Retirement extension via monthly B65K rejected in Khon Kaen

[bigginhill]

7 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

You should read\understand better

1/ it's not the OP who forgot the photo

2/ offered was not imposed, but was not free

''it was a Friday, and I was told that I could send new ones in to the I/O on his LINE profile, he would download and print them off and put them with the application, i.e. if I would like to donate something to their Xmas fund, of which I did as it would have been a 3 hour return trip, money spent on fuel and my time etc etc, wife didn't want too....lol, so the 500 baht was worth it IMO, in other words he did me a favor as opposed to me returning on Monday.''

i understand you should have accepted too, but if you don't see any problem

you don't know the definition of corruption (You can form a club with Matzzon who doesn't seem to understand it also) because it's not a random guys offering a random service. he is a public agent solliciting a bribe to do something in direct relation with his public job. Normaly if the IO want to be correct he should give to the user the internet local office link to send the photos FOR FREE.

You get it now or not yet?

 

Your post

"You should read\understand better

1/ it's not the OP who forgot the photo

2/ offered was not imposed, but was not free"

 

Then you followed by quoting the op, all bar the phrase proceeding the quote published in the above.

.

And that phrase is....

"there was once that I forgot to take photos when I submitted my extension based on marriage to a Thai,"

 

Why? Just out of curiosity.

 

I take it that also that you have first hand experience of that particular IM office, as I'm not sure all would provide this service of receiving documents and attaching them to the files as part of their offices duties. I have normally found that they had to be brought in by hand.

 

In this scenario that OP has explained, in the complete post, that I read and understood, the IM making this offer to ForMyEgo (or I) would have been perceived welcomely, whereas you would have perceived it as as corruption and insisted that he receive the documents internet, alternatively you would have returned with the said forgotton photos.

 

Edited November 15, 2019 by bigginhill

[kingofthemountain]

51 minutes ago, bigginhill said:

 

Your post

"You should read\understand better

1/ it's not the OP who forgot the photo

2/ offered was not imposed, but was not free"

 

Then you followed by quoting the op, all bar the phrase proceeding the quote published in the above.

.

And that phrase is....

"there was once that I forgot to take photos when I submitted my extension based on marriage to a Thai,"

 

Why? Just out of curiosity.

 

I take it that also that you have first hand experience of that particular IM office, as I'm not sure all would provide this service of receiving documents and attaching them to the files as part of their offices duties. I have normally found that they had to be brought in by hand.

 

In this scenario that OP has explained, in the complete post, that I read and understood, the IM making this offer to ForMyEgo (or I) would have been perceived welcomely, whereas you would have perceived it as as corruption and insisted that he receive the documents internet, alternatively you would have returned with the said forgotton photos.

 

The OP of this topic is Rexall, not 4MyEgo, but it's not essential.

Of course it is for you because you persist in your deny then every diversion 

possible is welcome. but I am not going to try to explain you anymore what is corruption

and what is not, obviously you are not able to understand (Or you don't want and

the result is the same) the difference. Nevermind and have a nice day\night (Depend where you are)

[bigginhill]

3 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

The OP of this topic is Rexall, not 4MyEgo, but it's not essential.

Of course it is for you because you persist in your deny then every diversion 

possible is welcome. but I am not going to try to explain you anymore what is corruption

and what is not, obviously you are not able to understand (Or you don't want and

the result is the same) the difference. Nevermind and have a nice day\night (Depend where you are)

You are indeed right the OP is Rexall. My bad.

Your quote was of 4MyEgo post num 4 page 1. 

And my post stands the same, why accuse someone of not reading understanding by deliberately omitting the phrase that proves the opposite? It's curious. 

 

For me the question of our different views of what corruption effectively consists of is not important. 

 

But I do wonder if there is a word for someone who knowingly baits by using a total falsity.  

 

I wish you a pleasant evening too. 

[billsmart]

My eight yearly extension is due in mid-Dec. I intend to go into my local Immigration office in Phetchabun with two sets of application papers.

One is based on Retirement showing 12 monthly deposits of my pension of about THB 85K apiece. The one's for last Dec and Jan, however, were done via TransferWise and show up as domestic transfers from Thai Military Bank. In Feb, I switched to a direct wire transfer from my US bank to my Thai bank which show as international transfers. It costs me about THB 2K more per transfer.

 

The other set is based on Marriage showing multiple months of a balance of over THB 400K. I do not have THB 800K.

