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phetchy

Possible blacklisting/deporting for overstay

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A ‘what if?’ scenario.

 

I have a longtime friend who lives a couple of k’s from me on the Dark side of Pattaya.

He’s been here for 20 years; he’s 90 years old and is dependent on others for his mobility and all day to day necessities.  For the last seven or eight years he’s lived alone in either ‘chalet’ type accommodation or in a ‘proper’ nursing home.  He’s moved out of the nursing home 2 or 3 times when he’s felt a bit better – until he’s fallen over or had to go to hospital and then moved back to the nursing home.  They have taken so much care of him and help him in any way they can.  They take him in a wheelchair to his local bar (200m), he calls them when he’s sufficiently pi**ed, and they come and take him back.

As of tomorrow he’s moving out again to a resort that has no-one to keep an eye on him or sort out his 90 day stuff, retirement extension paperwork, laundry, food, medicine etc etc. which was all done for him at the nursing home.  If he leaves, has a fall or a hospital visit (inevitable sooner or later), he will be stuffed if the nursing home is then full.  His son in the UK is in regular contact with him, but obviously can’t get here to sort it himself.

I do what I can for him, but he is so bloody obstinate and deaf to common sense, that I’m at the end of my tether.

Getting to the point – worst case scenario, he forgets to get his 90 days (due next week, hasn’t let me help), forgets to renew his retirement extension (November) and a further 90 days elapse so he is in overstay territory and a year or 5 out of the country looms, depending on how it’s found out.  In reality, if he leaves here before he has his last kick of the ball, he won’t be back.  He won’t voluntarily leave Thailand now, and for sure any airline wouldn’t accept him as fit to fly.  

Has anyone had or heard of such cases involving practically immobile and decrepit individuals overstaying? Is there any dispensation as far as being locked up in conditions that would likely to kill him?  I’m assuming the Embassy will do their usual paying lip service and PR thing – “we’d like to help, but…..”

It’s just the ‘deportation’ question that I am seeking help with – all good advice and suggestions for an easier life that he’s had (many), he’s ignored.

Any advice appreciated.

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Missing a 90 day report is not an overstay. At the most it is a 2000 baht fine for being late doing it.

His 90 day report is not required at the this until after July 31st since the are included in the amnesty.

A overstay can only occur if he does not apply for his extension of stay by the day it ends.

If he was unable to go to immigration for an extension he could appoint somebody to do with proof he cannot travel to immigration. 

 

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9 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Missing a 90 day report is not an overstay. At the most it is a 2000 baht fine for being late doing it.

His 90 day report is not required at the this until after July 31st since the are included in the amnesty.

A overstay can only occur if he does not apply for his extension of stay by the day it ends.

If he was unable to go to immigration for an extension he could appoint somebody to do with proof he cannot travel to immigration. 

 

He is on overstay: " forgets to renew his retirement extension (November) and a further 90 days elapse so he is in overstay territory"

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11 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Missing a 90 day report is not an overstay. At the most it is a 2000 baht fine for being late doing it.

His 90 day report is not required at the this until after July 31st since the are included in the amnesty.

A overstay can only occur if he does not apply for his extension of stay by the day it ends.

If he was unable to go to immigration for an extension he could appoint somebody to do with proof he cannot travel to immigration. 

 

Good response, what would constitute proof a letterf rom a hospital, clinic or physician ?

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My experience at CW in Bangkok is that if the 90-day report is on time, the representative just needs to have a) the passport, b) the signed report form, and c) the previous report form.   My rep was once sent home to fetch (c).   If a fine is due, though, an in-person report was required.    This can be filed very easily on line -- site says from 15 days out until the due date.  You'll need details from his passport and entry form: 

  https://extranet.immigration.go.th/fn90online/online/tm47/TM47Action.do?cmd=acceptTerm

-- Retiree

 

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24 minutes ago, RubbaJohnny said:

Good response, what would constitute proof a letterf rom a hospital, clinic or physician ?

Any of those could do it. Just short statement that is unable to travel to immigration due to his medical condition.

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1 hour ago, phetchy said:

He’s moved out of the nursing home 2 or 3 times when he’s felt a bit better – until he’s fallen over or had to go to hospital and then moved back to the nursing home.  They have taken so much care of him and help him in any way they can.  They take him in a wheelchair to his local bar (200m), he calls them when he’s sufficiently pi**ed, and they come and take him back.

