Republican coronavirus bill hits roadblock in U.S. Senate; negotiations continue

[JHolmesJr]

12 hours ago, bristolboy said:

Actually, it's that nut job Trump who wants to give lump sums to everyone. Buying votes much? The Democrats prefer to target those who have lost their jobs. People who keep their jobs have no special need for the cash. At least not more than they used to. But those without a job risking losing everything. The money should be targeted at them. 

And there should be strong provisions against using cash for buybacks. The Republican bill would allow Mnuchin to waife buyback provisions.

 

"Democrats have outlined a laundry list of objectionable provisions, arguing that the bill does not expand paid sick leave and actually caps how much employers have to pay.

A source familiar with the GOP bill text also said Republicans are “refusing to add strong worker protections” and have included language requiring companies keep employees “to the extent possible.”

...Democrats also wanted strong restrictions on corporations who take federal help, but the source said the GOP bill included “very weak” stock buyback restrictions that could be waived by Mnuchin."

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/488911-democrats-fume-over-gop-coronavirus-bill-totally-inadequate

 

 

More CNN fuelled nonsense.

 

Dems have voted against urgent relief because it didn't include:

Planned Parenthood funding

A bailout for the Post Office

Crippling new airline regulations

Solar & wind tax credits

Playing politics while Trump plays to beat this crisis.

[bkk6060]

22 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

Anyone who thinks that social justice warrior nonsense inserted into the bill is not a sign of sabotage is an idiot. 

You seem uneducated on how things like this work.

There are always give and take in these large bills whether they are Dem. or GOP.

The title of the bill many times does not mention the small print and other negotiable items which may not actually be related to the larger bill theme.

Normal course of business.

[Cryingdick]

1 minute ago, bkk6060 said:

You seem uneducated on how things like this work.

There are always give and take in these large bills whether they are Dem. or GOP.

The title of the bill many times does not mention the small print and other negotiable items which may not actually be related to the larger bill theme.

Normal course of business.

 

That's what made an argument for the line item veto. I haven't heard that term in ages not sure it still exists. Anyway whatever it is they need to pass something yesterday. We can trade a few uni-sex toilets on college campuses and some really weird anti-abortion law. 

 

Everybody is happy. right? 

[spidermike007]

I fully support the dems, in their push for more protection and more benefits for the people, over massive corporations, many of which were looking at record profits. Give the companies loans, not grants. Give the lower and middle income people grants, and the same for small business people, who live month to month and have little in the way of savings. Companies like Shell, Apple, Google and others, that have tens, or hundreds of billions of dollars on hand do not need the help. Of course, Trump will alway be there for them, and no doubt that this bill in it's present form represents a huge corporate gift. But that does not make it right, or correct. It is about the people and the small businesses. They are the ones who will really be struggling, and they are the ones who need the most help. The dews need to improve at getting the message out there. And the GOP needs to help the people, as much as they despise the poor. 

[Chiphigh]

17 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

You seem uneducated on how things like this work.

There are always give and take in these large bills whether they are Dem. or GOP.

The title of the bill many times does not mention the small print and other negotiable items which may not actually be related to the larger bill theme.

Normal course of business.

If you are obtuse enough to think that on the brink of the most destructive economic event in your life the following stupidity is purposely inserted to feed a ridiculous ideology you have lost your mind, let alone stating that it is business as usual. 

 

Here is the part of the stupidity tried by the house:

 

Publication of corporate pay statistics by race and race statistics for all corporate boards

-A bail out on all current debt at the Postal Service

-Required early voting

-Required same day voter registration 

-Provisions on official time for union collective bargaining

-Full offset of airline emissions by 2025

-Publication and reporting of greenhouse gas statistics for individual flights 

-Retirement plans for community newspaper employees

-Federal $15 minimum wage

-Permanent paid leave

-Study on climate change mitigation efforts 

The provisions will apply to the companies and business rescued by the bill. 

 

[Chiphigh]

3 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I fully support the dems, in their push for more protection and more benefits for the people, over massive corporations, many of which were looking at record profits. Give the companies loans, not grants. Give the lower and middle income people grants, and the same for small business people, who live month to month and have little in the way of savings. Companies like Shell, Apple, Google and others, that have tens, or hundreds of billions of dollars on hand do not need the help. Of course, Trump will alway be there for them, and no doubt that this bill in it's present form represents a huge corporate gift. But that does not make it right, or correct. It is about the people and the small businesses. They are the ones who will really be struggling, and they are the ones who need the most help. The dews need to improve at getting the message out there. And the GOP needs to help the people, as much as they despise the poor. 

