Return to Europe ....or not?

[donnacha]

Stay if you are in a living situation (reliable partner, friends, friendly neighbors, secure property, healthy bank balance etc) which you feel confident would insulate you from social unrest.

Be aware that the strict lockdown measures you are seeing in some countries, with police harassing people in walking in the countryside etc, are primarily about maintaining law and order, not about preventing infection. All countries are heading towards a full lockdown, Thailand included. 

Also, depending on age, you should be confident that you are able to take the precautions necessary to keep yourself uninfected, because the Thai medical system could get swamped more quickly than people realize. Also, if you are in a part of Thailand plagued by burning seasons, be aware that the combination of air pollution and Covid-19 could be a perfect storm.

Bear in mind that, despite what some governments are currently suggesting, this situation is likely to persist for at least two years. Some countries will have sufficient credit to keep giving their populations money. Some will not. If social order breaks down, people who are visibly foreign will be targets, so, being well-insulated is important.

 



 

Edited April 6, 2020 by donnacha

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, donnacha said:

Also, if you are in a part of Thailand plagued by burning seasons, be aware that the combination of air pollution and Covid-19 could be a perfect storm.

Burning will be over in the next week or two.

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, Londinium said:

I have a flight booked this week but don’t fancy a crowded aircraft

Hasn't the airport closure been extended?

[donnacha]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Burning will be over in the next week or two.

Hopefully, although we now have the other complication that, apparently, the wet weather could lower immunities enough to speed the spread.

 

Given that people are going to be stuck in Thailand for quite a while, along with the possibility that the next wave might be worse, settling in an area with good air, possibly even by the sea, would be a smart move.

 

[PETERTHEEATER]

17 hours ago, Logosone said:

Thailand has got to be safer.

 

Plus in the UK police are chasing people going for a walk with drones.

 

Imagine living like that.

 

I can't imagine living like that. Police harassment when I'm out walking my drone. What is the world coming to.....

[bosun]

The extension of the ban on all flights till 18/04 has given you ( more) time to reflect. Something else you may want to consider now you have time, is your longer term plans to spend time here and how much uncertainty you can deal with.. if you are the worrying type  or someone who likes things set in stone then this may not be the country to spend more time than say a long golfing holiday. 

[GAZZPA]

17 hours ago, Logosone said:

Thailand has got to be safer.

 

Plus in the UK police are chasing people going for a walk with drones.

 

Imagine living like that.

 

Rubbish. I am in the Uk and the police are not chasing down and hassling people. However if you are out and about gathering in groups and socialising outside you may be approached and you will be told to move on. For your information the press will exaggerate anything to sell papers/attract online customers and some people will believe it word for word and generalise. I would rather be in the UK for 2 reasons,, 1) you get the truth about the situation 2) healthcare is easy and free, no insurance or rip off hospital prices should you be unfortunate enough to need it. If you think otherwise then thats up to you. Good luck, stay safe.

[norfolkandchance]

I’m here for the duration. I live in Italy.

[JTXR]

A lot depends on your individual situation, of course.  What are your own specific living arrangements now in Thailand and what would they be in Europe?  Impossible to make a one-size-fits-all recommendation.  All things being equal, though, probably better to hunker down wherever you happen to be now.  Traveling anywhere right now is a nightmare.

[Aspaltso]

I can't think of a better place to be than Thailand right now with these circumstances. Perhaps an isolated island in the French South Pacific, but not too many places other than that.

[5633572526]

19 hours ago, madmen said:

Those that don't have insurance should go home if they can , it's a no brainer , could you imagine the bill after a couple of weeks in ICU?

Lockdowns will continue to get tighter here.. Slowly but surely

If you are a USA citizen with no insurance you should stay here. A couple weeks in icu here is far cheaper than the same stay in USA.

[MJCM]

15 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

For those who asked about the Covid Insurance plan, I did mine online here:

https://www.roojai.com/en/covid/

 

I saw no age restrictions mentioned.

Email confirmation of acceptance.

Policy forwarded by post.

First 14 days from acceptance invalid for claims.

(Tip: When enter the start date put tomorrows date).

 

Many of the banks are also offering similar policies.

