Life after coronavirus: Future of Thai tourism industry is in Chinese hands, and phones

[zyphodb]

1 hour ago, Okis said:

 

 

Here is what's faulty with the common whataboutism you are displaying. 

 

The way US act against minor countries doesn't justify China doing the same. 

 

When China acts the same, it makes the world even worse. Not better. 

 

It's not okay for me to murder or Rob someone only because someone else already does it. 

 

Yes you indeed look at it in a very mainstream way. Whataboutism is the number 1 fallacy sheeps always use to justify theirs or another country acting in a bad or dangerous way. 

 

We need less douchebag countries in the world,  not more of them. Existing douchebags doesn't justify new douchebags popping up. All douchebags are douchebags,  one douchebag doesn't make another douchebag less of a douchebag. 

 

 

I haven't noticed China killing 10's of millions of people of other countries with pretty feeble excuses why though. 

 There are douchebags and douchebags...

[CrunchWrapSupreme]

1 hour ago, Walker88 said:

Political Correctness has altered many historical names, one of which is to replace Imperialism with "Belt and Road Initiative".

You know which Empire is still alive and well in the textbooks I have to use, and some of the school certifications here. The one the sun never sets on, hmm? ????

 

I also must convince them that my Master's is just as good, if not better, than a PGCE I couldn't get since I wasn't in that Empire. ????

[drbeach]

6 hours ago, Thailand said:

There will not be many coming this year.Home tourism being promoted by China. Thais also need to look inward for tourism.

People do not want to get on aeroplanes to go on holiday and it will stay that way for some time.

Tourists, Chinese included, if they have money to travel at all this year won't be considering an overseas holiday as long as there are stringent entry requirements including quarantine. If a 14 day quarantine applies on entering Thailand and then another 14 day one is compulsory upon returning home, that's almost a month wasted without even enjoying yourself. Who in China gets 28 days off work, unless they're a business owner? Those few who thought it would be worth subjecting oneself to such nonsense, would lose their jobs in the meantime, thus making any future Thailand trips impossible.

 

I think as long as there is the prospect of stringent entry requirements, the only ones returning will be desperate expats and Thais wanting to be re-united with their families.

[ChouDoufu]

5 hours ago, baansgr said:

China's economy is down the crapper...they ain't gonna be travelling too much.

is it really?  they may not maintain the gdp rises they have over the past couple decades, but in the crapper?  any changes to the numbers we've seen over the past 8 weeks are temporary blips.  no telling what things will look like on the other side.

 

i'm sure some regions will be hit harder than others.  shenzhen may see some factory closures, or maybe not.  maybe they'll switch to products for domestic consumption, or switch target countries, or produce covid19 and covid20 vaccine.  other regions, here in hainan for example, have been essentially unaffected.

 

low-skilled migrant workers can be sent home to increase food production, or can be retrained.  china was planning to cut army manpower by around 50%, however that could be delayed.  and expect some massive infrastructure projects with oil and other commodities at record low prices.

[Steve Vincent]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

Tourism accounts for 12 per cent of his country’s GDP (up to 20 per cent when ancillary services are included) and provides jobs for almost one in 10 Thais, according to the International Labour Organisation.

 

But with borders closed and planes grounded across the world, this pillar of the Thai economy faces an uncertain future. The TAT’s best-case scenariois that 14-16 million people will visit this year, more than the 8.5 million projected by the University of the Thai Chamber of Commerce, but far fewer than last year’s record of 39.8 million, a figure that made it far and away Southeast Asia’s most popular tourism destination.

This is the result of putting all your eggs in one basket,. Showed contempt for the western world tourists “. Those living here have to have 800,000 baht in the bank without those foreigners living here the banks would collapse. As for wanting to get into bed with the Chinese it’s madness - more job losses will follow as Thai airways expected to go bankrupt and that will kill tourism off completely as people will lose trust ! In turn they will look for value holidays nearer to home,.as covid19 virus will leave nations struggling financially and unable to have luxury holidays abroad. Small example cost of flight into Thailand the same as 2wk all inclusive in say grand canaria - plenty sunshine and only few hours by plane

[Logosone]

1 hour ago, Trillian said:

It's the bottom line that counts and currently that is Chinese tourists in total who spend more than those of any other nation, second place doesn't matter and is over 15% lower.

