HuaHin IO Office: Non OA insurance needed

[RocketDog]

I went to the new immigration office ( Prachuap Kirikhan province, Pranburi District, HuaHin) located in the government office complex on the western edge of HuaHin to file my 90 report; this is not the IO satellite office in BluPort mall.

 

I am facing the third extension of stay for my original Non Immigarant OA visa at the end of May, 2020.

 

I had no problem with the 90 report other than having to produce the Yellow Book and Blue book since I recently bought a house in Prachuapkirikhan province.

 

I asked the dreaded question about requiring insurance for my upcoming extension of stay and the agent answered yes. I clarified that this was an extension of stay for an older visa, and repeated the question. Again the answer was affirmative. She understood English perfectly well. She did not offer any advice on switching to a Non O visa and I didn't ask.

 

Of course I simply smiled, thanked her, and left.

 

So that answers any questions other TVF members have about HuaHin immigration regarding OA extensions of stay.

 

Although I am also considering the change to a Non O as well as the Elite visa to avoid the costly and anecdotally-declared useless Thai insurance, I must admit that I am so weary of the topic that I may just buy the insurance this year and wait to see what develops.

 

I am aware that even when choosing this route it is wise to take action early as Pacific Cross for instance (hats off to TVF's own Sheryl) is reportedly taking 4-6 weeks to process applications.

 

Good luck to all of us.

 

I want to take this opportunity it especially thank TVF contributors such as Peter Denis and IssanLawyers ( Sebastian H. Brousseau ) for their well-organized and detailed summary posts of the best-known current information on possible options to this dilemma.

[ppatty]

Pacific Cross only take me a little over a week. Longest waiting is the blood test and Dr. report cause my husband is 75 year old. Kevin is take good care of me. once he got all the document, only take about 2-3 days to get certificate to show to IMO.

Edited January 3, 2020 by ppatty

[DoneTravelling]

I renewed mine in December and it was not required, I had my insurance papers and they gave them back, it may have changed since then. 

I was advised medical insurance is not required for renewal only for first time OA applicants.

 

Go back and ask again

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, ppatty said:

Pacific Cross only take me a little over a week. Longest waiting is the blood test and Dr. report cause my husband is 75 year old. Kevin is take good care of me. once he got all the document, only take about 2-3 days to get certificate to show to IMO.

Just out of curiosity > Which PC policy did you subscribe to, did you apply a deductible and how much is the annual premium you pay?

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, DoneTravelling said:

I renewed mine in December and it was not required, I had my insurance papers and they gave them back, it may have changed since then. 

I was advised medical insurance is not required for renewal only for first time OA applicants.

 

Go back and ask again

Thai-approved health insurance IS required when applying for an extension of stay based on an original OA Visa for reason of RETIREMENT.  When you apply for reason of marriage it is not required.

[DrJack54]

OP, excellent post. I think waiting as long as possible to switch to non O is very sensible. Also I along with yourself think folk such as Peter Dennis have tried to assist people who entered on an O-A and big thanks for that.

Personally I have non O so at present is not huge concern. That does not stop me being very angry that O-A folk have been sucked into this rubbish. This is far more serious than the big shibang about TM30.

Where is that farang guy that organized big meeting about that issue? Not sure if he UK or OZ. 

Love living here but so stuffed up. Talk about right hand not knowing what left hand doing does not half describe this rubbish.

[Gav Bic]

18 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Just out of curiosity > Which PC policy did you subscribe to, did you apply a deductible and how much is the annual premium you pay?

I am 62 years old and recently purchased the Pacific Cross Gold Plan (10 million baht cover). I chose the highest deductible of 300 000 baht which virtually halved the annual premium from approx 90 000 baht to approx 45 000 baht. I was previously self insuring so the high deductible is affordable for me.

[apetryxx]

If you deal with the heavy set woman at HH Immigration main office she will offer no help and be difficult. Others are quite polite and helpful

[Thingamabob]

Far better for you to have not posed the questions to did to the TIO. The answers you got will have been nothing more than a face-saving opinion. 

