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Entering Thailand with a new blank Thai passport with no stamp trail. Does this pose a problem?


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1 minute ago, Sticky Wicket said:

Can a Thai National leave Thailand to the UK with an new & empty UK passport + Thai ID card?

NO Thai passport at all

If they were an infant and were born here they could. But if they are old enough to have a ID card they would not be an infant.

They would need a Thai passport to leave the country. They would show both passports to the airline to prove they can enter the UK without a visa and the Thai one to immigration.

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5 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

If they were an infant and were born here they could. But if they are old enough to have a ID card they would not be an infant.

They would need a Thai passport to leave the country. They would show both passports to the airline to prove they can enter the UK without a visa and the Thai one to immigration.

So they wouldn't be able to fly without a Thai passport. Seems odd

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4 minutes ago, Sticky Wicket said:

So they wouldn't be able to fly without a Thai passport. Seems odd

Why would it be odd?

Could a person leave the UK without a UK passport or one from another country that has a visa or etc in it  to prove they are legally in the country.

A Thai ID card would not be accepted with the UK passport. Immigration will insist on seeing a Thai passport.

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Just now, ubonjoe said:

Why would it be odd?

Could a person leave the UK without a UK passport or one from another country that has a visa or etc in it  to prove they are legally in the country.

A Thai ID card would not be accepted with the UK passport. Immigration will insist on seeing a Thai passport.

I thought a dual citizen could fly on either passport

The ID shows the person is Thai and the UK passport shows they can enter the UK. 

The person is 11 years old

Is there no way of sacrificing the Thai citizenship and leaving on the UK passport (11 years overstay)?

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2 minutes ago, Sticky Wicket said:

I thought a dual citizen could fly on either passport

Of course they can, members of my extended family do it all the time - Thai passport to enter Thailand, Aussie passport to enter Australia (because in practice both countries demand their citizens enter the country on that country's passport)

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1 minute ago, ThaiBunny said:

Of course they can, members of my extended family do it all the time - Thai passport to enter Thailand, Aussie passport to enter Australia (because in practice both countries demand their citizens enter the country on that country's passport)

Yes I understand, but I want my daughter to leave on a new UK passport and enter the UK with that. 

The thought of trying to get a Thai passport and involving her avarice mother again fills me with utter dread

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9 minutes ago, Sticky Wicket said:

Yes I understand, but I want my daughter to leave on a new UK passport and enter the UK with that. 

The thought of trying to get a Thai passport and involving her avarice mother again fills me with utter dread

The most recent experience I can cite is that SQ refused point blank to issue a boarding pass for a Thai citizen checking in to Singapore using his Aussie passport because there was no evidence using that passport of how he was legally in Thailand. It was escalated to supervisor level. His Aussie passport is in a (slightly) different name to his Thai passport and his boarding pass is definitely in his Thai name (I kept a copy in case there was a struggle to get his frequent flyer points credited - there wasn't). I've also no idea how Thai Immigration would view that at the airport as she passes through outwards passport control

Edited by ThaiBunny
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You do not even have to leave Thailand. The immigration office of the province you are - and if they are too ignorant, then see the boys at Chaengwattana - stamp you out on the foreign passport and enter a stamp into your Thai passport with a remark "changed nationality", in Thai "เปลี่ยนสัญชาติ". So happened with my kids. 

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On 1/20/2020 at 1:35 PM, Nordlys said:


Or should it make no difference manned or unmanned gate?  

Are the automated gates at both Suvarnabhumi and Don Mueang?  ????

You're a Thai national, don't worry.

 

On 1/20/2020 at 3:09 PM, Nordlys said:

Hi Samran! 

We've done this topic perhaps a decade ago??  

It has finally come to a time that I have to do this as my employment in Thailand as a foreigner for which I've been issued a Non-Immigrant B is coming to an end.  

But no, I was born in Thailand.  

You're a Thai national born in Thailand with a Thai passport. Don't worry. 

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6 hours ago, Sydebolle said:

You do not even have to leave Thailand. The immigration office of the province you are - and if they are too ignorant, then see the boys at Chaengwattana - stamp you out on the foreign passport and enter a stamp into your Thai passport with a remark "changed nationality", in Thai "เปลี่ยนสัญชาติ". So happened with my kids. 


