What are the odds of a Schengen visa?

[JHicks]

I'm not expecting to be able to get into Thailand for a good few months and was wondering about inviting someone to come over to Europe for a few weeks, maybe to Spain or Greece but it doesn't matter that much really. I'm not sure whether the borders are open to Thais just now, but if they're not I expect they soon will be, so I'm focusing on the visa situation. I've read the sticky - the reason for the trip would be that I can't go to Thailand as planned, so will be heading to Europe and would like her to come with me. She's always wanted to see it and there won't be a better time. She's 28 and has family ties to her parents and sister but no kids. She has a job in a hotel but it's fairly casual really - it's not like a career she's spent years building or anything. I have Line messages going back a couple of years showing that we have been in touch regularly in that time. She came to Ho Chi Minh to see me one time and went home afterwards, but I get that that's not really the same. She's never been to the west. I have bank statements etc to show that I can cover the cost of the trip.

 

Is it worth her while applying for a visa? If it's unlikely to be granted I'd rather wait it out and see her next year. It'd be frustrating to apply and start planning everything only for the application to be turned down, but if there's a decent chance I'll mention it to her and see what she thinks.

[drbeach]

Seems unfair that Thais would be allowed to visit Europe soon but not Europeans heading in the other direction. I am talking about touristic visits here, like the one you are proposing.

 

I would have thought countries would work out reciprocal arrangements between each other first.

[mike111]

It's all up in the air now but based on Bangkok Post visitors may gradually be allowed within 1...3 months. Keep an eye on the news.

 

[JHicks]

18 hours ago, drbeach said:

Seems unfair that Thais would be allowed to visit Europe soon but not Europeans heading in the other direction. I am talking about touristic visits here, like the one you are proposing.

 

I would have thought countries would work out reciprocal arrangements between each other first.

You could certainly argue that, but then I have to deal with the situation as it is and I can't really help whether it's fair or not. The other side of the argument is that from an EU point of view Thailand is an extremely low risk country, but from a Thai point of view pretty much anywhere in Europe is a high risk country. On top of that, mindsets are very different - so I'm not that surprised to see the EU announcing that it's going to open up to low risk countries in the coming weeks, when Thailand is being much more cautious.

 

The risk on the Thai side is more that if she left she'd have to do 2 weeks quarantine on return, I guess.

 

Anyway, I'd still like to know the odds of getting a visa. I don't think it costs that much to apply so we could just try and see, but I don't want to get her hopes up if it doesn't fly.

[micmichd]

On 6/23/2020 at 12:21 AM, drbeach said:

Seems unfair that Thais would be allowed to visit Europe soon but not Europeans heading in the other direction. I am talking about touristic visits here, like the one you are proposing.

 

I would have thought countries would work out reciprocal arrangements between each other first.

If it would be really reciprocal then Thais shouldn't need a visa for the Schengen area at all if they stay no longer than 4 weeks. 

[khunPer]

On 6/22/2020 at 6:57 PM, JHicks said:

Is it worth her while applying for a visa? If it's unlikely to be granted I'd rather wait it out and see her next year. It'd be frustrating to apply and start planning everything only for the application to be turned down...

Visa will be under Schengen rules. You have, or rather your friend has two options.

 

The one option is an invitation from you, based on a letter with the invitation, where you are financial guarantor and show proof of income, or savings, and proof of home with space enough. Furthermore your friend need to show some funds of her own, that she has a work and ties to Thailand, so she will return and not try to stay in a Schengen country – that's often the most important part – and finally, when a visa is granted, shows a return ticket and travel insurance.

 

The other option is a tourists visa, which require your friend to show funds, tie to Thailand, as above, a detailed travel agenda, bookings of hotel(s) and/or room(s) for the whole trip – or an invitation if a private stay, which could be checked by local authorities before granting a visa – and a return ticket and travel insurance when collecting a granted visa.

