Ban of 3 substances will cripple sugar industry: expert

[overherebc]

31 minutes ago, teacherofwoe said:

You just need to wiki this stuff:

It is quick-acting and non-selective, killing green plant tissue on contact. It is also toxic to human beings and animals due to its redox activity, which produces superoxide anions. It has been linked to the development of Parkinson's disease^[6][7] and is banned in several countries.

Paraquat was first manufactured and sold by ICI in early 1962, and is today among the most commonly used herbicides.

Amazing! Toxic to humans causing Parkinson's and is one of the most common pesticides. And apparently without it, according to our expert, we can't grow sugar like they did 50 years ago.

Oxygen is the biggest killer but can take 90+ years to take effect in some cases.

[uncleeagle]

Im guessing the next stage of this ongoing development will involve replacement chemicals imported from China and probably no safer. 

[somo]

4 hours ago, Chazar said:

suicide  nonsense  again.............just  get  on  the  Thai  roads thats  a  real  good  suicide  attempt

In the last ten years there have been 3 suicides involving paraquat in my village of less then 200 people. 1.5% of the population. How many have died from paraquat infected food in the whole world in the last ten years? None that have been recorded as such so let's hold onto some perspective. If it is banned I guarantee there will be more suicides within a year or two as people lose their livelihoods and despair. How many lives would be saved if it is banned. Nothing like 1.5% of the worlds population I am sure.

Most proponents of this ban know nothing about farmers lives here in Thailand yet find the time to criticise and make jokes. If Thailand wants to save lives then yes I agree they should focus on making the roads safer not push poor people into tighter corners.

[from the home of CC]

kind of ironic that research suggests that sugar is one of the most toxic substances we readily ingest...

[hotchilli]

9 hours ago, webfact said:

“Currently Thailand is world’s 5th sugar producer and 2nd biggest exporter with more than 11 million rai of sugarcane plantation areas and 134 million tonnes of sugarcane produced per year,” he said. “The ban of these 3 substances, especially Paraquat, will affect the sugar production in 2020 as well as other related industries such as food processing, animal feed, ethanol manufacturing and biomass power plants.

So lets ignore all the worlds evidence and put profits before people & the environment... expert my <deleted>!

[George Aylesham]

This belated ban will avoid a lot of people becoming crippled. The industry has had yonks to switch to alternative methods of cultivation of sugar cane.

[Inn Between]

Less sugar is good thing. If production is significantly reduced, as the very biased "expert" says, the action of banning these toxins will kill two birds with one stone, so to speak. 

[Tayaout]

9 minutes ago, Inn Between said:

Less sugar is good thing. If production is significantly reduced, as the very biased "expert" says, the action of banning these toxins will kill two birds with one stone, so to speak. 

Most of it is used as fuel additive. It won't reduce sweet food but more likely increase price of fuel and everything else indirectly. 

[FarFlungFalang]

8 hours ago, Youlike said:

How do the farmers in Queensland Australia do it? Do they still use paraquat and the lot?

They don't I once worked with one who went organic because he said the he almost died from chemical poisoning!

[somo]

While we are at it lets ban cars. Think of all the lives and misery  and pollution that would save. Oh yeah alcohol, having fun etc. But no, everyone wants to ban something that won't affect them, only the poor, but then they don't matter do they? It's easy to be holier than though when you sit in a castle but being asked to make a personal sacrifice and everyone runs for cover. Cars kill millions and are largely responible for global warming but shock horror lets kill those headlines and distract everyone with something which has yet to be shown responsible for a single death other than suicide.

[Beggar]

Thailand just increased the tax on products containing a lot of sugar. It would be logical to decrease the sugar production. So where is the problem? 

[farmerjo]

4 minutes ago, Beggar said:

Thailand just increased the tax on products containing a lot of sugar. It would be logical to decrease the sugar production. So where is the problem? 

It grows well here.

Other crops not so well.

 

[FarFlungFalang]

18 minutes ago, somo said:

While we are at it lets ban cars. Think of all the lives and misery  and pollution that would save. Oh yeah alcohol, having fun etc. But no, everyone wants to ban something that won't affect them, only the poor, but then they don't matter do they? It's easy to be holier than though when you sit in a castle but being asked to make a personal sacrifice and everyone runs for cover. Cars kill millions and are largely responible for global warming but shock horror lets kill those headlines and distract everyone with something which has yet to be shown responsible for a single death other than suicide.

I'll second that motion!I've been pointing out this hypocrisy for thirty years.

[FarFlungFalang]

2 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

It grows well here.

Other crops not so well.

 

Hemp seems to do well here and requires no chemicals for successful cultivation and provides much more useful and healthy products than sugar. 

[Tayaout]

10 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Hemp seems to do well here and requires no chemicals for successful cultivation and provides much more useful and healthy products than sugar. 

It doesn't require chemicals in theory but that's not how things work most of the time when money is involved. Farmers with poor soil will use chemicals fertilizer to increase yield. Glyphosate can be used to kill weeds before planting and in some case directly on the crop to dry it out before harvest. Hemp is also vulnerable to some insects and fungus when under stress so some insecticide or fungicide could be used. 

