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Hope someone can help me here.

 

I bought this timer switch to control the floodlights connected to my alarm system.

 

It is a replacement for the switch that was in place, but it looks little different

 

When my home alarm get activated, floodlights go on as well, but not needed during daytime of course.

 

So I set this timer on 18.00 - off 07.00

 

Now I'm confused which of the 3 contacts at the bottom to connect the wires coming from the alarm panel, and which is the correct setting

 

image.png.43b9ef605493fc245e957b0ffe4f2f98.png

 

 

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The problem is that you are trying to run before you know you can walk.   disconnect  the time switch from everything    Follow the testing I listed    line and neutral to 1

If it follows the diagram z   1 and 2 are line and neutral permanently connected. Nothing to do with the load just powering the switch   3 is line in (to be switched) 4 is swi

If something is already in charge of turning the lights ON/OFF, I'd just take the LIVE LEG of the 220vac going to the lights and run it through your new timer.    Otherwise you need to under

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NC = Normally Closed (think power off state)

NO = Normally Open   (think timer triggered state)

POWER = External wire IN

 

Does the Alarm System have it's own power circuit to trigger an AC device (the lights)? Is it powered or an isolated relay (power by external source)?

Edited by RichCor
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8 minutes ago, RichCor said:

NC = Normally Closed (think power off state)

NO = Normally Open   (think triggered state_

POWER = External wire IN

I understand the meaning of NC and NO, but it doesn't make me any wiser which contacts to use, and what the correct settings should be.

 

Also, the switch is 220V, as was the previous one. My floodlights are obviously also 220V.

 

I know contact 1 and 2 get the 220V.

 

On the previous switch, 2 tiny wires went from 2 contacts at the bottom to a 12V relays.

 

I would think that if the top is 220V, the bottom contacts also get 220V

Edited by Susco
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If it follows the diagram z

 

1 and 2 are line and neutral permanently connected. Nothing to do with the load just powering the switch

 

3 is line in (to be switched)

4 is switched Normally Open to the load

5 is switched Normally closed to the load


so you need the 2 (3,4) in bold for your lights

 

However I’ve just had to swap out This one. The 3, 4, 5, may get mixed up. But as you only have line in and load out you can swap them round (if you are careful) while the power is on, I just did.

8D1956FD-B671-4311-85E6-FD016423C6BB.jpeg

Edited by sometimewoodworker
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I'd verify with a multimeter, Pins 3, 4, 5 should all be ISOLATED (non powered) from Pins 1, 2 (so no pass through).

 

You'd simply run one leg already powering the lights from the alarm system to pin 3 (Power), Then continue that leg from pin 4 (NO) on to the lights. Your Timer when should interrupt the power to the lights during the time you've set.

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4 minutes ago, RichCor said:

I'd verify with a multimeter, Pins 3, 4, 5 should all be ISOLATED (non powered) from Pins 1, 2 (so no pass through).

 

You'd simply run one leg already powering the lights from the alarm system to pin 3 (Power), Then continue that leg from pin 4 (NO) on to the lights. Your Timer when should interrupt the power to the lights during the time you've set.

Both wires at the bottom contacts of the previous switch go to the 12V relays

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2 minutes ago, Susco said:

Both wires at the bottom contacts of the previous switch go to the 12V relays

If something is already in charge of turning the lights ON/OFF, I'd just take the LIVE LEG of the 220vac going to the lights and run it through your new timer. 

 

Otherwise you need to understand the existing circuit (alarm system wired into the 12v relays, whose input or output was also previously 'switched' by the previous timer). I'd guest the old timer was controlling a 12v relay circuit that also itself controlled 220vac contacts.

 

So, what is your Alarm System outputing for triggering the lights ...12v or 220v

If 12v then I assume it's being used to run relays for 220v contacts to power the lights. If this is the case then you can either use the new timer to make/break the 12v going to the old relay, or the 220v LIVE Leg controlled by the 12v relays going to the lights. Two choices ...the new timer can be made to control either one.

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1 minute ago, RichCor said:

If something is already in charge of turning the lights ON/OFF, I'd just take the LIVE LEG of the 220vac going to the lights and run it through your new timer. 

 

Otherwise you need to understand the existing circuit (alarm system wired into the 12v relays, whose input or output was also previously 'switched' by the previous timer). I'd guest the old timer was controlling a 12v relay circuit that also itself controlled 220vac contacts.

 

So, what is your Alarm System outputing for triggering the lights ...12v or 220v

If 12v then I assume it's being used to run relays for 220v contacts to power the lights. If this is the case then you can either use the new timer to make/break the 12v going to the old relay, or the 220v LIVE Leg controlled by the 12v relays going to the lights. Two choices ...the new timer can be made to control either one.

The alarm system puts out 12 V to trigger the lights.

 

From the 12v relay wires go to a 220V contactor.

 

The wires that feed the switch are controlled by a breaker which is labelled floodlights

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Given that you'd stated that the lights are 220v (not 12v) then we have to assume:

 

The alarm system is powering via 12v the external relay circuit

The external relay circuit LOAD section is controlling a 220v load from a breaker, the output going to an external TIMER Power input, and Pin 'NO' direct to the lights.

 

You and I are thinking the same, the TIMER is just being replaced, just need to put those two wires from the 12 external relay circuit in the correct pin holes. (It shouldn't matter if it's 12v or 220v, the timer switch works the same for either one).