 

Your friend shall apply for visa in the embassy of the country of arrival, or the country with the longest Schengen-stay. Check with each possible country's actual demands and expected handling time for visa, which could be several weeks.

 

I have tried both methods with success, however the tourists visa was the most difficult – the rooms should be prepaid, so not only a reservation that could be cancelled – I had to use tourist visa when I had moved out to Thailand, and therefore no longer a home inside Schengen, when my girlfriend and I wished to visit Europe.

 

Wish you good luck with your plan...????

[Bogbrush]

Your main sticking point is probably the flight; until you can book firm then you can’t proceed as the tickets are required for the application. You appear to be planning to meet on ‘neutral’ ground so presumably will be using an hotel (booking obviously required) so it sounds like a pretty straightforward tourist visit requiring the above two, plus photo, travel insurance, Letter showing proof of funds in Thai bank and proof of residence.

 

The ‘hidden’ problem is getting an appointment at the relevant embassy; I applied for Greece in March and they were offering dates in July. 

[Letseng]

On 6/22/2020 at 7:21 PM, drbeach said:

Seems unfair that Thais would be allowed to visit Europe soon but not Europeans heading in the other direction. I am talking about touristic visits here, like the one you are proposing.

 

I would have thought countries would work out reciprocal arrangements between each other first.

At present some countries may be open to Non-EU citizens, some are not officially. You may need to quarantine and C19 neg. test.

While Austria isn't open a Pakistani arrived last week via Doha, travelled across Austria and fell ill with C19. How he got in without test etc. go figure.

[mike111]

Folllow up on my reply - foreigners being allowed entry:

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1940456/green-light-for-foreigners

 

 

[stouricks]

On 6/22/2020 at 11:57 PM, JHicks said:

I have Line messages going back a couple of years 

Why would you keep messages for that length of time. Do you go back and read them again thinking 'Aww she really does love me'

Old saved messages on a phone have caused more break-ups when found than promoting true love

[JHicks]

2 hours ago, khunPer said:

Visa will be under Schengen rules. You have, or rather your friend has two options.

 

The one option is an invitation from you, based on a letter with the invitation, where you are financial guarantor and show proof of income, or savings, and proof of home with space enough. Furthermore your friend need to show some funds of her own, that she has a work and ties to Thailand, so she will return and not try to stay in a Schengen country – that's often the most important part – and finally, when a visa is granted, shows a return ticket and travel insurance.

 

The other option is a tourists visa, which require your friend to show funds, tie to Thailand, as above, a detailed travel agenda, bookings of hotel(s) and/or room(s) for the whole trip – or an invitation if a private stay, which could be checked by local authorities before granting a visa – and a return ticket and travel insurance when collecting a granted visa.

 

Your friend shall apply for visa in the embassy of the country of arrival, or the country with the longest Schengen-stay. Check with each possible country's actual demands and expected handling time for visa, which could be several weeks.

 

I have tried both methods with success, however the tourists visa was the most difficult – the rooms should be prepaid, so not only a reservation that could be cancelled – I had to use tourist visa when I had moved out to Thailand, and therefore no longer a home inside Schengen, when my girlfriend and I wished to visit Europe.

 

Wish you good luck with your plan...????

Thanks. I am a UK passport holder so I think it has to be the tourist route. The rooms may not be a massive problem as I will go anyway, so it's just a case of adding her on the booking. If paying for the flight can be put off, that's the main thing. Good to know someone has had success with this route.

2 hours ago, Bogbrush said:

Your main sticking point is probably the flight; until you can book firm then you can’t proceed as the tickets are required for the application. You appear to be planning to meet on ‘neutral’ ground so presumably will be using an hotel (booking obviously required) so it sounds like a pretty straightforward tourist visit requiring the above two, plus photo, travel insurance, Letter showing proof of funds in Thai bank and proof of residence.

 

The ‘hidden’ problem is getting an appointment at the relevant embassy; I applied for Greece in March and they were offering dates in July. 

