Tourist Killed At “full Moon” Party

[LaoPo]

if there is one piece of advice that every tourist , and , it would seem , especially israeli tourists ,should be given as they pass through the airport here into thailand , it should be never , ever drink or associate with groups of thai males who are drinking unless you know them or are familiar with their class and their background.

Tax I know about the soi cowboy thing, I read your post a couple of years ago when it happened but you keep churning out this bit of advice and it sticks in my throat a bit. I've drunk with many a group of Thai males, strangers and from all sorts of backgrounds. I've never been attacked because I never spat a drink in their face. If you walked into a pub in the UK and spat a drink in someone's face you can expect a stabbing too.

Totally agree with the above, moral of the story, don't spit drinks in peoples faces.

So far I haven't seen any prove that the fight started with or about spitting in someones' face.

It's 'hear-say' so far but it appears to be fact already amongst some of the previous posters

Sad to see that history repeats itself with assumptions, hear-say and speculations.

LaoPo

[meemiathai]

it was brilliant to see, as when the hitman pulled out his gun the israili started crying like a little baby and payed up what he owed us.

What sort of person posts something like this on a thread about the tragic death of a young man, regardless of his nationality?

Disgusting IMO.

R.I.P.

Have you cried yet?

No, but I have grown up, learned manners and respect, and it is something that will hopefully happen to you eventually too.

I would not mind really if you guys discuss it here if it was me who got killed. And you also do not need to cry.

No need to tell me to RIP, I will myself.

[bkkmadness]

Fair point LaoPo, no facts have come about yet aside from the bare bones of the case which is their was a fight and a killing.

[meemiathai]

it was brilliant to see, as when the hitman pulled out his gun the israili started crying like a little baby and payed up what he owed us.

What sort of person posts something like this on a thread about the tragic death of a young man, regardless of his nationality?

Disgusting IMO.

R.I.P.

Oh god, not Terry and his Thai hitman experiences again.

And just in case you forgot, the Thai hitman was an ex-police officer.

Is that right, Terry?

[meemiathai]

Tax I know about the soi cowboy thing, I read your post a couple of years ago when it happened but you keep churning out this bit of advice and it sticks in my throat a bit. I've drunk with many a group of Thai males, strangers and from all sorts of backgrounds. I've never been attacked because I never spat a drink in their face. If you walked into a pub in the UK and spat a drink in someone's face you can expect a stabbing too.

there are thai males and there are thai males , and obviously not all thai males who drink are going to kill you.

bkkmadness , you know the country and have had enough experience here to judge situations and the people you sit down with.

but for those people who are new to the country , for those who cant recognise the various "species" of males that frequent drinking places , and for those who cant tell the difference between the different kind of drinking places there are out there i would say my advice is valid .

in the same way that a newcomer to say , the uk , would be unable to judge the type of pub he was entering , or the type of person drinking there , until perhaps it is too late.

there are times when a lot less of an insult than spitting beer in someones face can get you a beating from a drunk youth with a chip on his shoulder and a group to impress. in any country.

I think the last sentence is sound advice!

[davidjtayler]

The only thing we know for sure is that one Israeli is dead and that a group of Thais killed him!

Why that happened is up for conjecture!

We also know from sbk who lives on Koh Phangan that beer was spat into a Thai persons face exacerbating this explosive incident and we also know that previous long term bad behaviour from many Israelis within Thailand (and Asia) has caused deep seated resentment amongst many people in the local communties throughout SE Asia (not just Koh Phangan).

Therefore the resulting tragedy we see here, although totally unacceptable, is also unfortunately not surprising.

[terry57]

it was brilliant to see, as when the hitman pulled out his gun the israili started crying like a little baby and payed up what he owed us.

What sort of person posts something like this on a thread about the tragic death of a young man, regardless of his nationality?

Disgusting IMO.

R.I.P.

i was pointing out the reality's of playing games in thailand and just for you i'll spell out exactly what went down and maybe you may learn something.

actually, the said person got off very easily considering what went down.

my thai partner was in a very good mood that day.

israili enters our motor cycle rental shop and rents a new bike for 200 baht (1988) and fills out rental agreement which is standard in thailand.