 

But the real story is that the supply of Chinese tourists is right on Thailand's doorstep and they don't have to fly long haul to get there. As a result it's an easier destination that will result in increased visits per year, ditto ASEAN visitors which when combined with Chinese tourists gives local tourists a whopping great dominance over other countries.

The fact that Thailand is only a short-haul flight from China is of course part of the reason why the Chinese only spend very short holidays in Thailand and hence are in sixth place in per capita spending in Thailand.

 

ASEAN visitors spend even less than China per capita.

 

In fact if you combine European and American tourists they outspend Chinese tourists not just per capita but in total. Chinese do not actually spend that much more than Europeans.

 

The reality of tourism in Thailand is that it is a destination of global appeal and the Chinese are just one part of the puzzle. If you combine European and American tourists they outspend the Chinese. Add in Australians, Middle Eastern and African tourists the total would massively outnumber Chinese tourist spending.

 

Again, it is not correct that Chinese tourists per capita spend more than any other tourist in Thailand, in per capita spending they are in sixth place. Only as a total do they add up. That would suggest that if it is quality tourists, rather than quantity, ie those tourists that spend the most, that matter, then Thailand should focus on Mid East, European, Australian and American tourists. Not Chinese.

 

https://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism-income-Thailand.asp

 

 

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

Don't know today but twenty years ago I recall 2 such venues, both big, one just off the corner of Second Rd and Sth. Pattaya Rd, Pattaya, the other well down a soi opposite Pattaya City Hall. And I heard of more such places on Sukhumvit Road, Bkk.

 

From my understanding both venues in Pattaya had many Thai girls and boys on staff (not underage) who mixed nude with the paying clients and fondled the clients, and could be fondled. Big fee to enter and more fees for other 'activities, expensive drinks.  

 

Many Asian and western clients, some singles, some couples, and at set times the Thai staff did fxxx shows, and clients could request specific performers do private shows to watch in private rooms, for a fee, and clients could select specific performers to go with a client or a couple to a private room for a fee. 

 

How do I know, I worked in Bkk with an Aussie guy, mid twenties, he went to Pattaya every week end mostly for the above and told lots of stories re above, several times he convinced other work colleagues to go with him and they confirmed the stories he had told us.

 

The twist, we all have our fantasies/fetishes, he liked to view MF couples doing it, but he was looking actually for male performers who would agree to go to a room with him or to his hotel.  

 

Work colleagues would ask him why he didn't go to gay bars, his response was that he liked to see women and men nude and performing, but had no desire to have sex with women.

 

Maybe such places still exist today, I don't know.

 

 

Just remembered another point, a couple of times other colleagues asked 'aren't you frightened of a police raid'?

 

He responded that he asked the same question to the guys who took him there the first time, their reply 'don't worry the police are well rewarded to never visit this and other places'.

 

 

[Logosone]

1 hour ago, newnative said:

    Without tourist numbers being given for each region or country listed, your graph is rather meaningless as a way to gauge the importance of what each category contributes to Thai tourism.  

Well, I had posted the website where that graph was taken from, which contains the tourist numbers for each region. So that would suggest it is your analysis, rather than the graph that is meaningless.

 

Again, read the link:

 

https://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism-income-Thailand.asp

 

It's not just the numbers, it's also how much do they actually spend. And per capita the Chinese are in sixth place in spending. They only stay a short time when compared to American or Australian or European tourists, who when taken together also outspend the Chinese in absolute terms.

[ToddinChonburi]

The Chines unleashed a monster on the world and are now starting to financially mop up. They just purchased Norwegian air. Big military moves in the South China sea.

 

 

[ChouDoufu]

8 minutes ago, drbeach said:

Tourists, Chinese included, if they have money to travel at all this year won't be considering an overseas holiday as long as there are stringent entry requirements including quarantine. If a 14 day quarantine applies on entering Thailand and then another 14 day one is compulsory upon returning home, that's almost a month wasted without even enjoying yourself. Who in China gets 28 days off work, unless they're a business owner? Those few who thought it would be worth subjecting oneself to such nonsense, would lose their jobs in the meantime, thus making any future Thailand trips impossible.

 

I think as long as there is the prospect of stringent entry requirements, the only ones returning will be desperate expats and Thais wanting to be re-united with their families.

who has money and free time in china?

 

tens of millions of college and university instructors.  they get their salary year-round, along with payments to a special account to buy an apartment while living in campus housing rent-free.)

 

they have one month for spring festival, and two months in the summer.  i don't know of any who lost their jobs due to the virus, as most schools simply went with online classes.

