Retirement extension - Fixed Term Deposit

[Oxx]

41 minutes ago, khunPer said:

we are guests only

 

We are not guests.  Guests are treated courteously and with civility.

[EricTh]

On 1/18/2020 at 12:08 PM, JohnMidnight said:

 

 

 

You don't need the past 12 months statements because you're using 800k option which only require you to present at least 2 months before.

 

Ask the bank to print the last 6 months and that would only require one day instead of one week's wait.

 

They need to stamp and sign it on that day.

 

I did my renewal in Chiang Mai on Nov 2019. Document required from banks are:

 

1. Bank letter

2. Photocopies of bank passbook.

3. Statement of transactions for past 3-6 months 

 

#3 is a new requirement starting last year, in all my previous renewals only 1 and 2 are sufficient. I used the fixed deposit 800k option.

 

Your online statement doesn't show running balances for each transaction (including your first deposit) which is what they want.

Edited January 19, 2020 by EricTh

[Max69xl]

On 1/17/2020 at 10:06 PM, Sheryl said:

I think what you were told was in error. Statements are required for people using the 65K a month method but for the lump sum 800K in the bank all that is supposed to be necessary is an updated bank book plus standard letter from the bank. Only in case there are entries in the bank book that are accumulated (not applicable to a Fixed deposit) then you might need a statement for that time period since under the new rules they need to be able to confirm that the 800K was untouched for 3 months after your last extension, balance remained not less than 400K thereafter and then back to 800K 2 months before extension.

 

With a fixed deposit all you should need is an updated bank book. With Fixed Deposits that can be a problem but apparently there is a way to create an updated entry despite no activity by doing a "zero credit transaction: AKA :Balance Forward" transaction.

 

If you already had this (i.e. a bank book entry dated the day you went to immigration or nto more than the day prior) and they are still demanding a statement, makes no sense but if so best advice is to call BBL headquarter office and discuss with them the need to expedite the statement process. 

 

But if not, I would try first to get the bank book updated and then a letter from the bank stating current balance and that the balance has been maintained at that level since (date).

There's been several reports about a 12 month statement is needed even when using the money in the bank method. Immigration obviously wants to see that the balance never went below 400k after the 2+3 months with at least 800k. The new financial requirements started March 1 2019 and imo a statement shouldn't be required when applying for an extension in January 2020.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Max69xl

[JAN]

Think it might be possible to include a copy of this new "Statement letter" So one can show the bank as sample. Thanks. 

[giddyup]

I guess those using an agent to obtain their extension will be exempt from this requirement?

[Max69xl]

26 minutes ago, giddyup said:

I guess those using an agent to obtain their extension will be exempt from this requirement?

That's why people are using an agent. With an agent you can practically ignore every official requirement. 

[Max69xl]

41 minutes ago, JAN said:

Think it might be possible to include a copy of this new "Statement letter" So one can show the bank as sample. Thanks. 

The statement isn't something special. It's a normal printout for a chosen period of time. Stamped and signed by the bank. It should cost 200 baht tops. 

[JimGant]

11 hours ago, HuskerDo said:

It's unfortunate you've had to ask this question three times Sheryl as the "rules" should be the same at every IMM office. I can't imagine why the country can't get their "junk" together so that the rules are the same at all offices.

Ah, welcome to Asia and the 'rice bowl' concept that every government office is a fiefdom:

"rice bowl n. in the military, a jealously protected program, project, department, or budget; a fiefdom."   And not just in the military.

 

I worked with Hughes in Korea to automate their radar system. Simple concept, just like our SAGE system in the US: digitize the individual radar site returns and consolidate at a single location. Except some Korean radar site commanders had their sites oriented to true north, the others to magnetic north. To get all on the same page required the breaking of some rice bowls. No small matter, as the project was delayed months, and millions, due to this Asian concept of individual fiefdom.

