Popular Post candide Posted August 5, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Shaunduhpostman said: https://reaction.life/we-may-already-have-herd-immunity-an-interview-with-professor-sunetra-gupta/ Also a link to another source with more from Guptera and others such as nobel laureate and Stanford professor Dr. Michael Levitt who has based on classic epidemiology modelling and prediction created by William Farr put August 25th as the date COVID19 will be essentially done with. He has been correct in his predictions about China and Sweden to his credit: https://childrenshealthdefense.org/news/lockdown-lunacy-3-0-its-over/?itm_term=home (Irony/Sarcasm alert for the first sentence) Interview with conspiracy theorist, frothing at the mouth ranting raving menace to society, Dr. Sunetra Gupta, who probably used to date Alex Jones, and as a distant secondarily important side note is a professor of epidemiology at Oxford with much in depth and complex nuance to report on herd immunity which is what, along with our own immunity, protects us from being infected by the hundreds of trillions of viruses are present in each every human body and in practically infinite numbers all around us. There is also much in this interview regarding her contention that to report death totals among vast swaths of populations such as entire nations as large as the UK, and certainly the US and other large countries, is an incorrect and inaccurate way to get a picture of what is happening with the "virus". To quote Gupta from the article "COVID 3.0- Its Over," "When you think of the US as a whole, you’re missing the fact that the epidemic appears to be over in the north east and growing in the south west. Why would you put them together? There’s no reason to lump a rise in cases in Arizona with everything else." In the article linked above, Guptera elaborates more on this and in a nutshell she says that what is happening with people's immunity and their seroprevalence levels (anything that shows up in a blood test indicating exposure to a virus or whatever is being looked for) is very different from city to country and between different areas of countries, especially as large and diverse geographically and population-wise as the U.S. So to take what I infer is Guptera's perspective, I would assume that the OP is presenting yet another skewed msm/WHO/UN/Big Pharma perspective by using US death rates as a whole to support yet another alarmist position. In another article others present what epidemiology has long known regarding how flu virus develop more slowly in warmer areas. A video that encapsulates that position based on the work of epidemiologist R. Edgar Hope Simpson: And from the interview linked above: Maggie: The expression “herd immunity” has entered the same realms as austerity and Brexit. It has become a sort of danger word because of that whole debate at the very beginning. The minute you say herd immunity, the popular newspapers say you want to kill all the old. Dr. Guptera: It’s just a technical term. It’s just a technical term for the proportion of the population that needs to be immune in order to prevent the disease from spreading, which is the central concept in vaccinations. It’s a fundamental epidemiological concept, which clearly has been subverted. I guess the fact it includes the word herd has made it easier. The truth is that herd immunity is a way of preventing vulnerable people from dying. It is achieved at the expense of some people dying, and we can stop that by preventing the vulnerable class in the process. In an ideal situation, you would protect the vulnerable as best you can, let people go about their business, allow herd immunity to build up, make sure the economy doesn’t crash, make sure the arts are preserved, and make sure qualities of kindness and tolerance remain in place. We live, it seems, in this state of terror. Yes, international travel facilitates the entrance of contagion, but what it also does is it brings immunity." The interview from Prof. Gupta is quite interesting and is worth reading. We can only hope she is right. However: - the role T cells may play is just starting to be investigated, - she is herself quite cautious and calls her hypothesis a possibility among other possibilities (other hypotheses). as any scientist does. I am also a bit puzzled about one fact. If there is a high cross-immunity from previous coronaviruses, older people would be more immune, as was the case with H1N1 or the Spanish Flu. It's not the case with Covid-19. About the lockdown issue: - one of the main aim of lockdowns was to prevent hospitals from being overloaded, and to prevent an horrific situation in which people may have died without care in hospitals' corridors. - it has been done in a context of shortage of protective and other equipment, no knowledge on how to treat this disease, and most of it nearly no knowledge about the virus itself. In this context, delaying as long as possible was a sound strategy. So lockdown has been a good decision in this particular context. It may be criticised ex-post thanks to new knowledge (I.e. Gupta's research, in case it is confirmed by other studies). PS. I don't see anything in Gupta's interview supporting any conspiracy theory. Edited August 5, 2020 by candide 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 A post with misinformation has been removed and the replies. Sadly, numerous members put some time and effort into their reasonable replies. Continued posting of false information will result in suspensions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Credo Posted August 5, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 5, 2020 3 hours ago, Siamjim said: however again we see only what they want us to see...they never mentioned the recovery rate has also gone up in the 2.5 mil The 'recovered' figure is not easy to calculate. Many people have residual problems related to Covid. These include complications affecting the heart and kidneys. In children there is a syndrome that has occurred. There are also clotting problems. