O/A visa and insurance experience today

[brianj1964]

This was my experience at Bangkok airport yesterday.

i applied for an O/A from London and it was issued 15th October but due to English half term I decided to travel this week.

i got to passport control and showed the visa to the IO at the airport, he called my wife over and sent me to a desk where I was told the visa was invalid without the insurance, I told him my "understanding " was that it was only for visas applied for after the 31st and mine was issued 15th, he said that because I had traveled after the 31st I now required to obtain insurance, and he would only give me a 30 day tourist visa and I had 30 days to get it and take it to the immigration and they would then allow me 12 months.

after 2 hours I relented and said ok however when I represented the visa at the desk the young woman stamped it for 12 months minus 2 days. So all good however if I leave in the next 12 months for any reason I anticipate further problems

another observation was a German man who had an AXA policy which he claimed was better than the Thai policy was also having problems, they didn't seem to accept the paperwork  and said it had to be one of the Thai policies, I don't know if I have misunderstood my situation or the IO,s have been given wrong advice they just kept pointing to the paperwork they were given. I got here eventually but foresee problems for other people 

[ubonjoe]

Apparently not all immigration officers have gotten the message it does not apply to a visa issued prior to October 31st.

I seems the person that stamped you in to  the country for a year was aware of that.

[brianj1964]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

Apparently not all immigration officers have gotten the message it does not apply to visa issued prior to October 31st.

I seems the person that stamped you in the country for a year was aware of that.

That was my understanding Joe of the dates but could not get through to them and one of them said she would lose her job if she allowed me in without insurance 

[bangkokbanjo]

Well, I have my OA issued in October and am arriving in two weeks.  I got the insurance anyway, just to be safe .  It's an outside policy , but I downloaded the form from the official Thai website and have the necessary signatures for that.  Hopefully, I won't have any issues 

[jacko45k]

1 hour ago, brianj1964 said:

and I had 30 days to get it and take it to the immigration and they would then allow me 12 months.

Interesting statement. A person with an unused Non-Imm-OA, gets a 30 day stamp,  and can go to immigration in Thailand and get a 12 month stamp later. As I have said, this may explain why  insurance is mentioned in the police order relating to retirement extensions. 

[Andrew Dwyer]

6 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Interesting statement. A person with an unused Non-Imm-OA, gets a 30 day stamp,  and can go to immigration in Thailand and get a 12 month stamp later. As I have said, this may explain why  insurance is mentioned in the police order relating to retirement extensions. 

Seems about right.

They are saying “ you need the insurance, we will give you 30 days to get it then stamp you in for a year “

At least they are not refusing entry.

 

However, as he got stamped in for a year it just shows that Thai immigration are as confused as the rest of us !!

Edited November 6, 2019 by Andrew Dwyer

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Seems about right.

They are saying “ you need the insurance, we will give you 30 days to get it then stamp you in for a year “

At least they are not refusing entry.

Why would they refuse entry when a person is eligible for a 30 day stamp? 

[Peter Denis]

27 minutes ago, bangkokbanjo said:

Well, I have my OA issued in October and am arriving in two weeks.  I got the insurance anyway, just to be safe .  It's an outside policy , but I downloaded the form from the official Thai website and have the necessary signatures for that.  Hopefully, I won't have any issues 

Hi Bangkokbanjo,

When it turns out that health-insurance is indeed required even when entering on a pre Oct 31 issued OA Visa, yours would be an interesting case.

Border immigration officers have been instructed to check the OA Visa for health-insurance notes from the Embassy/Consulate that issued the OA Visa.  Your OA Visa does not carry such notes as it was issued pre Oct 31.

But you do have the health-insurance certificate that is required for post Oct 31 applications for an OA Visa.

Please keep us posted of your experience on entering.

Note: Hopefully in 2 weeks the present mess/confusion will have been sorted out by then.

 

[Sheryl]

42 minutes ago, bangkokbanjo said:

Well, I have my OA issued in October and am arriving in two weeks.  I got the insurance anyway, just to be safe .  It's an outside policy , but I downloaded the form from the official Thai website and have the necessary signatures for that.  Hopefully, I won't have any issues 

 

Very interested to hear you were able to get this form signed for a foreign policy, can I ask which company?

[Max69xl]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Apparently not all immigration officers have gotten the message it does not apply to a visa issued prior to October 31st.

I seems the person that stamped you in to  the country for a year was aware of that.

It doesn't matter if every officer in Thailand gets the message, many of them still don't understand how it works. 