[SoonOh]

 Pacific Cross is not the only options. Do you own leg work. Look at long term 

[TigerandDog]

7 hours ago, SoonOh said:

 Pacific Cross is not the only options. Do you own leg work. Look at long term 

Pacific Cross may not be the only option BUT it's premiums are not as expensive as ALL the other approved health insurance companies.

[JimHuaHin]

Thank you for your post.  And thanks also to "Peter Denis" for earlier detailed responses to related topics.

 

I have been in Thailand for about 6.5 years on a Non Imm. O-A "retirement" visa, and have comprehensive health insurance with a large US-based company, NOT on the list of 13 approved companies.  I extracted a signed stamped "Foreign Insurance Certificate" (Ministry of Public Health) from the company.

 

Last month I took this document to both the main Immigration office and the BluPort office and asked if it was acceptable.  In both cases I was told 'No"; I had to have health insurance from one of the accepted designated companies.

 

[RocketDog]

16 hours ago, apetryxx said:

If you deal with the heavy set woman at HH Immigration main office she will offer no help and be difficult. Others are quite polite and helpful

Yes, I think that was the one I met with ; she had glasses, scowled, and seemed quarrelsome. My Thai lady also questioned her and found her unpleasant. 

 

I will try again at my next 90 day report hoping to get another agent. 

 

Though I've about decided to just let the OA expire without a re-entry permit and take my lady to HCMC or Laos for a few days. Then return on a visa exempt and apply for a Non O as many have recommended. 

[Peter Denis]

16 minutes ago, JimHuaHin said:

...

I have been in Thailand for about 6.5 years on a Non Imm. O-A "retirement" visa, and have comprehensive health insurance with a large US-based company, NOT on the list of 13 approved companies.  I extracted a signed stamped "Foreign Insurance Certificate" (Ministry of Public Health) from the company.

 

Last month I took this document to both the main Immigration office and the BluPort office and asked if it was acceptable.  In both cases I was told 'No"; I had to have health insurance from one of the accepted designated companies.

Hi Jim,

Did you get your foreign insurance-company to fill-in and sign the dedicated form of the Ministry of Public Health 'Foreign Insurance Certificate'?

If so, please provide some more details (and if possible a scan of that certificate), as that would be very interesting for those applying for a new Non Imm OA in their home-country.

Thanks!

Note: I PM-ed you a comprehensive roadmap with all details/options on how to convert to a Non Imm O - retirement Visa, so that you can escape the bogus thai-approved health-insurance scam once your current permission to stay is due for extension.

 

Edited January 5, 2020 by Peter Denis

[RocketDog]

15 hours ago, Thingamabob said:

Far better for you to have not posed the questions to did to the TIO. The answers you got will have been nothing more than a face-saving opinion. 

Please clarify. 

Regardless, who do you suggest I ask? 

[RocketDog]

16 minutes ago, JimHuaHin said:

Thank you for your post.  And thanks also to "Peter Denis" for earlier detailed responses to related topics.

 

I have been in Thailand for about 6.5 years on a Non Imm. O-A "retirement" visa, and have comprehensive health insurance with a large US-based company, NOT on the list of 13 approved companies.  I extracted a signed stamped "Foreign Insurance Certificate" (Ministry of Public Health) from the company.

 

Last month I took this document to both the main Immigration office and the BluPort office and asked if it was acceptable.  In both cases I was told 'No"; I had to have health insurance from one of the accepted designated companies.

 

This is what I expected. I was planning to contact my USA insurance company and attempt to get the letter required. But didn't really expect it to be honored at immigration though each office is different. 

 

It would be interesting to hear from anybody that Did have such a letter accepted. 

 

Anybody out there? 

[Peter Denis]

21 hours ago, RocketDog said:

This is what I expected. I was planning to contact my USA insurance company and attempt to get the letter required. But didn't really expect it to be honored at immigration though each office is different. 