[JohnMidnight]

5 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

The statement isn't something special. It's a normal printout for a chosen period of time. Stamped and signed by the bank. It should cost 200 baht tops. 

Hi,

 

The 200 baht is no big deal, but to ensure the new regulations are followed this period must be for twelve months  and Bangkok Bank for some strange reason takes seven days to produce a twelve month statement.

But these new regulations should only apply for those who are renewing their extension on or after the 1st March 2020.

If they applied and received their renewal before 1st march 2019 the old three month rule then applied.  There was no onus on them to maintain a balance in the account after they received the extension.

Immigration appear to be retrospectively and universally applying the new rule.

And last time I renewed, January 2019,  I used the Income/Embassy letter method, so to comply with the new rules I should only need to provide proof that I had 800,000 on deposit for the previous 2 months.  If I decide to renew again in 2021 then and only then should it be necessary to provide a 12 month statement showing I maintained the necessary balance for the period January 2020 to January 2021.

 

 

[Max69xl]

48 minutes ago, JohnMidnight said:

Hi,

 

The 200 baht is no big deal, but to ensure the new regulations are followed this period must be for twelve months  and Bangkok Bank for some strange reason takes seven days to produce a twelve month statement.

But these new regulations should only apply for those who are renewing their extension on or after the 1st March 2020.

If they applied and received their renewal before 1st march 2019 the old three month rule then applied.  There was no onus on them to maintain a balance in the account after they received the extension.

Immigration appear to be retrospectively and universally applying the new rule.

And last time I renewed, January 2019,  I used the Income/Embassy letter method, so to comply with the new rules I should only need to provide proof that I had 800,000 on deposit for the previous 2 months.  If I decide to renew again in 2021 then and only then should it be necessary to provide a 12 month statement showing I maintained the necessary balance for the period January 2020 to January 2021.

 

 

I think you confuse a normal bank statement with the bank statement for the >65k monthly method when not having an income letter from your embassy. 

This is a bank statement with every transaction and balance during a chosen period of time, like the one you can sometime print out yourself when logging in to your bank account online.

Imo this 12 months statement when using the 800k in the bank method should be required after March 1, but as always several immigration officers don't have a clue.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Max69xl

[jonwilly]

I have used an agent ever since Thailand allowed the other nationals of Asian to be legal here.

The numbers at CM immigration rose drastically, so I as an older male decided I would be better off using the services of a professional agency.

Cost me under B9K plus government fees and they do my 12 month O visa based on retirement and my 90 day reports.

I have never had reason to complain about service offered, and know that I would be an angry old man if I had to endure the Vagaries of the Thai Immigration system.

Peace of mind is one of the reasons I came to live in Thailand.

 

john

[JohnMidnight]

On 1/19/2020 at 11:18 AM, JAN said:

Think it might be possible to include a copy of this new "Statement letter" So one can show the bank as sample. Thanks. 

Hi,

 

OK, returned to Immigration, this time armed with a "Bank Statement". 

 

I obtained the statement from the bank this morning.  Also had them update the passbook

 

(The attached statement was one I obtained on Friday 17th.  No time to scan the new).

 

Submitted:-

The Bank letter  (obtained and dated the 17th Jan)

The bank Statement (6 months period)

Scanned pages of the freshly updated bank book  (This has to be updated by the bank, can not be updated in the ATM)

Photocopies of all passport pages, TM6, and 90 day notice.

And of course the TM7

 

As I now have the fixed account on the internet I also submitted a print-out dated 20 July 2019 to 20/1/2020, same as attached

 

The IO very quickly went through the bank letter/statement, he highlighted every 810,200 in yellow.  Same with passbook.  He only gave a cursory glance to internet print-out.  (Asked the bank clerk to stamp but she refused)    He  cleared the submitted paperwork in less than five minutes. 

 

Signed a few forms. had photo taken, then had long wait for the return of my passport

 

 

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by JohnMidnight

[anterian]

I discovered several years back that the average IO does not understand how fixed deposit accounts work (probably like most Thais lives from pay day to payday). Ask for the senior officer, who might have one. I ended up getting the bank manager to talk to the immigration manager, the bank won .

