Thai Tourism: "Half of foreigners" don't pay their hospital bills; director points finger at three nationalities

[zydeco]

23 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

No hospital bills when dead.  just need to dig a hole in the ground 555

No. They simply refuse to release the body. An elderly CIA guy I knew died just that way in one of the regional hospitals in 2016. The hospital held the body ransom until they got 250,000 baht from the Thai family.

Edited November 29, 2019 by zydeco

[el jefe]

5 hours ago, Jessoro said:

Just make it compulsory for travel insurance like other European countries 

I traveled through 13 European countries in the past year. Only one required travel insurance -- Belarus.
Please tell us which other European countries require tourists to have travel insurance and how do they check?

 

[Traubert]

11 minutes ago, el jefe said:

I traveled through 13 European countries in the past year. Only one required travel insurance -- Belarus.
Please tell us which other European countries require tourists to have travel insurance and how do they check?

 

The application for a Shengen visa includes mandatory travel insurance that must comply with the terms stated on the application form. No insurance, no visa.

[greeneking]

5 hours ago, cmsally said:

Simply make it compulsory for those hiring motorbikes and doing watersports to purchase appropriate insurance when they hire the service in question. "attack by animals" ??!! don't know what to think about this one , is it by any chance stray dogs? In which case it is the municipalities job to sort out.

Who will insure riders with no licence? It is the freedom to do things you would not get away with at home that is one of the attractions here.

[sfokevin]

5 hours ago, cmsally said:

“attack by animals" ??!! don't know what to think about this one

You have obviously not strolled down Soi Sea Dragon... 

[FarangULong]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Not even that. I think it is half of all (or half of the total bills) using government hospitals.

 

Private hospitals know how to get their money and quite a few foreigners use private hospitals. Possibly most.

 

Those who use govt hospitsls -- especially tourists for whom they are difficult to manage (language etc)-- are often doing so for lack of funds or limited funds  to begin with. 

 

These complaints are coming solely from govt hospitals. 

Probably, I wouldn't know. But these are details, my point was that they obviously weren't refering to "half of all foreigners" or even "half of all tourists". And afaik many private hospitals won't even treat you, unless you can show proof of insurance or pay upfront.

And even if one takes the private hospital going foreigners into account, I'd say (a guess) that the vast majority of tourists or no insurance/low income or pension foreign residents are going to government hospitals anyway. So the private hospital patient percentage is probably miniscule.

[torturedsole]

6 hours ago, cmsally said:

"attack by animals" ??!! don't know what to think about this one , is it by any chance stray dogs? In which case it is the municipalities job to sort out.

Have to agree with previous poster as being attacked by soi dogs is common problem and have to be on guard and ready to defend. It's the authorities problem but that's no use when one is being attacked by vicious dog(s) and the potential for rabies.  

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Curt1591 said:

I've always been covered, motorcycle or whatever. Maybe someone should find better insurance. 

How many successful claims have you made?

And were you drunk or driving without a licence and helmet at the time?

Edited November 29, 2019 by BritManToo

[kickstart]

I would like to know how thy do a runner ,our 2  local  hospitals the out patients  you have to pay the bill first before you get your drugs etc  ,you could do a runner before ,but with out any drugs ,can not see the point of going in the first place if you do not have any drugs.

I had a hip replaced  ,and 24 hours after the op some one come asking for money ,wife had to take my ATM card and get some cash out fast ,this hospital ,a private  one would only take cash ,no plastic ,and they would not  take  my UK heath insurance card ,only my Thai AIA one .

Some one wrote saying with  credit cards you get heath insurance ,if you are in a big city BBK, CM,ect ,you should be ok ,any where else  especially in rial areas cash only ,and not all tourists  have 20,30,000 baht on them .

[Chelseafan]

5 hours ago, allencraig said:

I'm surprised no one has questioned the validity of "half of all foreigners are not paying their hospital bills." HALF? Of all foreigners who come to Thailand and visit a hospital? Really? I find that statistic very hard to believe.

Yes, there is a big different between Mean and Median. The mean would be 50,000 per person but the median could be 5000 per person.