# 1 rule is that if the bike is damaged you will receive the damaged parts and new parts will be put on the bike and that rule stands today.

we take his passport for security deposit.

later on that day the said person rocks up at our shop with bike in the back of a pick up truck as he has dropped the bike going over the mountain to tong nai pann and done a <deleted> load of damage.

im in the shop on my own and inform the dude what needs to be done to repair our new bike to its original condition.

i tell dude that when he does this, his passport will be returned, dude spits dummy and starts getting silly.

i tell dude to chill out and he can deal with my thai partner and i ring thai partner and he comes to shop to deal with said dude.

thai partner tells israili exactly the same as i told him and the dude starts to abuse thai partner.

anyway,

thai partner tells dude that he must pay the money or we can go and see the policeman.

dude say's ok , lets go and see the policeman.

off we go to see the policeman who i had never met before but had heard alot about from my partner.

ex policeman turned hired hitman.

very interesting experience for me as the hitman owned a set of bungalows, his working days were over unless the occasion called for a hit.

we sit down with the hitman and lay all the facts on the table including the lease agreement passport and the facts of the matter.

after all, we were 135% correct and the israili was 158 % wrong.

after going through all the facts of the matter it was explaining to the israili that he had two choises and the ball was in his court regards what he wanted to do.

# 1 = pay us our money and live happily ever after.

# 2 = not pay us our money and sort it out with the hit man.

bear in mind that the regular police are on our side as we were running a honest business.

the last thing that happenned was when the israili forgot his manners and started to be silly with the hit man thinking it was some sort of bluff.

the gun was then placed on the table and the israili started crying and found his manners real quick.

he then payed us our money, we give him his passport and he left the island on the next boat.

so i say to you mr tud, what is so disgusting about that. ?

i thought it was absolutly sensational, justice had been done and a lesson in respect had been delivered in an unmistakable manner to the said person.

I fell in love with the thai way on that very day.

thank you very much.

and just to stay on topic, that israili guy did not spit in my partners face but he was a very naughty boy.

[meemiathai]

it was brilliant to see, as when the hitman pulled out his gun the israili started crying like a little baby and payed up what he owed us.

What sort of person posts something like this on a thread about the tragic death of a young man, regardless of his nationality?

Disgusting IMO.

R.I.P.

Have you cried yet?

No, but I have grown up, learned manners and respect, and it is something that will hopefully happen to you eventually too.

What sort of person uses an avatar like this on a thread about the tragic death of a young man?

Very disturbing!

[bkkmadness]

i thought it was absolutly sensational, justice had been done and a lesson in respect had been delivered in an unmistakable manner to the said person.

I wonder how many other people that hitman used his gun on to get his own way, and I further wonder if it was all so 'justified'. Don't get carried away respecting the wrong people Terence, it's nice when it works in your favour but beware the one day it might not.

[LaoPo]

The killing is now also reported by other news-sources, although no 'new details' since the article in the BKK-Post:

Last update - 11:39 02/04/2007

Israeli tourist stabbed to death in Thailand island bar

By DPA (Haaretz.com - Israel)

From:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/845000.html

and:

Asia-Pacific News

Thailand's full moon party ends in death for Israeli tourist

From:

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/asiapac...Israeli_tourist

LaoPo

[JimmyTheMook]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

[ZZZ]

it should be never , ever drink or associate with groups of thai males who are drinking unless you know them or are familiar with their class and their background.

So I should fear all groups of Thai men in a bar/drinking?

Only if you are an aggressive mean drunk I'd think.

This happened to be set off by spitting but could just as easily had been a staring incident or pouring the whiskey wrong incident or a girlfriend incident.

When Thai males get drunk just about anything can set them off and when they are off you can be pretty sure that the Marquess of Queensberry rules will be out the window. Guns, knives, ten against one, anything goes and they very seldom stop until someone is dead or the police arrives.

What in most cases would have ended up in a broken nose in the west often results in someone getting killed.

[terry57]

it was brilliant to see, as when the hitman pulled out his gun the israili started crying like a little baby and payed up what he owed us.

What sort of person posts something like this on a thread about the tragic death of a young man, regardless of his nationality?

Disgusting IMO.

R.I.P.

Oh god, not Terry and his Thai hitman experiences again.

And just in case you forgot, the Thai hitman was an ex-police officer.

Is that right, Terry?

i got to tell you mee thai,

i love my hitman story as it happened in my second year in thailand, so i learnt a very valuable lesson on how things work in the los.

i mean i was'nt scared by the experience but impressed, because this dude had caused all his own problems and the thais were sorting it out thai way.

nobody got hurt, the dude learned a very good lesson and hopefully passed it on to his friends.

thats why i never have any problem what so ever in los, as i know the rules and im in possession of top respect for the locals.

its a very good system once learned and understood.

i got another hitman story when i was on koh tao, but i'll save that for latter.

and just to keep on topic,

its very disrespectful to spit in someones face.