I noticed how you ignored these ridiculous things in the house bill 

 

Publication of corporate pay statistics by race and race statistics for all corporate boards

-A bail out on all current debt at the Postal Service

-Required early voting

-Required same day voter registration 

-Provisions on official time for union collective bargaining

-Full offset of airline emissions by 2025

-Publication and reporting of greenhouse gas statistics for individual flights 

-Retirement plans for community newspaper employees

-Federal $15 minimum wage

-Permanent paid leave

-Study on climate change mitigation efforts 

The provisions will apply to the companies and business rescued by the bill. 

[Cryingdick]

4 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I fully support the dems, in their push for more protection and more benefits for the people, over massive corporations, many of which were looking at record profits. Give the companies loans, not grants. Give the lower and middle income people grants, and the same for small business people, who live month to month and have little in the way of savings. Companies like Shell, Apple, Google and others, that have tens, or hundreds of billions of dollars on hand do not need the help. Of course, Trump will alway be there for them, and no doubt that this bill in it's present form represents a huge corporate gift. But that does not make it right, or correct. It is about the people and the small businesses. They are the ones who will really be struggling, and they are the ones who need the most help. The dews need to improve at getting the message out there. And the GOP needs to help the people, as much as they despise the poor. 

 

Apple and Google also won't ask for or receive any. They print money.

[Nyezhov]

11 hours ago, Tug said:

FYI nether did the dems till it was on the floor for the vote not it’s final version bottom line they don’t want it to be a stock buyback scam like trumps tax welfare break for the wealthy 

Please quote the exact provisions that demonstrate that. Can't? Anybody?

 

Maybe folks should try posting original anaylses instead of basicly "Rachel Maddow said, Cuomo said, Lemon said, etc." Thinking for yourself is fun! Try it! 

[Cryingdick]

5 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

I noticed how you ignored these ridiculous things in the house bill 

 

Publication of corporate pay statistics by race and race statistics for all corporate boards

-A bail out on all current debt at the Postal Service

-Required early voting

-Required same day voter registration 

-Provisions on official time for union collective bargaining

-Full offset of airline emissions by 2025

-Publication and reporting of greenhouse gas statistics for individual flights 

-Retirement plans for community newspaper employees

-Federal $15 minimum wage

-Permanent paid leave

-Study on climate change mitigation efforts 

The provisions will apply to the companies and business rescued by the bill. 

 

The post office at this point only functions to deliver junk mail. Occasionally they deliver something like your vehicle tax or the census. However it is 99% pre-approved credit card offers. With digital communication, Fed ex and Amazon the Post office doesn't really do anything. 

 

Nobody goes to the post office Amazon and Fed Ex pick it up and do it for less, and also have pick up and drop off locations. The locations stay open 7 days a week. offer generous business hours and are closer than the Post Office and treat you like a a respected customer.

 

 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Cryingdick

[rabas]

Lest we forget. In October 2008 as the Treasury Dept began to see the world's banks began to freeze on their computer screens, Hank Paulson headed a task force to develop a urgent $700 billion rescue package to literally save the world. It was ready by Monday. The world would have been saved except for Nancy Pelosi's refusal to sign.

[spidermike007]

7 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

 

The post office at this point only functions to deliver junk mail. Occasionally they deliver something like your vehicle tax or the census. However it is 99% pre-approved credit card offers. With digital communication, Fed ex and Amazon the Post office doesn't really do anything. 

 

Nobody goes to the post office Amazon and Fed Ex pick it up and do it for less, and also have pick up and drop off locations. The locations stay open 7 days a week. offer generous business hours and are closer than the Post Office and treat you like a a respected customer.

 

 

I use the post office alot. Amazon or Fedex are not capable of delivering a letter for under 50 cents. I send checks, and pay bills by mail, sometimes. Also, I can send a priority mail package for under $10. Cost three times that with fedex, and double that with UPS. In addition, the USPS is the only service that offers something bordering on reasonable, for international shipments. I have boxes shipped here a few times a year using international priority express mail, via USPS. $40 or so for a small box, and it only takes a couple of weeks. I am grateful for the US postal service. 

[Cryingdick]

1 minute ago, spidermike007 said:

I use the post office alot. Amazon or Fedex are not capable of delivering a letter for under 50 cents. I send checks, and pay bills by mail, sometimes. Also, I can send a priority mail package for under $10. Cost three times that with fedex, and double that with UPS. In addition, the USPS is the only service that offers something bordering on reasonable, for international shipments. I have boxes shipped here a few times a year using international priority express mail, via USPS. $40 or so for a small box, and it only takes a couple of weeks. I am grateful for the US postal service. 