 

Add it to airfare <deleted>. I won't resent paying an extra 100-200 baht

 

[Nice Boyd]

Absolute  Lies , Farang Bashing Statement, Foreigners like Burmese and Cambodian and Lao , always escorted to cashier, I’ve been to many hospitals 

[holy cow cm]

It’s just unbelievable. I just had a small operation (50k out of pocket) and Yeah I could have escaped but it would have been hard. They have your details and watch you pretty well. Same as my son last year + half ago who broke his arm and needed surgery to fix it. It is not the expats. We can not run anywhere. Tourists perhaps, but even so they watch you pretty well. All Hospitals have atms. They will not release you. Years ago at a hospital starts with S in Bangkok an American racked up a bill and they would not let him go until Blue Cross sorted it out. No way. 

 

So I could believe a China person or Russian running like a sneaky chicken, but not most foreigners. French person is the one I did not expect. Nigerian yes, Canadian no.  

Edited November 29, 2019 by holy cow cm

[Inn Between]

6 hours ago, Isaanbiker said:

I had a chat with a Thai doctor from Sapphasit/Ubon R, but he said something totally different.

 

  The majority were from neighboring countries like Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar. 

This is far more likely the truth. There are tens of thousands of these undocumented and semi-legal laborers in Thailand doing construction jobs and that sort of hard and more dangerous work. They get injured but can leave the hospital with a bill because they work for peanuts and don't have the cash to pay it all at once. Thailand needs the very cheap and vulnerable labor they get from their neighbors, so not a lot of pressure is put on them or restrictions made about paying up. There's no sense to getting tough about it because that would only stop the flow of cheap workers across the border, and that would have a devastating effect on Thailand. It's a lot easier to point the finger at tourists who have the money to make up for the real culprits they can't touch. 

[MeePeeMai]

3 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Increase taxes by 1% in tourist places and that extra 1% can go into a hospital slush funds to cover any short falls.

Only problem is that this money would never make it to the slush funds to cover any short falls.

[CygnusX1]

1 hour ago, Traubert said:

The application for a Shengen visa includes mandatory travel insurance that must comply with the terms stated on the application form. No insurance, no visa.

At least if you’re Australian, probably many other countries as well, you can enter EU and Schengen states visa free, as long as you don’t stay more than 90 out of 180 days. Hence, no travel insurance required, I think.

[Langkawee]

6 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

How to deal with this issue:

 

1. Add 100 Baht to each plane ticket.

 

OR

 

2. Make it difficult, bureaucratic, nonsensical, stupid and unintelligible in order to make every visitor angry.

 

Which do you think will be chosen?

 

 

They no longer need to worry, the tourists have all gone to Vietnam, compare HCMC, HANOI to Pattaya, a photo of these places says much more than TATS DIY statistics. Love to know the amount of LCC tourists using Bangkok as a hub and never leave airport. 

[CygnusX1]

5 hours ago, uncleeagle said:

very good travel insurance policies cost very little. mine is less than 2000 baht annually

That seems extraordinarily cheap, I’d have thought you’d pay more than that for a trip of a couple of weeks. Luckily, my credit card gives me complimentary travel insurance for trips out of Australia of less than 6 months, but don’t know how I’d be able to prove I had that insurance to an immigration officer.

[MeePeeMai]

I don't think Thai hospitals are losing much money on foreign patients doing runners (especially not the expats).

 

I think they are losing money because overall tourism is declining (due to their latest blunders) and "medical tourist" numbers are also falling due to a well publicized, stiff increase in the overcharging of "foreigners" (to which the government gave it's blessings).  Less tourists equals less patients at the private hospitals in the main tourist areas.

 

Hospitals in some areas smell blood now and know that the time is right to exaggerate and publicize their losses and push for further insurance mandates on all foreigners (to which they hope to be able to capitalize on in one way or another). 

 

 

[Monomial]

23 minutes ago, Inn Between said:

This is far more likely the truth. There are tens of thousands of these undocumented and semi-legal laborers in Thailand doing construction jobs and that sort of hard and more dangerous work. They get injured but can leave the hospital with a bill because they work for peanuts and don't have the cash to pay it all at once. Thailand needs the very cheap and vulnerable labor they get from their neighbors, so not a lot of pressure is put on them or restrictions made about paying up. There's no sense to getting tough about it because that would only stop the flow of cheap workers across the border, and that would have a devastating effect on Thailand. It's a lot easier to point the finger at tourists who have the money to make up for the real culprits they can't touch. 

