SURVEY: Bilingual education -- Worth it or Not?

[Number 6]

1 hour ago, Alex2554 said:

6th grade (12yo) English book for Thai government schools

What am I missing? The issue?

[Reigntax]

2 hours ago, AlexRich said:

Most expats come to Thailand’s to improve their Cunnilingual skills.

Is that where you speak and eat at the same time?

[Number 6]

1 hour ago, Orton Rd said:

Know a few kids going to so called bi lingual Catholic Schools, they all come round to our house for lessons off the Mrs in English.

I'm aware of no Catholic bilingual schools in Bangkok.

 

The top Catholic and Christian schools have wait-list. Very competitive. Dunno about your backwater. My hunch is they're not bilingual at all. Maybe EP and in all likelihood just IP. 3 hours a week in English.

[Orton Rd]

18 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

I'm aware of no Catholic bilingual schools in Bangkok.

 

The top Catholic and Christian schools have wait-list. Very competitive. Dunno about your backwater. My hunch is they're not bilingual at all. Maybe EP and in all likelihood just IP. 3 hours a week in English.

Sarasas there about 30 of them, Catholic owned.

[Number 6]

15 minutes ago, Orton Rd said:

Sarasas there about 30 of them, Catholic owned.

Well they certainly aren't top schools. A few are so-so. I've never heard they are Catholic?? I'm certain these are for profit schools??

 

Anyone?

 

[Orton Rd]

British curricullum and some are very large campuses, the ones I have been to all have statues of Mary etc here and there. No not top schools but you get what you pay for.

[Kurtf]

To have bi lingual education first you must have bi lingual teachers and Thailand has damn few of those so the whole idea although well intentioned is doomed to failure.

[Rhys]

Until the Education ADMINISTRATION is replaced with professionals who know what they are doing, the new approach is doomed.

[shy coconut]

2 hours ago, Alex2554 said:

6th grade (12yo) English book for Thai government schools

Disgraceful, they've spelled fitness centre incorrectly!

[ivor bigun]

Our son reads ,writes and speaks English perfectly,and at 26 runs an import export company , so yes ,its always been his English that has been a major factor , 

ps the wife reads and writes it as well , as for me i think its just as good to be the same in Thai ,pity ime thick . 

[emptypockets]

2 hours ago, Number 6 said:

Rubbish. I've taught at five different schools in the past six years. During my time there I worked with no NNES in my department. There are good religious schools that employ many NES still.

 

Avoid Thai schools? What horrible advice. Top international schools aside all the competition is to get INTO Thai HS. Same with universities. Private universities are not good here to be certain.

 

Schools past six years, first hand:

1 No NNES 20 teachers

2. No NNES in EP English. Subjects were Filipino. IP all NES.

3. Same as above.

4. 8 NES teachers, 1 Filipino

5. All NES teaching LS, RW or very close. 30 teachers NES easy.

 

#2-4 schools NOW use as many NNES as possible because they do not want to pay 50-60-70k for teachers. 4 now has 3/8 foreign teachers it's a good school but being public has pay limits. The better Catholic schools and Christian schools pay ok and still employ many NES.

5 jobs in 6 years? Must look good on your resume. Can't hold down a job?

 

 

Only joking mate.

[emptypockets]

1 hour ago, Number 6 said:

Writing in particular. Vocabulary. Pronunciation. Am/Brit literature. Getting these skills from NNES imo is hopeless.

 

Standard big classroom for 30k. Have at it bro.

 

No guarantee that NNES can teach English either AND they are NNES!

 

I do agree about some of the Anglo Irish accents though. In Asia the North American accent preferred as is the spelling / vocab. I've only known two Thai kids with British accents (they were clean). One had Brit father, another studied with British teacher for years. Oh, another lots of time in Wales.

It may have missed your notice but most communication these days is either verbal or digital. The old requirements of perfect grammar/ spelling/ pronunciation went out the window years ago..

U no wat I meen?

 Might be sad but that is the reality.

The only requirement is to be able to communicate with another human and share an idea. Writing skills are pretty well redundant

 

When was the last time you wrote a letter?

[emptypockets]

43 minutes ago, Kurtf said:

To have bi lingual education first you must have bi lingual teachers and Thailand has damn few of those so the whole idea although well intentioned is doomed to failure.

Especially amongst the NES teachers.

[emptypockets]

19 minutes ago, ivor bigun said:

Our son reads ,writes and speaks English perfectly,and at 26 runs an import export company , so yes ,its always been his English that has been a major factor , 

ps the wife reads and writes it as well , as for me i think its just as good to be the same in Thai ,pity ime thick . 

Millions of people worldwide run I/E businesses without using English.

 

[thequietman]

3 hours ago, Solinvictus said:

Maybe it will cause a higher demand in Native English speakers along with better pay. I'd like to see that, of course.

 

[Isaanbiker]

4 hours ago, fruitman said:

Maybe they marry one of the international racers at the circuit! Valentino Rossi or so....

  A new one every day. You never get bored. 

[Toadie]

6 hours ago, EricTh said:

I thought I heard from some Thai people that they start learning English from grade 1 onwards? So isn't that already bilingual?

They have "English"  classes from the start of school. Teaching and learning whole different concept

[Scott]

6 hours ago, Happy Grumpy said:

One can't honestly answer such a question with such limited information.