 

You are old school and quickly becoming the minority. Paperless billing is the way to go. The USPS would never be able to provide the service to the people right now as Amazon does. Order your essentials in the next 30 minutes get FREE delivery by 2 pm tomorrow. 

 

It's apple's and oranges. Amazon also doesn't need a bail out.

[bristolboy]

14 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Please quote the exact provisions that demonstrate that. Can't? Anybody?

 

Maybe folks should try posting original anaylses instead of basicly "Rachel Maddow said, Cuomo said, Lemon said, etc." Thinking for yourself is fun! Try it! 

Well, you could try the right wing Heritage Foundation for once. They are usually gung-ho for Trump to a ludicrous degree. But even they think his bailout for big business stinks:

The Senate’s Coronavirus Bill: Bailouts, Missed Opportunities, and Positive Reforms

https://www.heritage.org/public-health/report/the-senates-coronavirus-bill-bailouts-missed-opportunities-and-positive

[Nyezhov]

6 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

 

Let's just hope the virus destroys the world. Before the dems take over and things get really bad. 

Thats so mean dude, thats so mean. ???? But, sadly true.

 

I could make all sorts of truly shocking TRUTHFUL comments about the virus and who it affects and the politics of that, but that would make me so universaly condemned that I would need to change my name to Milo. But, feel free to PM me.

[bristolboy]

53 minutes ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

More CNN fuelled nonsense.

 

Dems have voted against urgent relief because it didn't include:

Planned Parenthood funding

 

I won't go into the other ones but what the proposed bill says is to deny aid to any Medicaid-funded business not just Planned Parenthood.  Why are Medicaid funded businesses singled out during a pandemic? 

[spidermike007]

16 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

 

You are old school and quickly becoming the minority. Paperless billing is the way to go. The USPS would never be able to provide the service to the people right now as Amazon does. Order your essentials in the next 30 minutes get FREE delivery by 2 pm tomorrow. 

 

It's apple's and oranges. Amazon also doesn't need a bail out.

I like Amazon too. Their service is amazing. I do object to their packaging, which is way over the top. But, they are good. However, they are not a substitute for the guy I need to send a check to for my garage rental, nor the book I need to ship, at book rate, which is really cheap, nor the occasional package I need to ship overseas. The post office still serves a very useful function for millions every day. 

 

And let us hope none of the bailout money goes to Amazon, Apple, Netflix, Facebook, or any of the other giants that are making more money that most can count. 

[Cryingdick]

13 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I like Amazon too. Their service is amazing. I do object to their packaging, which is way over the top. But, they are good. However, they are not a substitute for the guy I need to send a check to for my garage rental, nor the book I need to ship, at book rate, which is really cheap, nor the occasional package I need to ship overseas. The post office still serves a very useful function for millions every day. 

 

And let us hope none of the bailout money goes to Amazon, Apple, Netflix, Facebook, or any of the other giants that are making more money that most can count. 

 

It's the airlines. They have never been good business. Too many risks.  Amazon basically functions as the de facto medical, food, and essential goods distributor. Google and Apple... will have more money than the government soon if this keeps up.

 

Here is what one of the greatest CEO of all time said about the company he ran American Airlines.

 

“I’ve never invested in any airline. I’m an airline manager. I don’t invest in airlines. And I always said to the employees of American, ‘This is not an appropriate investment. It’s a great place to work and it’s a great company that does important work. But airlines are not an investment.’”

 

-Robert Crandall

 

Agreed on Amazon's packaging however these days it is made out of very young trees. We have more wood pulp than you can shake a box at these days and it's sustainable.

 

 

For this maybe the government should get involved airlines will always have problems weather, war, disease, economics, fuel prices... 

 

 

The airlines have to be bailed out that isn't even in question.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Cryingdick

[metisdead]

Some off topic rambling posts and replies have been removed. 

[gamb00ler]

13 hours ago, Nyezhov said:

Have you read the bill? Good, you can help us all and provide us with each and every provision that is skewed towards big corps vis a vis working citizenss.

 

If you cant, then as usual, its just another biased rant based on someone elses thoughts.

You've invited the question....have you read the bill?  If you haven't you won't be able to tell if he has.  Who's on first?

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

More CNN fuelled nonsense.

 

Dems have voted against urgent relief because it didn't include:

Planned Parenthood funding

A bailout for the Post Office

Crippling new airline regulations

Solar & wind tax credits

Playing politics while Trump plays to beat this crisis.