Seriously??  ????????

But it's not like I'm renouncing my other citizenship and surrender my other passport.  When did your kids do that and was it at Chaengwattana??
 

Edited by Nordlys
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18 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

We did the "mistake" of exiting Thailand using our 6 month old daughters foreign passport.

When we then returned to Thailand, we of course knew she had to enter Thailand on her now blank Thai passport.

We were pulled aside and a IO supervisor was called in. They fixed the problem and we were on our way 10 minutes later.

 

What did they ask and how did you make it through that??

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9 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Immigration will not do it. Others have tried and they were told to leave on their non Thai passport.

They will only do it for those that applied for Thai nationality here.

You mean like naturalization?  

Also, can I do it at land border checkpoint?  

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3 minutes ago, Nordlys said:

You mean like naturalization?  

Yes

3 minutes ago, Nordlys said:

Also, can I do it at land border checkpoint?  

If you left at a land border using your non Thai passport you would have to use it to re-enter the country if you enter at a land border. They check for stamps for the other country and they have to be in the same passport you used to leave the country.

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10 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

How did they know they had UK passports? As I wrote before a person should never show immigration the other passport.

Immigration cannot deny entry to a Thai national and that is stated in the constitution.

Even if they show the other passport on what ground can they deny entry to a Thai passport holder?  

Like you say, a Thai national is a Thai national is a Thai national regardless whatever other country's passport s/he has.  

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3 minutes ago, Nordlys said:

Even if they show the other passport on what ground can they deny entry to a Thai passport holder?  

None at all but the problem is that many people are not aware of it and will comply with what the ill informed officer says.

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11 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Immigration will not do it. Others have tried and they were told to leave on their non Thai passport.

They will only do it for those that applied for Thai nationality here.

There are others who claim they did just that and had their foreign passport stamped "out" at Chaengwattana and stamped "เปลี่ยนสัญชาติ" (changed nationality) on Thai passport.  

Is there anything to lose if I go to Chaengwattana to try my luck and attempt just that?  Do I jeopardize anything at all?  

Edited by Nordlys
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12 minutes ago, Nordlys said:

There are others who claim they did just that and had their foreign passport stamped "out" at Chaengwattana and stamped "เปลี่ยนสัญชาติ" (changed nationality) on Thai passport.  

Is there anything to lose if I go to Chaengwattana to try my luck and attempt just that?  Do I jeopardize anything at all?  

I am not aware of what the circumstances were when he says that immigration did it.

I am only aware of people entering on a non Thai passport and tried to get it changed.

I know they will do it if you obtained Thai nationality.

It should not be a problem to do it but it could open a can of worms.

As myself and others have stated it will not be any problem to enter without a departure stamp in you new passport. I am aware of others doing it.

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9 hours ago, Sticky Wicket said:

I thought a dual citizen could fly on either passport

The ID shows the person is Thai and the UK passport shows they can enter the UK. 

The person is 11 years old

Is there no way of sacrificing the Thai citizenship and leaving on the UK passport (11 years overstay)?

The correct way for duel passport holder to use them is always enter the country of your citizenship on the local passport. Yes, a UK citizen can enter Thailand on Visa exempt and get 30 days to be here, but why would they want to be tourists here? 

A child born in Thailand to non Thai parents has to go on the parent's permit of stay. Since your daughter was born here to a Thai mother she's been staying here by right of her Thai nationality and therefore must use a Thai passport to leave Thailand. 

You might be able to somehow get away with it by mumbling something to the immigration officer as to why you haven't put her on your permit to stay but then you open yourself to other problems, such as travelling with a minor without her mother's consent (you need that to get her the Thai passport as well and if I understood your earlier reply you are trying to avoid contracting the mother), getting your daughter stamped for a very long overstay, and upon returning to Thailand having her as a foreigner and not as a Thai (assuming she enters on her UK passport) 

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9 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

The most recent experience I can cite is that SQ refused point blank to issue a boarding pass for a Thai citizen checking in to Singapore using his Aussie passport because there was no evidence using that passport of how he was legally in Thailand. It was escalated to supervisor level. His Aussie passport is in a (slightly) different name to his Thai passport and his boarding pass is definitely in his Thai name (I kept a copy in case there was a struggle to get his frequent flyer points credited - there wasn't). I've also no idea how Thai Immigration would view that at the airport as she passes through outwards passport control

Strange! I normally just show both passports to the airline check in, they never have any issues.

