Multiple-Entry Non-O Visa Based on Marriage during COVID-19

[brain150]

11 hours ago, Eibot said:

Says who?

 

Immigration !!!

[stoicccc]

Please report if you manage, or don't manage, to get 1-year extension on NON-O while on amnesty and 60day extension used already. Cheers.

[steve187]

13 hours ago, Pravda said:

I don't want to sound like someone who's riding the high horse, but these multiple entry non o marriage visas are not meant for long stay in Thailand. 

 

I am also on this exact same visa but I have 400k in the bank ready once the immigration smartens up and tells me that these visas are not meant for long stay. 

 

So I think you will be asked to leave if there is not another amnesty or don't have the cash ready. 

they will not 'smarten up' as multi non 'O' married are for people living in Thailand, i dont see why you are on a multi visa if you have money in the bank, its a far more expensive route to take, just the visa alone is 5000thb as opposed to an extension at 1,900, unless of course you are leaving every 90 days for a work related issue

[Peter Denis]

22 minutes ago, brain150 said:

Immigration !!!

Your initial post stated > Multiple entry visas are for people who are not supposed to live in Thailand !

Yes, you are correct.

However, it is fully legal to enter Thailand on your 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa and stay the full 90-days the permission to stay stamped in your passport on entry, entitles you to. 

After those 90-days you either need to exit the country or apply for the (one-per-entry) 60-days extension of stay for reason of visiting your thai wife/dependant child.

By doing simple border-runs you can repeat the above, and when timed right this allows you to squeeze almost 17 months of long-stay out of your 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa.

But although it is tolerated by Immigration to do so, it was indeed not the intention to live permanently on such a Visa in Thailand doing the 3 or 5-monthly border-runs.

And there has been at least one case of someone whose IO refused to provide him the 60-day extension of stay, because he was 'mis-using the system' and they wanted him to apply for a regular Non Imm O Visa for long-stay in Thailand.

Also with the roll-out of the mandatory on-line system to apply for a Visa at a thai Embassy/consulate abroad, the 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa will be gradually phased out as that on-line system does not have that option.  And there are only a few thai consulates left that still issue them.

But as long as you still can apply for these 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa, it is a very attractive option because on such a Visa you do not have to deal with in-country Immigration for 1-year extensions of stay and all the associated hoops some IOs impose on such extension-applications.

[steve187]

1 minute ago, Peter Denis said:

Your initial post stated > Multiple entry visas are for people who are not supposed to live in Thailand !

Yes, you are correct.

However, it is fully legal to enter Thailand on your 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa and stay the full 90-days the permission to stay stamped in your passport on entry, entitles you to. 

After those 90-days you either need to exit the country or apply for the (one-per-entry) 60-days extension of stay for reason of visiting your thai wife/dependant child.

By doing simple border-runs you can repeat the above, and when timed right this allows you to squeeze almost 17 months of long-stay out of your 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa.

But although it is tolerated by Immigration to do so, it was indeed not the intention to live permanently on such a Visa in Thailand doing the 3 or 5-monthly border-runs.

And there has been at least one case of someone whose IO refused to provide him the 60-day extension of stay, because he was 'mis-using the system' and they wanted him to apply for a regular Non Imm O Visa for long-stay in Thailand.

Also with the roll-out of the mandatory on-line system to apply for a Visa at a thai Embassy/consulate abroad, the 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa will be gradually phased out as that on-line system does not have that option.  And there are only a few thai consulates left that still issue them.

But as long as you still can apply for these 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa, it is a very attractive option because on such a Visa you do not have to deal with in-country Immigration for 1-year extensions of stay and all the associated hoops some IOs impose on such extension-applications.

what is a ''regular non imm O visa for long-stay in Thailand.'' if not a multi entry non imm O by reason of marriage

[Peter Denis]

3 minutes ago, steve187 said:

what is a ''regular non imm O visa for long-stay in Thailand.'' if not a multi entry non imm O by reason of marriage

You are correct.