 

 

Quote

 

1. The above insurance premiums include 7% VAT and 0.4% stamp duty.

2. The insured aged between 1 year - 99 years (current year minus the year of birth) at the date of the insurance must be completely healthy, not disabled, without any chronic disease and undergone insurance consideration.

3. This insurance policy does not cover people who are infected with Coronavirus (2019-nCoV) disease (including the condition complications) or that were before the insurance and still not cured or is a person suspected of being addicted.

4. Limit the purchase of 1 person per insured amount not more than 1 million baht.

5. Any illnesses such as coma, brain and nervous system damage or disorders, terminal illness, and or death that is a direct result from the Coronavirus where a physician has determined that there is no cure for which has been caused by coronavirus (2019-nCoV) virus.

6. Benefits and coverage are according to the policy terms and conditions. (Thai Nationals Only)

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lee4Life]

19 hours ago, jonwilly said:

Go please GO, all the defeatist should be rounded up and shipped out. Then those of us in for the long run  can get on with the job of living here without all the whining winging miserable folk.

john

Nobody's forcing you to read it.

[donnacha]

10 minutes ago, 5633572526 said:

If you are a USA citizen with no insurance you should stay here. A couple weeks in icu here is far cheaper than the same stay in USA.

My understanding is that, for this pandemic, the goal in the US is to treat everyone, regardless of insurance status.

The real factor you have to consider is not cost but the availability of ventilators. I believe Thailand has around 2,000 for a population of 70m. The USA has 170,000 for a population of 331m (so, roughly 4x the population of Thailand).

So, although the official figures suggest that Thailand is somehow avoiding the worst of the pandemic, if the numbers were to start to get worse, the medical services here could become swamped very rapidly.

Also, you have to consider the real possibility that, if there is a shortage, the limited number of ventilators may not be allocated as fairly in Thailand as in the West. It is possible that Thai families may be better at ensuring that their loved ones get one.

Anyone over the age of 50 who decides to stay in Thailand should make sure they are damn careful not to get infected.

 

[david555]

16 minutes ago, MJCM said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

!!! (?)

[condohope]

Staying 6 months in Thailand for more than 10 years now my concern is the coming back to Thailand after leaving. Covid 19 + insurance no problem but when borders are still closed how to get another one year visa extension? Hate to have papers done even in my native country, worse if you find out you need one that you cannot aquire from abroad.

[david555]

2 minutes ago, condohope said:

Staying 6 months in Thailand for more than 10 years now my concern is the coming back to Thailand after leaving. Covid 19 + insurance no problem but when borders are still closed how to get another one year visa extension? Hate to have papers done even in my native country, worse if you find out you need one that you cannot aquire from abroad.

Same reason I did not risk it to fly out June (if any available ) Thailand  home country for my every 2 years 1 month visit

[Thingamabob]

Speaking as a Brit I will be staying here. There's almost nothing I like in today's UK.

[zhounan]

Yes. Here expat is continuously harassed, Better to live a quiet life in your own country or in a country based on justice and not on oppression. In Thailand it has become almost forbidden for a foreigner to even think about start a family, you're constantly harassed until your relationships explode. Not to mention the heavy air of false tolerance that one breathes everywhere.

[spidermike007]

Not sure why anyone would want to return to one of the epicenters, at this point in time. I believe you are so much safer here. It will be just as boring back there, but infinitely more expensive, far more dangerous, and why risk it? Why risk quarantine? Better to stay put for the time being. 

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, MJCM said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Many thanks for highlighting that point.

 

Rather misleading but Item 6 also refers to the terms and conditions of the Policy.

Roojai inform me that under those terms and conditions any foreigner who has long term permission of stay for longer than 6 months is accepted. Basically those with work permits or annual extensions based on retirement or marriage are classed as residents for the purpose of the Policy.

 

The Policy does not cover those classed as Tourists.

 

Under any claim proof of the right to stay for longer than 6 months would be requested.

I have however suggested they could change their website to determine those foreigners who qualify and those who would not. 

[Lloydyboy]

54 minutes ago, david555 said:

!!! (?)

Also from the same website: #7 says different

Terms and conditions

1. The above insurance premiums include 7% VAT and 0.4% stamp duty.

2. The insured aged between 1 year - 99 years (current year minus the year of birth) at the date of the insurance must be completely healthy, not disabled, without any chronic disease and undergone insurance consideration.

