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Sanders climbs, now tied with Biden among registered voters - Reuters/Ipsos poll


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32 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I don't agree with your analysis of 2016 but it doesn't matter. I've already explained why I think Bernie or Sanders would lose to the impeached president. Red Baiting. Non stop conflating them with Venezuela. Yes, I believe that and yes I believe a more moderate choice would get the same stupid attacks but they wouldn't stick. 

We are having the core debate now among democrats. 

Which candidate that either matches or is close enough to your values has the best chance of beating 45 and more importantly no losing to him.

Only 2 candidates pull more than 10% of Trump voters. Bernie and Yang. Up to you.

 

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7 minutes ago, FMarch said:

When America's Greatest President of the 20th century,  Donald J Trump is elected for his third term... You will Still be Crying about you Polls and other non-sense ... do yourself a favor... go put on your big boy pants then get a life in reality.

Third term huh? Too funny. If he's going to be a monarch who is above all U.S. laws, why even bother with elections? 

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29 minutes ago, FMarch said:

When America's Greatest President of the 20th century,  Donald J Trump is elected for his third term... You will Still be Crying about you Polls and other non-sense ... do yourself a favor... go put on your big boy pants then get a life in reality.

 

This is the 21st century. Just sayin'.

 

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56 minutes ago, FMarch said:

When America's Greatest President of the 20th century,  Donald J Trump is elected for his third term... You will Still be Crying about you Polls and other non-sense ... do yourself a favor... go put on your big boy pants then get a life in reality.

He probably be like Lula in the song Copacabana after 2020. Sitting in Trump bar so refined and drink himself half blind. 

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4 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Bernie's got a few problems. First of all, let me say I like and and admire him tremendously. He is the patron saint of the progressive movement. Here are the issues, however. 1) All those so called "liberal" media are going to turn on him as if he were the Anti-Christ if he becomes the nominee. Liberalism is their "angle" to create a competive niche, same as Fox's conservatism. In the end they are corporate establishment and Bernie's interests are not theirs. I, in fact think, they would be only too happy to have Trump around another 4 years and if things turn to <deleted> they'll sell their company to the Chinese. Their interests are maximizing shareholder value. They don't give a <deleted> about America. 2) Bernie is an activist, he is not a manager. If you went into a fight, you'd want him on your side, but you wouldn't want him managing your company/country. 3) M4A is not going to pass, nor is free college for all, nor is 100 student loan forgiveness. These things are not going to pass whether or not there is a Republican Senate or a Democrat Senate. All of that creates a failed presidency by an octogenarian and will usher in some vile right wing ideologue much worse than Trump, who is only self serving and not an ideologue. People real ought to be looking at Yang. I know the press has marginalized him, and that's for a reason, but take a look and see if that's not the better way to go.

 

But you turn on liberal news right now, and it is completely unprecedented. Never has a president been attacked like this. Don Lemon, Rachel Maddow. What you are saying is this tide is all the sudden going to turn. 

 

I think you are right in that the media wont want him to be president. I just think it will be a very difficult sell for those hosts to be anti Bernie while obviously being anti Trump at the same time.

 

The people are going to have to learn to fight if they want a single payer system. In France there are huge protests all the time. M4a comes in steps. I do not understand why people are insistent on not taking the first step just because we know the second step will be more difficult. That would be like giving up in the 8th inning because you know Mariano Rivera is pitching the ninth. Yeah, we are gonna have to fight the most powerful people on earth to get medicare for all. But even if we fail, the stage will have been set and the health and pharmaceutical companies will probably have been exposed for more of what they actually are - corporations profiteering off of sickness. 

 

I know quite a bit about Yang and he would be great with me. I just don't see him as plausible at this point. A guy like Yang could easily end up on a Bernie ticket though. 

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3 hours ago, Nigel Garvie said:

I agree totally, and I read with some amazement the posts that follow where the left is fighting over how ideologically sound their favoured candidate is, and how all the rest are tied to the "Establishment". It is odd that the Deep state, the Zionist conspiracy, and the Archans haven't been mentioned also. 

