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Bangkok Air Pollution 2020


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2 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

And then do what?   Move?

At least you will be able to know if the air in your house is ok or not and do something to fix it if it is not ok. Same goes for your kid's school and your workplace. Most school actually have air purifiers or are willing to install them. You will also find many safe havens, such as many malls, restaurants, coffee shops, kids indoor play areas, etc. all with good air. 

 

I too am here for work and although I am seriously considering leaving, for now I try to make the best of it. 

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2 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Why would you think that?

 

I have HEPA air purifiers at home that I use regularly as needed. I also have a pair of Sndway digital PM2.5 monitors that take readings in real time.

 

I can see the indoor PM2.5 levels when we come home to an empty house. We turn on our air purifiers, and I can see the PM2.5 levels steadily drop until we get them where we want them, based on a combination of the ambient air conditions and what fan speeds we choose to use.

 

As long as they're quality units, the filters are replaced as needed and the units are sized properly for the areas you're trying to keep the air clean for, they'll perform exactly as intended.

 

I too run air purifiers at home, one in each room. They most certainly have a huge effect. The air inside is usually under 20 AQI and at the worst of times never over 40 AQI. It makes a massive difference, especially if you sleep 20-30% of your life, or like most young kids 50%. 

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34 minutes ago, JimShorts said:

Anything other than green is not safe for health, especially for young kids and older people. Yellow and orange are not be careful, they are this is unhealthy. Yellow equals unhealthy. Orange, red, purple and brown are more and more unhealthy. 

 

Jim, I think that's a matter for some judgment.

 

The actual official standard for yellow is "moderate." You don't get an official declaration of unhealthy for sensitive groups until you get to orange.

 

Personally, I keep my home levels always in the green AQI category. And I'd bit a bit wary of going outside for exercise when the moderate levels get toward the high end of that range, up toward 100 AQI.

 

But officially, the EPA authorities that make up these categories I don't think would say 50-100 AQI (yellow) is unhealthy for the general population. That's their standard, though you or I certainly can choose to be more rigorous.

 

Note the official AQI health impact statements by level:

 

Yellow:

Moderate

Air quality is acceptable; however, for some pollutants there may be a moderate health concern for a very small number of people who are unusually sensitive to air pollution.

 

Orange:

Unhealthy for Sensitive Groups

Members of sensitive groups may experience health effects. The general public is not likely to be affected.

 

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47 minutes ago, JimShorts said:

You will also find many safe havens, such as many malls, restaurants, coffee shops, kids indoor play areas, etc. all with good air. 

 

I've never found that to be the case here...

 

No. 1 - Those kinds of places typically aren't using any kind of purifier equipment other than traditional air con units. and

 

No. 2 -- Malls and restaurants have a lot of cooking activity going on, and that involves frying, baking, grilling etc etc that generates A LOT of localized PM2.5.  When I've taken my Sndway units out and around, you'd be surprised at just how high the PM2.5 levels get in some big malls. In general, they are NOT any kind of air quality refuge.

 

Edited by TallGuyJohninBKK
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18 hours ago, mickey rat said:

When breathing is unhealthy it's an issue for us and I'm no idiot. 😉

 

However, we will be wearing masks until we leave mid February. Don't care <deleted> it looks like or what people think. But, I do feel sorry for the ignorant and those with no other option. 

 

 

Thailand is unhealthy. Why did you bother to step off the plane?

 

Air is never going to get better so all I can do is plan the exit strategy. The question is why you came in the first place. Air has been horrible two years running.

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15 hours ago, edwardandtubs said:

Why not pin this one instead:

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1021518-bangkok-air-pollution/

 

It's a treasure trove of information about Bangkok air pollution and how to protect yourself from it.

Best way to protect yourself...

 

Leave.

 

If it REALLY bothers you mentally or physically why would you stay? You cannot possibly plan to live the balance of your life under a mask?! Really don't understand people.

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1 hour ago, Number 6 said:

Best way to protect yourself...

 

Leave.

 

If it REALLY bothers you mentally or physically why would you stay? You cannot possibly plan to live the balance of your life under a mask?! Really don't understand people.

What other people choose to do seems to be bothering you mentally. Why would you care if I wear a mask? I'm perfectly happy living here but something seems to be making you unhappy.

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5 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Jim, I think that's a matter for some judgment.

 

The actual official standard for yellow is "moderate." You don't get an official declaration of unhealthy for sensitive groups until you get to orange.

 

Personally, I keep my home levels always in the green AQI category. And I'd bit a bit wary of going outside for exercise when the moderate levels get toward the high end of that range, up toward 100 AQI.

 

But officially, the EPA authorities that make up these categories I don't think would say 50-100 AQI (yellow) is unhealthy for the general population. That's their standard, though you or I certainly can choose to be more rigorous.

 

Note the official AQI health impact statements by level:

 

Yellow:

Moderate

Air quality is acceptable; however, for some pollutants there may be a moderate health concern for a very small number of people who are unusually sensitive to air pollution.

 

Orange:

Unhealthy for Sensitive Groups

Members of sensitive groups may experience health effects. The general public is not likely to be affected.

 

Yes it depends on the source. Many studies question the "safe" levels set by the EPA. The WHO states no level is safe and that exposure should not exceed an average of 25µg/m3 (78 AQI) in a 24-hour period which is almost exactly in the middle of the yellow. They also state exposure should not exceed an average of 10µg/m3 (42 AQI) in an annual period, which is green. 