[Max69xl]

36 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Why would they refuse entry when a person is eligible for a 30 day stamp? 

That's not the point. The point is that he had a valid O-A Visa issued prior to October 31, and the IO still didn't understood the instructions in the police order released in April this year.

[brianj1964]

46 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Interesting statement. A person with an unused Non-Imm-OA, gets a 30 day stamp,  and can go to immigration in Thailand and get a 12 month stamp later. As I have said, this may explain why  insurance is mentioned in the police order relating to retirement extensions. 

They told me without the insurance they would give me a 30 day tourist visa and I would have to arrange the insurance with a Thai company and tthen return to immigration and be allowed to use the O/A. I was at the passport control for 2 hours trying to argue my case 

[Sheryl]

3 minutes ago, brianj1964 said:

They told me without the insurance they would give me a 30 day tourist visa and I would have to arrange the insurance with a Thai company and tthen return to immigration and be allowed to use the O/A. I was at the passport control for 2 hours trying to argue my case 

 

I urge you to complain back to the Embassy/Consulate which issued the visa.

[jacko45k]

5 minutes ago, brianj1964 said:

They told me without the insurance they would give me a 30 day tourist visa and I would have to arrange the insurance with a Thai company and tthen return to immigration and be allowed to use the O/A. I was at the passport control for 2 hours trying to argue my case 

Sorry to hear you got messed about but your feedback is useful.  Thanks. 

[Max69xl]

58 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Seems about right.

They are saying “ you need the insurance, we will give you 30 days to get it then stamp you in for a year “

At least they are not refusing entry.

 

However, as he got stamped in for a year it just shows that Thai immigration are as confused as the rest of us !!

An immigration officer at the largest airport in Thailand is supposed to be able to read a police order in thai and understand it. And if they don't understand, why not ask someone who should know? The police order was released in April,over 6 months ago. 

Edited November 6, 2019 by Max69xl

[brianj1964]

12 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

I urge you to complain back to the Embassy/Consulate which issued the visa.

I got it from London, I applied before 31st October, I uploaded the documents they requested. If someone applies now would the insurance  be part of the application? Or would someone apply after the visa is granted?

Edited November 6, 2019 by brianj1964

[ubonjoe]

16 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

That's not the point. The point is that he had a valid O-A Visa issued prior to October 31, and the IO still didn't understood the instructions in the police order released in April this year.

The police order was issued in September.

You confusing the cabinet resolution done in April with it.

[jacko45k]

3 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

An immigration officer at the largest airport in Thailand is supposed to be able to read a police order in thai and understand it. And if they don't understand, why not ask someone who should know? The police order was released in April,over 6 months ago. 

The one I saw signed by some police general was dated Sept 27, 2019 and stated effective from Oct 31st. The cabinet resolution was indeed in April. So they haven't had as long as you suggest to get up to speed. I have an image of a swan paddling like crazy against a current.

[brianj1964]

How much is this insurance costing per year?

they told me to take a picture of a web link when they originally told me I could get a tourist visa? My wife seemed to think the IO said 40,000

[UKresonant]

34 minutes ago, brianj1964 said:

They told me without the insurance they would give me a 30 day tourist visa and I would have to arrange the insurance with a Thai company and tthen return to immigration and be allowed to use the O/A. I was at the passport control for 2 hours trying to argue my case 

So you are not new to Thailand? 

If before the end of the 30 days, I understood  previously, that you may have to be in Thailand more than 180 days to fulfill the T&Cs of these policies, or do those conditions no longer apply on these policies now??

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by UKresonant

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, brianj1964 said:

How much is this insurance costing per year?

Check some of the companies shown on this website by clicking the links for them. https://longstay.tgia.org/home/companiesoa

[Jingthing]

39 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

That's not the point. The point is that he had a valid O-A Visa issue hid prior to October 31, and the IO still didn't understood the instructions in the police order released in April this year.

Well that potential issue will be timed out fairly quickly as OA visas issued before October 31 all become used. 

[Sheryl]

25 minutes ago, brianj1964 said:

I got it from London, I applied before 31st October, I uploaded the documents they requested. If someone applies now would the insurance  be part of the application? Or would someone apply after the visa is granted?

 

They would have to show proof of insurance now. And the Embassy would make a notation next to the visa stating that insurance requirement has been met.

 

They -- quite rightly -- did not require it prior to the effective date of 31 October and they need to know that this problem is occurring so they can provide appropriate feedback.