 

many of the chinese teachers i've dated have visited thailand on "zero-dollah" tours, coming back with two suitcases of duty-free items, and thousands of selfie shots.  every one of them, no exception, loved the ladyboy shows.  none of them partook (or didn't admit to) in happy-end soapy massages or sex with poor rice farmers.

 

local government hospitals offer covid19 testing for the equivalent of 1000 baht.  travel insurance that covers covid19 treatment is available, and is cheap enough....about $50 bucks for two weeks from western companies.  i'm sure some chinese insurance carrier will jump at the chance to sell policies.

 

drop the quarantine and they will come.

 

 

[Asernume]

1 hour ago, DirtyFarang said:

So quickly they forget who gave us this virus in the first place.

 

If Thailand started treating ALL foreigners decently again, as they did before the coup against Thaksin, things might turn around.  The virus is just the capper on a long sting of mistreatment and insults.  They vulgar Chinese are not affected much by the mistreatment; they get it as home.  But Western folks don't cotton to it.

 

But to put yourself in the hands of the Chinese.  Wow, talk about a Faustian agenda!

The Chinese have no problem being mistreated by their totalitarian government that's true, but they would never accept such thing coming from a foreign people. This is what their government teaches them and that's why the Chinese government will demand apologies anytime a Chinese citizen gets "mistreated", weak cowardly governments generally cave in front of the Chinese bully and apologize.

Government of western nations generally couldn't care less if their own citizens are mistreated in a foreign country as long as it doesn't go too far.

 

The Chinese will generally corrupt a few important people at the top with a lot of money, which works well in societies where a few have all the power. One of the thing they will require is that Chinese citizen are treated well, not that the CCP cares about the well-being of Chinese citizens, but they are a symbol of China when abroad and therefore should be respected. They also want to make sure Chinese citizen will feel like ubermenschen and therefore never get the silly idea that they could learn something from other countries they are visiting.

Corrupt leaders in the hand of the China will spend a great deal of time to make their population believe that China is a great country that will bring economic prosperity to all, a lie.

 

Good recent quotes from the last British governor of Hong Kong:

“We should stop being fooled that somehow at the end of the all the kowtowing there’s this great pot of gold waiting for us. It’s always been an illusion,” Patten said.
“We keep on kidding ourselves that unless we do everything that China wants we will somehow miss out on great trading opportunities. It’s drivel.”

[Oziex1]

The Chinese are trying to fight off a global enquiry into how they let the virus out, are they ready to unleash their hords across borders?

[Walker88]

2 hours ago, marqus12 said:

I think that such stupid propaganda won't do much in the long run
Offer investments, your own belt & road version and compete economically

with the Chinese.
But you are so full of pride and used to getting everything for free that you

are not mentally able to do it..

Not sure what I got for free. Did the US get Canada? Saudi Arabia? Am I the Burgermeister of Koh Samui? Where's my decorative stationary?

 

Yes, the US has made some bad mistakes, but on balance has also done a lot of good things, and if you think the BRI is without fault, you are deluding yourself or engaging in your own 'stupid propaganda'.

 

I have personally seen the Belt and Road Initiative at work in Myanmar. Pay off the generals and then abuse the locals and the environment purely for China. China has engaged in slash and burn timber harvesting in Kachin State, open pit mining of a variety of resources, damming the confluence of the two rivers meeting at Myitsone (which resulted in the forced movement of 15,000 Kachin people and provided a total of 2 jobs to Myanmars---Lo Hsing Han and his son Steven Law---while China imported 100,000 Chinese laborers to do the work) until the KIA attacked a few Chinese engineers and scared off the dam builders. Oh, and every last kilowatt of generated power was to go to China. For gold mining, Chinese companies used a cyanide leaching process. The cyanide got into the ground water, killing wildlife and people. Other Chinese Govt owned companies used mercury. They did hire a few Myanmar for that, where workers kneaded mercury by hand into a slurry to leach out the gold.  Do you know the genesis of the Mad Hatter? That's the result of Hg exposure.

 

The BRI is hardly noble. Your defense of it might qualify as 'stupid propaganda'.

Edited May 25, 2020 by Walker88
add

[sambum]

8 hours ago, Thailand said:

There will not be many coming this year.Home tourism being promoted by China. Thais also need to look inward for tourism.

People do not want to get on aeroplanes to go on holiday and it will stay that way for some time.