[mrt273nva]

The killing is now also reported by other news-sources, although no 'new details' since the article in the BKK-Post:

Last update - 11:39 02/04/2007

Israeli tourist stabbed to death in Thailand island bar

By DPA (Haaretz.com - Israel)

From:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/845000.html

and:

Asia-Pacific News

Thailand's full moon party ends in death for Israeli tourist

From:

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/asiapac...Israeli_tourist

LaoPo

there is no new info at either of those sites. it is the same story copied and pasted to other websites.

[cdnvic]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

[JimmyTheMook]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

Edited April 2, 2007 by JimmyTheMook

[bkkmadness]

When Thai males get drunk just about anything can set them off and when they are off you can be pretty sure that the Marquess of Queensberry rules will be out the window.

You can be pretty sure that outside of a boxing ring Queensbury rules do not apply anywhere.

[cdnvic]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

Ten years to think that up?

And you called them dumb animals

[LaoPo]

The only thing we know for sure is that one Israeli is dead and that a group of Thais killed him!

Why that happened is up for conjecture!

We also know from sbk who lives on Koh Phangan that beer was spat into a Thai persons face.....................

With respect for what 'sbk' said before.....it's still 'hear-say' and no facts.

We ALL know that 'news' travels fast, especially also on a relatively small island like Phangan; but we also know that 'news' is often 'turned-around or away' from actual facts.

And, despite the fact (so I learned now but didn't know since I never encountered them in LOS) that Israeli -young- tourists have a bad name, we still don't know -for a fact- that the killed Israeli was to blame for spitting or other bad behaviour; he also could have been the 'wrong guy at the wrong moment in the wrong place'.....

The same counts for "A gang of Thai teenagers - including the son of a local politician..."

Let's wait for more facts, shall we ? It's not the first time in Thailand (or world) that newspapers were wrong or partly wrong in their first article.

The only fact is: a -killed- 32 year old man.

LaoPo

[LaoPo]

The killing is now also reported by other news-sources, although no 'new details' since the article in the BKK-Post:

Last update - 11:39 02/04/2007

Israeli tourist stabbed to death in Thailand island bar

By DPA (Haaretz.com - Israel)

From:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/845000.html

and:

Asia-Pacific News

Thailand's full moon party ends in death for Israeli tourist

From:

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/asiapac...Israeli_tourist

LaoPo

there is no new info at either of those sites.

That's exactly what I said in my first sentence.

LaoPo

[meemiathai]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

And still cannot count from 1-10 in thai?

[terry57]

i thought it was absolutly sensational, justice had been done and a lesson in respect had been delivered in an unmistakable manner to the said person.

I wonder how many other people that hitman used his gun on to get his own way, and I further wonder if it was all so 'justified'. Don't get carried away respecting the wrong people Terence, it's nice when it works in your favour but beware the one day it might not.

its not my problem maddy as i dont play silly games with thai locals.

i think it would be very unusual for a hit to be carried out on an innocent farang as it costs money to get the deed done.

there is usually a vendetta going regards drugs, women and bar ownership.

the average punter has nothing to fear.

we have a good mafia going in australia but they only kill drug dealers.

not worried about me.

and just to keep on topic ive never seen anyone spit in someones face as its bad manners.

[JimmyTheMook]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

Ten years to think that up?

And you called them dumb animals

When you live here full time your views may change.

[thaigerd]

Really Taxexile? I thought my comment about it being senseless and unnecessary conveyed my opinion more correctly than your subjective editing of my post. All I said was it was a matter of time, just because you can see a train wreck coming doesn't mean you approve. The regular local people are appalled and most feel, as Southwest has posted, that this kind of violence is completely unnecessary. Another word I used in my post that you managed to overlook, tax.

i wasnt accusing you of having that ( schadenfreud) attitude sbk.

but there is a certain stereotyping attitude noticeable on this board that israelis ( possibly because of the politics of the middle east region) deserve what they get and that they are all tight with their money.

similar to the stereotyping attitude that all muslims are terrorists and treat women as slaves.

most young people travelling are tight with money and seek the best deal , thailand has a deserved reputation for overcharging foriegn guests , haad rin especially , and their care over expenditure could be seen as a result of that reputation.

young thais are equally careful with their money when travelling , as are most people.

this was a horrible murder , and nothing less.

im very surprised that it has taken this long for an israili to end up like this on hadrinn.

when i was running my business on koh phangan and koh tao, if there was any trouble you could near on gaurantee that an israili would be involved.

