Buying land

[Lamphen]

Good evening,

My wife and I have today found a plot of land close to Buriram City that we would like to buy.

Does anyone have any experience in buying a plot of land without using a lawyer?

Looking forward to hearing from you.

 

Kind regards

Lamphen

Edited August 9, 2020 by Lamphen

[mr mr]

don't do it without having every angle covered. odds are you will still be taken for a ride.

 

good luck. 

[Chris.B]

As a start, visit the seller at their home and ask for a copy of the chanote.

 

Doesn't your wife have family who can help her with this?

[blackcab]

1 hour ago, Lamphen said:

Does anyone have any experience in buying a plot of land without using a lawyer?

 

I have quite a lot of experience. What would you like to know?

[Misab]

Do you know farangs in the area, ask them about price on land. We once want to buy a pice of land. My wife went to the land office to hear about plans for the area. It showed the seller did not own the land. Surprise Surprise.

 

 

[baansgr]

Check Title and bounderies, which with Chanote should be clearly marked with numbered pegs.

Is water and electric easily connected...this can be expensive running electric lines to land if not already close by.

Is it on a government road for access, what level is the land, if filling to raise can be expensive.

Is there flooding in the area.

What are the neighbours like...recycling plant or businesses can be noisy.

Is there a boundry wall..again expensive to build.

And of course check the seller is actually the owner..name on UD matches that in Title with no loans attached.

 

[4MyEgo]

7 hours ago, Lamphen said:

Does anyone have any experience in buying a plot of land without using a lawyer?

Get a lawyer if its Chanote, they don't cost half as much as back in the old country. We didn't use one, but our land is not Chanote, the wife got the owner her grandmother to sign a letter with a map pegging out the land in the village, it was witnessed neighbours either side in the village its in and the mayor, it is one below Chanote.

 

It was cheap enough back and just about everyone in the village knows who owns what, and what a plot sells for, that said, it was strange to me at the time, coming from a property background, however I did say to my wife, I am only investing as much as I am prepared to lose and if in the future you lose it, because farangs cannot own land, (house now built), that's my 10% of my worth invested, and her reply was, if you think my grandmother and or her family are going to try to rip me off, you are mistaken, that said, only invest as much as your prepared to lose, have read lots of stories here, so do your due diligence.

[Lamphen]

8 hours ago, Chris.B said:

As a start, visit the seller at their home and ask for a copy of the chanote.

 

Doesn't your wife have family who can help her with this?

Yes, my wife's family will assist, but based on their explanation of the process I just find it to be too easy.

I was told "we just go to the bank together with the seller, pay the money (the bank get their part and the seller get his part), get the paper (the bank will release the paper), go to the land office and make the transfer.

It might be this easy, but I wanted to try to obtain some additional information before going to the bank.

[Lamphen]

7 hours ago, blackcab said:

 

I have quite a lot of experience. What would you like to know?

I was told "we just go to the bank together with the seller, pay the money (the bank get their part and the seller get his part), get the paper (the bank will release the paper), go to the land office and make the transfer.

Is it this straight forward?

[Lamphen]

2 hours ago, Misab said:

Do you know farangs in the area, ask them about price on land. We once want to buy a pice of land. My wife went to the land office to hear about plans for the area. It showed the seller did not own the land. Surprise Surprise.

 

 

Good idea, I do not know anybody in the area, but I can always knock on the door to the one farang in the area if he's home.

[Lamphen]

1 hour ago, baansgr said:

Check Title and bounderies, which with Chanote should be clearly marked with numbered pegs.

Is water and electric easily connected...this can be expensive running electric lines to land if not already close by.

Is it on a government road for access, what level is the land, if filling to raise can be expensive.

Is there flooding in the area.

What are the neighbours like...recycling plant or businesses can be noisy.

Is there a boundry wall..again expensive to build.

And of course check the seller is actually the owner..name on UD matches that in Title with no loans attached.

 

Thanks for the input, I'll check.

[Lamphen]

1 hour ago, 4MyEgo said:

Get a lawyer if its Chanote, they don't cost half as much as back in the old country. We didn't use one, but our land is not Chanote, the wife got the owner her grandmother to sign a letter with a map pegging out the land in the village, it was witnessed neighbours either side in the village its in and the mayor, it is one below Chanote.

 

It was cheap enough back and just about everyone in the village knows who owns what, and what a plot sells for, that said, it was strange to me at the time, coming from a property background, however I did say to my wife, I am only investing as much as I am prepared to lose and if in the future you lose it, because farangs cannot own land, (house now built), that's my 10% of my worth invested, and her reply was, if you think my grandmother and or her family are going to try to rip me off, you are mistaken, that said, only invest as much as your prepared to lose, have read lots of stories here, so do your due diligence.