Plus the extra cost of getting on aeroplanes will be a big  deterrent, because you can guarantee that once the airlines are up and running again, they won't be reducing their prices to attract customers!

 

[bangrak]

4 hours ago, newnative said:

  Wondered when the ridiculous zero dollar tourism canard would appear--as it always does with a tourism thread.   Guess you missed the part about 1 in 10 Thais being employed by tourism.  If zero dollars stay in Thailand, how are these 1 in 10 Thais being paid?

Obviously, you were never informed (or didn't understand) how the "0$" works, as it does, believe it or not. Look it up by yourself in a hurry when you want to avoid posting such ... stuff as here above! Thanks

[newnative]

17 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Well, I had posted the website where that graph was taken from, which contains the tourist numbers for each region. So that would suggest it is your analysis, rather than the graph that is meaningless.

 

Again, read the link:

 

https://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism-income-Thailand.asp

 

It's not just the numbers, it's also how much do they actually spend. And per capita the Chinese are in sixth place in spending. They only stay a short time when compared to American or Australian or European tourists, who when taken together also outspend the Chinese in absolute terms.

    It would have been helpful for your post if you had included all the graphs to get the full picture, rather than just the one that supported your argument.  You're right, it's important how much 'they actually spend.'  The figure I find most meaningful and important, and apparently Thailand does as well, is tourists from China 'actually spend' more, by far, than any other country.  You have to put ALL the countries of Europe together to get a very distant second place.  

    And, yes, you are right that it is not always 'just the numbers...'.   However, in this case I think it is--the sheer numbers we're talking about.  Africa looks wonderful on your graph, with spending of over 70,000 baht per tourist, much more than an average Chinese tourist.  My goodness, African tourists must be one of the most important tourist segments to Thailand's tourism bottom line.  Over 70,000 baht per tourist!  But, their actual contribution, what they 'actually spend' in total,  is teeny tiny in comparison to China.  

[holy cow cm]

36 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

Pay off the generals

That is exactly correct. If carefully done and hidden, even here.

[DJ54]

What’s that bread in one basket thing... IMO they should not market to one country.. it might turn others away...

[holy cow cm]

As the rest of the world is going Anti chia and Chinese, Thailand does a stupendous job of sucking up to them. I for one and not looking forward to seeing them in mass anymore. I have had quite my fill that would last me five lifetimes now.

[sambum]

5 hours ago, Geoffggi said:

True, there is a small contribution to the grass roots of Thai society but the overall information is deceiving the public into thinking the Chinese are the saviours of all but they are not, it has been reported many times that the working class Thais want the farang back as they were the biggest contributor to the common Thai survival that consists of small shop keepers, small bar and restaurant owners etc. a fact the government continues to ignore ......!!!

Correct - how often do you see Chinese in the small shops, bars or restaurants? 

 

They come in their hordes, but stay in their hotels, and scramble for the "all you can eat" buffets, and spend very little to help the local economies, except a few baht in 711 on Pot Noodles!

 

Of course, all this means absolutely NOTHING to TAT, whose only concern is NUMBERS - the financial benefits or otherwise are not their concern - only "a Tourist Authority of Thailand spokesman reports that tourist figures are UP **% from last month". 

Edited May 25, 2020 by sambum

[newnative]

17 minutes ago, bangrak said:

Obviously, you were never informed (or didn't understand) how the "0$" works, as it does, believe it or not. Look it up by yourself in a hurry when you want to avoid posting such ... stuff as here above! Thanks

You didn't answer my question.  If 1 in 10 Thais are employed by tourism, how are they being paid if 'zero tourism dollars' stay in Thailand?

[Lacessit]

5 hours ago, Geoffggi said:

True, there is a small contribution to the grass roots of Thai society but the overall information is deceiving the public into thinking the Chinese are the saviours of all but they are not, it has been reported many times that the working class Thais want the farang back as they were the biggest contributor to the common Thai survival that consists of small shop keepers, small bar and restaurant owners etc. a fact the government continues to ignore ......!!!

IMO the contribution of Chinese tourism is over-estimated, and goes into the pockets of the big end of town.

Several shopkeepers I know in Chiang Mai have gone to the extent of refusing service to Chinese tour groups, because so much of their time is wasted.

It's curious how, when dealing with Chinese people in a one-on-one situation, they are polite and helpful. Put them in a large group, and they become pack animals.

[Deli]

The Chinese are definitely the last ones I would like to see back here. Has everbody forgotten that it was them who brought this misery to the world. Instead of condeming them, again they get the red carpet. And the Westerners a kick in the butt.

