Retirement extension - latest from Phang Nga

[auntyedna]

For the second time in a year, the team at Phang Nga Immigration has changed.  When extending a retirement visa, applicants should now bear in mind the following:
1.  Passport copies showing TWO double pages per sheet of A4, despite no photographic reduction, will be REJECTED.  They only accept one double page per sheet.
2.  Bank book copies in landscape format will be REJECTED.  They only accept PORTRAIT format.
3.  The conventional wisdom expressed on this site that it is not necessary to get visas transferred to a new passport, even if they are about to expire, DOES NOT APPLY at Phang Nga.
4.  Previous retirement extensions stamped in the old passport are NOT ACCEPTABLE to enable transfer.  They require the ORIGINAL VISA in the ORIGINAL PASSPORT, which in my case was issued fourteen years ago.
5.  An expiring extension of stay that was stamped on a passport page that previously held a stick-on visa (e.g. Cambodia) that fell out is deemed ILLEGAL, despite the fact the department was responsible for putting it there.
6.  When presenting your sheaf of documents, be sure to arrange them in EXACTLY the same order as the "Required Documents" information form, or they will be REJECTED and handed back to you.
7.  90-day reports sent by mail ARE NOT ACCEPTED. My registered letter sent during Covid was handed back to me.
8.  They do NOT ACCEPT CASH any more; you have to pay by debit/credit card, and they add 2 per cent to the fee.

In a previous trip last February, the Immigration staff offered me a cup of coffee, and one of the staff took a selfie of herself, me and the coffee.  Those happy days are gone.  At a time when the tourist industry has collapsed, I respectfully suggest that Thailand should be falling over itself to attract long-stay residents, and that naked hostility to existing residents who wish to stay, may be counter-productive.

[jackdd]

18 minutes ago, auntyedna said:

At a time when the tourist industry has collapsed, I respectfully suggest that Thailand should be falling over itself to attract long-stay residents, and that naked hostility to existing residents who wish to stay, may be counter-productive.

They don't care about Thailand, all they care about are the backhanders from agents which go into their pockets.

Edited August 7, 2020 by jackdd

[Matzzon]

You really let them handle you as they wish. ????????????????????????

 

If you read what you wrote yourself, you will understand how much they had fun with you.

[auntyedna]

21 minutes ago, Matzzon said:

You really let them handle you as they wish. ????????????????????????

 

If you read what you wrote yourself, you will understand how much they had fun with you.

Oh yes!!  They had a TERRIFIC time!  But having dealt with govt departments when I was working as an engineer, I am only too aware of how doors slam shut around you if you lose your rag or act British.  I was even told by one Thai colleague, when I was suffering breach of contract from a govt department, that it is considered "impolite" to refer to the contract!  So yes - sickly smile around gritted teeth - they handled me to their satisfaction... but I got my extension.

[Matzzon]

5 hours ago, auntyedna said:

Oh yes!!  They had a TERRIFIC time!  But having dealt with govt departments when I was working as an engineer, I am only too aware of how doors slam shut around you if you lose your rag or act British.  I was even told by one Thai colleague, when I was suffering breach of contract from a govt department, that it is considered "impolite" to refer to the contract!  So yes - sickly smile around gritted teeth - they handled me to their satisfaction... but I got my extension.

I get it. This happens a lot over in this country. At the end you got your extension, so nothing more is needed. Good for you!

However, my immigration officer do not handle me like a football, and he knows that.

[Bangkok Basha]

Please clarify what this means:  Passport copies showing TWO double pages per sheet of A4, despite no photographic reduction, will be REJECTED.  They only accept one double page per sheet. Does that mean each single page in the passport must be photocopied separately, as opposed to the two adjacent pages together? If so, what a waste of paper! I'm hoping Chonburi Immigration is not so wasteful. I never had the issue in several years of extensions at Chiang Wattana in BKK. 

[jackdd]

32 minutes ago, Bangkok Basha said:

Please clarify what this means:  Passport copies showing TWO double pages per sheet of A4, despite no photographic reduction, will be REJECTED.  They only accept one double page per sheet. Does that mean each single page in the passport must be photocopied separately, as opposed to the two adjacent pages together? If so, what a waste of paper! I'm hoping Chonburi Immigration is not so wasteful. I never had the issue in several years of extensions at Chiang Wattana in BKK. 

He said "two double pages", meaning 4 passport pages on one sheet of paper, are not accepted by them.

[nobodysfriend]

And what about health insurance for retirement ( O-A ) Visa extensions ?

As you did not mention it , I think it is not needed ....?

Last year it was not necessary ...