I think you can book firm, but the airline can still cancel. I have a flight to Thailand booked in August - I'm sure I won't be on it (it's a flex fare and I will eventually use the ticket) but it's not a provisional booking. I hadn't initially picked up on the fact that you have to pitch up in person at the embassy. That's quite a trip if you live near Sukhothai and the application is a gamble.

13 minutes ago, stouricks said:

Why would you keep messages for that length of time. Do you go back and read them again thinking 'Aww she really does love me'

OK you got me... but then I have messages from the cleaner from 2 years ago as well - hopefully she doesn't love me ;-)

[stouricks]

13 minutes ago, JHicks said:

Thanks. I am a UK passport holder so I think it has to be the tourist route. The rooms may not be a massive problem as I will go anyway, so it's just a case of adding her on the booking. If paying for the flight can be put off, that's the main thing. Good to know someone has had success with this route.

I think you can book firm, but the airline can still cancel. I have a flight to Thailand booked in August - I'm sure I won't be on it (it's a flex fare and I will eventually use the ticket) but it's not a provisional booking. I hadn't initially picked up on the fact that you have to pitch up in person at the embassy. That's quite a trip if you live near Sukhothai and the application is a gamble.

OK you got me... but then I have messages from the cleaner from 2 years ago as well - hopefully she doesn't love me ????

And has she finally come round to clean?    PML  555

[sandyf]

On 6/23/2020 at 6:38 PM, JHicks said:

Anyway, I'd still like to know the odds of getting a visa. I don't think it costs that much to apply so we could just try and see, but I don't want to get her hopes up if it doesn't fly.

You should be aware that freedom of movement is restricted at this point in time so very unlikely any applications would be accepted.

Going forward it looks like origin may be a factor, UK could be more problematic than Thailand.

 

At the same time, the Commission has recommended that the Member States should start allowing third-country nationals to enter the EU starting from July 1, gradually and partially, based on the epidemiological situation in each third-country.

These recommendations include the resumption of visa operations abroad so that the nationals of the 105 required to apply for a Schengen visa to travel to the EU, will be able to submit their applications.

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/eu-commission-lays-out-guidance-for-resumption-of-visa-operations/

[drbeach]

23 hours ago, Letseng said:

At present some countries may be open to Non-EU citizens, some are not officially. You may need to quarantine and C19 neg. test.

While Austria isn't open a Pakistani arrived last week via Doha, travelled across Austria and fell ill with C19. How he got in without test etc. go figure.

Well the other thing is, I can't see how a Thai tourist would be able to leave for Europe and then return to Thailand, if they need to apply for permission to return and then do a 2-week quarantine upon arrival back home. It would basically ensure the number of Thai tourists is basically zero. What company would allow a Thai to go on holidays to Europe (or even a business trip) and then have that person away for an unknown number of weeks?

[rasg]

Why worry about bringing her to Europe? A Thai can travel visa free to Turkey when things are vaguely back to normal. Or they were the last time I looked. Some beautiful places in Turkey.

[cerox]

I had the same Turkey idea but the Thai person will go into quarantine when returning to Thailand.

[drbeach]

On 6/25/2020 at 8:41 AM, micmichd said:

If it would be really reciprocal then Thais shouldn't need a visa for the Schengen area at all if they stay no longer than 4 weeks. 

The risk is that Thais are likely to abscond and work illegally in Europe, therefore I can't see there being a visa exemption for Thai citizens until the country becomes substantially wealthier, in other words, almost as rich as European countries are. At minimum, Thailand would have to be on par with Poland or Romania in terms of incomes before such an offer could be proposed. At the moment, most Thais are about as poor as Ukrainians, so there is some way to go.

 

New Zealand previously offered Thais visa-free entry, but when half the Thais who went to New Zealand didn't return home, NZ cancelled the visa waiver and now has strict conditions in place for Thais to seek a visa.

[varun]

I don't think the consulates with be granting Type-C visas or even accepting applications at this time.