[newnative]

4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

IMO the contribution of Chinese tourism is over-estimated, and goes into the pockets of the big end of town.

Several shopkeepers I know in Chiang Mai have gone to the extent of refusing service to Chinese tour groups, because so much of their time is wasted.

It's curious how, when dealing with Chinese people in a one-on-one situation, they are polite and helpful. Put them in a large group, and they become pack animals.

     Well, I don't know about CM but here in Pattaya it is clearly evident right now how important the Chinese tourists are to the local economy--both those in tour groups and the independent travelers.  

[marqus12]

51 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

Not sure what I got for free. Did the US get Canada? Saudi Arabia? Am I the Burgermeister of Koh Samui? Where's my decorative stationary?

 

Yes, the US has made some bad mistakes, but on balance has also done a lot of good things, and if you think the BRI is without fault, you are deluding yourself or engaging in your own 'stupid propaganda'.

 

I have personally seen the Belt and Road Initiative at work in Myanmar. Pay off the generals and then abuse the locals and the environment purely for China. China has engaged in slash and burn timber harvesting in Kachin State, open pit mining of a variety of resources, damming the confluence of the two rivers meeting at Myitsone (which resulted in the forced movement of 15,000 Kachin people and provided a total of 2 jobs to Myanmars---Lo Hsing Han and his son Steven Law---while China imported 100,000 Chinese laborers to do the work) until the KIA attacked a few Chinese engineers and scared off the dam builders. Oh, and every last kilowatt of generated power was to go to China. For gold mining, Chinese companies used a cyanide leaching process. The cyanide got into the ground water, killing wildlife and people. Other Chinese Govt owned companies used mercury. They did hire a few Myanmar for that, where workers kneaded mercury by hand into a slurry to leach out the gold.  Do you know the genesis of the Mad Hatter? That's the result of Hg exposure.

 

The BRI is hardly noble. Your defense of it might qualify as 'stupid propaganda'.

My God! Before, we only had Wu Mao in this small forum
Now also Wu Trump...555
Your posts are too long and they are boring, not convincing

Have a nice writing. Shalom !

[Logosone]

21 minutes ago, newnative said:

     Well, I don't know about CM but here in Pattaya it is clearly evident right now how important the Chinese tourists are to the local economy--both those in tour groups and the independent travelers.  

The Chinese tourists are important to the local economy in CM, however, they are not the only important tourist group. They are just one of several important groups. In per capita spending the Chinese lag behind Middle Eastern, American, Australian, European and African tourists. They only stay for short time periods, as opposed to Europeans, Americans and Middle Eastern tourists who stay longer and spend more.

 

That's not to say that Chinese tourists are not important, due to sheer numbers they play an important role, but they alone would not be enough to save Thailand's tourism, which depends even more heavily on American, Australian and European tourists.

[gerritkaew]

yes Chinese good for business, come on over and bring corona to thailand and the rest off the world, good job

[bkk6060]

37 minutes ago, newnative said:

     Well, I don't know about CM but here in Pattaya it is clearly evident right now how important the Chinese tourists are to the local economy--both those in tour groups and the independent travelers.  

Yes, it has surprised me some.  It is deader then dead here.  Kind of nice in some ways noise levels way down near the beach and no crowds.  But, business people and workers are suffering big time.  I would say 75% of GDP here the past few years has been based on Chinese presence.  The locals cannot support this place but after all, it is a tourist town and without them no way Pattaya survives to anything close to what it was.

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed.

 

An offensive post has been reported and removed. 

[Redvic]

9 hours ago, scorecard said:

I suspect the tourist spending is really the point including tourists from any country.

 

But the reality is that tourists from China come to LOS in very big numbers and that equates to massive funds coming coming into the Thai economy from spending, accommodation, ground travel etc. Much much bigger than any other country.

 

Incoming tourism generates about 20% all funds coming into the Thai economy, a massive slice of these funds come from China.

 

Also important, tourism (massive numbers from China) directly/indirectly provides paid work for around 3 million Thai people. That money feeds and clothes Thai families and pays school fees, puts gasoline in the tank of the family motorcycle etc.  

 

 

You must be chinese because you are talking 100% <deleted>. They spend very little in Thailand all planned and paid in china. They are like a plague wherever they go destroy and leave the place like a <deleted>house. 

Edited May 25, 2020 by Redvic