 

Has nobody learnt ANYTHING from what happened on our side of the pond. Jeremy Corbyn and his hard left puppet masters, were paragons of left wing ideological purity. The didn't just get beaten in the election, they got utterly humiliated. Corbyn it is true, was uniquely unpopular, but there were many other reasons. The manifesto promised everything to everybody, and people just didn't believe it. 

 

As a result we are left with a compulsive liar as deeply unpleasant and self serving as 45.

 

"So, the NYT endorsed Warren, which was my expectation. They wanted an establishment candidate that appears progressive. The problem is that doesn't hold up. She's a fraud.........etc" Lannarebirth.

 

No offence intended, but this is precisely the sort of nonsense that comes from the teenage starry eyed fantasists in Momentum. Everyone to the right of Trotsky is a Blairite, centrists in the Labour Party are in fact Tories in disguise, everyone who disagrees with you is a servant of the establishment. The reward that the Labour Party got for this sort of thinking was 5 more years of a far right wing government, which will shaft the poor once again. 

 

I don't care how you do it but defeat 45. Use an air fleet of poisoned nano drones if you like, but you are fighting a deep and profound evil (IMHO) which must be destroyed. Pretending that most Democrats are no different to Republicans, as you polish your noble far left credentials, is a self indulgence no one can afford.

 

Any theory as to why we are fighting completely unnecessary, costly, unpopular and even illegal wars for the past 20 years? Killing untold numbers of US soldiers and innocent civilians if the commander in chiefs have not been doing the bidding of corporations? Because it is not a very big mystery if you assume presidents have all been part of it.

 

This is not conspiratorial. This is the way things are, and was even predicted by Eisenhower in 1961. https://www.npr.org/2011/01/17/132942244/ikes-warning-of-military-expansion-50-years-later

 

What have we gotten out of these wars exactly beside oil profits, military weapons production and contractor profits. What is your reasoning as to why they have been started, and why we seem to purposefully take actions that make it unable for us to get out of the region? 

 

Do people just like death, and to see American troops die? What is the reason? There is only one plausible reason. 

 

You would also need to answer why every single non establishment candidate, for example Bernie and Yang, are unfairly covered and treated by the media, which is an arm of the establishment. Just google "yang biased media coverage". You do not have much further to look than the pharmaceutical ads during the presidential debates to understand exactly what is going on. Corporations that are making obscene profits do not want change. 

 

Isn't it interesting, if you assume I am right, everything going on makes perfect sense. Every single question answers itself perfectly. And if you are right, nothing makes any sense at all? Don't you find that somewhat suspicious? 

 

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3 hours ago, Nigel Garvie said:

I agree totally, and I read with some amazement the posts that follow where the left is fighting over how ideologically sound their favoured candidate is, and how all the rest are tied to the "Establishment". It is odd that the Deep state, the Zionist conspiracy, and the Archans haven't been mentioned also. 

 

Has nobody learnt ANYTHING from what happened on our side of the pond. Jeremy Corbyn and his hard left puppet masters, were paragons of left wing ideological purity. The didn't just get beaten in the election, they got utterly humiliated. Corbyn it is true, was uniquely unpopular, but there were many other reasons. The manifesto promised everything to everybody, and people just didn't believe it. 

 

As a result we are left with a compulsive liar as deeply unpleasant and self serving as 45.

 

"So, the NYT endorsed Warren, which was my expectation. They wanted an establishment candidate that appears progressive. The problem is that doesn't hold up. She's a fraud.........etc" Lannarebirth.

 

No offence intended, but this is precisely the sort of nonsense that comes from the teenage starry eyed fantasists in Momentum. Everyone to the right of Trotsky is a Blairite, centrists in the Labour Party are in fact Tories in disguise, everyone who disagrees with you is a servant of the establishment. The reward that the Labour Party got for this sort of thinking was 5 more years of a far right wing government, which will shaft the poor once again. 

 

I don't care how you do it but defeat 45. Use an air fleet of poisoned nano drones if you like, but you are fighting a deep and profound evil (IMHO) which must be destroyed. Pretending that most Democrats are no different to Republicans, as you polish your noble far left credentials, is a self indulgence no one can afford.

