Request to Apply for "12 Mnt." Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay on basis of A_staying with my Thai Child PLUS B_my per Mnt. Personal Income being at, or above, THB 40k, was declined ; BUT,- I was advised apply for "60 Day" Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay

[Our Man in the Tropics]

Dear Fellow Thaivisa.com Posters,

 

I would greatly appreciate yer positive constructive relevant answers to the question I pose below report

 

REPORT ;

1_

Non-Immigrant Visa Type "O" Visa obtained PRIOR TO C-19 ...demic ;

Basis / Reason ;

"Staying with Thai Child"

I received Permission-to-Stay of 90 Days upon presenting my passport at Thailand land-border checkpoint.

 

2_

Upon "Hello" visit, recently, to my Local Immigration Office :

 

2_1_

said :

do NOT submit Application for Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay to get 12 Mnt.s based on :

A_

Staying with my Thai Child

PLUS

B_

my per Mnt. Personal Income" being at, or above, THB 40k

BUT RATHER :

2_1_1_

apply only for plain 60 Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay,

&

2_1_2_

within that 60 day window period apply for "12 Mnt." Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay.

 

2_2_

accepted -- upon my specific rhetorical question -- that foreigner can get "12 Mnt." Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay based on :

A_

Staying with my Thai Child

PLUS

B_

"my per Mnt. Personal Income" being at, or above, THB 40k ;

But,- they reiterated that they would NOT entertain such an application from me, but rather they invite me to apply for plain-old "60" day Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay ONLY.

 

2_3_

bring Birth Certicate for my Thai child [ even though they have record of I having done so previously during visit to their office by me with my Thai child & the child's mother ]* for that Application for 60 Day Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay  ;

 

*That "family-visit" + "showing of Birth Certificate" upon the Immigration Office's request

 

3_

Yesterday,- I applied for 60 Day Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay.

I received the 60 Day Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay.

 

4_

Upon my question of "when to return to Immigration Office ?",- I was told :

 

4_1_

return within the final 2 weeks of the 60 days of Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay.

 

BUT -- BUT -- BUT

4_2_

keep abreast of all Thailand Government notices to foreigners meanwhile ;

Because,- I -- with a general mass of foreigners -- may be directed to leave the country.

 

4_3_

my Visa is finished now

I replied that I think my Visa is finished as soon as I am allowed to enter Thailand with Permission-to-Stay.

 

NOTE ;

No mention by these very staff, so familiar with my circumstance, to apply for "12 Mnt." Extension of Stay when I get the 60 Day Extension-of-Permission-to-Stay as originally advised during their direction on initial visit [ above ].

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

QUESTION ;

GVEN MY LOCAL IMMIGRATION OFFICE'S MOST RECENT RESPONSE,- HOW -- DURING THE NEXT 58 DAYS WITHIN THAILAND -- CAN I OBTAIN "12 MNT." EXTENSION-OF-PERMISSION-TO-STAY THAT IS BASED ON :

A_

I STAYING WITH MY THAI CHILD

PLUS

B_

I HAVING PER MNT. PERSONAL INCOME AT, OR ABOVE, THB 40k ?

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

NOTE ;

I have found Thai civil servants to be exemplary in attitude to me a foreigner despite my own civil servants** being typically most hostile to "non-connected" indiginous citizens of my country.

**

I acknowledge my own civil servants are typically very facilitating to non-indigenous persons in, & outside, my country ;

So,- I suppose they typically are not the baddest they can be

????

 

 

Thanking yee all in advance for yer most kind helpful replies.

 

Kind Regards,

 

Our Man in the Tropics

Edited September 26, 2020 by Our Man in the Tropics

[treetops]

You might want to re-write that without all the bolding, capitals, abbreviations, dashes, underscores etc. if you want an informed response.  It's too difficult to follow the way it is.

[Our Man in the Tropics]

15 minutes ago, treetops said:

You might want to re-write that without all the bolding, capitals, abbreviations, dashes, underscores etc. if you want an informed response.  It's too difficult to follow the way it is.

I accept ur opinion as being valid about my post not being a fluid read ;

Not being fluid in the lyrical sense.

 

But, because I wish to be stringently abiding to THE FACTS ONLY & avoid confusion & also to edify novices per the terms & possibilities Re ; Thailand's Visas & Permission-of-Stays & Extension-of-Permission-of-Stays, which I have gleaned very much so from knowledgeable posters on this blog [ e.g. Ubon Joe ],- I feel need to use the Style of Language, & the formatting, which I do in this blog per such matters.

 

I trust that this presentation is most appreciated by those with legal, & technical, & otherwise smart, mind-set per such matters.

 

Of course,- I have different choicest writing approaches for other respective matters.

 

Thanks for replying anyway treetops ;

I viewed it as not a troll reply anyway.

 

Kind Regards,

 

Our Man in the Tropics

Edited September 26, 2020 by Our Man in the Tropics

[BritTim]

If applying for a 12-month permission to stay based on income, try to get a letter from your embassy confirming your income. At many immigration offices, they will not entertain extensions based on income, from those who ought to be able to get an embassy income letter, without it.

