New York sues to break up NRA, accuses it of corruption

[Logosone]

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

You ask others proof of the NRA laundering money, since you claim the NRA is not laundering money, I'm sure you have the proof for that to show here.

Sorry but you are a bit confused about how it works.

 

If someone says the NRA is involved in laundering money then that person has to adduce the evidence. The burden of proof is on the person making the allegation.

 

I note that so far not a single piece of evidence has been posted to show that the NRA has engaged in laundering money. Not one.

 

It's almost as if the NRA does not in fact launder money.

[Sujo]

5 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Lol, he was clearly insinuating the NRA laundered money. Just like Chomper Higgot, who I'm sure will surely post the evidence that the NRA is laundering money.

 

Can't wait to see it.

 

Is it going to be long?

No not long, maybe the case can be expedited.

[Logosone]

5 minutes ago, Sujo said:

No not long, maybe the case can be expedited.

But no evidence? You know, of money laundering?

Edited August 7, 2020 by Logosone

[MRToMRT]

20 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Sorry but you are a bit confused about how it works.

 

If someone says the NRA is involved in laundering money then that person has to adduce the evidence. The burden of proof is on the person making the allegation.

 

I note that so far not a single piece of evidence has been posted to show that the NRA has engaged in laundering money. Not one.

 

It's almost as if the NRA does not in fact launder money.

Will not that be done in a court rather than on TV?

[animalmagic]

4 minutes ago, Logosone said:

But no evidence? You know, of money laundering?

I'm afraid I am not privy to the investigative process or involved in the gathering of evidence for these cases.  However, let me point you towards some websites that raise questions, as I did when first posting on here.

https://www.npr.org/2019/09/27/764879242/nra-was-foreign-asset-to-russia-ahead-of-2016-new-senate-report-reveals

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2019/03/nra-russia-butina-torshin-trump-investigations/

There are sufficient reports out there to justify asking questions and a desire to seek the truth.

But it could all be a Hoax and Fake News.  

 

[Phoenix Rising]

11 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Sorry but you are a bit confused about how it works.

 

If someone says the NRA is involved in laundering money then that person has to adduce the evidence. The burden of proof is on the person making the allegation.

 

I note that so far not a single piece of evidence has been posted to show that the NRA has engaged in laundering money. Not one.

 

It's almost as if the NRA does not in fact launder money.

"Sorry but you are a bit confused about how it works."

I'm afraid you're the confused one. It's NY's AG that claims the good ol' boys in the NRA are engaged in criminal activities. Did you even read the article in the OP??

 

"If someone says the NRA is involved in laundering money then that person has to adduce the evidence. The burden of proof is on the person making the allegation."

Yup, NY's AG. Has anyone else made that allegation?

 

"I note that so far not a single piece of evidence has been posted to show that the NRA has engaged in laundering money. Not one."

Duh, you will have to wait for the trial. Is this difficult to grasp?

 

"It's almost as if the NRA does not in fact launder money."

See all of the above.

 

 

 

[Phoenix Rising]

20 minutes ago, Logosone said:

But no evidence? You know, of money laundering?

How on earth do you know this? Do you have a source in the AG's office?

[Eric Loh]

10 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

If someone says the NRA is involved in laundering money then that person has to adduce the evidence. The burden of proof is on the person making the allegation."

Yup, NY's AG. Has anyone else made that allegation?

Is this sufficient to claim that the money laundering is more than an allegation?

 

• The FBI is investigating the National Rifle Association to determine whether Russians illegally funneled money through the organization to help the Trump campaign.

[simple1]

2 hours ago, Logosone said:

Terrible move by Letitia.

 

Not only does it illustrate the litigious backstabbing many AGs now engage in, politicising their office, but it also jolts all the millions of NRA members into action as they see their much beloved organisation being treated like, as was said here, Al Capone.

 

The political response by those in the NRA, many of whom are very high profile and very wealthy, will strengthen Trump's numbers come election time. However the legal action will drag on for years.

 

Bad move.

it is not an attack on the NRA, it's calling to account NRA executives for extensive fraud which any reasonable person would comprehend is a terrible breach of trust against the membership and smearing the reputation of the NRA.

 

Given the political sensitivity I say the AG has overwhelming evidence against the NRA executives, though I am concerned regarding potential for negative impact on the Dems.

 

As expected, trump has already started with his usual BS which without doubt will be repeated ad nauseum by his supporters.

[J Town]

24 minutes ago, Logosone said:

But no evidence? You know, of money laundering?

You are deflecting. Nobody knows at this time whether there is money laundering or not. What do we know? The NYAG is prosecuting the NRA for abuse of their positions. They don't do this lightly and have over 160 pages in their case. You keep trying to drag attention away from the actual facts.

[J Town]

5 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Is this sufficient to claim that the money laundering is more than an allegation?

 

• The FBI is investigating the National Rifle Association to determine whether Russians illegally funneled money through the organization to help the Trump campaign.