 

During my last eight extensions, I have switched back and forth between Retirement and Marriage before with no problem (other than the additional paperwork for Marriage and the added one-month wait for it to be approved by the regional office in Chiang Mai).

 

The visa I used to last enter Thailand 9 years ago was an OA visa. I have considered changing that to an O visa, but I'm going to wait and see what happens in Dec. I am 73 and have no health insurance and can probably not get any.

 

Wish me luck... ????

 

[hansnl]

21 hours ago, rexall said:

Thanks, Matzzon. It's possible. That is why I used the word "claim."  I don't know them personally, but do find the stories credible. One of the guys is a real straight-shooter, "law & order" type who impresses me as someone who makes sure to dot all of his i's and cross all of his t's. Neither of the stories involved any specific objections from the I/O other than that the B65K method was unacceptable. 

We'll see. But two in one week is too much of a coincidence not to raise a red flag..

There is a new chief........

[jesimps]

19 hours ago, PatOngo said:

What is disturbing is people who think they can retire but can't scrape together 800,000 baht!

That's a very patronising post. Nothing disturbing about it at all. I think most people have no problem getting together the 800k baht, but for various reasons prefer to do the monthly income or marriage visa method and it's perfectly legal according to the immigration rules. In my own case, I don't want to pop off leaving 800k in the bank here. My wife has the house, car and everything else I have in Thailand and she has a good job teaching, so I'd like to have a reasonable sum in the bank at home to leave to my youngest kids in the UK. 

Edited November 16, 2019 by jesimps

[hansnl]

20 minutes ago, billsmart said:

My eight yearly extension is due in mid-Dec. I intend to go into my local Immigration office in Phetchabun with two sets of application papers.

One is based on Retirement showing 12 monthly deposits of my pension of about THB 85K apiece. The one's for last Dec and Jan, however, were done via TransferWise and show up as domestic transfers from Thai Military Bank. In Feb, I switched to a direct wire transfer from my US bank to my Thai bank which show as international transfers. It costs me about THB 2K more per transfer.

 

The other set is based on Marriage showing multiple months of a balance of over THB 400K. I do not have THB 800K.

 

During my last eight extensions, I have switched back and forth between Retirement and Marriage before with no problem (other than the additional paperwork for Marriage and the added one-month wait for it to be approved by the regional office in Chiang Mai).

 

The visa I used to last enter Thailand 9 years ago was an OA visa. I have considered changing that to an O visa, but I'm going to wait and see what happens in Dec. I am 73 and have no health insurance and can probably not get any.

 

Wish me luck... ????

 

It seems, if you have a yellow tambien baan, hence a Thai ID number, are registered for tax and pay tax, you are a resident in Thailand, which means that by law a health insurance isn't obligatory.

Ask a lawyer, I asked a Public Prosecutor.

[rexall]

37 minutes ago, billsmart said:

My eight yearly extension is due in mid-Dec. I intend to go into my local Immigration office in Phetchabun with two sets of application papers.

One is based on Retirement showing 12 monthly deposits of my pension of about THB 85K apiece. The one's for last Dec and Jan, however, were done via TransferWise and show up as domestic transfers from Thai Military Bank. In Feb, I switched to a direct wire transfer from my US bank to my Thai bank which show as international transfers. It costs me about THB 2K more per transfer.

 

The other set is based on Marriage showing multiple months of a balance of over THB 400K. I do not have THB 800K.

 

During my last eight extensions, I have switched back and forth between Retirement and Marriage before with no problem (other than the additional paperwork for Marriage and the added one-month wait for it to be approved by the regional office in Chiang Mai).

 

The visa I used to last enter Thailand 9 years ago was an OA visa. I have considered changing that to an O visa, but I'm going to wait and see what happens in Dec. I am 73 and have no health insurance and can probably not get any.

 

Wish me luck... ????

 

Have a backup plan because there have been more than one report of extensions being denied on the basis of one or two deposits showing as domestic rather than foreign. In one incident, the OP was able to show receipts from TransferWise proving that the transfers were from offshore.  He was denied.  I/O wanted to see that FTT notation in the bankbook.

[KeeTua]

13 hours ago, rexall said:

17 hours ago, KeeTua said:

In September I was successful with getting my 1 year extension at Khon Kaen based on 65K/month for 12 months.

 

At first the IO said I needed 800K deposit in the bank. I said that 65K/month was allowed. We went back and forth politely until the IO got up and went to the IO in the small office at the rear, the one that signs off on the extensions.