 

[Sparkles]

On 1/18/2020 at 12:08 PM, JohnMidnight said:

Hi,

 

Have now got this Fixed account on the internet.   So can now request/print off account details for the past six months 

 

BUT it does not show any additional information  that was not covered by the print out of the passbook.

 

Have sent a message to Bangkok Bank seeking guidance/help.  Awaiting their reply

Identical in format to what I got from Bangkok Bank, KSK ,December 18 when I did my extension based on 800,000 baht fixed deposit which has never dropped below that amount in 13 yrs and obviously identical to what is in the passbook. I was apparently the first to advise BB of this new requirement as they knew nothing about it.My contact is Khun Sombat my bank bloke for 13 yrs at 3 different BB branches.Word of warning while you can print it out it still is has to be signed by a bank official I was  told. Cost was 100 baht

 

Most Immigration officers do not understand fixed term deposits.

 

The year before the female officer said "Why you only have 800,000 baht in your account ? "     

My answer of course was "well that's YOUR rule and it gains interest every day of the fixed term".She simply had no idea what I was talking about and just mumbled "you should have more"

 

So with the new boss in place upstairs it appears he is seeking to find those who are dipping into the 800,000 b, or sharing it, after getting their extension approved.I have very little other savings that's why I resist the temptation to dip into it apart from taking out the yearly interest which at 1.5% is not a lot but pays for a couple of nights away.Plus I process the 1800 baht tax rebate at Amphur Hang Dong

[Max69xl]

2 hours ago, Sparkles said:

Identical in format to what I got from Bangkok Bank, KSK ,December 18 when I did my extension based on 800,000 baht fixed deposit which has never dropped below that amount in 13 yrs and obviously identical to what is in the passbook. I was apparently the first to advise BB of this new requirement as they knew nothing about it.My contact is Khun Sombat my bank bloke for 13 yrs at 3 different BB branches.Word of warning while you can print it out it still is has to be signed by a bank official I was  told. Cost was 100 baht

 

Most Immigration officers do not understand fixed term deposits.

 

The year before the female officer said "Why you only have 800,000 baht in your account ? "     

My answer of course was "well that's YOUR rule and it gains interest every day of the fixed term".She simply had no idea what I was talking about and just mumbled "you should have more"

 

So with the new boss in place upstairs it appears he is seeking to find those who are dipping into the 800,000 b, or sharing it, after getting their extension approved.I have very little other savings that's why I resist the temptation to dip into it apart from taking out the yearly interest which at 1.5% is not a lot but pays for a couple of nights away.Plus I process the 1800 baht tax rebate at Amphur Hang Dong

"I was apparently the first to advise BB of this new requirement as they knew nothing about it."

What new requirement are you referring to? 

[Sparkles]

On 1/22/2020 at 12:20 PM, Max69xl said:

"I was apparently the first to advise BB of this new requirement as they knew nothing about it."

What new requirement are you referring to? 

That you have to get the bank to provide an official bank statement of any transactions,signed and stamped by the teller (as pictured in previous post) This was never a requirement before as it duplicates the information in the passbook.

[JohnMidnight]

23 minutes ago, Sparkles said:

That you have to get the bank to provide an official bank statement of any transactions,signed and stamped by the teller (as pictured in previous post) This was never a requirement before as it duplicates the information in the passbook.

Hi,

 

For anyone who renews their extension after 1st March 2020 and who used the 800K method the previous year must supply the full 12 month statement in order that the IO can check that the following was adhered to :- 

At least 2 months prior to filing date and at least 3 months after being granted the last visa or extension the alien had funds deposited in a bank in Thailand of no less than THB 800000. The alien did not withdraw these funds for 3 months after being granted permission and that the remaining balance never dropped below THB 40000 for remaider of year.  Bank statement suitably stamped and signed.   (Bank clerk refused to stamp/sign my internet print-out, when asked why, she said "Because we did not print it")

 

Technically at the moment it should only be necessary to show 800K in the bank for 2 months prior to renewal date
 

[Max69xl]

1 hour ago, Sparkles said:

That you have to get the bank to provide an official bank statement of any transactions,signed and stamped by the teller (as pictured in previous post) This was never a requirement before as it duplicates the information in the passbook.