Edited August 8, 2020 by nobodysfriend

[OJAS]

19 hours ago, auntyedna said:

or act British.

So are we to infer from this and points 3 & 4 in your OP that you are a Brit who has recently had to endure the bureaucratically tedious process of getting your passport renewed from Thailand, thanks, in particular, to the requirement for 2 enforced route marches to an office building with an exceedingly silly name somewhere in deepest darkest Bangkok - which presumably had to be undertaken all the way from Phang Nga in your case? IMHO the ridiculously cumbersome procedures which those incompetent fools at HMPO have inflicted on us Brits in LOS at passport renewal time since 2014 are far more worthy of complaint than anything that Immigration here has imposed on us retirees!

Edited August 8, 2020 by OJAS

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, nobodysfriend said:

And what about health insurance for retirement ( O-A ) Visa extensions ?

As you did not mention it , I think it is not needed ....?

Last year it was not necessary ...

According to an earlier report Phang Nga IO have same policy as Phuket IO.

Phuket IO officially announced that they are currently not enforcing the thai IO-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for a 1-year extension for reason of retirement from your original Non Imm O-A Visa.  And they will evaluate that non-enforcement policy in October, but till then not needed.

There are also reports of other IOs that are currently not insisting on the thai IO-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for a 1 year extension of stay for reason of retirement based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa.  Most probably that is because during the Amnesty with land-borders closed it is not possible now to do a border-run and on return apply for the 90-day Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement and subsequently apply for the 1-year extension of that Visa.

The requirements for the 1-year extension based on a Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement are exactly same s for the Non Imm O-A Visa, with the one exception that the Non Imm O does NOT require that $%^&* thai IO-approved health-insurance scam.

[CM Dad]

For more than thirty years I always prepared all of my own documents for Thai Immigration.  This year, for the first time, I used an agent.  The entire process was so quick and so smooth that I would never even consider dealing with Immigration any other way from now on.  We arrived at a pre-booked time, went to a side entrance, entered an office in the rear of the building, presented all documents and my passport, had my information entered into the computer, took a photo, had the passport stamped, received a smile, and was done in less than ten minutes.  The agent handled the financial transaction.  Afterwards, the agent took me back home.  It was the briefest and most pleasant time I have had at any government office anywhere in the world.

[Scott Tracy]

What does 'act British' mean?

 

Not to refer to the contract...? why have a contract?

 

We all know the rules and know they can be interpreted differently by each Immigration Office. We also know that each Immigration Office has its own way of doing things.

Experience has shown me to 'over prepare ', in exactly the same way as I used to have to for and during an Aviation Authority regulatory compliance audit.

It also showed me, each regulatory authority auditor had their own interpretations of the rules and that would likely change with auditor.each

 

I also found out, the best way of demonstrating compliance was to offer a solution before the audit and see how that floated with the auditor. Then we should know we were 'singing from the same hymn sheet '. A lot to be said for 'running it up the flagpole'. Satisfy the auditor and satisfy the regulations. Satisfy the Immigration Officer and get your extension. As I just did...

[Peter Denis]

16 minutes ago, CM Dad said:

For more than thirty years I always prepared all of my own documents for Thai Immigration.  This year, for the first time, I used an agent.  The entire process was so quick and so smooth that I would never even consider dealing with Immigration any other way from now on.  We arrived at a pre-booked time, went to a side entrance, entered an office in the rear of the building, presented all documents and my passport, had my information entered into the computer, took a photo, had the passport stamped, received a smile, and was done in less than ten minutes.  The agent handled the financial transaction.  Afterwards, the agent took me back home.  It was the briefest and most pleasant time I have had at any government office anywhere in the world.

Which IO - which agent - what category extension - what fee?

Thanks for the report but without the above details it is of little practical use.

[Nemises]

What a horrifying experience. 
 

Thank goodness that there are people who do your extensions for you for a small outlay. 
 

???? ????

[auntyedna]

4 hours ago, jackdd said:

He said "two double pages", meaning 4 passport pages on one sheet of paper, are not accepted by them.

Correct.  Even though they are not reduced.  I have never tried copying them on both sides of the sheet - probably an arrestable offence.

[auntyedna]

4 hours ago, nobodysfriend said:

And what about health insurance for retirement ( O-A ) Visa extensions ?

As you did not mention it , I think it is not needed ....?

Last year it was not necessary ...

This is item (6) on Police order 35/2562 of 18 January 2018.  It does NOT appear on the current Phang Nga list of required documents... yet.  That will be a real killer if it is ever implemented.  Getting health insurance over the age of 70 is either prohibitively expensive or refused.