my thai partner had a hit man on call and the only time i saw him call the hitman in was to sort out this israili.

he smashed up our new bike and would not pay.

it was brilliant to see, as when the hitman pulled out his gun the israili started crying like a little baby and payed up what he owed us.

anyway,

its just not that there so tight with there money, its the way they look down on thai people in general, spit venom and talk in such a rough way verging on offensive.

its got nothing to do with travelling on a budget as the majority of backpackers are on a budget and dont behave like this, especially thais which you have used as an example.

being in there groups is also a huge turn off for most backpackers and locals.

its not good that they killed this guy as a broken arm and leg would of done the job and taught him some manners but if you play the spit game this can happen.

to be truthful if you spat your drink in someones face here in perth there's a real good chance you could get murdered for it, so to do it in thailand is plain insanity as the thais are a tad touchy regarding these things.

i think anyone who has ever had a tourist related business and had to deal with israili's can understand how this incident came about.

but just to be fair, in the last 20 years of travelling in thailand i have met some great israili's.

they where all at the airport flying home.

thank you very much.

I am working more than 14 yrs now in Thailand, restaurants, hotels etc.

I must agree the Israeli tourist are a bit tight with their money(glass of water & 6 straws) but not all of them. Most of them are nice people, believe me.

3 days ago here in Phuket at the airport, cargo department I've watched 2 Israelis receiving many boxes of wine, nice ones.

So I went over to them:

"Sorry for approaching you just saw ur love wine, would u mind to have a spare bottle for me and my wife for our dinner tonight? And btw I am German but I am glad to talk to u and meet you here!"

We had a nice chat and the rushed to find the best of their wine for me.

After 15 minutes when I had to go with my wine I said a Friendly "SHALOM!!!".

Gerd

[cdnvic]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

Ten years to think that up?

And you called them dumb animals

When you live here full time your views may change.

When you start referring to your hosts as dumb animals, you've failed and it's time to move on.

[JimmyTheMook]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

And still cannot count from 1-10 in thai?

What a dumb comment.

My Thai is more than adequate as well as my ability to deal with the locals.

[JimmyTheMook]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

Ten years to think that up?

And you called them dumb animals

When you live here full time your views may change.

When you start referring to your hosts as dumb animals, you've failed and it's time to move on.

When you can do a bit better than being a frequent visitor , maybe you will have a better understanding.

[cdnvic]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

That's not only showing ignorance of Thais, but its just plain ignorant also.

I have been here for the better part of 10 years , this is not something I just came up with.

Ten years to think that up?

And you called them dumb animals

When you live here full time your views may change.

When you start referring to your hosts as dumb animals, you've failed and it's time to move on.

When you can do a bit better than being a frequent visitor , maybe you will have a better understanding.

Your time in the country does not mask the fact that you are a total failure at lerning to understand anything about Thais. You've obviously gotten jaded and assume that it's all the fault of the Thais. Don't feel bad, plenty of people try to make it in Thailand and turn out like you, the rest, even after 20 or more years, are still well adjusted and without that silly chip on their shoulders.

[terry57]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

maybe we have understood your quote there jimmy.

do you really think that the thai people are dumb animals. ?

and if you do, why?

thank you very much.

i think if we rewind this thread we all disagree with what has happenned to the israili but can understand it.

lets forget the israili aspect and realise it would of happened to any nationality that committed the said act regardless whether one was wright or wrong.

many people have commented on the israili's because of past experiences but the nationality is irrelevant

it is the said act that caused the unreasonable response.

[JimmyTheMook]

Don't pick fights with Thai, they can't deal with reasoned negotiation unless they are guaranteed success.

Well put , it is like dealing with a dumb animal.

maybe we have understood your quote there jimmy.

do you really think that the thai people are dumb animals. ?

and if you do, why?

thank you very much.

i think if we rewind this thread we all disagree with what has happenned to the israili but can understand it.

lets forget the israili aspect and realise it would of happened to any nationality that committed the said act regardless whether one was wright or wrong.

many people have commented on the israili's because of past experiences but the nationality is irrelevant

it is the said act that caused the unreasonable response.

To me it has nothing to do with the fact the person was from Israel, what it is about is that he was brutally murdered in public over something very trivial.

The whole supporting the Thai's actions leading up to this is absurd , it was the actions of a bunch of animals.

Unfortunately there are those who seem to try to justify or even condone these animal actions.

Not looking to debate this issue , as I actually live here and see more and more of this attitude every day, it is a sad reality.