 

Who will be the English teachers? Thais? Native English Speakers? Non-Native Speakers from South Africa? NNES from the Philippines? 

What qualifications will they have?

How many hours per day will they spend with their class?

Will they be homeroom (one class teachers, shared with one Thai teacher) or will they teach different lessons to different classes everyday?

 

Answer these questions please so we can properly vote. 

 

I am quoting from the article.  I don't know and I don't think anyone can answer for exactly how the gov't plans to implement the program.   I did work in bilingual education for many years, so I can only tell you what it generally means.  

 

First, bilingual schools usually conduct almost all classes in both English and Thai, so the split is approximately 50/50.   So math, social studies, science, PE, etc., all taught in both languages.  

 

Second, who will be teaching English?   Again I can't answer with any certainty, but we do know that the Ministry of Education does require either a Teacher's License or a Waiver for foreign teachers.   I suspect a significant number of teachers will be non-native speakers with a degree in English (and education).  

Some English teachers may be classroom teachers and be with the class full-time, others may be subject teachers and go from class to class to teach a particular subject.  

 

[Toadie]

I once seen a mathom English book they used stating,

 

"such and such a river is important because it is the border with x country and runs up hill"

 

I asked students why that was stupid. No answer.

 

Asked many "farang teachers".  Now that's painful.

 

Anybody?

[WeekendRaider]

no.  Pasa Thai as the 2nd language, and a foreign language such as English as a 3rd language, as it is now... only taught as to grammar and spelling and simple spoken phrases but not as a written language, except for fake assessments.... is the biggest thing holding back Thailand.

 

and make no mistake, at least anywhere north of Uttaraditt I know absolutely for sure that even in 2019... Gahm Mueaang is everyone’s first language.  Not the school required upper diglossia.  Yet huge studying and teaching efforts are still plowed into the idea of a diglossia, with all foreign languages a poor 3rd language.... except for some Bangkok and other elites that live as separate from everyday Thai as 80% of most ‘farlang’ and other foreigners do.

[tjo o tjim]

You have to look at it as a multi-generational problem.  First generation won’t be proficient due to current language skills of teachers, but by the third generation you should have fully proficient teachers and solid student outcomes. 
 

Of course, in 3 years they will decide something else is critical and undo any progress, but hey...

[tjo o tjim]

6 hours ago, emptypockets said:

It may have missed your notice but most communication these days is either verbal or digital. The old requirements of perfect grammar/ spelling/ pronunciation went out the window years ago..

U no wat I meen?

 Might be sad but that is the reality.

The only requirement is to be able to communicate with another human and share an idea. Writing skills are pretty well redundant

 

When was the last time you wrote a letter?

It really depends on what you do.  While bad english is the universal language, it does not translate to written form. Translation apps will allow for greater ignorance, but there is only so much they can do effectively. Outside of slack, I don’t think I would tolerate “U no wat I meen?” Language is about precision. 

[Fex Bluse]

I always try to respond to these surveys but find my options missing.

 

We have a few variables that the survey laid out:
1. good idea vs bad idea
2. will improve English skills vs will not
3. good investment of money vs not
4. will produce good results vs will not
5. should teach English vs should teach Chinese

 

So, the survey, at a minimum, should make available all combinations of these options.

 

[CALSinCM]

Reality: Who is going to teach English?  Thai teachers with a so-called 'Masters' in English who are not capable of holding a conversation with a NES no less being able to write English with minimal fluency, and who still teach all subjects, especially English, using rote learning while reinforcing the Thai cultural trait that making mistakes are 'bad', therefore student never learn and simply become risk-adverse clones.

It's going to take a total revamp of the educational system including a quantum shift in Thai culture to ever successfully teach Thai students English at a level where there is at least minimal fluency by the time the kids graduate.

[lemonjelly]

Most Thai have been too brainwashed by the spinners of Thai culture to seriously consider embracing anything foreign.

[Airbagwill]

Being bilingual or multilingual is shown to give  more successful students and higher degrees of competency in later life.... regardless of eventual language usage ...it improves learning abilities

Unfortunately many schools in Thailand are of very poor quality educationally being straight-jacketed by the Thai Education board and retrogressive and unimaginative nabobs 

[bkk_mike]

My own kids went to an International school, but the in-laws kids went to a Thai school, with English lessons from a Thai teacher who'd studied in New Zealand. Being taught by a Thai didn't stop my niece getting into a University in the UK. Being able to afford it as an international student was a different matter though.

 

I met the teacher a few times and she spoke better English than a lot of native English speakers.

[Happy Grumpy]

10 hours ago, Scott said:

I don't know and I don't think anyone can answer for exactly how the gov't plans to implement the program. 

So how on Earth are we supposed to decide and vote on if it is worth it or not, when we/you don't even know what 'it' is!!

[CALSinCM]

17 hours ago, EricTh said:

I thought I heard from some Thai people that they start learning English from grade 1 onwards? So isn't that already bilingual?

They all can sing "Happy Birthday" and say "Good Morning Teacher."  It's all downhill after that.

[Grusa]

Until the top hiso families actually want a population which can think, reason, argue, and understand international affairs and politics, it can never happen.

 

Turkeys won't vote for Christmas. Least of all the two top turkeys.