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAMHERE Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 How can anyone use those fake numbers to justify a position, any position. The numbers are cooked folks. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post geriatrickid Posted August 5, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 5, 2020 11 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said: ‘In the Axios interview, .....’ The Axios interview is arguably one of the most damning indictments of Trump. It’s painful to watch and hear his ignorant, callous and out of touch responses to reasonable questions any competent leader would have coherent and logical answers to. His doubling down on support for Maxwell is something needs examination and explanation. I urge all, supporters and those opposed to Trump to watch the whole of this Axios interview. Doing so will help better inform future discussion. Painful and depressing. A country which has contributed so much to scientific advancement and public health advances, and then this. I had to stop watching several times because it was so upsetting. Many people would say, oh come on, people are smarter than this, and they can see it for what it is, but then you see a comment in TVF like this; 13 minutes ago, IAMHERE said: How can anyone use those fake numbers to justify a position, any position. The numbers are cooked folks. And you realize that there are a lot of people who are in their own imaginary world. Anything that frightens them or requires some sober thought is dismissed as fake. Is it any wonder why so many are scammed and ripped off in life? I wish I had an answer to fix this bigger issue. I don't so I stick to what I can control and manage: My own life and accept that many will die needlessly due to ignorance. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post dunroaming Posted August 5, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 5, 2020 15 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said: For once I agree with you. But do you know what is worse than Trump? The tens of millions Americans who still support him. And the GOP politicians who are willing to support him to be president for another 4 years. Idiots exist all over the world but in most countries they are not elected to be president. Exactly. The scary thing is that being the President of the USA makes him the most dangerous idiot in the world today! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redline Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 16 hours ago, geriatrickid said: Well, for once he was honest when he said the following; "They are dying, that's true. And it is what it is," Trump said. "But that doesn't mean we aren't doing everything we can. It's under control, as much as you can control it." I am no fan of the man, but he's got a valid point. Within the context of the US culture and the views of a large number of Americans, his administration is doing everything that it can. You see it every day in TVF with the extremist statements. Americans in large numbers will not listen, nor consider scientific fact. There are tens of millions who are creationists, who are functional illiterates, who barely completed high school, who do not even know the basic facts of their own country's electoral system. These people will not accept social distancing or the wearing of masks. They are rabid followers of conspiracy promoters like Alex Jones and Rush Limbaugh, accepting whatever they say as the gospel truth. No on challenged Alex Jones when he claimed that the mass murder of children at Sandy Hook was fake. Wackos like Jenny McCarthy and her false narrative on vaccines go unchallenged. Some state governors had it in their power to protect their citizens, but chose not too because they were in fear of this segment of America. Outsiders do not grasp how divided and sectarian the country has become. Americans who have been outside the country for a few years do not see how their country has frayed at the seams. The USA is a country where some people were able to spread a hateful lie about the former President Obama being born in Kenya and not Hawaii, unchallenged. Elsewhere, people would have said no and taken such liars to task. Taking all of the aforementioned into consideration, it is indeed believable when Trump says they did what they could and it is what it is. A large part of the USA is ignorant, afraid and angry. His administration's strategy reflects that sad fact. It’s not the majority ???? If you think that, you are equally as ignorant as he is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redline Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, geriatrickid said: Painful and depressing. A country which has contributed so much to scientific advancement and public health advances, and then this. I had to stop watching several times because it was so upsetting. Many people would say, oh come on, people are smarter than this, and they can see it for what it is, but then you see a comment in TVF like this; And you realize that there are a lot of people who are in their own imaginary world. Anything that frightens them or requires some sober thought is dismissed as fake. Is it any wonder why so many are scammed and ripped off in life? I wish I had an answer to fix this bigger issue. I don't so I stick to what I can control and manage: My own life and accept that many will die needlessly due to ignorance. The ignorance seems to be spreading across the world Edited August 5, 2020 by Redline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtls2005 Posted August 5, 2020 Share Posted August 5, 2020 Today's Covid Task Force briefing: "It's just going to go away." I feel so much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post spidermike007 Posted August 5, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 5, 2020 (edited) His shtick is no longer working. The BS, and insincerity is now costing him dearly. Trump will say or do anything for a vote. But, over 66% of the public does not trust want he says, for