 

Start here on your journey to enlightenment. The truth wont set you free, unfortunately. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, sucit said:

Any theory as to why we are fighting completely unnecessary, costly, unpopular and even illegal wars for the past 20 years? Killing untold numbers of US soldiers and innocent civilians if the commander in chiefs have not been doing the bidding of corporations? Because it is not a very big mystery if you assume presidents have all been part of it.

 

This is not conspiratorial. This is the way things are, and was even predicted by Eisenhower in 1961. https://www.npr.org/2011/01/17/132942244/ikes-warning-of-military-expansion-50-years-later

 

What have we gotten out of these wars exactly beside oil profits, military weapons production and contractor profits. What is your reasoning as to why they have been started, and why we seem to purposefully take actions that make it unable for us to get out of the region? 

 

Do people just like death, and to see American troops die? What is the reason? There is only one plausible reason. 

 

You would also need to answer why every single non establishment candidate, for example Bernie and Yang, are unfairly covered and treated by the media, which is an arm of the establishment. Just google "yang biased media coverage". You do not have much further to look than the pharmaceutical ads during the presidential debates to understand exactly what is going on. Corporations that are making obscene profits do not want change. 

 

Isn't it interesting, if you assume I am right, everything going on makes perfect sense. Every single question answers itself perfectly. And if you are right, nothing makes any sense at all? Don't you find that somewhat suspicious? 

 

You have a perception problem, I agree with almost everything you say here. Of course the US military industrial complex  is a ravenous beast that needs to be fed, and that involves the deaths of many US servicemen and women, and countless soldiers and civilians of other countries as well. I come from well on the left in UK political terms ( I left the Labour Party when Blair helped invade Iraq) and I am well aware of most of the things going on in the US political sphere. You said "Start here on your journey to enlightenment. The truth wont set you free, unfortunately". I didn't bother, sometime later maybe, I expect I will know and agree with the points you are making, and I will forgive your rather pompous "Start here on your journey to enlightenment". I marched in the 60s in London against the Vietnam war where your country, you should remember, was destroying the lives and country of people very similar to my good Thai friends who I am blest to share my life with here. 

 

It appears from what you say above that you missed the point of my argument, which was, put simply, "Don't lose the battle due to your obsession with ideology, like we did. The greatest left wing leaders we ever had were practical men WHO GOT THEMSELVES ELECTED, and quietly achieved real advances. Don't put off ordinary voters by telling them how you are going to castrate the GOP, get elected first and then do it.

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15 hours ago, Nigel Garvie said:

You have a perception problem, I agree with almost everything you say here. Of course the US military industrial complex  is a ravenous beast that needs to be fed, and that involves the deaths of many US servicemen and women, and countless soldiers and civilians of other countries as well. I come from well on the left in UK political terms ( I left the Labour Party when Blair helped invade Iraq) and I am well aware of most of the things going on in the US political sphere. You said "Start here on your journey to enlightenment. The truth wont set you free, unfortunately". I didn't bother, sometime later maybe, I expect I will know and agree with the points you are making, and I will forgive your rather pompous "Start here on your journey to enlightenment". I marched in the 60s in London against the Vietnam war where your country, you should remember, was destroying the lives and country of people very similar to my good Thai friends who I am blest to share my life with here. 

 

It appears from what you say above that you missed the point of my argument, which was, put simply, "Don't lose the battle due to your obsession with ideology, like we did. The greatest left wing leaders we ever had were practical men WHO GOT THEMSELVES ELECTED, and quietly achieved real advances. Don't put off ordinary voters by telling them how you are going to castrate the GOP, get elected first and then do it.

"Pretending that most Democrats are no different to Republicans, as you polish your noble farleft credentials, is a self indulgence no one can afford."

 

That was you in your previous post. 

 

Again, establishment democrats are no different from republicans. If they were, we would have seen a stop to these wars that almost everyone is in full agreement are costly, deadly, wasteful, and ineffective. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, sucit said:

"Pretending that most Democrats are no different to Republicans, as you polish your noble farleft credentials, is a self indulgence no one can afford."

 

That was you in your previous post. 

 

Again, establishment democrats are no different from republicans. If they were, we would have seen a stop to these wars that almost everyone is in full agreement are costly, deadly, wasteful, and ineffective. 

 

 

You have a point about wars and that's an important issue but it's not the only important issue. 

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