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3 hours ago, Nordlys said:


Seriously??  ????????

But it's not like I'm renouncing my other citizenship and surrender my other passport.  When did your kids do that and was it at Chaengwattana??
 


Followed advice by the immigration and it worked. Upon leaving Thailand for a holiday, both passports were presented to the immigration officer who stamped out on the foreign passport and put another stamp into the Thai passport. The foreign passport got the mentioned remark - done deal! 

As the new passports these days are loaded with biometrics you can also take your chance and do as suggested; leave as a foreigner and enter the destination country with the Thai passport (like Singapore, Hong Kong etc.). The destination immigration might ask, why the Thai passport is not stamped and you can refer to the fact, that Thailand is not stamping Thai passports any longer (which apparently is true when leaving certain airports). 

If you have the nerves, i.e. IF, then get it from the horse's mouth at Chaengwattana. The place is a beehive but the "special request desks" are usually almost empty and pretty efficient. I am a PR and got a new TM17 booklet within less than half an hour - top service (also at top official fees against receipt of THB 7'600). 

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15 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

How did they know they had UK passports? As I wrote before a person should never show immigration the other passport.

Immigration cannot deny entry to a Thai national and that is stated in the constitution.

Because the immigration officer told us that they know what passport every passenger checks in with in their home country. The plan had been to check in at Edinburgh on their UK passports and then enter and leave on their Thai passports and re-enter the UK on their UK passports, I posted all about this when it happened, I think it's more down to what immigration officer you get, some haven't a clue and some do. We're going back in July and my wife and kids will be on new Thai passports from London but this time they will travel both ways on their Thai passports and show their UK passports at check-in at Bangkok for the flight home.

 

 

 

Brigante7.

Edited by Brigante7
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54 minutes ago, Brigante7 said:

this time they will travel both ways on their Thai passports and show their UK passports at check-in at Bangkok for the flight home.

Which is the correct way of doing it... I always check in with the passport I intend to use at the destination 

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7 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

The correct way for duel passport holder to use them is always enter the country of your citizenship on the local passport. Yes, a UK citizen can enter Thailand on Visa exempt and get 30 days to be here, but why would they want to be tourists here? 

A child born in Thailand to non Thai parents has to go on the parent's permit of stay. Since your daughter was born here to a Thai mother she's been staying here by right of her Thai nationality and therefore must use a Thai passport to leave Thailand. 

You might be able to somehow get away with it by mumbling something to the immigration officer as to why you haven't put her on your permit to stay but then you open yourself to other problems, such as travelling with a minor without her mother's consent (you need that to get her the Thai passport as well and if I understood your earlier reply you are trying to avoid contracting the mother), getting your daughter stamped for a very long overstay, and upon returning to Thailand having her as a foreigner and not as a Thai (assuming she enters on her UK passport) 

It's way too logical to show Thai immigration her Thai birth certificate and Thai ID card + UK passport.

It seems to be easier if she was a foreign kid. Just leave on a UK passport and have an 11 year overstay with no fine.

I know what complete ârseholes immigration are, so I'm going to have to get a Thai Passport!

 

That means I've got to go to Bangkok and arrange to meet her mother to get a Thai passport that she will use for about 1 minute and then throw in the bin.

That will be fun and take about 10 attempts as she won't turn up and demand money , then not turn up again and demand more money.

One step forward, a thousand back!

 

I will never ever ever ever return to Thailand and I can't imagine that my daughter will in the next five years at least, therefore a Thai passport is completely superfluous 

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22 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Why would it be odd?

Could a person leave the UK without a UK passport or one from another country that has a visa or etc in it  to prove they are legally in the country.

A Thai ID card would not be accepted with the UK passport. Immigration will insist on seeing a Thai passport.