 

Came back and said OK but they were very firm that it needed to be 12 months which I was able to prove. All clearly international transfers.

 

My suggestion is to dress and speak politely. If there is some problem, trying to convince the IO to ask the boss will go better if they have some respect for you.

 

Is it OK if I post this on the Khon Kaen Forum?  I won't use your name if you don't want.

Sure, go ahead and post it. You can leave my name off. Thanks for asking first.

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, billsmart said:

..

I am 73 and have no health insurance and can probably not get any.

 

At 73 with no major health problems  a number of international companies will insure you with an ecpat policy as will 3 of the approved cpmpanies on the Immigration "list". For the latter see

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1129628-oam-visa-insurance-options/

The premiums listed for Pacific Cross can be reduced 30 -50% by taking a deductible (excess) of 109-300k. (Obviously  would need to be sure you can afford the deductible)

 

Immigration aside it is not a good idea to be here uninsured. 

[JustinCredible]

22 hours ago, rexall said:

This is very interesting, guys. What I am hoping for is to identify if this is a pattern that extends beyond Khon Kaen and beyond these two incidents,  or if it  is an outlier.  I don't this so, but maybe the two guys I mentioned had a menacing look in their eyes and gravy stains on their Make America Great Again T-Shirts. As I said these seem pretty "meat, potatoes and beer" kind of guys and they have been following this subject along with the rest of us the past year. But it would help to know if they did something inadvertently or advertently to <deleted> off the I/O.  It would be even more interesting to know if this is happening to others.

 

It would also be interesting to know if it was the SAME IO rejecting the applications. I know of several people that have no problems using the income method at Khon Kaen.

 

[NoshowJones]

22 hours ago, PatOngo said:

What is disturbing is people who think they can retire but can't scrape together 800,000 baht!

Another poster who looks down on people who are not as well off financially as themselves.

People are entitled to give their opinions here on Thaivisa, but this sort of attitude is uncalled for.

 

[NoshowJones]

22 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

I never said that I approve or even value corruption.

 

I also don't write the law and of course am entitled to my opinion on overstayers, but perhaps you didn't read my post reply on overstayers further down the post, might want to refresh, "up to you".

 

I saw his gesture as a win/win, i.e. saving me a 3 hour return trip, which would have wasted my time, fuel into the environment, and my pocket, and contributing to their Xmas fund saved me all of the above, for 500 baht, chicken feed, he could have told me to come back, that would have peeeed me off.

 

I see no corruption here, a business transaction maybe, besides I once had to pay them 1,500 baht to come to our place to take photos together, as they have to pay for their own fuel, I confirmed this with a friend of a friend who has a brother-in-law who is in immigration, a bit like the cops having to purchase their own guns.

 

I consider myself an opportunist, if it works and saves me time and is for a small amount of money, sure thing, but to have to pay an agent 20k-30k to stay in the country because I don't have the funds, well that's got to hurt, but each to their own, and that's what I call getting lynched using your word.

There are people like myself who can afford to have the required funds in a Thai bank, but  want to give the banks as less custom as possible are they are the biggest crooks

in the country.

[Thailand]

2 hours ago, rexall said:

Have a backup plan because there have been more than one report of extensions being denied on the basis of one or two deposits showing as domestic rather than foreign. In one incident, the OP was able to show receipts from TransferWise proving that the transfers were from offshore.  He was denied.  I/O wanted to see that FTT notation in the bankbook.

I had that happen at CM but also went with a back up plan.

If the head honcho does not know of alternative ways of showing funds were from overseas then the subordinates are not going to know or certainly not query the HH,subsequently rejection.

 

For the coming year I should have all the monthly income ducks in a row but now Bangkok Bank shows income from overseas as "International Transfer" not FTT as required by the local office. So I have to wait a few months and be concerned that the IO's will not accept that either. (I see little point in going to ask them now if it would be acceptable as that is exactly what I did with the last "rejection")

No way to go on after 17 years and consecutive extensions of stay here. 

 

[kevinmartyn]

I have been working for over 40 years and a British foreigner staying in Thailand. I personally do NOT have access to 65,000 bhat and have NI payments over 35 years! Who are these people that have a pension income of 65k++

[Thailand]

14 minutes ago, kevinmartyn said:

I have been working for over 40 years and a British foreigner staying in Thailand. I personally do NOT have access to 65,000 bhat and have NI payments over 35 years! Who are these people that have a pension income of 65k++

Private pensions plus perhaps state pensions or other acceptable income.