 

However if it was my livelihood I would probably choose hemp but it's not legal yet... 

[farmerjo]

2 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Hemp seems to do well here and requires no chemicals for successful cultivation and provides much more useful and healthy products than sugar. 

I grow sunn hemp,it is chemical free throughout its growing period except for before planting glyphosate is used to kill the weeds before it germinates.If i had to live off either sunn hemp or sugar,i would be growing sugar.

The other hemp seems a closed shop for the local Thai battlers at this stage.

[atyclb]

10 hours ago, Topdoc said:

12 hours ago, keith101 said:

extremely toxic to the liver

Is it a coincidence that the incidence rate of liver cancer in Khon Kaen is the highest in the world and that Khon Kaen is one of the country's major sugarcane growing areas?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12718642

 

yup and maybe compounded by local alcohol consumption and pickled crab(a known source of liver flukes/cancer)

[emptypockets]

11 hours ago, Inn Between said:

Less sugar is good thing. If production is significantly reduced, as the very biased "expert" says, the action of banning these toxins will kill two birds with one stone, so to speak. 

Nonsense. Other countries will simply fill the void left by reduced Thai sugar on the world market. The same with any other tradeable commodity.

[emptypockets]

11 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

They don't I once worked with one who went organic because he said the he almost died from chemical poisoning!

Organic cane growing in Queensland? Surely you jest.

[FarFlungFalang]

16 hours ago, overherebc said:

Oxygen is the biggest killer but can take 90+ years to take effect in some cases.

If you breathe  only oxygen it will kill you a lot faster than that.

[FarFlungFalang]

2 hours ago, emptypockets said:

Organic cane growing in Queensland? Surely you jest.

No he farmed organic veggies after moving to NSW.He was a neighbour,but we grow plenty of sugar here without chemical weed  or insecticides!

[overherebc]

3 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

If you breathe  only oxygen it will kill you a lot faster than that.

Sneaky stuff, you can't trust it. I get my own back on it. I filter it through cigarettes.

[TPI]

Utter nonsense, Australia grows enormous amounts of sugar cane without the use of lethal poisons! Khun Kitti is only an industry stooge. If they were to truly organise and modernise their industry the profits would be enormous but that wont happen while the "sen yai's" of the industry can continue to con the farmers of the cane!

[Coremouse]

Paraquat is extremly LETHAL, in China we have name it "bai cao ku" could literally translate to omni-wither, we're told the thing have a death rate of >99%(wiki: there are more than 5,000 deaths in China from paraquat poisoning every year) just hearing that name would send chills to my spine.

 

Seen suicide case with it, even a small dosage could be terminal, and even the suicidal person regrets and want to be saved, there's nothing in the world can save him from a long, painful death of respiratory failure, and repeated gastric lavage doesn't help life quality either. When orally ingested the chem literally melts the lung and kidney and destroy a human from within.

 

[fforest1]

1 hour ago, Coremouse said:

Paraquat is extremly LETHAL, in China we have name it "bai cao ku" could literally translate to omni-wither, we're told the thing have a death rate of >99%(wiki: there are more than 5,000 deaths in China from paraquat poisoning every year) just hearing that name would send chills to my spine.

 

Seen suicide case with it, even a small dosage could be terminal, and even the suicidal person regrets and want to be saved, there's nothing in the world can save him from a long, painful death of respiratory failure, and repeated gastric lavage doesn't help life quality either. When orally ingested the chem literally melts the lung and kidney and destroy a human from within.

 

Same goes for toilet bowl cleaners which should all be banned to stop suicides......Same goes for bleach which should be banned to stop suicides.....

[emptypockets]

53 minutes ago, fforest1 said:

Same goes for toilet bowl cleaners which should all be banned to stop suicides......Same goes for bleach which should be banned to stop suicides.....

And rope, including hemp rope.Ban that as well as many people hang themselves with rope. Ban belts and sheets too. No building above one storey allowed, and all buildings to be surrounded by 1 foot of foam rubber just in case anyone thinks about jumping. Tear down those condos and hotels NOW!

 

When will people understand that paraquat is not the problem, mental illness is. The suicidal will find other methods to top themselves.

 

That is the problem trying to have a rational discussion with people who never seen, let alone used industrial or agricultural chemicals. Paranoia, nonsense, ill founded emotion, selective picking of "facts" from Wikipedia ( boy, has that got a lot to answer for!) and nonsensical arguments enter the arena.

 

[MaxLee]

Who can sense an enormous round of brown envelops making the rounds???

[Tayaout]

11 minutes ago, emptypockets said:

That is the problem trying to have a rational discussion with people who never seen, let alone used industrial or agricultural chemicals. Paranoia, nonsense, ill founded emotion, selective picking of "facts" from Wikipedia ( boy, has that got a lot to answer for!) and nonsensical arguments enter the arena.

 

The effect of banning paraquat is not as straightforward to interpret as you want to believe: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5667494/