 

It would be interesting to hear from anybody that Did have such a letter accepted. 

 

Anybody out there? 

The PoliceOrder states specifically that it needs to be thai health-insurance to be evidenced with an approved Insurance Certificate stating that your policy meets the IO requirements (and your insurer needs to upload your policy-data in the IO Health-insurance database to avoid fraudulent documents).

So yes, it would indeed be quite interesting if someone got his OA - retirement extension approved with a Foreign Insurance Certificate. 

Note: That Foreign Insurance Certificate is only accepted by thai embassies/consulates in your home-country when applying for a Non Imm OA (long-stay) Visa.

 

[DrJack54]

Don't think we will see a "Foreign Insurance Certificate" accepted. Reason being is that it would provide quality insurance to expats if they could use non Thai insurance companies and more importantly would not line the pockets of ..........

[JimHuaHin]

21 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Hi Jim,

Did you get your foreign insurance-company to fill-in and sign the dedicated form of the Ministry of Public Health 'Foreign Insurance Certificate'?

Hi Dennis - yes, I did.

 

21 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

If so, please provide some more details (and if possible a scan of that certificate), as that would be very interesting for those applying for a new Non Imm OA in their home-country.

I have sent you a copy of the document via a PM.

 

What further details would you like?

 

21 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Thanks!

Note: I PM-ed you a comprehensive roadmap with all details/options on how to convert to a Non Imm O - retirement Visa, so that you can escape the bogus thai-approved health-insurance scam once your current permission to stay is due for extension.

Thank you very much.

21 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

 

 

[RocketDog]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

The PoliceOrder states specifically that it needs to be thai health-insurance to be evidenced with an approved Insurance Certificate stating that your policy meets the IO requirements (and your insurer needs to upload your policy-data in the IO Health-insurance database to avoid fraudulent documents).

So yes, it would indeed be quite interesting if someone got his OA - retirement extension approved with a Foreign Insurance Certificate. 

Note: That Foreign Insurance Certificate is only accepted by thai embassies/consulates in your home-country when applying for a Non Imm OA (long-stay) Visa.

 

Thank you Peter for all your work on this forum topic. Your work, information, and tireless posting is appreciated. 

 

Your Road Map for Non OA to Non O is a must-read for so many of us. 

 

That means these certicates are useless to all excepting new Non OA applicants. 

[gk10002000]

On 1/3/2020 at 8:23 AM, Peter Denis said:

Thai-approved health insurance IS required when applying for an extension of stay based on an original OA Visa for reason of RETIREMENT.  When you apply for reason of marriage it is not required.

How can you state that and how can you state that for all Immigration offices or all of Thailand national policy or law?  Last I read it was still ambiguous and no complete formal national statement for clarification has been issued by any Senior Thai official that really does speak for the entire country.  Can you provide any such national statement?

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

How can you state that and how can you state that for all Immigration offices or all of Thailand national policy or law?  Last I read it was still ambiguous and no complete formal national statement for clarification has been issued by any Senior Thai official that really does speak for the entire country.  Can you provide any such national statement?

No insurance is mentioned in clause 2.18 of the police order for an extension based upon marriage. Only clause 2.22 for retirement shows the insurance in it.

[HogRidr60]

I have just sent all my A-O VISA app paperwork to the Thai Consulate in California. Previously I had applied for medical iNsurance From 3 of those listed thai companies With the same results. All refused to ‘cover’ me as I am 71, and have a few pre-existing conditions from my 20 years in the US Military, including Vietnam in ‘68-‘69.

 

Because I am retired US military I am perpetually covered for medical and prescriptions anywhere in the world, and also 100% disabled veteran which has its own coverage.

My government pays for all of this and it has no minimums, limits, or ceilings but then does not qualify as ‘adequate medical insurance’ and has no CEOs, or public web site. Also it never disappears, or disqualifies, or can be revoked. When does this change, when I die.