For the money in the bank method, only a bank letter showing the 800k in the bank 2 months before the day of application for the 1 year extension is needed. But you also need to have the 800k in your account 3 months later,and never below 400k.

This year,from March 1 immigration offices (when applying for a 1 year extension) might ask for a 12 months bank statement showing just that. This is yet not an official requirement,I haven't seen it at my immigration office (I might have missed it), and that's why banks don't have a clue about it.

The bank statement shows every transaction, the bank book doesn't unless you update it every month. If you don't, the bank statement is not a duplicate of the bank book.

For me, 12 months of transactions incl deposits is 2 full bank books. I prefer a 200 baht bank statement any day of the week instead of copies of every page in 2 bank books = 15 pages incl the page with the name. 

My last 1 year extension included 14 copies. I don't want 15 more. 

 

[Sparkles]

4 hours ago, Max69xl said:

For the money in the bank method, only a bank letter showing the 800k in the bank 2 months before the day of application for the 1 year extension is needed. But you also need to have the 800k in your account 3 months later,and never below 400k.

This year,from March 1 immigration offices (when applying for a 1 year extension) might ask for a 12 months bank statement showing just that. This is yet not an official requirement,I haven't seen it at my immigration office (I might have missed it), and that's why banks don't have a clue about it.

The bank statement shows every transaction, the bank book doesn't unless you update it every month. If you don't, the bank statement is not a duplicate of the bank book.

For me, 12 months of transactions incl deposits is 2 full bank books. I prefer a 200 baht bank statement any day of the week instead of copies of every page in 2 bank books = 15 pages incl the page with the name. 

My last 1 year extension included 14 copies. I don't want 15 more. 

 

My 12 months fixed deposit passbook would show if I had withdrawn money at any time. The bank statement was exactly the same as the passbook ie only 4 items ie balance ,interest,tax, re investment. Why would I update it monthly, or whenever, if its a fixed term and I don't intend to touch it ?

The officer who processed my retirement extension made no mention of the balance having to be there for any fixed period after approval.I didn't mention it as I have no intention of using it.

 

You could guarantee than every Immigration office is not on the same page.

[Oxx]

9 minutes ago, Sparkles said:

My 12 months fixed deposit passbook would show if I had withdrawn money at any time.

 

Is that actually true? Most banks only update their passbooks for the last 6 months of transactions.  (They provide a consolidated transaction for any new transactions before the six months.)  It would be perfectly possible for someone to withdraw, then replace money without providing a clear audit trail in a standard passbook.

[Sparkles]

16 hours ago, Oxx said:

 

Is that actually true? Most banks only update their passbooks for the last 6 months of transactions.  (They provide a consolidated transaction for any new transactions before the six months.)  It would be perfectly possible for someone to withdraw, then replace money without providing a clear audit trail in a standard passbook.

With my BB fixed deposit there is no ATM card so any withdrawal has to be be over the counter and the transaction would be updated in the passbook by the teller.The passbook of course records all transactions which is why the seperate statement now required is just duplication in my case.

I might add that on the day I attended Imm ,Dec 18,someone else seeking a retirement extension, who was with her Agent, got caught out too. The Agent was not aware that the new boss upstairs had brought in this requirement.The suggestion by the officer who processed mine indicated it was a very recent additional requirement for fixed term applicants.

Nothing surprises me with Immigration requirements they vary from office to office and from officer to officer.If you need confirmation of that check  forums in other provinces 

Edited January 25, 2020 by Sparkles