Is there a thread about applying for a Thai passport anywhere and where you can do it?

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22 minutes ago, Sticky Wicket said:

Is there a thread about applying for a Thai passport anywhere and where you can do it?

I would say they are many of them but all the info needed is on the Consular Affairs Website in Thai (Google translate works good on it).

List of passport offices here. http://www.consular.go.th/main/th/organize/21037-หน่วยบริการหนังสือเดินทาง.html

Procedure and requirements for under 20 years old is here, http://www.consular.go.th/main/th/services/10150/111295-เยาวชน-(ต่ำกว่า-20-ปีบริบูรณ์).html

Consent form that needs to be signed by their mother at a Amphoe to have it certified. 

http://www.consular.go.th/main/contents/files/services-20120630-195748-510034.pdf

 

 

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5 hours ago, Sticky Wicket said:

It's way too logical to show Thai immigration her Thai birth certificate and Thai ID card + UK passport.

It seems to be easier if she was a foreign kid. Just leave on a UK passport and have an 11 year overstay with no fine.

I know what complete ârseholes immigration are, so I'm going to have to get a Thai Passport!

 

That means I've got to go to Bangkok and arrange to meet her mother to get a Thai passport that she will use for about 1 minute and then throw in the bin.

That will be fun and take about 10 attempts as she won't turn up and demand money , then not turn up again and demand more money.

One step forward, a thousand back!

 

I will never ever ever ever return to Thailand and I can't imagine that my daughter will in the next five years at least, therefore a Thai passport is completely superfluous 

You either need to have both parents there (and bring all documents, BCs, house registrations AND your passport just in case).
 

Otherwise you need to get sole custody of your child through the thai courts to be able to apply for the passport yourself without the mother. There are threads around here on how to do that if the mother is being non cooperative. 

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31 minutes ago, samran said:

Otherwise you need to get sole custody of your child through the thai courts to be able to apply for the passport yourself without the mother. There are threads around here on how to do that if the mother is being non cooperative. 

It depends upon various conditions and reasons for one of the parents to be absent when the application is done.

In the end the most important thing is a consent form signed by the absent parent if still alive. See the link I posted earlier.

 

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2 hours ago, overherebc said:

I thought a Thai who has a Thai ID Card cannot be refused entry to their own country even on an expired Thai passport.

They can’t, but refusals do occasionally happen though less and less. Usually happens when a dual citizen tries to enter flashing both passports, and they come across a IO who also doesn’t know the rules and insist they be stamped in on the foreign passport.

 

My mother once upon a time did the former, but fortunately the IO simply took the Thai passport and stamped her in on that.

 

The best method of travelling for dual citizens has been outlined many times above - and based on 30 years of personal experience - what is outlined above is the best way.

Edited by samran
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  • 1 month later...
On 1/21/2020 at 9:23 PM, Sydebolle said:


Followed advice by the immigration and it worked. Upon leaving Thailand for a holiday, both passports were presented to the immigration officer who stamped out on the foreign passport and put another stamp into the Thai passport. The foreign passport got the mentioned remark - done deal! 

As the new passports these days are loaded with biometrics you can also take your chance and do as suggested; leave as a foreigner and enter the destination country with the Thai passport (like Singapore, Hong Kong etc.). The destination immigration might ask, why the Thai passport is not stamped and you can refer to the fact, that Thailand is not stamping Thai passports any longer (which apparently is true when leaving certain airports). 

If you have the nerves, i.e. IF, then get it from the horse's mouth at Chaengwattana. The place is a beehive but the "special request desks" are usually almost empty and pretty efficient. I am a PR and got a new TM17 booklet within less than half an hour - top service (also at top official fees against receipt of THB 7'600). 


I might seriously have to explore this avenue as I'm having a serious doubt that the flights I've booked for Songkran holiday will ever take off.  The flights are completely empty of bookings for almost 6 weeks after we made bookings both outbound and inbound despite flying out the day before the official start of Songkran holiday and returning the day after....  And this despite my destination is not a high-risk country (Medan, Indonesia).

Is there a phone # at Chaengwattana that I can make anonymous call to inquiry?  

Edited by Nordlys
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