They started that investigation in 2018. I can't find anything that shows what the conclusion was (if any, it may still be active) to this probe, but it is true. What THIS NYAG action focuses on is CEO Wayne LaPierre's abuse.

 

https://www.npr.org/2020/08/06/899712823/new-york-attorney-general-moves-to-dissolve-the-nra-after-fraud-investigation

[Logosone]

6 minutes ago, simple1 said:

it is not an attack on the NRA, it's calling to account NRA executives for extensive fraud which any reasonable person would comprehend is a terrible breach of trust against the membership and smearing the reputation of the NRA.

 

Given the political sensitivity I say the AG has overwhelming evidence against the NRA executives, though I am concerned regarding potential for negative impact on the Dems.

 

As expected, trump has already started with his usual BS which without doubt will be repeated ad nauseum by his supporters.

Of course it's an attack on the NRA, a very useful and charitable body in the USA.

 

Letitia admits it herself and speaks openly of dissolving the NRA. If it were just about calling to account the executives then only LaPierre and Co would have been indicted. However, as Letitia James has made clear, her aim is to dissolve the NRA altogether. For the crime of supporting Donald Trump.

 

This is a political prosecution with a political aim. It is not about accountability, crimes or anything remotely connected therewith. 

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, Logosone said:

Of course it's an attack on the NRA, a very useful and charitable body in the USA.

 

Letitia admits it herself and speaks openly of dissolving the NRA. If it were just about calling to account the executives then only LaPierre and Co would have been indicted. However, as Letitia James has made clear, her aim is to dissolve the NRA altogether. For the crime of supporting Donald Trump.

 

This is a political prosecution with a political aim. It is not about accountability, crimes or anything remotely connected therewith. 

But surely a charity should not be supporting a politician? 

[nausea]

Whatever the validity of the allegations the timing is a bit suspect, very convenient it happens just before the Presidential elections. If you're against the guy, beat him on the issues; investigate after. All this anti-Tump media stuff is getting a bit tiresome and obvious, even to me, who am not the most media savvy guy in the world.

[simple1]

2 hours ago, Why Me said:

The gun nuts are a core Trump constituency. They'd vote for him even he shot one of them on Fifth Ave.

 

I doubt the AG moved without substantial evidence. She doesn't want to look silly any more than anyone else. And I suspect if the charges look like they're going to damage the NRA, a lot of independents will be happy. And happy to vote for Biden to keep the momentum going.

I assume the Court case will not be heard until after the election due to legal manoeuvring by the NRA / defendants. In the meantime, IMO, the partisan bitterness will escalate even further due to this matter; will that benefit the Dems?

[J Town]

1 minute ago, nausea said:

Whatever the validity of the allegations the timing is a bit suspect, very convenient it happens just before the Presidential elections. If you're against the guy, beat him on the issues; investigate after. All this anti-Tump media stuff is getting a bit tiresome and obvious, even to me, who am not the most media savvy guy in the world.

Unfortunately - it's an election year. Expect more of the same. For what it's worth, if Biden gets elected, we won't be going through this at this level four years from now. Biden won't go for a 2nd term. That's why all the speculation on who his running mate will be. She will have a leg up on running for prez 2024. And really - you want to see a President PENCE?!?

[Logosone]

33 minutes ago, MRToMRT said:

Will not that be done in a court rather than on TV?

Sure, but just to be clear: Nobody on here has any evidence whatsoever of the NRA laundering money?

 

Is that right?

[Rookiescot]

3 minutes ago, nausea said:

Whatever the validity of the allegations the timing is a bit suspect, very convenient it happens just before the Presidential elections. If you're against the guy, beat him on the issues; investigate after. All this anti-Tump media stuff is getting a bit tiresome and obvious, even to me, who am not the most media savvy guy in the world.

Yes we knew that.

So the timing should be determined by outside events?

Robert Mugabe would agree I suspect.

[J Town]

Just now, Logosone said:

Sure, but just to be clear: Nobody on here has any evidence whatsoever of the NRA laundering money?

 

Is that right?

Yes, you are right. Feel better now?

[simple1]

8 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Of course it's an attack on the NRA, a very useful and charitable body in the USA.

 

Letitia admits it herself and speaks openly of dissolving the NRA. If it were just about calling to account the executives then only LaPierre and Co would have been indicted. However, as Letitia James has made clear, her aim is to dissolve the NRA altogether. For the crime of supporting Donald Trump.

 

This is a political prosecution with a political aim. It is not about accountability, crimes or anything remotely connected therewith. 

if the executives are found guilty, plus there would have been plenty of enablers (now witnesses?), a good idea for the NRA to reinvent and rebrand itself with a clean slate.

[Logosone]

36 minutes ago, animalmagic said:

I'm afraid I am not privy to the investigative process or involved in the gathering of evidence for these cases.  However, let me point you towards some websites that raise questions, as I did when first posting on here.

https://www.npr.org/2019/09/27/764879242/nra-was-foreign-asset-to-russia-ahead-of-2016-new-senate-report-reveals

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2019/03/nra-russia-butina-torshin-trump-investigations/

There are sufficient reports out there to justify asking questions and a desire to seek the truth.