[wtfracing]

22 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

Not by intention on the part of policy makers.  It is clear that both should still be possible. It is implementation insome provinces (not all by any means) that is flawed. And the overall ability of TI to introduce new rules and ensure they are understoof =d and followed, that is and long has been, very sub-optimal.

 

May not matter to those affected but I think it helps to understand that a lot of this is not in fact part of a systemic plan to push us out, as some people have come to feel.

So in other words the the total lack of common sense and each officials own interpretation of the laws as he sees fit is alive and well in Thailand as it has been in the 11 years I have been here lol that what I thought. Enjoy.

[flexomike]

2 hours ago, Sheryl said:

At 73 with no major health problems  a number of international companies will insure you with an ecpat policy as will 3 of the approved cpmpanies on the Immigration "list". For the latter see

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1129628-oam-visa-insurance-options/

The premiums listed for Pacific Cross can be reduced 30 -50% by taking a deductible (excess) of 109-300k. (Obviously  would need to be sure you can afford the deductible)

 

Immigration aside it is not a good idea to be here uninsured. 

what do the insurance companies consider major health issues, I have been taking both blood pressure and cholesterol pills, numbers are all good with the meds, hoping this isn't a disqualifier

[Thingamabob]

23 minutes ago, kevinmartyn said:

I have been working for over 40 years and a British foreigner staying in Thailand. I personally do NOT have access to 65,000 bhat and have NI payments over 35 years! Who are these people that have a pension income of 65k++

Possibly people with a state pension plus one or more company pensions.

[Thingamabob]

21 hours ago, dikcwakka said:

make no mistake they dont call it the emmigration department for nothing, sole qualification for getting a job there is to truly and thoroughly HATE farang

Ridiculous.

[Sheryl]

38 minutes ago, flexomike said:

what do the insurance companies consider major health issues, I have been taking both blood pressure and cholesterol pills, numbers are all good with the meds, hoping this isn't a disqualifier

Wouldn't be with some international insurers. Cigna Global insured me with no exclusions despite being on BP meds (but with good numbers), their intakee form is detailed and asks for current numbers etc and they distinguish hetween problems that ate and are not well controlled. Thai insurers though are usually spooked by the very mention of such meds.  If you need a policy from an Immigration approved company best bet would be Pacific Cross but I can't guarantee what they'd decide, you'd have to see. If over 65 they require a physical exam, if those numbers come back normal then perhaps ok.

[Sheryl]

Bickering and baiting posts that contribute nothing to the discussion have been removed.

[Peter Denis]

4 hours ago, billsmart said:

My eight yearly extension is due in mid-Dec.

...

The visa I used to last enter Thailand 9 years ago was an OA visa. I have considered changing that to an O visa, but I'm going to wait and see what happens in Dec. I am 73 and have no health insurance and can probably not get any.

I suggest you keep a close eye on the developments whether the health-insurance requirement will be enforced for extensions based on an original Non Imm OA retirement Visa.

If that's the case, there are 2 options:

1. Applying for a thai health-insurance policy that meets the 400/40K in/out-patient requirements and will issue a certificate stating the above.  When you want to go that road, you should do that well in advance (suggest NOW) because at your age you will be required to go through a medical check-up and approval procedure before the Insurance company would issue the policy and the required certificate.  The 'quick' policies that skip the above step are as good as worthless, so - if insurance is your way to go - better head for a policy that at least will provide you some value.

2. Do a border-run to a neighboring country that issues Non Imm O Visas, and apply there for such a Non Imm O Visa.  After having re-entered Thailand and at the end of the 60 days the Non Imm O Visa gives you, apply for an extension of stay at your local IO.  That way you circumvented the health-insurance requirement if it turns out that they enforce it on OA Visas.

Note that when your presently have a valid Re-Entry permit for your OA Visa, that you would need to let that expire before you can apply for a Non Imm O abroad.

>> Good luck and keep us posted!