I should have written a 1-year extension of stay based on your original Non Imm O Visa.  It are the 1-year extensions of stay that are meant to be living long-term in Thailand.  But you need to start from a Non Imm O (or O-A) Visa, in order to apply for these 1-year extensions of stay.

The category of Visa (issued for reason of marriage, retirement or other) doesn't matter, nor whether the original Visa was Single-entry or Multiple-Entry.  

All those now on a 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa for reason of marriage, whose 90-day permission to stay already expired and already did use up their 60-day extension of stay for reason of visiting their thai wife/dependant child, are not able - with border closed - to do a border-run.  And hence their only option left is to apply for the 1-year extension of stay based on that original Non Imm O Visa they acquired abroad (in most cases ME for reason of marriage).

[easydoor]

Multiple entry visas are for people who are not supposed to live in Thailand !

Now they have a situation where they can enforce this quite easily.

 

It is not about whether you like it or not ... right now there seems to be no other option !!!

Just get the right visa

[bolt]

I currently hold an extensions of stay based on marriage, which expires September 29^th and I’m currently outside of Thailand.

 

The biggest issue right now is, if you leave Thailand you have a lot of paperwork to do before being allowed back in.

So my advice is change any visa to an extension of stay. Do NOT leave Thailand, no matter what appears the cost of getting the extension.

 

The cost of (re)entering Thailand as of this month and next month appears to be approx.  125,000-150,000 Baht for everything.

So whatever you can do to prolong your stay in the country I would say Do it.

[Bangkok Barry]

13 hours ago, Eibot said:

The thai government is not oblivious too multiple entry. If they want to ban them they could simply do so....

They already have, in many locations. As far as I know, even in the region there are only two places they can be obtained, and both London and Paris after demanding applications only be made on-line have no provision for a ME. Just part of the slow turning of the screw to rid the country of foreigners, along with the demand for health insurance for some that may be impossible for them to get due to their age.

 

I really don't know what Thailand has against foreigners living in the country and spending money, mostly sourced from abroad. And nor does anyone else I know. Just another example of Thai logic, I suppose.

[sandyf]

13 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

The holders of this type of visa typically have families here, have actual lives here (children etc), have stable income and live here legally, sometimes have done so for many years. They are not always able to meet the financial requirements for an extension, especially given the current situation. Now telling them all of a sudden that they will have to "get out" as if they were mere tourists raises a number of questions, both on a legal and ethical level. That is the purpose of this topic and I look forward to reading insightful comments.

Although I understand the sentiment your argument is basically flawed. Nobody has lived here legally for years on a Non O ME, you have lived legally for 90 days, and then 90 days, and then 90 days etc, the time has not been continuous. You must accept that you understood the risks of that approach when it was adopted.

As for the crisis you must also accept that the government would have been quite within their rights to repatriate everyone not on a continuous long term arrangement. I think everyone should see that the government has been quite reasonable in the way it has been handled.

 

That being said and as i said initially I understand the sentiment but various factors come into play. Some choose to use the ME visa when they could get an extension and they have to accept the pros and cons of that choice. Others however use the visa as a result of immigration policy and would certainly agree that is not as fine tuned as it should be.

When I first came to live here I spent the first 6 years on Non O ME, I had next to no income and put what funds I had into building a house rather than a long term extension, now about 12 years later I am effectively penalised by immigration for that move. When I did get my first extension in 2014 I could get a retirement extension on what pension I had but now my pension, which hasn't changed, is barely sufficient to get a marriage extension but immigration do not see "rent free" as a contribution to income. I am sure there are may here living here in similar circumstances.

I cannot blame the government for the deterioration in the £, we all know where that lies but the way immigration treats income does little to help. Last year I lost my extension because of a missing payment so trotted off to HCMC for a Non O ME and now ironically I only need 2/3 transactions for an extension rather than the 12. Currently I can move back to an extension but that could easily change if the Bojo puts his foot in it. That being the case I would have to accept the situation and return to the UK, probably for a few months until things sorted themselves out.