People who have existing long-stay (Type D-work) visas as still enter Schengen with no problems.

 

Best to wait it out for a month or two more - Schengen borders are still in flux.

 

[kno77]

I see a few problems getting a tourist visa right now. First how to apply while VSF global offices are still not open. I have no experience with the Embassy of the UK but for Schengen Embassies they won't issue any tourist or family visit visa right now. Maybe the next month but my guess is not earlier then august 1st. Again just guessing. Also how the UK or the Schengen would react if Thailand refuses entry to their citizens while Thai people can visit the UK or a Schengen country. 

 

Choosing what's the best visa it depends. My Thai gf got a tourist first. later I preferred the family visit option. The paperwork ain't the main issue. Proof that your GF will return is the most difficult part. Proof of property (car,house) , family ( children, sick parents) or a job ( proof of a contract)  can help. Dumping a lot of money on her bankbook will sometimes cause suspicion. 

 

Finally there aren't many regular flights out of thailand right now. It seems that Thailand is keeping their citizen in a lockdown. Finally keep in mind that the moment your Thai gf will return she might have to stay at hotel for 14 days at her own expenses before being allowed to return home. 

 

Anyway I am in a similar situation so lets hope for the best. 

 

 

[JHicks]

On 6/26/2020 at 10:16 PM, rasg said:

Why worry about bringing her to Europe? A Thai can travel visa free to Turkey when things are vaguely back to normal. Or they were the last time I looked. Some beautiful places in Turkey.

That is not a bad idea at all. I just have no concept of whether we'd be able to distance in Turkey or whether you get crowded when you go out over there. I'm not saying you do - I just don't know. Then there's the problem raised by Dr Beach:

On 6/26/2020 at 7:26 AM, drbeach said:

Well the other thing is, I can't see how a Thai tourist would be able to leave for Europe and then return to Thailand, if they need to apply for permission to return and then do a 2-week quarantine upon arrival back home. It would basically ensure the number of Thai tourists is basically zero. What company would allow a Thai to go on holidays to Europe (or even a business trip) and then have that person away for an unknown number of weeks?

Plus immigration are well aware of that problem, so might doubt whether the plan really was to go back (or if so whether it was realistic).

[Meat Pie 47]

On 6/23/2020 at 7:38 PM, JHicks said:

You could certainly argue that, but then I have to deal with the situation as it is and I can't really help whether it's fair or not. The other side of the argument is that from an EU point of view Thailand is an extremely low risk country, but from a Thai point of view pretty much anywhere in Europe is a high risk country. On top of that, mindsets are very different - so I'm not that surprised to see the EU announcing that it's going to open up to low risk countries in the coming weeks, when Thailand is being much more cautious.

 

The risk on the Thai side is more that if she left she'd have to do 2 weeks quarantine on return, I guess.

 

Anyway, I'd still like to know the odds of getting a visa. I don't think it costs that much to apply so we could just try and see, but I don't want to get her hopes up if it doesn't fly.

Europe is a country? I thought it was a continent.

[JHicks]

6 hours ago, kno77 said:

I see a few problems getting a tourist visa right now. First how to apply while VSF global offices are still not open. I have no experience with the Embassy of the UK but for Schengen Embassies they won't issue any tourist or family visit visa right now. Maybe the next month but my guess is not earlier then august 1st. Again just guessing. Also how the UK or the Schengen would react if Thailand refuses entry to their citizens while Thai people can visit the UK or a Schengen country. 

 

Choosing what's the best visa it depends. My Thai gf got a tourist first. later I preferred the family visit option. The paperwork ain't the main issue. Proof that your GF will return is the most difficult part. Proof of property (car,house) , family ( children, sick parents) or a job ( proof of a contract)  can help. Dumping a lot of money on her bankbook will sometimes cause suspicion. 

 

Finally there aren't many regular flights out of thailand right now. It seems that Thailand is keeping their citizen in a lockdown. Finally keep in mind that the moment your Thai gf will return she might have to stay at hotel for 14 days at her own expenses before being allowed to return home. 