 

What I know is ‘officially’ Bangkok Hospital and Chiang Mai RAM Hospital, in writing, accept it for direct billing in INPATIENT services. Outpatient services are paid at discharge, in full, then we submit claims forms for 75% reimbursement. 
 

Because I am also a 100% disabled veteran, Chiang Mai RAM Hospital bills the US Veterans Administration directly for inpatient and outpatient services. Both of these private hospital state that this is INSURANCE and acceptable to them. 
 

Now, I have submitted all of this to the Consulate and await their determination. All retired US military, anywhere in the world, use this insurance. I have been using it since 1987. Any Bangkok Hospital, anywhere in Thailand is officially allowed to accept our insurance. I hope Immigration agrees with that.

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, HogRidr60 said:

I have just sent all my A-O VISA app paperwork to the Thai Consulate in California. Previously I had applied for medical iNsurance From 3 of those listed thai companies With the same results. All refused to ‘cover’ me as I am 71, and have a few pre-existing conditions from my 20 years in the US Military, including Vietnam in ‘68-‘69.

Hi, you only need to meet the thai-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for an extension of stay of your original OA Visa for reason of retirement.

In case you have in mean time married with a thai national, you can when your extension renewal is due apply for reason of MARRIAGE.  In that case, no health-insurance is required and - nice bonus - the financials to be proved are way lower.

When not married to a thai national, you can also embark on the road to convert to a Non Imm O - retirement Visa.  The process to do so is surprisingly simple and will cost you max 7000 THB (as it requires 1 border-run).

>> I have PM-ed you a comprehensive roadmap outlining all details/options, on how to do it.

To access your PM-message, click the 'letter' icon next to your Profile when being logged in to the Forum.

[watthong]

27 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

>> I have PM-ed you a comprehensive roadmap outlining all details/options, on how to do it.

To access your PM-message, click the 'letter' icon next to your Profile when being logged in to the Forum.

Could you also be so kind to PM me the same roadmap? A friend of mine is in the same dilemna and no matter how I tried to explain that it's possible to switch to Non Imm O, he would not believe that it could be done without proof of insurance. Thank you in advance, much appreciated,

[Peter Denis]

1 minute ago, watthong said:

Could you also be so kind to PM me the same roadmap? A friend of mine is in the same dilemna and no matter how I tried to explain that it's possible to switch to Non Imm O, he would not believe that it could be done without proof of insurance. Thank you in advance, much appreciated,

>> Done !  And feel free to contact me if you have questions or need additional information. 

Cheers and Happy NewYear ????

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 1/5/2020 at 10:22 AM, TigerandDog said:

Pacific Cross may not be the only option BUT it's premiums are not as expensive as ALL the other approved health insurance companies.

PC is one of the few in the approved O-A insurance providers program that will write new policies for older, post-65 folks. That's one advantage.

 

And I think, they're also either one of the few, or perhaps the only one in the program, that has approved O-A policies where you can significantly reduce the regular premiums by opting for annual deductibles.  Most of the other O-A approved policies don't seem to allow that option.

 

[zaZa9]

I to would very much appreciate a 'road map' to swapping to a Non  Imm O Visa ( then Retirement )  ! Thanks in advance !

I have been scouring TV these past 2 days and Ive seen a fair bit of conflicting info.

Ive been on Extensions based on an original Non Immigrant  O-A for 10 years and Im unwilling to trade in my Aetna Insurance that has given me a written agreement to cover me for life , for some new 'scheme' that could dump me at 70...

 

I did come across this.

Is Point 1) saying/implying  a new  one  year Non Imm O is achievable WITHOUT 800k in the bank by simply returning  from home ( for me Aus ) on a 90 day Non Imm Visa issued there ( Sydney )  and extending it  ?? ( and is the  rest written below correct also ?)