[Bangkok Barry]

I cannot imagine for a moment that if foreign residents with wife and maybe kids cannot leave and re-enter the country for a border run or to renew visas because borders are still closed after 26th September that they will be deported if they can't produce 40,000/400,000.

 

The worldwide outcry at what many would consider a human rights abuse would kill stone dead any reputation that Thailand still has and encourage many, including tourists and more importantly businesses, to avoid the country like the plague. Who would want to have anything to do with a country that deliberately breaks up families for no practical reason at all, except for a distrust and dislike of foreigners. That can work both ways, Thailand.

 

So forget any thoughts of unreachable (for some/many) financial demands and the threat of deportation. Ain't going to happen.

[bolt]

11 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

They already have, in many locations. As far as I know, even in the region there are only two places they can be obtained, and both London and Paris after demanding applications only be made on-line have no provision for a ME. Just part of the slow turning of the screw to rid the country of foreigners, along with the demand for health insurance for some that may be impossible for them to get due to their age.

 

I really don't know what Thailand has against foreigners living in the country and spending money, mostly sourced from abroad. And nor does anyone else I know. Just another example of Thai logic, I suppose.

that is in correct, i have previous multi entry from Singapore, and also from UAE, lots more issue them if you qualify and meet the requirments. 

[james.d]

Firstly, thank you to the contributors of this thread and I apologize if my question has been answered somewhere.

 

I have the Non IMM O multiple (5,000 Thb) based on marriage from Sawannakhet

I was due a border run on 28th April but due to lockdown I believe I'm ok until the 31st July.

 

Question.

My Non O visa is valid until 5th August, so on the 31st July do l go to the border in Kanchanaburi for another 30 days?

 

Thank you for your time.

 

[sandyf]

8 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I cannot imagine for a moment that if foreign residents with wife and maybe kids cannot leave and re-enter the country for a border run or to renew visas because borders are still closed after 26th September that they will be deported if they can't produce 40,000/400,000.

 

The worldwide outcry at what many would consider a human rights abuse would kill stone dead any reputation that Thailand still has and encourage many, including tourists and more importantly businesses, to avoid the country like the plague. Who would want to have anything to do with a country that deliberately breaks up families for no practical reason at all, except for a distrust and dislike of foreigners. That can work both ways, Thailand.

 

So forget any thoughts of unreachable (for some/many) financial demands and the threat of deportation. Ain't going to happen.

The UK regularly breaks up families and deports people without any worldwide outcry, why would Thailand be any different.

The Thai government have given 2 months notice, up to individuals to deal with that as they see fit.

 

Paragraphs A320 and 320(7B) of the Immigration Rules state that you have to leave the UK voluntarily within 30 days of your visa expiring in the UK.

If you leave the UK voluntarily after the 30 day period, you could be banned from re-entering. The length of ban will depend upon when you leave the UK, whether you left voluntarily or were deported and whether you have the funds to pay to go back to your country of origin.

If you do not leave voluntarily, you risk enforced removal by deportation.

https://www.davidsonmorris.com/overstay-in-uk/

[Peter Denis]

6 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I cannot imagine for a moment that if foreign residents with wife and maybe kids cannot leave and re-enter the country for a border run or to renew visas because borders are still closed after 26th September that they will be deported if they can't produce 40,000/400,000.

 

The worldwide outcry at what many would consider a human rights abuse would kill stone dead any reputation that Thailand still has and encourage many, including tourists and more importantly businesses, to avoid the country like the plague. Who would want to have anything to do with a country that deliberately breaks up families for no practical reason at all, except for a distrust and dislike of foreigners. That can work both ways, Thailand.

 

So forget any thoughts of unreachable (for some/many) financial demands and the threat of deportation. Ain't going to happen.