Thanks, I'll ask around and check.

[blackcab]

2 hours ago, Lamphen said:

I was told "we just go to the bank together with the seller, pay the money (the bank get their part and the seller get his part), get the paper (the bank will release the paper), go to the land office and make the transfer.

Is it this straight forward?

 

That's not the normal process. If there is a mortgage secured on the property the mortgagee asks the bank for a settlement figure to be calculated for a specific date (the date of sale).

 

The purchaser goes to their bank the day before the sale and buys two cashier cheques. The first cheque is made payable to the mortgagee's bank for the quoted settlement figure. The second cheque is made payable to the seller for the balance of the purchase price. When you have the cheques you send a photo of the cheques to the seller so they can verify them.

 

On the day of the sale (normally the next day) the seller will have arranged for the bank's representative to be present at the land office.  The bank's representative will bring the original land title deed with them and give it to the land office official.

 

You give the cheque to pay off the mortgage to the bank's official. They will verify the cheque, then sign to remove the encumbrance on the land. Immediately thereafter the land will be sold between the seller and the purchaser.

 

When the chanote is received by the purchaser it will have two entries dated on the day of sale. The first entry will show the bank's encumbrance has been removed. The second entry will show the sale between the former owner and the current owner, who are both listed by name.

[Bender Rodriguez]

you will be owning nothing, paying is a different department

[LukKrueng]

So many replies and none (well, maybe 1) answers the actual question: do you need a lawyer for buying a property? Simple answer: no. 

The process of transferring names is very simple. Yes, you have to check the title dead at the local land office. You could also ask them to survey the plot and make sure the actual plot is a it shows on the chanot.

If the chanot is "red" you won't be able to transfer ownership until the stipulated date on the chanot. If its all free and clear you show up at the land office with the seller, sign a standard sell/buy contract, pay the transfer fee and get the chanot with your wife's name on it. 

If the property is mortgage - the ownership transfer can only be done after the debt is cleared. As far a i know you don't just go the the bank, pay the debt and get back the chanot, but you actuality have to set an appointment with the bank at the land office, clear the debt, remove the warning from the chanot, and then proceed with the process of ownership transfer. 

In any case - no need for a lawyer

[kingofthemountain]

7 minutes ago, LukKrueng said:

If its all free and clear you show up at the land office with the seller, sign a standard sell/buy contract, pay the transfer fee and get the chanot with your wife's name on it. 

You can have the names of the 2 persons on the chanote

the foreigner name and the Thai wife name. In case of the Thai

wife death, and if there is no will, the foreign husband is still the

owner of the land. However, as a foreigner doesn't have the right to own

land in Thailand, he has 1 year to sale it to a Thai.

[crazykopite]

Your question is very vague you fail to mention your wife’s nationality is she Thai or like you a foreigner

[how241]

I would recommend ONLY buying land with a full "Red-Bird"  Chanote.  You will have GPS markers showing exactly where your land starts and ends. Lower types of Chanotes have different levels of risk. 

[a10ams]

We bought land about seven years ago. No legal people there at all. Both parties went to the land office to do the chanote transfer. Job done.

 

It may have helped that this was between family members though.

[maprao]

Bought 3 plots of land no lawyers. No Chanotes as with most land in the boonies in Nakhon nowhere.

First in 2000 cheaper than a weekend  bender in Europe.

Second Slightly more expensive but still cheap.

Third expensive but still OK.

Total > 30 Rai

 

No Chanotes

No lawyers

Only owners villagage elders and the Puyai Bahn (village head).

 

Very relaxed as the sums involved were relatively small. Not so sure now. 

 

20 years happy carefree and trouble free living. May try and replicate the "Good life" series before retirement just for fun.

 

I would do it all again in a heart beat at those prices. Not so sure now with the prices I see people paying as both land and houses can be cheaper in both Spain and the US.

 

Happily did it in my wife's  name as "security" for her and my kids when I'm no longer around.

 

SUMMARY NOT NEEDED.

 

Good luck!

 

[The Fat Controller]

Both plots my wife bought just involved going to the land office with the seller, paying the assessed transfer tax, paying the seller and the Chanote was updated after a short wait.

 

If you are formally married, some offices require the foreign husband to sign a "declaration of no interest" in the land.

 

This can apparently be ignored in the event of divorce when assets acquired during a marriage are considered, but that's another topic.