[auntyedna]

1 hour ago, Scott Tracy said:

What does 'act British' mean?

 

Not to refer to the contract...? why have a contract?

 

 

Acting British: in this case, how about pedantic, righteous and pompous?

Why have a contract?  When designing and constructing mass transit railways, they are generally required.

[auntyedna]

3 hours ago, OJAS said:

So are we to infer from this and points 3 & 4 in your OP that you are a Brit who has recently had to endure the bureaucratically tedious process of getting your passport renewed from Thailand, thanks, in particular, to the requirement for 2 enforced route marches to an office building with an exceedingly silly name somewhere in deepest darkest Bangkok - which presumably had to be undertaken all the way from Phang Nga in your case? IMHO the ridiculously cumbersome procedures which those incompetent fools at HMPO have inflicted on us Brits in LOS at passport renewal time since 2014 are far more worthy of complaint than anything that Immigration here has imposed on us retirees!

Yes, yes, yes, and yes.  AND the Liverpool office rejected my photo without saying what was wrong with it - I had followed all their guidelines and measurements to the nearest millimetre.  I sent several photos back printed with different contrast, brightness, and weights of paper, and I incorporated in my letter a checklist of photographic parameters for them to tick or cross if none of the new set was satisfactory.  That shut them up.  But here's a question - why couldn't the minions at the "office building with an exceedingly silly name in deepest Bangkok" accept or reject the photo at the time of submission??

[Peter Denis]

20 minutes ago, auntyedna said:

This is item (6) on Police order 35/2562 of 18 January 2018.  It does NOT appear on the current Phang Nga list of required documents... yet.  That will be a real killer if it is ever implemented.  Getting health insurance over the age of 70 is either prohibitively expensive or refused.

> See my post #10 in this thread why currently not enforced at Phang Nga.

But even if it would be enforced, there are thai IO-approved TGIA-associated insurers that will provide the required insurance when under 76 years of age.

The cheapest one being LMG Insurance whose Plan 1 policy (with 200K deductible) has an annual premium of 6.000 THB to 11.400 THB in the age brackets of 51 to 75 years of age.  And that policy does NOT require an - expensive - medical to subscribe to it.

 

[Baerboxer]

1 hour ago, CM Dad said:

For more than thirty years I always prepared all of my own documents for Thai Immigration.  This year, for the first time, I used an agent.  The entire process was so quick and so smooth that I would never even consider dealing with Immigration any other way from now on.  We arrived at a pre-booked time, went to a side entrance, entered an office in the rear of the building, presented all documents and my passport, had my information entered into the computer, took a photo, had the passport stamped, received a smile, and was done in less than ten minutes.  The agent handled the financial transaction.  Afterwards, the agent took me back home.  It was the briefest and most pleasant time I have had at any government office anywhere in the world.

 

Very nice. Oh, and if we may inquire, how much did this extension and pleasant experience cost you?

[Max69xl]

6 hours ago, CM Dad said:

For more than thirty years I always prepared all of my own documents for Thai Immigration.  This year, for the first time, I used an agent.  The entire process was so quick and so smooth that I would never even consider dealing with Immigration any other way from now on.  We arrived at a pre-booked time, went to a side entrance, entered an office in the rear of the building, presented all documents and my passport, had my information entered into the computer, took a photo, had the passport stamped, received a smile, and was done in less than ten minutes.  The agent handled the financial transaction.  Afterwards, the agent took me back home.  It was the briefest and most pleasant time I have had at any government office anywhere in the world.

My 1 year extensions takes far less than 10 minutes everytime for a cost of 1900 baht (2000 baht incl the bank letter). I wouldn't dream of using an agent. 

Edited August 8, 2020 by Max69xl

[Thingamabob]

8 hours ago, OJAS said:

So are we to infer from this and points 3 & 4 in your OP that you are a Brit who has recently had to endure the bureaucratically tedious process of getting your passport renewed from Thailand, thanks, in particular, to the requirement for 2 enforced route marches to an office building with an exceedingly silly name somewhere in deepest darkest Bangkok - which presumably had to be undertaken all the way from Phang Nga in your case? IMHO the ridiculously cumbersome procedures which those incompetent fools at HMPO have inflicted on us Brits in LOS at passport renewal time since 2014 are far more worthy of complaint than anything that Immigration here has imposed on us retirees!

Well said.

[Max69xl]

9 hours ago, nobodysfriend said:

And what about health insurance for retirement ( O-A ) Visa extensions ?

As you did not mention it , I think it is not needed ....?

Last year it was not necessary ...