 

The fact is no level of PM2.5 is safe. Any exposure causes health issues:

https://www.downwindersatrisk.org/2017/07/new-harvard-study-there-is-no-safe-level-of-exposure-to-smog-or-particulate-matter/

https://www.nhs.uk/news/lifestyle-and-exercise/safe-levels-of-air-pollution-could-still-be-harmful/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/safe-levels-of-air-pollution-can-actually-be-deadly/ar-BBYIjfY

 

Also keep in mind both the WHO and the EPA recommendations are for full grown healthy adults. The numbers are exponential different for young children (especially babies) elderly, pregnant (fetus) and sick people, thus the vague "sensitive group" reference. 

https://qz.com/1166010/air-pollution-even-at-levels-that-meet-national-standards-causes-premature-death/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5480095/Even-safe-levels-pollution-damage-babies-study-finds.html

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/06/170630124346.htm

 

Also keep in mind pollutants build up in the body, so when coupled with other pollutants like pesticides, chemicals, radiation, etc. which most people are over-exposed to, the impact is greater. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I've never found that to be the case here...

 

No. 1 - Those kinds of places typically aren't using any kind of purifier equipment other than traditional air con units. and

 

No. 2 -- Malls and restaurants have a lot of cooking activity going on, and that involves frying, baking, grilling etc etc that generates A LOT of localized PM2.5.  When I've taken my Sndway units out and around, you'd be surprised at just how high the PM2.5 levels get in some big malls. In general, they are NOT any kind of air quality refuge.

 

I have taken my portable monitor to the 2 malls at Phrom Phong, when the air is bad outside (over 50µg/m3) and they both have decent air, under 20µg/m3, aside from the food courts which like you said have really bad air, usually over 50µg/m3 even when the air ok outside. 

 

Same goes for a number of coffee shops and other indoor places. The coffee shop I was at this morning the air was under 15µg/m3. 

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4 hours ago, Number 6 said:

Best way to protect yourself...

 

Leave.

 

If it REALLY bothers you mentally or physically why would you stay? You cannot possibly plan to live the balance of your life under a mask?! Really don't understand people.

Not an option for everyone. Also living anywhere is a balance of pros and cons. Staying indoors and wearing a mask for a few months each year sucks, but not necessarily a deal breaker.  Some other places you have to stay inside for 6 months and wear a mask because it is so cold. Many pros to living in Bangkok, also a fair amount of cons, air pollution being the biggest con in my mind. 

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I live on the border of Bangkok and Nonthaburi only a few hundred meters from Changwattana.

 

This morning in my house downstairs my meter showed AQI of 127 and 2.5 level of 103. It was only very very slightly higher outside.

 

Mrs J has gone off to play golf at Muang Ake, She has taken my meter and hopefully will remember to check what the level is there. If I get a reading I will post.

 

 

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18 hours ago, JimShorts said:

My bad, I did not explain myself correctly. What I was trying to say is that aqicn.org website is indeed the best measure we have available and I am thankful for the project. However the way most people interpret the AQI colors is inaccurate. Anything other than green is not safe for health, especially for young kids and older people. Yellow and orange are not be careful, they are this is unhealthy. Yellow equals unhealthy. Orange, red, purple and brown are more and more unhealthy. 

If children are more susceptible to air pollution, then they should be in masks at all times during other-than-green pollution levels. The thing is I don't think I've seen child-size masks for sale anywhere. Would the children even wear them (or be made to wear them) if they were available?

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19 hours ago, JimShorts said:

At least you will be able to know if the air in your house is ok or not and do something to fix it if it is not ok. Same goes for your kid's school and your workplace. Most school actually have air purifiers or are willing to install them. You will also find many safe havens, such as many malls, restaurants, coffee shops, kids indoor play areas, etc. all with good air. 

 

I too am here for work and although I am seriously considering leaving, for now I try to make the best of it. 

One would have to carry a PM2.5 meter to measure and verify the levels anywhere. I have done this at the FoodLand (Took La Dee) restaurants and pollution levels are actually worse than outside - probably because of the cooking. I doubt that there are many "safe havens" out there among the malls, restaurants and coffee shops and (even) the schools. If I had a child in school, I'd be verifying steps it has taken to lessen its pollution level. But what do the children do during recess? How many children are actually in effective masks these days (rhetorical question)?

 

I don't worry about it too much because I'm always in an effective mask except when I'm actually eating. I wear a mask even in my apartment's un-air-purified rooms because I know the pollution levels in those rooms are essentially the same as outside. I keep only one "clean room", my bedroom of around 15 m2. I try to keep the levels at < 5 mcg/m3 there. My biggest nightmare is falling asleep and breathing 100 mcg/mfor several hours as do (apparently) most of the residents of Bangkok during "unhealthy/red" hours. I personally consider anything greater than a very clean "green" level to be unhealthy, but that's just me.

 

Incidentally, since I've been wearing an effective mask full-time when out and about, my incidences of what used to be catching a cold regularly has dropped to zero (knock on wood). I also try to avoid being around people (mainly due to the noise - another pollution issue with me).

 

 

 

 

Edited by MaxYakov
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4 hours ago, JAS21 said:

I live on the border of Bangkok and Nonthaburi only a few hundred meters from Changwattana.

 

This morning in my house downstairs my meter showed AQI of 127 and 2.5 level of 103. It was only very very slightly higher outside.

 

Mrs J has gone off to play golf at Muang Ake, She has taken my meter and hopefully will remember to check what the level is there. If I get a reading I will post.

 

 

It was worse there and at 10am my drive way showed AQI of 150.....

 

Now it is 11am and AQI is 70 and 2.5 is 59...we have a slight breeze...

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