Maintaining a presence in home country when working abroad...

[marf 31]

I wish to spend an extended time period of perhaps a year to several years travelling and working abroad before returning to the UK. I realise that not being resident and working in the UK for a long time can affect entitlement to health treatment and no contributions to state pension. Additionally, many banks will close your accounts if you do not have a UK address.

 

What steps are recommended to maintain a regular presence, or at least the appearance of one, whilst working abroad, with the intention of returning to the UK at a later date. Even if things change and I stay abroad, it would be nice to have some elements of a pension when I eventually retire.

 

I can change my address to have my mail delivered to friends. Can I pay additional National Insurance? Must be people running their own businesses/contractors who are not on PAYE. How to pay? How much is required?

 

Anything else that's recommended?

Edited November 19 by marf

[sunnyboy2018 4,025]

I kept my address and had my post redirected. The details of any important letters copied into WhatsApp and i reply to them via friend who puts them in an english envelope with stamp. Dont worry about NI stamps..

you can lose five years. You do not lose right to NHS treatment but will need an address to have a GP. Dont tell your doc you are away...they only check after 5 years. Dont worry. I have travelled for the last 20 years plus and still.haveva UK presence.

[marf 31]

43 minutes ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

Dont worry about NI stamps... you can lose five years.

I am not sure... I may have a sketchy NI history in the past with a lot of only part time work for about six years or so directly after university...

[mokwit 1,247]

3 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

Dont worry. I have travelled for the last 20 years plus and still.haveva UK presence.

Same here, but in the the next 20 years this is going to be harder to do IMO e.g banks will be able to profile you much better and will notice patterns of debit card use that are out of line with someone living in the UK etc.

[steve187 4,342]

3 hours ago, marf said:

I am not sure... I may have a sketchy NI history in the past with a lot of only part time work for about six years or so directly after university...

either pay a voluntary stamp class 3 £16 a week, or go self employed class 2 at under £3.00 a week, but class 2 may stop in the near future

[Mike Teavee 978]

44 minutes ago, steve187 said:

either pay a voluntary stamp class 3 £16 a week, or go self employed class 2 at under £3.00 a week, but class 2 may stop in the near future

You are (or at least were) treated as self employed when working overseas so pay class 2.

 

I thought I'd read somewhere that this had stopped from April 2018 and I would begin to be charged at Class 3, but so far still seem to be being charged for Class 2

  

You can also top-up the previous 6 years contributions so if you do get to pay Class 2 you might as well, but please note it's debatable whether catching up on anything before April 2016 is worth it as they changed the calculations then & seem to have baselined people so anything before then may or may not count (I'm still trying to work out as I caught up 2010-2016 so now have 36 years and they're still telling me I'm 5 years short).

  

[topt 2,056]

10 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

I caught up 2010-2016 so now have 36 years and they're still telling me I'm 5 years short).

Depends when you caught up as they calculate which system (old/new(current) your contributions gave you the most pension at April 2016.

But it is complicated by reductions if you were contracted out at any time. I had 33 but need another 8 for example due to contracting out.

[sunnyboy2018 4,025]

On 11/19/2019 at 8:22 PM, marf said:

I am not sure... I may have a sketchy NI history in the past with a lot of only part time work for about six years or so directly after university...

You can pay a backlog of 7 years if you wish. One reason for signing on the dole is to get your stamps paid. How many years you have paid by the age of 67 will determine the size of your pension. You need 35 years for a full pension.

[Moonlover 3,748]

23 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

You are (or at least were) treated as self employed when working overseas so pay class 2.

Where did you get that from? I worked abroad for nearly 20 years and paid class 3 (voluntary) contributions. There was no mix up, DWP knew exactly where I was.

[Mike Teavee 978]

24 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Where did you get that from? I worked abroad for nearly 20 years and paid class 3 (voluntary) contributions. There was no mix up, DWP knew exactly where I was.

From HMRC, I have posted pics of the tables that they sent to me on the UK Pension thread, unfortunately the pics are on my Laptop in Singapore so won't be able to access them until I get back on 4th December.

 

I don't know if it makes a difference that I was posted overseas by the UK Bank I was working for, or if it makes a difference I was working/living in SIngapore (Which has a DTA with the UK but not a reciprocal Social Security agreement).

 

As a matter of interest where were you working whilst you were paying it?

 

 

I did a quick Google to see if I could find anything & came across this... https://app.croneri.co.uk/topics/national-insurance-employees-working-abroad/indepth skip to the Voluntary part.... 

Seconded workers who are not liable to pay Class 1 NICs may pay either voluntary Class 3 NICs or where appropriate Class 2 NICs. Class 2 and 3 contributions are set at a weekly fixed rate, adjusted around the start of each tax year. Class 2 contributions are currently considerably cheaper than Class 3 contributions and also provide a wider range of benefit entitlement. Therefore, where a person wishes to pay voluntary contributions to preserve their UK contribution record, it is advisable to pay Class 2 rather than Class 3 contributions.