But it could all be a Hoax and Fake News.  

 

Sorry, but the links you posted refer to the NRA introducing Russian people to its associates in the US.

 

There is absolutely no mention whatsoever of money laundering in those articles.

 

So I guess you have no evidence of money laundering on the part of the NRA then?

[Eric Loh]

20 minutes ago, J Town said:

They started that investigation in 2018. I can't find anything that shows what the conclusion was (if any, it may still be active) to this probe, but it is true. What THIS NYAG action focuses on is CEO Wayne LaPierre's abuse.

 

https://www.npr.org/2020/08/06/899712823/new-york-attorney-general-moves-to-dissolve-the-nra-after-fraud-investigation

We don’t hear much about this investigation because the Republicans block the case. Of course they did. 
https://about.bgov.com/news/russia-meddling-uproar-worsens-as-probe-of-nras-role-is-dropped/

[J Town]

2 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Sorry, but the links you posted refer to the NRA introducing Russian people to its associates in the US.

 

There is absolutely no mention whatsoever of money laundering in those articles.

 

So I guess you have no evidence of money laundering on the part of the NRA then?

Please - you're on the verge of the very definition of trolling - Let it go! The FBI DID investigate the NRA in 2018 for money laundering, the investigation may still be ongoing. The topic here is the NYAG investigating the NRA and four leaders including Wayne LaPierre.

[Logosone]

Just now, Eric Loh said:

We don’t hear much about this investigation because the Republicans block the case. Of course they did. 
https://about.bgov.com/news/russia-meddling-uproar-worsens-as-probe-of-nras-role-is-dropped/

They just pointed out that the initial Democrat report contained a number of conclusions that were overblown and unwarranted, as well as clear exaggerations.

 

21,000 USD paid in travel expenses. Big deal.

[J Town]

Just now, Joe well ya know said:

Have you had a cog...cog tive thing. You know. You a junkie?

 

I'd suggest you lurk on this forum for a bit. You're not off to a good start.

[Logosone]

3 minutes ago, J Town said:

Please - you're on the verge of the very definition of trolling - Let it go! The FBI DID investigate the NRA in 2018 for money laundering, the investigation may still be ongoing. The topic here is the NYAG investigating the NRA and four leaders including Wayne LaPierre.

No. 

 

You are misrepresenting what the FBI actually investigated. They were checking whether a Russian banker used the NRA to fund Donald Trump's campaign. Nothing to do with money laundering by the NRA.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/18/trump-nra-fbi-alexander-torshin-russia-investigation

 

And of course this investigation went nowhere because it was based on totally unwarranted and overblown false insinuations and misrepresentations. 

 

Like the entire Russia fairytale the Democrats have been spinning for ages. It's just ridiculous.

[Phoenix Rising]

28 minutes ago, Logosone said:

Of course it's an attack on the NRA, a very useful and charitable body in the USA.

 

Letitia admits it herself and speaks openly of dissolving the NRA. If it were just about calling to account the executives then only LaPierre and Co would have been indicted. However, as Letitia James has made clear, her aim is to dissolve the NRA altogether. For the crime of supporting Donald Trump.

 

This is a political prosecution with a political aim. It is not about accountability, crimes or anything remotely connected therewith. 

So you've seen the evidence the prosecution will present? Didn't think so.

[J Town]

1 minute ago, Logosone said:

No. 

 

You are misrepresenting what the FBI actually investigated. They were checking whether a Russian banker used the NRA to fund Donald Trump's campaign. Nothing to do with money laundering by the NRA.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/18/trump-nra-fbi-alexander-torshin-russia-investigation

 

And of course this investigation went nowhere because it was based on totally unwarranted and overblown false insinuations and misrepresentations. 

 

Like the entire Russia fairytale the Democrats have been spinning for ages. It's just ridiculous.

From 2018: "The FBI is investigating the National Rifle Association to determine whether Russians illegally funneled money through the organization to help the Trump campaign."

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/15/nra-russia-and-trump-money-laundering-poisoning-us-democracy-commentary.html

[amykat]

6 hours ago, Logosone said:

 

the NRA, a charitable organisation.

I bet some Mexican drug cartels are more “charitable” at times ...

[Logosone]

1 minute ago, J Town said:

From 2018: "The FBI is investigating the National Rifle Association to determine whether Russians illegally funneled money through the organization to help the Trump campaign."

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/15/nra-russia-and-trump-money-laundering-poisoning-us-democracy-commentary.html

Yes, the allegation was that Russia tried to interfere in the US elections with a Russian banker paying money to Trump's campaign.

 

So nothing to do whatsoever with the NRA engaging in money laundering.

 

And of course these allegations maybe carried some credibility in 2018 when the whole Russia story was not clearly exposed as a fantasy. It has been now, this investigation went nowhere and there was no proof the NRA engaged in the activity that was alleged.

 

So if that is it, we can safely say the NRA has not engaged in any money laundering.