Not so sure about this...

IO will have to consider the possible consequences of the precedent they created when they would wave the financial requirements for a 1-year extension of stay because you have a thai family/children and cannot meet the financial requirements.

It would probably be dealt with on a case-by-case basis, and most probably some Examples will have to be set.

Don't get me wrong, I would be the last to approve them breaking up your family for not meeting the financial requirements, but no so sure that IO would have same considerations.

 

[Bangkok Barry]

Just now, bolt said:

13 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

They already have, in many locations. As far as I know, even in the region there are only two places they can be obtained, and both London and Paris after demanding applications only be made on-line have no provision for a ME. Just part of the slow turning of the screw to rid the country of foreigners, along with the demand for health insurance for some that may be impossible for them to get due to their age.

 

I really don't know what Thailand has against foreigners living in the country and spending money, mostly sourced from abroad. And nor does anyone else I know. Just another example of Thai logic, I suppose.

that is in correct, i have previous multi entry from Singapore, and also from UAE, lots more issue them if you qualify and meet the requirments. 

The OP was asking about the situation for those who would find it difficult to meet those financial requirements (and I've read on this site that the UAE will only grant you a visa if you are a resident of the UAE). The only places in the entire region where you do not have to have the (as the OP said, possibly challenging) financial requirement are Savannakhet and HCM City. No matter what the law says. Each office makes up its own rule (ie the 40,000/400,000 is either required by law or it isn't).

It annoys me that I can live very comfortably on 20,000 a month after buying a house here when the baht was in the toilet, yet the government demands a minimum of 40,000. Fortunately for some, a very limited number of consulates decide to ignore that nonsense for whatever reason known only to them.

[Peter Denis]

5 minutes ago, james.d said:

Firstly, thank you to the contributors of this thread and I apologize if my question has been answered somewhere.

 

I have the Non IMM O multiple (5,000 Thb) based on marriage from Sawannakhet

I was due a border run on 28th April but due to lockdown I believe I'm ok until the 31st July.

 

Question.

My Non O visa is valid until 5th August, so on the 31st July do l go to the border in Kanchanaburi for another 30 days?

 

Thank you for your time.

Your 90-day permission to stay on which you entered Thailand has already expired quite some time ago.  If you had to do a border-run on 28 April which you were not able do due to lock-down, you are already on the Amnesty extension since that date.

The borders are still closed so you cannot do a border-run.

However, the Amnesty has been extended till 26 September, so you are permitted to stay till that date.

 

If you do not want to (be forced to) leave after that date,  you need to apply at your local IO for an extension of stay.

And there are 2 options:

- Applying for a 60-day extension of stay for reason of visiting your thai wife/dependant child, if you did not already use that option as you can do that only once per entry;

- Applying for a 1-year extension of stay based on your original Non Imm O Visa, but that requires that you meet the 2-months seasoning requirement of your funds on a thai personal bank-account.

As we are already 28 July you cannot meet that 2-month requirement anymore (if you did not start with it) when using the money-in-bank method, as the latest possible date for application is 25 September.

But you can still meet the requirement by using  the monthly income transfer method, which would require you to transfer at least 40K (marriage application) or at least 65K (retirement application) in the months of August and September.  It is actually recommended to also do one such transfer in July, because some IOs - incorrectly - require 3 monthly-income transfers.

You would also need to provide evidence of the foreign origins of these transfers, and might be asked to also prove the source of the monthly foreign income you transferred.

Applying at your Embassy for a certified monthly income statement is also an option, and that option does not require any funds on a thai personal bank-account, but that option is not available for citizens of US, UK and Australia as their Embassy does not issue such statements anymore.

 

> There is also the very real risk that your local IO is not willing to handle your application for the 1-year extension of stay even when you meet the financial requirements.  Some IOs are only handling such applications when on a 'valid' permission to stay, and will not do it when you are on the Amnesty.  So better enquire at your local IO whether they would be willing to handle your application for the 1-year extension of stay when on the Amnesty.