[GreasyFingers]

19 hours ago, Lamphen said:

Does anyone have any experience in buying a plot of land without using a lawyer?

Yes, it is easy to do without a lawyer if you know how the system works here. Just listen to Blackcab post #13.

But before you do that get a copy of the chanote and go to the Land Office with your wife (do not go with the seller).

Check that the LO title is the same as the the one you were given, and get the wife to ask them if everything is okay with the title.

Then go to your local Tessaban and ask them if it possible to build on the land and if there are any restrictions.

 

If the title is not chanote think again.

[sometimewoodworker]

19 hours ago, Lamphen said:

 

Does anyone have any experience in buying a plot of land without using a lawyer?

Yes, no problems.

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, how241 said:

I would recommend ONLY buying land with a full "Red-Bird"  Chanote.  You will have GPS markers showing exactly where your land starts and ends. Lower types of Chanotes have different levels of risk. 

There is only 1 land paper that is a chanote (Nor. Sor. 4 Jor) none of the other land documents are chanotes 

[ChaiyaTH]

Never rush what does not need to be rushed. And never skip lawyer checks and paperwork.

[misterphil]

When we bought our land the land owner paid the land registry to come out to the plot and measure it in front of us. 
 

They gave us a copy of the measurements and confirmed what was on the Chanote and where the boundary markers were.

 

All parties happy we went to the land registry and handed over the cash and the Chanote transferred to my wife. 
 

Attached is the measurements confirming the size and a boundary marker example. 
 

Go see the land and there will be boundary markers. Those numbers must match whats on the Chanote. They generally have a concrete post with the marker next to them. 
 

I recommend having it measured and checked as I heard rumours that these markers get moved over the years by people trying to get a bit more land for free. 

[baansgr]

10 hours ago, Lamphen said:

Yes, my wife's family will assist, but based on their explanation of the process I just find it to be too easy.

I was told "we just go to the bank together with the seller, pay the money (the bank get their part and the seller get his part), get the paper (the bank will release the paper), go to the land office and make the transfer.

It might be this easy, but I wanted to try to obtain some additional information before going to the bank.

No, no, no......you meet at the land office, owner and bank rep, the mortgage amount is paid to the bank rep and the remaining of the sale price to the owner.....do not under any circumstances do as your wife's family have said.

[khunPer]

20 hours ago, Lamphen said:

Does anyone have any experience in buying a plot of land without using a lawyer?

Yes, I bought several plots of land, and also sold one, without use of a lawyer, neither by me or the seller/buyer, however the buyer needed a mortgage, so representatives from buyers bank showed up at land office when transfer was done, and paid by cashier's cheque on behalf of buyer.

 

When buying land I always make the agreement by head-of-village (poo yai ban). He will know the land plots, the legality of deeds, the people living in the village, etc., and he will sign documents as witness. Depending of the area he shall be paid a fee for the service, normally from 1,000 baht and up – a Thai wife should know what is fair, or can ask her in her network – depending of the size of land, and price. In Buriram probably in the level of what I paid in neighboring Surin, when buying land close to the city, which was 1,000 baht for a quite large plot in 2006, so probably around 2,000 baht today.

 

If a head-of-village's service is used in a tourist area with land prices of several millions baht, 5,000 to 10,000 baht is more likely a reasonable fee for the service; I used to pay 10,000 baht.

 

I've also once bought a plot directly from the seller, everything worked fine.

 

I've always used the standard agreements available from local paper shops, and a deposit is often paid upon signature. Sometimes an additional deposit can be transferred to a bank account, if it's a more expensive plot. The balance is paid a the land office when transferring the dead, often in cash, or by a bankers cheque. It's best to agree in advance how payments shall be made, and also remember to state in the sales agreement who shall pay tax, and who shall pay transfer fee and stamps. Normally seller pays tax, and buyer pays transfer fee, but transfer fee can sometime be shared.

????

[Acharn]

My niece just did it, but I'm afraid I don't know the details. Apparently she and her husband just went to the Land Office and asked what they needed to do. The helpful people there explained it all to them. 

[how241]

1 hour ago, sometimewoodworker said:

There is only 1 land paper that is a chanote (Nor. Sor. 4 Jor) none of the other land documents are chanotes 

Yes, you are correct.  I was using the term 'chanote' loosely to refer to the land ownership papers. Although many do buy and sell the 'other' types of land ownership papers,  I would only buy 'Chanote' as there can be problems with other claiming ownership later on. Usually, you will pay more for land with the true 'chanote'.