for further exits/reentries to keep your permission to stay date alive.

[Peter Denis]

9 minutes ago, domdom said:

Hello

For the american guy, it seems normal as his visa was issued before oct 31st..

I read I think on TV that the new visas will mention "health insurance compulsory" and that insurance will be checked by IO at Swampi..

Let s see if someone getting a visa abroad from today onwards can confirm..

Good evening to everybody

Thanks for the response.

I want to point out that the French guy going for extension of his permission to stay ALSO had a pre Oct 31 issued OA Visa and subsequent permissions.

So we now have the strange situation that the American guy will not be required for at least 1 year to have health insurance to stay on his OA Visa, while the French guy needs to have it now or his permission to stay will not be approved.

It's a bit of a mess, to use an understatement.

[Max69xl]

18 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

I see what you're saying about the Retirement Extension, but I'm not sure about the part above. Say you leave and re-enter just before the end of the first year. You now have another year. Are you saying that if you want exit and re-enter during this second year, you need a re-entry permit?

Yes,he does. The first year he's got free Multi Entry. Second year he needs a re-entry permit if leaving the country and coming back. 

[Max69xl]

3 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Thanks for the response.

I want to point out that the French guy going for extension of his permission to stay ALSO had a pre Oct 31 issued OA Visa and subsequent permissions.

So we now have the strange situation that the American guy will not be required for at least 1 year to have health insurance to stay on his OA Visa, while the French guy needs to have it now or his permission to stay will not be approved.

It's a bit of a mess, to use an understatement.

Like I told you earlier today, the immigration officers have no clue how to read the police order. And we are not any wiser. 

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, Pib said:

You can not convert an OA to an O. 

 

You must either leave Thailand and get a Non O in another country. 

 

Or leave Thailand "without" a reentry permit which then causes your OA to die upon leaving Thailand and then reenter Thailand on a exempt entry.  Then start the process to convert the exempt to a Non-O within Thailand.

There is some debate on this.. It was hinted (but not confirmed) that Phuket felt it was ok to extend a non imm OA class permission of stay, under non imm O type retirement extension. Thereby converting the reason for extension like converting from marriage to retirement or biz to marriage.. 

 

I take no firm side in the issue.. In fact lean to the idea it would be viewed as against the spirit of the law, but it sounded like this was what Phuket said would be ok. 

[LivinLOS]

40 minutes ago, Exploring Thailand said:

I see what you're saying about the Retirement Extension, but I'm not sure about the part above. Say you leave and re-enter just before the end of the first year. You now have another year. Are you saying that if you want exit and re-enter during this second year, you need a re-entry permit?

yes obviously.. Your visa has expired at that point. 

 

If you leave your permission to stay expires and coming back you would have no grounds for anything other than a visa exempt arrival.