 

Edited November 16, 2019 by Peter Denis

[Russell17au]

Ok, Rex has tried to explain things that are happening here in Khon Kaen and I am one of those that Rex has mentioned but most of you do not believe my claim so here are the facts and not a fictional claim. I went to Khon Kaen Immigration to renew my extension based on marriage and I was with my wife. We met with the I/O that sits at desk #1 and I presented him with all the documents which he looked through including the 1 year bank statements which showed my income coming from overseas and the letter from the bank plus a spreadsheet that was done by the bank which clearly showed my average monthly income for the year, but that did not suit the I/O. Unlike many of you I am on an Australian pension and that pension is paid directly from the Reserve Bank of Australia to my Bangkok Bank account in Khon Kaen it does not go through a commercial bank in Australia, but like all Australian pensions that are paid directly overseas they are paid at a 4 weekly interval and not a monthly interval so I am paid 13 x 4 weekly payments and not 12 x 1 monthly payments and that is what the I/O used against me even thou the official police order clearly states that the income system is worked on the annual average monthly income. As for going to another immigration office, that I am not doing but I am going to Savannakhet instead. Since this has happened to me I have spoken to others and there are a few that have had problems with their extension renewals that have been using the income system.

Edited November 16, 2019 by Russell17au

[Henryford]

On 11/15/2019 at 12:25 PM, PatOngo said:

What is disturbing is people who think they can retire but can't scrape together 800,000 baht!

I agree upto a point. But some start their retirement with well over the 800k but maybe illness, or several wives later, they find it hard to maintain the balance.

[zydeco]

1 hour ago, flexomike said:

what do the insurance companies consider major health issues, I have been taking both blood pressure and cholesterol pills, numbers are all good with the meds, hoping this isn't a disqualifier

One thing is certain, all these new requirements and lack of a dependable means of determining what will or will not be enforced is likely contributing to many people's ill health and high blood pressure. Wonder how many will fail the insurance physicals simply because of the haphazard way this law was introduced?

[billsmart]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

At 73 with no major health problems  a number of international companies will insure you with an ecpat policy as will 3 of the approved cpmpanies on the Immigration "list". For the latter see

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1129628-oam-visa-insurance-options/

The premiums listed for Pacific Cross can be reduced 30 -50% by taking a deductible (excess) of 109-300k. (Obviously  would need to be sure you can afford the deductible)

 

Immigration aside it is not a good idea to be here uninsured. 

If it comes to this, I hope to be able to find an insurance company, government agency, or a local hospital which will help me establish a "surety bond." In the USA, a surety bond is accepted in lieu of insurance. That would mean I'd give the bondholder THB 440K, in this case, and that would act as my "proof of insurance" for the year. They would charge me a small fee for this, and fees for handling any claims. At the end of the year, if I had withdrawn any of the money, I would have to replenish the total up to THB 440K again to get another year's bond. If I leave Thailand or die, the balance in the account (minus some small handling fees, of course) would go to whomever I stipulated on the bond, in my case, my Thai wife.

Does anyone know any insurance company or other responsible party or organization that could and would do something like this?

 

Thanks for all replies or advice...

[Fairynuff]

On 11/15/2019 at 1:25 PM, PatOngo said:

What is disturbing is people who think they can retire but can't scrape together 800,000 baht!

There are people living in their home countries, retired and don’t have the equivalent of 80,000 thb let alone 800. Don’t be disturbed by that, have a little understanding and compassion instead.

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, billsmart said:

If it comes to this, I hope to be able to find an insurance company, government agency, or a local hospital which will help me establish a "surety bond." In the USA, a surety bond is accepted in lieu of insurance. That would mean I'd give the bondholder THB 440K, in this case, and that would act as my "proof of insurance" for the year. They would charge me a small fee for this, and fees for handling any claims. At the end of the year, if I had withdrawn any of the money, I would have to replenish the total up to THB 440K again to get another year's bond. If I leave Thailand or die, the balance in the account (minus some small handling fees, of course) would go to whomever I stipulated on the bond, in my case, my Thai wife.

Does anyone know any insurance company or other responsible party or organization that could and would do something like this?

 

Thanks for all replies or advice...

No, I don't.  Definitely no hospital and no health insurance company.

 

Would not meet the Immigration requirement even if you could find someplace that did this.

[zydeco]

21 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

like all Australian pensions that are paid directly overseas they are paid at a 4 weekly interval and not a monthly interval so that is what the I/O used against me

Now, this is interesting. Back when these new 65K rules were first formulated, I saw a similar problem that could occur with American SS.  That is because SS is not always paid monthly. Sometimes, such as last year, it is paid twice during certain months, such as August last year, when September deposits were made early, on August 31, because of Labor Day. I wondered at the time, if this would trip people up. I also remember many Australians posting exactly about your situation, four week intervals rather than monthly.