 

1 hour ago, Susco said:

It is a replacement for the switch that was in place, but it looks little different

Different in what way?

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13 minutes ago, RichCor said:

Given that you'd stated that the lights are 220v (not 12v) then we have to assume:

 

The alarm system is powering via 12v the external relay circuit

The external relay circuit LOAD section is controlling a 220v load from a breaker, the output going to an external TIMER Power input, and Pin 'NO' direct to the lights.

 

You and I are thinking the same, the TIMER is just being replaced, just need to put those two wires from the 12 external relay circuit in the correct pin holes. (It shouldn't matter if it's 12v or 220v, the timer switch works the same for either one).

 

Different in what way?

This is the previous switch, and the wires were connected to 4 & 5.

 

When I connect the new switch to 4 & 5  the lights don't work, even if I set the switch to on

 

China Digital LCD Programmable Timer Switch for AC 220V Hot Selling (THC 15A)  - China Time Switch

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If you follow the silk-screen diagram of the two timer relay switched pins

 

image.png.036bb9aeea5494abeb23fe196fbfe077.png  image.png.9bd9406c3a3dd4cc6d194497b307a415.png

 

The "Old" timer is

4 = Powered Common  ->  220v L Input from 12v relay controlled circuit

3 = Normally Closed

5 = Normally Open       ->  220v L Throughput when timer activated

 

The "New" timer is

3 = Powered Common  -> 220v L Input from 12v relay controlled circuit

5 = Normally Closed

4 = Normally Open        -> 220v L Throughput when timer activated

 

*if the "New" timer completed wired circuit works opposite to what you want, move the 220v L Throughput when timer activated from pin 4 to pin 5.  

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17 minutes ago, RichCor said:

If you follow the silk-screen diagram of the two timer relay switched pins

 

image.png.036bb9aeea5494abeb23fe196fbfe077.png  image.png.9bd9406c3a3dd4cc6d194497b307a415.png

 

The "Old" timer is

4 = Powered Common  ->  220v L Input from 12v relay controlled circuit

3 = Normally Closed

5 = Normally Open       ->  220v L Throughput when timer activated

 

The "New" timer is

3 = Powered Common  -> 220v L Input from 12v relay controlled circuit

5 = Normally Closed

4 = Normally Open        -> 220v L Throughput when timer activated

 

*if the "New" timer completed wired circuit works opposite to what you want, move the 220v L Throughput when timer activated from pin 4 to pin 5.  

 

Thanks we get there.

 

I had the input connected to 4 and the throughput to 3 and the lights worked when I activated the alarm this evening.

 

Does it matter if I switch 3 and 4?

 

I assume input is the wire that goes to the relay, and throughput the wire that comes from the alarm pane. Correct?

Edited by Susco
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12 minutes ago, Susco said:

Does it matter if I switch 3 and 4?

 

I assume input is the wire that goes to the relay, and throughput the wire that comes from the alarm pane. Correct?

As I mentioned previously, the Timer is being used as an ON/OFF switch and can switch either the 12v or 220v loads. If one of the wires comes direct from the alarm system, and the alarm only provides 12v power, then the timer as wired is being used to switch the 12v to the external 12v relay circuit (that in turn controls the 220v power to the lights).

 

As the timer is a replacement for an ON/OFF switch, wire polarity doesn't really matter, so long as one of them is attached to the common power pin 5 and the other to either pin 3 or pin 4 (as the timer controls the ON/OFF or OFF/ON state at those pins). 

 

Glad to read you got it running. 

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1 hour ago, RichCor said:

Glad to read you got it running. 

Here's another one for you.

 

Ordered from lazada and arrived today. It is supposed to be used for my 15V perimeter lights.

 

I ordered the 220V version, but it looks as if they send me the 12V version.

 

Only thing I don't understand is how it can have 12V input but 220V output.

 

To be clear, the timer sits between the 220V feed and the 15V transformer

 

IMG_20200917_110822.thumb.jpg.e2b527fb5ad7963183b226d0e21986f4.jpg

Edited by Susco
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38 minutes ago, Susco said:

Only thing I don't understand is how it can have 12V input but 220V output.

Think of it as an electric see-saw. When a child sits on the board one end goes down while the other goes up. The child stand up, the board moves in the opposite position.

 

Now, replace the child with a spring and wire-wound magnet. When de-energized the spring pulls the board down (and the other end of the see-saw board goes up), but when the wire-wound magnet i energized and can overcome the pull of the spring the board pulls up (and the other end of the see-saw board goes down). This side of the electro-magnetic relay can be whatever volts is necessary to control the mechanism.

 

The OTHER side of the see-saw can now be used as an isolated SWITCH because something can make it go up or down. If metal contacts are place on this other end of the see-saw it can be made to MAKE a contact when in the extreme DOWN position or contact when in the extreme UP position.

 

So, one end of the see-saw controls what happens on the other end ...but the two ends are ISOLATED. A 5v or 12v power supply can make movement on one end, and *whatever* voltage can effectively be switched ON/OFF or OFF/ON at the other end --the only real limit of what voltage (and amperage) can be effectively 'switched' is the design of the of the spring/wire-wound magnet on one end of the see-saw and the contact pads making/breaking electrical contacts on the other.

 

See: https://electrosome.com/electromagnetic-relay/

Edited by RichCor
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