That's the way I want to go phetchy.....good on him. Is he an Oz ?

 

Usually its easier to get something from IO when your in a hospital or like.....but go with what ever advice UbonJoe gives---& good luck with it all, like to see him finish his time here---when ever that is.

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20 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Missing a 90 day report is not an overstay. At the most it is a 2000 baht fine for being late doing it.

His 90 day report is not required at the this until after July 31st since the are included in the amnesty.

A overstay can only occur if he does not apply for his extension of stay by the day it ends.

If he was unable to go to immigration for an extension he could appoint somebody to do with proof he cannot travel to immigration. 

 

I appreciate that.  I understand, I'm not concerned about 90 days reporting, what I am concerned about is what will actually physically happen to him if he forgets his annual retirement extension, then after a further 90 days (if he surrenders himself) or immediately (if he's caught) deportation is on the cards. It just happens to be that 90 days is the period for both normal reporting during the currency of a retirement extension (amongst others), and the point at which a years exclusion kicks in as a punishment.   

 

As I understand it, currently you have 90 days "grace" after your retirement extension expires, after that, it's a years exclusion at least (depending on the length of overstay), or 5 years if you get caught before owning up.  I appreciate all the advice, but I am solely concerned (given his physical and mental state) with how the Thai authorities might treat a helpless old man in his possible predicament.  Getting letters from doctors or any form of assistance is not going to help.  As i said, he's totally beyond reasoning with.  I know what most must be thinking - "stupid old sod, let him get on with it" - I'm losing patience, but if no-one keeps tabs on him, he'll just get lost in the system.    

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OP, like your attitude. 

Have you considered obtaining good agent for him. He could either leave money in bank if that's what he is using or forget about money in bank. The agent cost obviously different. 

Agent can also do 90 report online. 

All done. Happy days.

BTW I have never used an agent, but I'm not 90.

Just depends on his finances

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4 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

OP, like your attitude. 

Have you considered obtaining good agent for him. He could either leave money in bank if that's what he is using or forget about money in bank. The agent cost obviously different. 

Agent can also do 90 report online. 

All done. Happy days.

BTW I have never used an agent, but I'm not 90.

Just depends on his finances

Thanks Dr Jack, but it's nothing to do with his finances.  They're not great, certainly not enough for an agent to buy his way out of trouble (allegedly}. 

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17 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

He is on overstay: " forgets to renew his retirement extension (November) and a further 90 days elapse so he is in overstay territory"

 

He's not on an overstay, you haven't read the thread properly, what if he forgets, not he forgot.

 

The OP said "Getting to the point – worst case scenario, he forgets to get his 90 days (due next week, hasn’t let me help), forgets to renew his retirement extension (November)

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20 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

He is on overstay: " forgets to renew his retirement extension (November) and a further 90 days elapse so he is in overstay territory"

I think OP is talking about November this year. 

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18 hours ago, phetchy said:

Thanks Dr Jack, but it's nothing to do with his finances.  They're not great, certainly not enough for an agent to buy his way out of trouble (allegedly}. 

If done on-time, agent-service for retirement-based extensions is 15K Baht per year or less in the Jomtien area.  Just have to get the passport to the agent, then probably ride with the agent to immigration for a photo (5 or so mins at immigration).  The agent-fee would be even cheaper if he has the 800K in the bank.

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19 hours ago, phetchy said:

I appreciate that.  I understand, I'm not concerned about 90 days reporting, what I am concerned about is what will actually physically happen to him if he forgets his annual retirement extension, then after a further 90 days (if he surrenders himself) or immediately (if he's caught) deportation is on the cards. It just happens to be that 90 days is the period for both normal reporting during the currency of a retirement extension (amongst others), and the point at which a years exclusion kicks in as a punishment.   

 

As I understand it, currently you have 90 days "grace" after your retirement extension expires, after that, it's a years exclusion at least (depending on the length of overstay), or 5 years if you get caught before owning up.  I appreciate all the advice, but I am solely concerned (given his physical and mental state) with how the Thai authorities might treat a helpless old man in his possible predicament.  Getting letters from doctors or any form of assistance is not going to help.  As i said, he's totally beyond reasoning with.  I know what most must be thinking - "stupid old sod, let him get on with it" - I'm losing patience, but if no-one keeps tabs on him, he'll just get lost in the system.    

Why is your friend moving out in the first place? If he refuses to accept help with a very simple 90 days report, what will he do in November when his extension is up for renewal? 

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