[Max69xl]

17 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

The one I saw signed by some police general was dated Sept 27, 2019 and stated effective from Oct 31st. The cabinet resolution was indeed in April. So they haven't had as long as you suggest to get up to speed. I have an image of a swan paddling like crazy against a current.

I think the problem is the chain of information. How do they get the info? Even if they had 1,5 month what's so hard about understanding a police order? I'm sure they will learn eventually. 

[brianj1964]

6 minutes ago, UKresonant said:

So you are not new to Thailand? 

If before the end of the 30 days, I understood  previously, that you may have to be in Thailand more than 180 days to fulfill the T&Cs of these policies, or do those conditions no longer apply on these policies now??

 

Been on holiday about 25 times and previously held a 90 day non immigrant, this OA is my retirement plan. The 30 day I was offered was to allow me to enter without using the OA and told to deal with the insurance and then use the OA

[Max69xl]

9 minutes ago, UKresonant said:

So you are not new to Thailand? 

If before the end of the 30 days, I understood  previously, that you may have to be in Thailand more than 180 days to fulfill the T&Cs of these policies, or do those conditions no longer apply on these policies now??

 

Do you understand the topic? It's about an O-A Visa issued prior to October 31,and then an insurance is not needed. 

[Max69xl]

42 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

I urge you to complain back to the Embassy/Consulate which issued the visa.

What good will that do? The embassy/consulate didn't do anything wrong, and they won't lift a finger anyway. 

[Sheryl]

29 minutes ago, brianj1964 said:

How much is this insurance costing per year?

they told me to take a picture of a web link when they originally told me I could get a tourist visa? My wife seemed to think the IO said 40,000

 

Immigration officer will not know the cost which in any case will depend on your age and which company/policy you select. Unless you are under the age of 60 your premium is going to be well over 40,000.

 

  The 40,000 the Immigration officer referred to is  the required coverage:  a minimum of 400,000 inpatient and 40,000 outpatient cover. Note that 400,000 inpatient cover, while it satisfies Immigration requirements, is completely insufficient for actual protection, a single hospitalization here after a severe accident or illness can reach 1 million baht in a government hospital and well over 3 million in a private hospital.

 

You can find charts which  summarize the info available from the companies on the website  here:

 

Has a short chart attached and is what you should refer to if you are planning n settling here permanently.

 

If you are not planning on retiring here permanently (and therefore do not need to worry about whether the policy can be renewed for life) then your choices are wider and you should see the chart attached to this thread:

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1128396-cheat-sheet-for-longstay-insurance-policies/

 

 

[Sheryl]

4 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

What good will that do? The embassy/consulate didn't do anything wrong, and they won't lift a finger anyway. 

 

Elsewhere it has been reported that Embassies were being asked to provide feedback on the new system requiring insurance.

 

Of course they did not do anything wrong but, as they have issued visas to people based on the understanding that the insurance was not required before the 31st,  they need to know that some  Immigration officers at airports are enforcing the requirement on people with visas issued earlier.

 

We have had many reports of people holding O-As issued by this Embassy prior to Oct 31 calling them to see if they would have a problem and being told no. At a minimum the Embassy might advise otherwise given this information. But they won't know if not told.

 

They do have channels open to them to report the problem.

[brianj1964]

5 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Immigration officer will not know the cost which in any case will depend on your age and which company/policy you select. Unless you are under the age of 60 your premium is going to be well over 40,000.

 

  The 40,000 the Immigration officer referred to is  the required coverage:  a minimum of 400,000 inpatient and 40,000 outpatient cover. Note that 400,000 inpatient cover, while it satisfies Immigration requirements, is completely insufficient for actual protection, a single hospitalization here after a severe accident or illness can reach 1 million baht in a government hospital and well over 3 million in a private hospital.

 

You can find charts which  summarize the info available from the companies on the website  here:

 

Has a short chart attached and is what you should refer to if you are planning n settling here permanently.

 

If you are not planning on retiring here permanently (and therefore do not need top worry about whether the policy can be renewed for life) then your choices are wider and you should see the chart attached to this thread:

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1128396-cheat-sheet-for-longstay-insurance-policies/

 

 

I'm 55 Sheryl so I'm expecting a good price, it's difficult looking on my phone I will investigate my options when I get computer access in Pattaya in 3 days.

i was planning permanent retirement here but I didn't anticipate this when I retired in May. I always thought that's what the 800,000 was for previously 

do I have any other options to live here permanently without insurance? Visa wise?