If your IO is not willing to do so, you could first apply for the 60-day extension of stay for reason of visiting your thai wife/dependant child (if you meet that requirement) and doing so would be your life-line, as you could then apply for the 1-year extension of stay from that 'valid' 60-day permission to stay.  And it might also make it possible to make use of the 800K or 400K money-in-bank method, if you are unable to meet the 'sourcing' requirement for the monthly income-transfer method.

When not married to a thai national or with thai dependant children, and your IO is not willing to accept your appliction for the 1-year extension of stay, your only option left would then be to relocate to a different province with a more accomodating IO that would let you apply for the 1-year extension of stay, even while under the Amnesty.

Relocating would require a rental contract for a place in that other province, and with that rental contract do your TM30 (or TM27) change of address at the local IO of that province.

Physically relocating is not required, if you prefer staying in your present place, but you might need to be there during the 'under consideration' period during which your local IO might visit your place, to check whether you are actually 'living' there.

[ubonjoe]

20 minutes ago, james.d said:

I have the Non IMM O multiple (5,000 Thb) based on marriage from Sawannakhet

I was due a border run on 28th April but due to lockdown I believe I'm ok until the 31st July.

They just extended the ministerial notice to September 26th. You can stay until then now.

If you have not done one yet you could apply for a 60 day extension to visit your wife prior to September 26th to stay longer.

 

20 minutes ago, james.d said:

My Non O visa is valid until 5th August, so on the 31st July do l go to the border in Kanchanaburi for another 30 days?

At this time all border crossings are closed.  It they were open you would get a new 90 day entry if you did it before your visa expires.

[sometimewoodworker]

15 hours ago, jackdd said:

3) Let your wife take a loan so that you have 400k in the bank (if you have 30k pension per month you need just 100k in the bank)

The combination method is only available for retirement extensions. It is not available for marriage.

[james.d]

11 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

They just extended the ministerial notice to September 26th. You can stay until then now.

If you have not done one yet you could apply for a 60 day extension to visit your wife prior to September 26th to stay longer.

 

At this time all border crossings are closed.  It they were open you would get a new 90 day entry if you did it before your visa expires.

Many thanks UJ & Peter.

I will sit tight in BKK until 26th September, then l will if permitted apply for another years Non O based on marriage in Sawannakhet.

Thank you again.

[time2093]

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

I cannot imagine for a moment that if foreign residents with wife and maybe kids cannot leave and re-enter the country for a border run or to renew visas because borders are still closed after 26th September that they will be deported if they can't produce 40,000/400,000.

 

The worldwide outcry at what many would consider a human rights abuse would kill stone dead any reputation that Thailand still has and encourage many, including tourists and more importantly businesses, to avoid the country like the plague. Who would want to have anything to do with a country that deliberately breaks up families for no practical reason at all, except for a distrust and dislike of foreigners. That can work both ways, Thailand.

 

So forget any thoughts of unreachable (for some/many) financial demands and the threat of deportation. Ain't going to happen.

Unfortunately I cant see immigration showing much compassion for what your saying. They made it pretty clear to everybody that has a long stay O visa to apply to extend it for the year.. I for one is in the same boat with many others here. I'm just not taking any chances on hoping that the boarders will be open by the end of September which I highly dought it they will open up again this year.

 

I dont have the 400k to extend it and will try the 40k rout by having family transfer 40k from abroad for 2 months to my Thai account. Encase immigration wants to see source of income, I will have to figure that out some how.

Edited July 28, 2020 by time2093

[Peter Denis]

18 minutes ago, james.d said:

Many thanks UJ & Peter.

I will sit tight in BKK until 26th September, then l will if permitted apply for another years Non O based on marriage in Sawannakhet.

Thank you again.