Do you have a source for your claims?

48 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

If you are obtuse enough to think that on the brink of the most destructive economic event in your life the following stupidity is purposely inserted to feed a ridiculous ideology you have lost your mind, let alone stating that it is business as usual. 

 

Here is the part of the stupidity tried by the house:

 

Publication of corporate pay statistics by race and race statistics for all corporate boards

-A bail out on all current debt at the Postal Service

-Required early voting

-Required same day voter registration 

-Provisions on official time for union collective bargaining

-Full offset of airline emissions by 2025

-Publication and reporting of greenhouse gas statistics for individual flights 

-Retirement plans for community newspaper employees

-Federal $15 minimum wage

-Permanent paid leave

-Study on climate change mitigation efforts 

The provisions will apply to the companies and business rescued by the bill. 

 

The topic is the Senate bill.  I'm sure at some time or another Representatives have tried to get some of your list into a House bill, but not as stated ("Required early voting"?  As in "Voter early or you go to jail"?  I doubt it.)  However that is not the topic.

[Cryingdick]

1 minute ago, heybruce said:

Do you have a source for your claims?

The topic is the Senate bill.  I'm sure at some time or another Representatives have tried to get some of your list into a House bill, but not as stated ("Required early voting"?  As in "Voter early or you go to jail"?  I doubt it.)  However that is not the topic.

 

We can all agree the vote early bill doesn't need to be there. 

[Nyezhov]

4 minutes ago, gamb00ler said:

You've invited the question....have you read the bill?  If you haven't you won't be able to tell if he has.  Who's on first?

Nope, havent read it at all, but Im not here screeching about what is and isnt in it. Its the proponent of the idea who has the burden of proving it, not the questioner...

 

The Moon is made from Green Cheese!

Um, how do you know?

How do you know? I said it, now prove me wrong!

 

Naw, thats not the way things work. Although it does sound like the Democratic party and their media shills.

[Cryingdick]

2 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Nope, havent read it at all, but Im not here screeching about what is and isnt in it. Its the proponent of the idea who has the burden of proving it, not the questioner...

 

The Moon is made from Green Cheese!

Um, how do you know?

How do you know? I said it, now prove me wrong!

 

Naw, thats not the way things work. Although it does sound like the Democratic party and their media shills.

 

Let Pelosi drag it out. It will be her district that suffers the most. Primarily because they elected her but now for larger reasons. I can't even imagine what it is like to be stuck in a SF room with 4 roommates and you can't leave. Cough cough.

[bristolboy]

12 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Nope, havent read it at all, but Im not here screeching about what is and isnt in it. Its the proponent of the idea who has the burden of proving it, not the questioner...

 

The Moon is made from Green Cheese!

Um, how do you know?

How do you know? I said it, now prove me wrong!

 

Naw, thats not the way things work. Although it does sound like the Democratic party and their media shills.

There's plenty of evidence out there for what the bill contains. My link to the Heritage Society evaluation is just one of them. If you don't know, it's because you don't want to know. And given your political predilections, that's understandable.

[Tug]

13 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

 

Let Pelosi drag it out. It will be her district that suffers the most. Primarily because they elected her but now for larger reasons. I can't even imagine what it is like to be stuck in a SF room with 4 roommates and you can't leave. Cough cough.

She’s playing donald like a fiddle they aren’t gonna let trump and his cronies get away with a 500 billion slush fund of taxpayer money with no strings attached to do what they want with they aren’t stupid or corrupt 

[heybruce]

36 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

 

We can all agree the vote early bill doesn't need to be there. 

Is it there?  What is your source?

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Nyezhov said:

Thats so mean dude, thats so mean. ???? But, sadly true.

 

I could make all sorts of truly shocking TRUTHFUL comments about the virus and who it affects and the politics of that, but that would make me so universaly condemned that I would need to change my name to Milo. But, feel free to PM me.

I suspect, as it is you overestimate your current standing.

[Cryingdick]

20 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Is it there?  What is your source?

 

It doesn't matter. We need to reopen today. 

[Chiphigh]

2 hours ago, Tug said:

She’s playing donald like a fiddle they aren’t gonna let trump and his cronies get away with a 500 billion slush fund of taxpayer money with no strings attached to do what they want with they aren’t stupid or corrupt 

She looks remarkably partisan and ignorant. As usual the dems think there can be employees without employers. 

[RichardColeman]

Sack the whole lot and get in Kevin Spacey to get things done - least he'd do away with those holding things up