 

Anyway I am in a similar situation so lets hope for the best. 

 

 

 

12 hours ago, varun said:

I don't think the consulates with be granting Type-C visas or even accepting applications at this time.

 

You can apply to a few countries "in anticipation of the current restrictions being lifted". At least one (Estonia) is taking postal applications. I would think external borders will be open by 1 Aug and am sure Thailand will be on the whitelist because of the low incidence over there, but yeah there's the problem of what happens on return. There's been a bit of "if you're not having our people we're not having yours" but that's really been internal squabbling and I think the member states would follow EU guidance when it came to Thailand. If it's harder for Thais to get into the EU a couple of months from now than it normally is, it will be because EU immigration authorities aren't clear on how they're going to be able to get back to Thailand.

[CLS]

Thailand is on the EU+ safe countries list.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53222356

[kno77]

Indeed

14 hours ago, CLS said:

Thailand is on the EU+ safe countries list.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53222356

Indeed but how will the EU react if THailand will not open their borders? 

[spiekerjozef]

Otherwise I couldn't see a problem.

But in the current situation, probably better not to travel at all.

[Maestro]

On 6/30/2020 at 3:14 PM, kno77 said:

Indeed

Indeed but how will the EU react if THailand will not open their borders? 

 

The EU has agreed to open the borders to Thai nationals without the requirement that Thailand do the same for the nationals of EU member states.

[drbeach]

9 hours ago, Maestro said:

 

The EU has agreed to open the borders to Thai nationals without the requirement that Thailand do the same for the nationals of EU member states.

Strange that the EU has demanded reciprocity from China, but not Thailand, in this matter.

 

Aside from a few business travelers, there are FAR more Europeans visiting Thailand than China. Even in Shanghai and Beijing, you have to look hard and wide to spot a westerner, unlike in many parts of Thailand, where they outnumber locals in some instances.

[kno77]

On 6/29/2020 at 11:34 PM, JHicks said:

 

 

You can apply to a few countries "in anticipation of the current restrictions being lifted". At least one (Estonia) is taking postal applications. I would think external borders will be open by 1 Aug and am sure Thailand will be on the whitelist because of the low incidence over there, but yeah there's the problem of what happens on return. There's been a bit of "if you're not having our people we're not having yours" but that's really been internal squabbling and I think the member states would follow EU guidance when it came to Thailand. If it's harder for Thais to get into the EU a couple of months from now than it normally is, it will be because EU immigration authorities aren't clear on how they're going to be able to get back to Thailand.

Right now the situation is fuzzy. My GF tells me that airlines in Bangkok are refusing Thai tourists with a valid Schengen visa because these airlines fear that suppose there would be a second covid outbreak they cannot return on that ticket. Although some countries (Netherlands,France,Germany) are following the advice made at july 1st. Belgium,Italy,Hungary and Denmark closed their borders for tourists outside Schengen countries. It seems that Austria is not allowing transits. All rumours. The german embassy in Bangkok is clear. No tourists unless regular flights are starting. Their VSF global still closed. My guess after august 1st. 

[kno77]

On 7/7/2020 at 12:02 PM, kno77 said:

Right now the situation is fuzzy. My GF tells me that airlines in Bangkok are refusing Thai tourists with a valid Schengen visa because these airlines fear that suppose there would be a second covid outbreak they cannot return on that ticket. Although some countries (Netherlands,France,Germany) are following the advice made at july 1st. Belgium,Italy,Hungary and Denmark closed their borders for tourists outside Schengen countries. It seems that Austria is not allowing transits. All rumours. The german embassy in Bangkok is clear. No tourists unless regular flights are starting. Their VSF global still closed. My guess after august 1st. 

Today I got a confirmed story of a Thai with a Schengen Visa short stay (issued earlier before Corona) who arrived at Amsterdam airport. She was not stopped when checking in at Bangkok airport.