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Why British dementia patients are being sent to Thailand


webfact

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29 minutes ago, Yinn said:

My grandmother have it. I take care of her. I know.

 

And your experience?

A Thai grandmother can be much more obliging and easy... my mother was easy... even when my father could no longer walk, could barely see or stay awake, he insisted on driving the car... and even being his children, we did not have legal right to take his license and car keys. Everything was a fight with him. It's a long story but none of it was even close to easy, partly to blame are privacy laws in USA... 

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15 minutes ago, GeorgeCross said:
6 hours ago, Yinn said:

Why the family not take care each other? Nobody care?

Very sad.

 

because family have to work or they all STARVE.

This doesn't explain why elderly parents in the west don't typically live with their grown-up children.  Mine certainly didn't. 

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6 hours ago, Yinn said:

Why the family not take care each other? Nobody care?

Very sad.

Family ties are not as strong in the West. There is also a cost consideration, proper aged care in Australia is far more expensive, unless the parent is put in a profit mill, where they are fed porridge and ham sandwiches, plus zombie medications, for the rest of their lives.

One can find decent aged care in Chiang Mai for about 45,000 baht/month. Believe it or not, that is much cheaper.

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6 hours ago, Yinn said:

Why the family not take care each other? Nobody care?

Very sad.

Looking after a person with dementia isn't easy, it can cause marriage break ups and send you into depression. In the West it is necessary for both husband and wife to work to cover the cost of living, no time to look after an 80 Kg adult with the needs of a baby.

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21 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Looking after a person with dementia isn't easy, it can cause marriage break ups and send you into depression. In the West it is necessary for both husband and wife to work to cover the cost of living,

 

Money for holiday etc

No money take care grandmother?

 

21 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

 

 

no time to look after an 80 Kg adult with the needs of a baby.

No time to care for your mother/father?

They care for you 0-16 years old right? 

 

I know it not easy.

Look after baby not easy same. 

 

I help care grandmother.

I will help care mother and father same. They take care me when I baby, small kid. Is life.

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59 minutes ago, Curmudgeon1 said:

You've obviously never dealt with dementia/alzheimers.

 

You think thai people not get this problem?

 

 

 

59 minutes ago, Curmudgeon1 said:

 

You need trained caregivers who are very special people if they're good.

Or family love. 

IMO is best way. 

 

They remember long long time ago. But not remember 5 minutes before.

 

Put them with stranger they will not remember.

IMO with family better.

 

Also, can you trust the stranger who not love them? 

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42 minutes ago, soalbundy said:
7 hours ago, Yinn said:

Why the family not take care each other? Nobody care?

Very sad.

Looking after a person with dementia isn't easy, it can cause marriage break ups and send you into depression. In the West it is necessary for both husband and wife to work to cover the cost of living, no time to look after an 80 Kg adult with the needs of a baby.

Is there any real data?

i.e.  - the gender breakdown?

 - how long the ( I reckon Men invariably) were already been in LOS beforehand?

 

otherwise I'd make an assumption these were of the previous generation of male skidaddlers, for whom time has finally caught up with...

   something for current TV'er Expats to look forward to????

 

 

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3 minutes ago, JAFO said:

Yep,

Think about the quality of life. People try and hold on far too long. I admired my Gma, she was diagnosed with cancer and she said "No Treatment". "Make me comfortable until I go" and that we did. She stayed at home, lasted about 3 months and passed. She told me she was not going to be a guinea pig for doctors and at her age, whats the point? Its not like you recover.

 

I always found the human race odd at times you hit an age then spend every last penny you saved having endless procedures to just "Stay" alive. No quality of life.

 

I fully support euthanasia. I have made it explicitly clear if I am diagnosed with something terminal or I am unable to care for myself, its time to go. 

 

 

We need a euthanasia forum on Thai Visa. It would generate a lot of traffic, unfortunately members would cease to post after a while.

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4 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

In my observation, Thai people/families take care of anyone in the family with a problem/issue. Thats also why the hospitals allow families to stay in the room etc, which you would rarely see in the west.

In my village there are a few that I have seen, but from what I understand, generally disabled family members, blind, disfugured, mental health are all cared for by the families.

They are often restricted to the home and kept out of sight. Some that are not so bad are allowed to be free and the village know who they are and where there home is, so you could say the community takes care of them too.Its great to see and I admire that.

This was probably born out of inability to place anywhere else due to cost or facility etc for rural villages etc but has remained a family trait and in my opinion is great to see and heart warming attitude by the community in general.

Grandmother die already. 

But she like to walk and walk. She forget and get lost. 

Must watch her, and the neighbor know also. Help together.

 

if old person in thailand have no family, some temples look after them also. But not really good condition. 

Put many Dementia people together is not good idea IMO. Difficult.

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 About twelve years ago before moving from Chiang Mai a group of us looked at the viability of building and running a care home.  On paper it was a really good earner and relatively easy to do.  Nursing staff were a worry but one of our group was a German dentist who ran a successful operation in Bangkok so had a lot of experience with medical staff in Thailand.  Financing wasn't a problem with the banks very keen to invest.  I ended up leaving Thailand before the project got any further but it was definitely a missed opportunity.