 

1)

Normally and the smoothest way (less paperwork) is to start with a 90 days Non-Immigrant O obtained in your home country and after 60 days extend it 1 year at the local immigration office, cost 1900 baht. 2)

You can also after 30 days convert a 60 days SETV to a 90 days Non-Immigrant O at the local immigration office. But you need the 800k in a thai bank 2 months before the application,cost 2000 baht and after 60 days extend it 1 year, cost another 1900 baht. Then you need a copy of your rental contract,bank letter from your bank, copies of your bank book,several copies from your passport incl. the TM6-card. 2 sets of documents when converting from the SETV to the Non-Immigrant O, and then another set when extending it 1 year. 

 

[Peter Denis]

13 hours ago, zaZa9 said:

I to would very much appreciate a 'road map' to swapping to a Non  Imm O Visa ( then Retirement )  ! Thanks in advance !

I have been scouring TV these past 2 days and Ive seen a fair bit of conflicting info.

Ive been on Extensions based on an original Non Immigrant  O-A for 10 years and Im unwilling to trade in my Aetna Insurance that has given me a written agreement to cover me for life , for some new 'scheme' that could dump me at 70...

 

I did come across this.

Is Point 1) saying/implying  a new  one  year Non Imm O is achievable WITHOUT 800k in the bank by simply returning  from home ( for me Aus ) on a 90 day Non Imm Visa issued there ( Sydney )  and extending it  ?? ( and is the  rest written below correct also ?)

 

1)

Normally and the smoothest way (less paperwork) is to start with a 90 days Non-Immigrant O obtained in your home country and after 60 days extend it 1 year at the local immigration office, cost 1900 baht. 2)

You can also after 30 days convert a 60 days SETV to a 90 days Non-Immigrant O at the local immigration office. But you need the 800k in a thai bank 2 months before the application,cost 2000 baht and after 60 days extend it 1 year, cost another 1900 baht. Then you need a copy of your rental contract,bank letter from your bank, copies of your bank book,several copies from your passport incl. the TM6-card. 2 sets of documents when converting from the SETV to the Non-Immigrant O, and then another set when extending it 1 year. 

 

I PM-ed you a comprehensive roadmap with all details/options on how to switch from (an extension of) a Non Imm OA - retirement Visa to a Non Imm O - retirement Visa.

It addresses all the questions you have and outlines all the options not only limited to the ones you describe.

 

[oldcpu]

On 1/5/2020 at 10:56 AM, RocketDog said:

This is what I expected. I was planning to contact my USA insurance company and attempt to get the letter required. But didn't really expect it to be honored at immigration though each office is different. 

 

It would be interesting to hear from anybody that Did have such a letter accepted.

I contacted my International Health Insurance company (provides excellent coverage for both myself and my Thai wife) where my insurance exceeds the Thai 400k/40k requirement for both of us.  The insurance comes with, and is heavily subsidized by my pension, so changing it to another non-subsidized insurance makes no economic sense. 

 

I was advised my Insurance company would NOT fill in the Thai government form, as they did not understand the Thai health Insurance requirements, with no further detail/explanation provided. (I speculate they do not understand the requirement as laid out and referenced in that Thai form).

 

It was all really a mute point, as the form was not suitable for my Type-OA visa case, as I already have a Type-OA visa (issued March-2019, and I entered Thailand May-2019), and the the "Foreign Insurance Certificate" I believe is only intended for those applying for a Type-OA visa the first time.

 

I'm instead currently proceeding to register my marriage (in Canada to my Thai wife) here in Thailand.   Then sometime in the future (~ Feb-2021 ? ) when I go for my first permission to stay extension (from my original Type-OA visa), I plan to apply for an extension based on "Marriage" instead of "retirement" and see if that works.   Its a way around the 'system', which is unfortunate being 'necessary', as with the excellent International Health Insurance that I have, its too bad its not accepted by Thailand immigration (I note my Insurance is thou accepted by the Thai hospitals).

 

Edited January 7, 2020 by oldcpu