3. This insurance policy does not cover people who are infected with Coronavirus (COVID-19) disease (including the condition complications) or that were before the insurance and still not cured or is a person suspected of being addicted.

4. Limit the purchase of 1 person per insured amount not more than 1 million baht.

5. Any illnesses such as coma, brain and nervous system damage or disorders, terminal illness, and or death that is a direct result from the Coronavirus where a physician has determined that there is no cure for which has been caused by coronavirus (COVID-19) virus.

6. Benefits and coverage are according to the policy terms and conditions.

7. The insured person must reside in Thailand at the time of policy issuance. In case of a foreigner, he/she must have a passport and work permit, or have resided in Thailand for more than 6 months.

 

[NoshowJones]

20 hours ago, sapson said:

On another post on here this morning news item reported private hospitals told to treat everyone for free claim if have insurance, but if not, still treated, maybe i miss read it ? seems too good to be true.

It has been well publicised, but I would assume that if it is true, then it would only apply to the Virus and not any other health problems.

[david555]

7 minutes ago, Lloydyboy said:

Also from the same website: #7 says different

Terms and conditions

1. The above insurance premiums include 7% VAT and 0.4% stamp duty.

2. The insured aged between 1 year - 99 years (current year minus the year of birth) at the date of the insurance must be completely healthy, not disabled, without any chronic disease and undergone insurance consideration.

3. This insurance policy does not cover people who are infected with Coronavirus (COVID-19) disease (including the condition complications) or that were before the insurance and still not cured or is a person suspected of being addicted.

4. Limit the purchase of 1 person per insured amount not more than 1 million baht.

5. Any illnesses such as coma, brain and nervous system damage or disorders, terminal illness, and or death that is a direct result from the Coronavirus where a physician has determined that there is no cure for which has been caused by coronavirus (COVID-19) virus.

6. Benefits and coverage are according to the policy terms and conditions.

7. The insured person must reside in Thailand at the time of policy issuance. In case of a foreigner, he/she must have a passport and work permit, or have resided in Thailand for more than 6 months.

 

So they follow government policy by contradicting themselves inside the group ….5555 no surprise so they can use the version they like at the moment , as of course the Thai version is the legall one , good luck with reading Thai....

Edited April 7, 2020 by david555

[NoshowJones]

19 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Look at it another way.

 

How many in Europe would feel safer in Thailand ……… quite a lot.

Lower infection rates.

Lower death rates.

No panic buying and queuing for essentials at the supermarkets.

You can at least take exercise whilst maintaining social distancing, due to the better climate.

 

Going back to Europe at the moment would be like jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.

 

You can get very cheap Insurance to cover Covid in Thailand. 850 baht covers 100,000 in medical bills and 1,000,000 in the event of death to a beneficiary.

Your last paragraph, what insurance company would that be, and what is the age limit?

[CMoldie]

My personal opinion is that, with very few exceptions, the safest place for anyone to stay is right where they are, wherever that may be. Travel is one of the biggest hazards, to yourself snd others.

For insurance, i suggest contacting whoever issued your existing policy and asking them to extend it. Second option is to speak to a local broker about suitable local insurance but, be warned, do not leave this until the last minute. Many policies bar claims in the first month, so you would need an overlap with your existing policy.

If you cannot get insurance, try your hardest to go home. If you try  but do not succeed, you may have some continuing cover until you can get home. Then again, you may not. You need to read the policy to know that.

[thecolonel]

4 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

It has been well publicised, but I would assume that if it is true, then it would only apply to the Virus and not any other health problems.

*everyone*?? not just thais? beggars belief....

[Tanoshi]

7 minutes ago, david555 said:

So they follow government policy by contradicting themselves inside the group ….5555 no surprise so they can use the version they like at the moment , as of course the Thai version is the legall one , good luck with reading Thai....

The wife reads Thai.

Roojai also have excellent English speakers to explain.

Nobody forcing you to take the cover if you qualify.

[Tanoshi]

10 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

Your last paragraph, what insurance company would that be, and what is the age limit?

Read the last few posts before yours.

Age limit 99.

Edited April 7, 2020 by Tanoshi

[mylesfdo]

9 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Read the last few posts before yours.

Age limit 99.

Ignore my PM pls bud I hadnt read the thread before sending!  Apologies and thanks for the info re the policy.