In that case, be prepared that - if the borders haven't opened by then - that you will have to leave the country ultimately 26 September (or be on over-stay).

If you are married to a thai national or have a thai dependant child you could apply until last day for the 60-day extension of stay.

[Peter Denis]

5 minutes ago, time2093 said:

Unfortunately I cant see immigration showing much compassion for what your saying. They made it pretty clear to everybody that has a long stay O visa to apply to extend it for the year.. I for one is in the same boat with many others here. I'm just not taking any chances on hoping that the boarders will be open by the end of September which I highly dought it they will open up again this year.

 

I dont have the 400k to extend it and will try the 40k rout by having family transfer 40k from abroad for 2 months to my Thai account. Encase immigration wants to see source of income, I will have to figure that out some how.

>> I did PM you a document on how you (or in this case your family) can use TransferWise to transfer the money to your thai personal bank-account, and how to enure that you can provide immigration with the required proof of 'foreign origins' of the transferred funds.

That document is also useful even when using another means than TransferWise to transfer the funds.

 

[transam]

1 hour ago, easydoor said:

Multiple entry visas are for people who are not supposed to live in Thailand !

Now they have a situation where they can enforce this quite easily.

 

It is not about whether you like it or not ... right now there seems to be no other option !!!

Just get the right visa

What a load.....????

[time2093]

Just now, Peter Denis said:

>> I did PM you a document on how you (or in this case your family) can use TransferWise to transfer the money to your thai personal bank-account, and how to enure that you can provide immigration with the required proof of 'foreign origins' of the transferred funds.

That document is also useful even when using another means than TransferWise to transfer the funds.

 

Yes you did Peter and I thank you for that, but for me it doesin't look like Transferwife is possibility as my elderly parents who are not very computer savvy will have a very hard time figuring out how to use Transferwise as it does look a bit complicated to me as to appose receiving transfers to my Thai account from abroad the old fashion way.

[time2093]

13 minutes ago, transam said:

What a load.....????

Why is it a load, If immigration is going to stick by their guns and implement that people on Non O visas only available option is to extend their visa if the boarders dont open up any time soon its going to be real wake up call to many guys here.

Edited July 28, 2020 by time2093

[Peter Denis]

7 minutes ago, time2093 said:

Yes you did Peter and I thank you for that, but for me it doesin't look like Transferwife is possibility as my elderly parents who are not very computer savvy will have a very hard time figuring out how to use Transferwise as it does look a bit complicated to me as to appose receiving transfers to my Thai account from abroad the old fashion way.

Also when doing it the old fashioned way, the money will be coded as 'domestic transfer' on your bank-book, as it will be routed first to either Bank of Thailand or to the HQ of your local bank-branch.  The document I sent you contains information on how to get hold of the required evidence that the transfer originated from abroad (as required by IO).

[james.d]

10 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

In that case, be prepared that - if the borders haven't opened by then - that you will have to leave the country ultimately 26 September (or be on over-stay).

If you are married to a thai national or have a thai dependant child you could apply until last day for the 60-day extension of stay.

Thank you again Peter,

 

Yes, l am married to a Thai national.

To avoid confusion from my side, if the border reopens before the 26th Sept for example 1st September, do I leave the date it reopens or could leave the country maybe 24th Sept?

[mancub]

3 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Also when doing it the old fashioned way, the money will be coded as 'domestic transfer' on your bank-book, as it will be routed first to either Bank of Thailand or to the HQ of your local bank-branch.  The document I sent you contains information on how to get hold of the required evidence that the transfer originated from abroad (as required by IO).

Be most grateful if you could find the time to forward said doc to myself also .I use Transferwise but am unsure of which copy/statement my IMO ( Ubon) are likely to accept....if any !! Thanks in advance.

 

[Nong Khai Man]

20 hours ago, keith101 said:

I have already used my 60 day ext. due to the fact the amnesty came to late for me .

Me Too !! So Next Suggestion Please !!