This was likely true in the past, but they have gotten very good at making sure all laborers are now here on proper L-A visas including government healthcare insurance. There are still illegals from border countries of course, and so this problem hasn't completely gone away, but this issue is getting much less common now than it was since it is relatively easy to get the proper paperwork, and given much higher penalties employers are more likely to quietly pay the hospital bill rather than risk being exposed for hiring illegals.

 

I have to believe the biggest issue is probably with tourists who do not have a culture of paying their bills. I won't speculate on what countries this includes, but I think Westerners who are used to rule of law are far more likely to try a go fund me pity campaign rather than doing a runner. Logic dictates that the major payment problems would primarily involve short stay tourists from countries where corruption is high and they are not used to laws being enforced. 

 

[The Farang]

I was just in the hospital and they asked or my insurance.  Can't blame foreigner's,  blame procedures.   All hospitals usually collect insurance information before doing anything. 

Edited November 29, 2019 by The Farang

[StayinThailand2much]

55 minutes ago, holy cow cm said:

So I could believe a China person or Russian running like a sneaky chicken, but not most foreigners. French person is the one I did not expect. Nigerian yes, Canadian no.  

A Chinese could easily 'sneak out without paying', as staff might mistake him for a Thai citizen (with Thai ID, permanent address, job, etc.). But for a French or Russian tourist it would, IMHO, be much more difficult.

[garyk]

Sounds like the insurance companies are lobbying again. 

They are starting to spread around some of the new found wealth.

Won't be long now.

Edited November 29, 2019 by garyk

[dcnx]

9 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

How to deal with this issue:

 

1. Add 100 Baht to each plane ticket.

 

OR

 

2. Make it difficult, bureaucratic, nonsensical, stupid and unintelligible in order to make every visitor angry.

 

Which do you think will be chosen?

 

 

You know exactly which one they will choose. The dumbest option. Always. They can’t help themselves.

[Cabradelmar]

I call BS on this... Words with no basis in fact... But if I were to blame a nationality it would be Chinese and Russian... I mean have you been to Pattaya lately... Lawlessness 

[northernboy]

Glad the Thai government charges visa fees for non Chinese visitor so they can dip into that fund to cover the fee jumpers.
As well as the 25% over asian fees legal to charge for white people, is that not enough to cover the bill runners?
Or is it just the insurance companies have found a new profitable market niche if their friend in government make a new law? 

 

Is it Time to invest in Thai insurance stocks or get out of the tourism business. Why are the foreigners long term visitors here not paying to insure all Thai companies stay rich in these trying times in Thailand. 

[Selatan]

Good to see Malaysians not among the top 3 nationalities that didn't pay their Thai hospital bills. After all, Malaysia is ranked second highest source of tourists to Thailand.

 

No point for Malaysians to be treated in Thailand anyway, unless it is an emergency. Public hospitals in Malaysia charge as low as 1 ringgit for consultation plus medicines and 3 ringgit per day for a 3rd class ward.

[d2b2]

Van unfortunate hospitalization this week, required waiting 7hours for discharge. If Bangkok Hospital could get their act together and reduce the time it takes to pay your bill, perhaps the problem could be largely nonexistent. We were ready to walk out ton the bill too after waiting so long. Btw approved direct billing was covering all but 4000baht.

[daveAustin]

As a tourist, you need your head read if you don't fly with insurance - it's something like 30 quid for Brits for a standard policy. But scamming long-termers with local insurers won't bode well... this is likely the route they'll take to shift more comfy expats.

[Kf6vci]

14 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Result = almost no tourists.

 

I do wonder how the 9,000 foreigners treated over the last year causes 448 Million in bills to be unpaid.

Even if we're talking 10x the normal billing for foreigners.

 

Is that amount for Phuket alone? Because the number of patients, 9 k, is way too low for all of Thailand! 

[Kf6vci]

11 hours ago, worgeordie said:

How did the non payers even get out of the door.

regards worgeordie

In CA in 2001, my late mother needed to prepay like $ 500 just to see a doctor.

 

This year, I got dental treatment at a government hospital. It was below cost, like 600 THB for 35 minutes' work and an xray. But they could a) double the charge and b) make foreigners prepay.

 

Many food & drink places do that, world wide. Last month, I had to pre-pay my drink in Dhaka. No problem. 

---

Credit card companies could team up with insurers and offer additional cover. $ 50 should do nicely for everyone (cover for up to a month per holiday, proof of flights required). 

 

Those long-term residents, who will cover a guy in his 70s with a long list of pre-existing conditions?!?