"Last year it was not necessary"

The need for a health insurance kicked in October 31 last year.  

[lamyai3]

19 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

There are also reports of other IOs that are currently not insisting on the thai IO-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for a 1 year extension of stay for reason of retirement based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa.  Most probably that is because during the Amnesty with land-borders closed it is not possible now to do a border-run and on return apply for the 90-day Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement and subsequently apply for the 1-year extension of that Visa.

Any word on how Chaengwattana are handling this? My O/A expiry is early November, meaning I could technically apply for extension mid-September while the amnesty is still on (45 days early).

 

Any success stories of people extending a pre-october 2019 Non O/A without needing the insurance? My situation is as you describe - visa issued before the insurance rules came in, unable to maximise usage due to closed borders, and unable to leave country to change visa class for the same reason.

 

I'm anticipating having to cough up for the insurance, but if anyone has got a Non O/A extension at CW without it this year during the amnesty period please chime in! 

[Peter Denis]

52 minutes ago, lamyai3 said:

Any word on how Chaengwattana are handling this? My O/A expiry is early November, meaning I could technically apply for extension mid-September while the amnesty is still on (45 days early).

 

Any success stories of people extending a pre-october 2019 Non O/A without needing the insurance? My situation is as you describe - visa issued before the insurance rules came in, unable to maximise usage due to closed borders, and unable to leave country to change visa class for the same reason.

 

I'm anticipating having to cough up for the insurance, but if anyone has got a Non O/A extension at CW without it this year during the amnesty period please chime in! 

Several reports that the thai IO-approved health-insurance is required when applying at CW for the 1-year extension of stay based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.  So CW - in contrast to some other IOs - does also require it during the Amnesty.

In the likely case you are not able to do a border-run before the end of the Amnesty as first step in the process to convert to a Non Imm O retirement Visa, I did sent you PM some info on the LMG Insurance Plan 1 policy, which is the cheapest option to meet the worthless #$%^& thai IO-approved health-insurance requirement (additional advantage being that it does not require an expensive medical to subscribe to that policy).

 

[auntyedna]

Clarification re: health insurance... "According to the order [the Jan 2019 police order], health insurance is not required for those applying for an extension of stay of a non-immigrant category O visa based on retirement or Thai wife."  Seems like it's just Type O-A.

Source: https://www.thaiembassy.com/travel/health-insurance-thailand-new-requirement-for-retirees.php

[BritTim]

22 hours ago, auntyedna said:

Correct.  Even though they are not reduced.  I have never tried copying them on both sides of the sheet - probably an arrestable offence.

On the contrary, next year they may insist on it to make it more accurately represent the original passport.

[Peter Denis]

17 minutes ago, auntyedna said:

Clarification re: health insurance... "According to the order [the Jan 2019 police order], health insurance is not required for those applying for an extension of stay of a non-immigrant category O visa based on retirement or Thai wife."  Seems like it's just Type O-A.

Source: https://www.thaiembassy.com/travel/health-insurance-thailand-new-requirement-for-retirees.php

That quote is from a non-official commercial website.  And it is not correct as it fails to mention that when you apply for a 1-year extension based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa (even if that dates from yesteryear) that the thai IO-approved mandatory health-insurance requirement is ONLY applicable when applying for reason of RETIREMENT.

A Non Imm O-A 1-year extension for any other reason that retirement does NOT require the mandatory health-insurance requirement.

As this is Thailand some Immigration officers are confused by their own rules/regulations and may want to impose the health-insurance requirement when applying for the 1-year Non Imm O-A extension for reason of marriage.  In that case a call to the IO Helpdesk (1178) should quickly solve the matter and confirm that it is not applicable in that case.

[auntyedna]

On 8/9/2020 at 12:52 PM, Peter Denis said:

That quote is from a non-official commercial website.  And it is not correct as it fails to mention that when you apply for a 1-year extension based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa (even if that dates from yesteryear) that the thai IO-approved mandatory health-insurance requirement is ONLY applicable when applying for reason of RETIREMENT.

A Non Imm O-A 1-year extension for any other reason that retirement does NOT require the mandatory health-insurance requirement.

As this is Thailand some Immigration officers are confused by their own rules/regulations and may want to impose the health-insurance requirement when applying for the 1-year Non Imm O-A extension for reason of marriage.  In that case a call to the IO Helpdesk (1178) should quickly solve the matter and confirm that it is not applicable in that case.

Royal Thai Police Order 35/2562 section 2.22 item 6 refers only to O-A visas with regard to health insurance

[jacko45k]

Pedantic simply does not suffice......