 

However these days I am more likely to be a resident than an investor!

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7 hours ago, webfact said:

Why British dementia patients are being sent to Thailand

On the face of it I would imagine it's down to cost... Britain is very expensive for residential or care home help. The government or social services virtually offer no financial help if you are a property owner or have savings.

Having said that I would also imagine other Asian countries with nursing staff ie Philippines, would also be a choice... they have many trained nurses going to europe to work. I'm sure there must be care homes that would gladly take them.

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5 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

I'm sure some of us would welcome you naming the drug in question. On the other hand dementia associations mention the issue without attributing it to any drug treatment - https://www.dementia.org.au/support-and-services/families-and-friends/personal-care/intimacy-and-sexual-issues

Several studies (22-24), employing varying criteria, reported an increased interest in sex in 1-50% of PD patients treated with L-dopa. ... When the patient was on apomorphine treatment, erections also occurred within 20 minutes of the administration of a dose of L-dopa.
 
Because the same drug was being trialed and used on dementia patients back then, a joke portrayed a grim picture of the future, with men running around with erections, but forgetting what to do with them!!

SEXUAL DISORDERS IN PARKINSON'S DISEASE Rossella ...

 
 
There were also a few jokes going around at the time which suggested a negative portrayal of the future as the d
 
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This is actually a MASSIVE growth industry.

 

My wife and I own a design (architecture, interior, branding) agency. We've completed 4 'elder care' facilities in the past two years: two in the Philippines, two in Mexico. Three more coming down the pipe, one in Thailand, two in Panama. Not everyone there has dementia, but they seem to care less if they do. 

 

I can't speak for UK/Europe but Americans are shipping their elders out of the US as they can't afford long term care back in the States. Plus all the servants are from Latin America/Phils so might as well send the parents back to the source to get better care. 

 

Price comparison: $1-2k/mo overseas vs $5-15/mo back in the major US cities. 

 

Brave new world.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Berkshire said:

You're right, difference in culture.  Thai families will generally look after their elderly parents until the end.  The west....not so much. 

This is why there are so few nursing homes in Thailand.  I'm surprised they mentioned eight in Chiang Mai.  I checked myself a few years ago and found two.  Maybe there are more now, but I'd guess they cater mostly to non-Thais. 

...are privately owned and operated and are making money hand over fist.

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7 hours ago, kingdong said:
8 hours ago, Sticky Wicket said:

If they ever cure dementia the NHS costs would reduce dramatically overnight.

Probably 10-20%!

One to one care for people with Alzheimers and dementia is extremely expensive and a huge burden on the health system

What's the answer?euthanasia?

Pretty obvious what the answer is. Ship them to northern Thailand and make the same amount of money off them that the hugely over-hyped NHS can't afford to spend on them.

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6 hours ago, zydeco said:

How is insurance coming to play in this? I can see Thai authorities using it as whip against the rest of us.

Probably qualifying and paying for the standard Thai government sanctioned insurance is already factored into whatever package deal is being offered by these Thai care homes and accepted by the guardians of the patients. What's the bet that it's all easily facilitated through agents, including 90-day reports?

 

I can't see how that can be seen as a 'whip' against a compis-mentis retiree who simply can't afford to stay here, probably considers that the 90-day reporting is akin to being treated like a criminal and thinks that agents are a a corrupt and illegal entity that they refuse to use.

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8 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

dementia is tough to deal with.  I am 63 now and have seen friends I grew up with in the 1970s even had their great aunts living with them, just living skeletons, sitting in the chair all day long.  Such a drain on the family, patience, frustration, financially, emotionally, etc.  My mom is 90 now and the last of her generation.  Two of my great aunts went alzheimer's but luckily there was enough money in that generation to care for them in facilities.  My Mom is the last of her generation of our fairly large greek family.  My grandmother had 10 brothers and children, that generation has all passed.  Their kids, my aunts and uncles are all gone now, except for my Mom.  Her physical health is good, but she is getting very forgetful, but not senile yet.  Luckily one of my sisters is a nurse and has a house and god bless her and her husband for taking my mother in.  I send money every month.  Really not sure how we would handle this financially if Ma had to go to a facility.  Those places literally charge whatever they think you can afford. 

 

  Not being ghoulish, but there is a lot to be said for the slightly older days, when people went out a bit quicker.  Until and unless you see people wither and linger, I don't think you can really understand that.  Watch them sit around all day in the reclining chair, watch redundant news, Dr Phil, Oprah for hours and hours on end.  They lose interest in things, stop cooking for themselves, etc

And what is your Point actually?

The mentioned home in CM is excellent and well known for care and accomodation and food. They have well educated nurses and docs. I think some Swiss opened that home. So most of the old are coming from Switzerland ich Austria and Germany. They organise walks in Parks and going for trips together. 

I doubt Everybody could offer this to their relatives in Europe. 

 

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