good reason. He is a pathological liar. He has lost 20% of his super loyal base in the last few months. His "recent performances" have been horrendously bad, and he looks feeble, stressed, and in decline. His physical and mental health appears poor. This latest Axios interview was an utter disaster. He is completely out of touch, and is a dinosaur. The world has changed and evolved, and that is something he is incapable of. He is cascading toward the most humiliating defeat of his lifetime, and he will likely take a portion of the GOP with him. And that is deserved. He, McConnell, Graham and others are overdue for retirement. The American people will speak in November. Gone, baby gone. The planet will rejoice. Edited August 5, 2020 by spidermike007 7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCauto Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 17 hours ago, Saint Nick said: Just a side note: what a smelly, steaming pile of ... Let's be perfectly clear: a joke it was, 100%! Allow me to borrow your own words with respect to my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bendejo Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 (edited) Quote “It’s going away. It’ll go away. Things go away. No question in my mind that it will go away,” Brilliant! A poet and a prophet. https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/05/trump-says-theres-no-question-the-coronavirus-will-go-away.html Ashes to ashes, and things go away. Will Barron be going off to school? Edited August 6, 2020 by bendejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimmer Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 An off post has been removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 On 8/5/2020 at 7:42 AM, OneMoreFarang said: For once I agree with you. But do you know what is worse than Trump? The tens of millions Americans who still support him. And the GOP politicians who are willing to support him to be president for another 4 years. Idiots exist all over the world but in most countries they are not elected to be president. It seems a growing world trait! Elect the least worst idiot from the appalling choices offered. Trump got elected because people saw through corrupt Hilary. But he's shown what a clown he really is. Now they have to choose between 4 more years of him or dopey sleepy corrupt old Joe and his possible successor VP choice, "a woman of color" (isn't white a color? But that would only please the feminists not the racists). Poor Americans, what a choice! Boris got elected because few liked the far left, terrorist loving, unpatriotic, inadequate Corbyn; and the LibDems weren't even in it! So the UK got Boris the buffoon and the sinister puppet master Cummings. What's worse, the opposition still flounder and will likely field another numpty against Boris. France had to choose between the far right Marine, who wanted out the EU, or the little emperor, former banker, and EU federalist Marcron. His lack of popularity, the yellow vest protests, and other industrial protest actions says it all about his regime. But he is good at spending on Presidential baubles. Corvid 19 actually helped him! Spain - a <deleted>'s muddle. Italy, all over the place. Australia controversial. Still, better than China, Russia, Venezuela, Cambodia and banana republics where there's no real choice. Where have all the real class, skillful, leaders gone? Now being exposed as corrupt, inept, ineffective, self interested and a liar aren't barriers to a career in politics. It's almost accepted as par for the course! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post johnnybangkok Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 32 minutes ago, Baerboxer said: It seems a growing world trait! Elect the least worst idiot from the appalling choices offered. Trump got elected because people saw through corrupt Hilary. But he's shown what a clown he really is. Now they have to choose between 4 more years of him or dopey sleepy corrupt old Joe and his possible successor VP choice, "a woman of color" (isn't white a color? But that would only please the feminists not the racists). Poor Americans, what a choice! Boris got elected because few liked the far left, terrorist loving, unpatriotic, inadequate Corbyn; and the LibDems weren't even in it! So the UK got Boris the buffoon and the sinister puppet master Cummings. What's worse, the opposition still flounder and will likely field another numpty against Boris. France had to choose between the far right Marine, who wanted out the EU, or the little emperor, former banker, and EU federalist Marcron. His lack of popularity, the yellow vest protests, and other industrial protest actions says it all about his regime. But he is good at spending on Presidential baubles. Corvid 19 actually helped him! Spain - a <deleted>'s muddle. Italy, all over the place. Australia controversial. Still, better than China, Russia, Venezuela, Cambodia and banana republics where there's no real choice. Where have all the real class, skillful, leaders gone? Now being exposed as corrupt, inept, ineffective, self interested and a liar aren't barriers to a career in politics. It's almost accepted as par for the course! Your thoughts on Hilary and that of of Biden clearly demonstrate the real problem with politics these days. You have branded Hilary 'corrupt' and Biden 'dopey sleepy corrupt old Joe' and Corbyn 'far left, terrorist loving, unpatriotic, inadequate' but where did you actually get that from? Hilary has been exhonerated many, many times for Benghazi and other 'scandals', Biden has never been accused of being corrupt and the only time I hear 'dopey, sleepy, old Joe' is from Trumps twitter pulpit and although lacking in many areas, I would never see Corbyn as 'terrorist loving nor unpatriotic.' Inadequate? Definately. The point though is even though you go on to say many things I agree with you have in turn inadvertantly fallen for unfettered propoganda which the right have become experts in. The left have always tried to take the high ground in these matters but it seems a voting public make their choices from catchy monikers and schoolyard insults. It's as if the left don't know what the game is any more, never mind there is no longer any rules. Also, you ask 'Where have all the real class, skillful, leaders gone?' and I would venture they are still there; Merkal - Germany, Arden - New Zealand, Solberg - Norway, Marin - Finland but is it a coincidence they are all women? When it comes to the balances required for these position, I say get rid of the over egotistical and fundamentaly flawed men (of which Trump demonstrates in spades) and just let the woman run the show. After all they did a fantastic job of raising us lot, so running a country should be a walk in the park. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post OneMoreFarang Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 2 hours ago, Baerboxer said: Where have all the real class, skillful, leaders gone? I guess part of the problem is that the uneducated delusional masses want heroes who say a few words and all the problems are solved. People love easy solutions for difficult problems. But the problem with easy solutions to difficult problems it that they are mostly wrong. So what happens if a honest politician tells the people that he has no easy solution because there is no easy solution. Do the masses accept that? Or do they vote for someone who tells them something like: No problem, I will do that. All will be fine. Believe me. I think most qualified people don't want to be politicians because they know that the stupid masses will never vote for them. And that is unfortunately true almost anywhere in this world. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opl Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 Trump can advantageously be compared to Bolsonaro when it comes tp COVID-19 pandemic handling, Trump does a better job, by far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post earlinclaifornia Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 19 hours ago, EVENKEEL said: I understand that's what the dems are banking on, So what you are saying is that improving cover 19 virus situation and dealing with the worst unemployment ever in history is directly related to the Democrats banking on more failure? We need to see if everything you are claiming is true. Please let us know more if you would? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post earlinclaifornia Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 21 minutes ago, Opl said: Trump can advantageously be compared to Bolsonaro when it comes tp COVID-19 pandemic handling, Trump does a better job, by far. Myself living in USA over 65 years, we really never compare ourselves to Brazil, unless you want to compare soccer, perhaps. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post JCauto Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 3 hours ago, Baerboxer said: It seems a growing world trait! Elect the least worst idiot from the appalling choices offered. Trump got elected because people saw through corrupt Hilary. But he's shown what a clown he really is. As one of his cheerleaders, I can only hope that the rest of those who made that choice in 2016 are coming to a similar position of regret and realization of how much damage that fool has done. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jingthing Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 How the USA failed so miserably in its response to the pandemic. Yep. No surprise. It's mostly on 45. https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/09/coronavirus-american-failure/614191/ How the Pandemic Defeated America A virus has brought the world’s most powerful country to its knees. How did it come to this? A virus a thousand times smaller than a dust mote has humbled and humiliated the planet’s most powerful nation. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welovesundaysatspace Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 5 minutes ago, JCauto said: As one of his cheerleaders, I can only hope that the rest of those who made that choice in 2016 are coming to a similar position of regret and realization of how much damage that fool has done. That won’t matter, because he will be stealing the election anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim1000 Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 Poor chap and all he gets is a dollar ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 10 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said: That won’t matter, because he will be stealing the election anyway. He will definitely try. No doubt. It might require a Biden landslide to overcome his dirty tricks. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVENKEEL Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 2 hours ago, earlinclaifornia said: So what you are saying is that improving cover 19 virus situation and dealing with the worst unemployment ever in history is directly related to the Democrats banking on more failure? We need to see if everything you are claiming is true. Please let us know more if you would? You already show how disingenuous you are by deleting the rest of my post which was pretty short. Bad unemployment figures are most definitely going to be highlighted by the dems come election time as is the growing deficit trying to keep people afloat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post earlinclaifornia Posted August 6, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted August 6, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, EVENKEEL said: You already show how disingenuous you are by deleting the rest of my post which was pretty short. Bad unemployment figures are most definitely going to be highlighted by the dems come election time as is the growing deficit trying to keep people afloat. The unemployment numbers and the covid 19 response and those numbers both really. What are you claiming about me deleting anything you said? Nonsense! Edited August 6, 2020 by earlinclaifornia 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now