 

Edit: Interesting post here 

 

Edited November 21 by Mike Teavee

[steve187 4,342]

On 11/20/2019 at 7:29 AM, Mike Teavee said:

You are (or at least were) treated as self employed when working overseas so pay class 2.

 

I thought I'd read somewhere that this had stopped from April 2018 and I would begin to be charged at Class 3, but so far still seem to be being charged for Class 2

  

You can also top-up the previous 6 years contributions so if you do get to pay Class 2 you might as well, but please note it's debatable whether catching up on anything before April 2016 is worth it as they changed the calculations then & seem to have baselined people so anything before then may or may not count (I'm still trying to work out as I caught up 2010-2016 so now have 36 years and they're still telling me I'm 5 years short).

  

what is your pension forecast showing

[metisdead 7,164]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.  The OP is seeking information about returning to the UK, not about the USA. 

[DannyCarlton 5,003]

On 11/19/2019 at 7:38 PM, sunnyboy2018 said:

I kept my address and had my post redirected. The details of any important letters copied into WhatsApp and i reply to them via friend who puts them in an english envelope with stamp. Dont worry about NI stamps..

you can lose five years. You do not lose right to NHS treatment but will need an address to have a GP. Dont tell your doc you are away...they only check after 5 years. Dont worry. I have travelled for the last 20 years plus and still.haveva UK presence.

I've been in Thailand more than 5 years and my doctor has made no checks on me. I still recieve a regular repeat prescription and return to the UK for an annual health check. The trick is to go dark. My doctor, banks, company pension provider, DWP etc. have no idea that I'm in Thailand.

 

From the get go I have maintained a room in my friends apartment, with all my personal effects in it. The bed is made up and it looks lived in. If an official did a spot check, it would appear lived in by me. The friend would just tell them that I'm away on an extended holiday.

 

My friend opens my mail and forwards anything important to me. He also collects my prescriptions and posts them to me.

 

This costs me nothing as my friend is a regular visitor to Thailand (here next week) and has a room in my house. A reciprocal arrangement.

 

There's nothing to stop you making a similar arrangement with a family member, ex spouse, sibling, offspring etc.

 

I can't give too much advice on NI contributions but will say that the requirement fo a full pension is 35 years contributions. I had more than 40 years contributions on retirement but still was subjected to a small reduction because I'd opted out of SERPS many decades ago. Was told I could make it up with a lump sum contribution (equivalent of one years NI contreibutions, I think) but as I already had 41/35 years contributions, thought it a con and told them to go spin on it.

 

Very easy to check your current lifetime NI contributions on the government website.

[Moonlover 3,748]

10 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

From HMRC, I have posted pics of the tables that they sent to me on the UK Pension thread, unfortunately the pics are on my Laptop in Singapore so won't be able to access them until I get back on 4th December.

 

I don't know if it makes a difference that I was posted overseas by the UK Bank I was working for, or if it makes a difference I was working/living in SIngapore (Which has a DTA with the UK but not a reciprocal Social Security agreement).

 

As a matter of interest where were you working whilst you were paying it?

 

 

I did a quick Google to see if I could find anything & came across this... https://app.croneri.co.uk/topics/national-insurance-employees-working-abroad/indepth skip to the Voluntary part.... 

Seconded workers who are not liable to pay Class 1 NICs may pay either voluntary Class 3 NICs or where appropriate Class 2 NICs. Class 2 and 3 contributions are set at a weekly fixed rate, adjusted around the start of each tax year. Class 2 contributions are currently considerably cheaper than Class 3 contributions and also provide a wider range of benefit entitlement. Therefore, where a person wishes to pay voluntary contributions to preserve their UK contribution record, it is advisable to pay Class 2 rather than Class 3 contributions.

 

Edit: Interesting post here 

 

I was working in the middle east, mainly Saudi Arabia. I never researched this back in the day, I simply ran with the advise given during induction by British Aerospace.

 

As I recall, the advise was to pay class 3 NI contributions if you wish to retain full pension rights and to be able fully integrate back into the NI system on return to the UK. Who was I to argue with that?

 

Anyway, I'm glad I did, because they were quite right and as well as having a couple of periods of unemployment during I was awarded NI credits I was also able to claim a full retirement pension.

 

I haven't researched it, as I have no vested interest in doing so, but I wouldn't think that £3 for class 2 as apposed to £15 for class 3 p/w (as it is today) would have bought me all those rights.

 

The O/P @marf should really do his own homework on this. Don't just accept advise from a few forum members. What we knew back in the day, might not apply now.

[sanemax 19,525]

On 11/19/2019 at 7:22 PM, marf said:

What steps are recommended to maintain a regular presence, or at least the appearance of one,

Illegal activity , shouldnt be discussed on a public forum 

Poster could be an informant