[Our Man in the Tropics]

30 minutes ago, BritTim said:

If applying for a 12-month permission to stay based on income, try to get a letter from your embassy confirming your income. At many immigration offices, they will not entertain extensions based on income, from those who ought to be able to get an embassy income letter, without it.

I informed the immigration office on 1st visit that I can get proof of income ;

Proof from bank was not objected to.

Indeed,- the proof from the bank is very clear that it comes from outside of Thailand & as 1 amount only per month.

 

Still,- the immigration office initially said that they want me to apply for 60 day Extension-for-Permission-of-Stay [ EFPOS ] ONLY.

 

Super big problem -- incl. Income for Thai family -- if foreign parent leave Thailand & try to return.

Immigration knows that my little familyis depending on me for survival.

 

Why not apply "Rule of Law" to the righteous foreign weaker party who fulfills the criteria by allowing them to apply for "12 Mnt." EFPOS ?

Edited September 26, 2020 by Our Man in the Tropics

[ubonjoe]

Are you the legal parent of you child by way of marriage or legitimization of your parenthood?

Does your embassy still issue a proof of income document that could be used to prove the 40k baht income?

How many months of transfers from abroad do you have that you can prove?

[userabcd]

34 minutes ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

 

Deleted

Edited September 26, 2020 by userabcd

[Our Man in the Tropics]

24 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Are you the legal parent of you child by way of marriage or legitimization of your parenthood?

Does your embassy still issue a proof of income document that could be used to prove the 40k baht income?

How many months of transfers from abroad do you have that you can prove?

1_

Legal Parent of my Thai Child by way of Legitimization of Parenthood

They have copies of all the proof of that, & more, at this very office.

 

2_

Do not know if Embassy still issue Proof of Income document

But,- proof from Thai bank -- & a branch directly next to them & which they use I am led to understand -- was not objected to ;

Also,- proof from this Thai bank brand was accepted for initial Non-Immigrant Visa "O" based on Staying with My Thai Child was accepted by Thailand Consulate at issuing Consulate [ Savanakhet, Laos ].

 

3_

3 or 4 transfers from abroad ;

Thus beyond the minimum as specified by Thailand Police Order 777/2551

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

The seemingly-so main decision-maker [ female ] at the Thai immigration office said on my initial visit :

this office will not give 12 Mnt. EFPOS ahead of learning what the Thai Government says over next few months

8-)

 

Edited September 26, 2020 by Our Man in the Tropics

[Peter Denis]

11 minutes ago, userabcd said:

To translate your non o visa to extension of stay in the country, the first step is for imm to issue a 60 day extension of stay.

 

This allows you to sort out the paperwork and funds and docs needed for when you apply for last step of 12 month extension of stay.

 

Just before the expiry of the 60 day extension of stay you now have, you return back to immigration with the necessary docs and you apply for the 12 month ext of stay.

If OP is eligible for the 1-year extension of stay based on his Non Imm O Visa, and meets all the requirements, there is NO NEED for an intermediate short-stay extension (like the 60-day one).  That would only be necessary if he was not yet able to meet the requirements for his 1-year extension of stay application, such that the short-stay extension would allow him to get hold of the required documents or meet the seasoning requirement of his funds.

Note; When applying for the 1-year extension of stay for reason of Thai dependent child, there is no seasoning requirement when using the 400K funds-in-bank method.  But as he would use the +40K monthly income transfer method, he would normally be required to show 12 of such transfers (with foreign origins proven) during each and every of the 12 months preceding his application.  And on top of that his local IO might require him to provIde evidence of the SOURCE of those transfers, depending upon his nationality that would be an Embassy income-letter or a document proving foreign income.

[userabcd]

1 minute ago, Peter Denis said:

If OP is eligible for the 1-year extension of stay based on his Non Imm O Visa, and meets all the requirements, there is NO NEED for an intermediate short-stay extension (like the 60-day one).  That would only be necessary if he was not yet able to meet the requirements for his 1-year extension of stay application, such that the short-stay extension would allow him to get hold of the required documents or meet the seasoning requirement of his funds.

Note; When applying for the 1-year extension of stay for reason of Thai dependent child, there is no seasoning requirement when using the 400K funds-in-bank method.  But as he would use the +40K monthly income transfer method, he would normally be required to show 12 of such transfers (with foreign origins proven) during each and every of the 12 months preceding his application.  And on top of that his local IO might require him to provIde evidence of the SOURCE of those transfers, depending upon his nationality that would be an Embassy income-letter or a document proving foreign income.

Thanks Peter, that is correct.

[ubonjoe]

18 minutes ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

2_

Do not know if Embassy still issue Proof of Income document

What is your nationality. If from the UK, US or Australia they do not do them. Most other will issue them.

 

18 minutes ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

3_

3 or 4 transfers from abroad ;

Thus beyond the minimum as specified by Thailand Police Order 777/2551

Many office want a 12 months of transfers. The immigration order allowing them issued in 2018 states 2 is enough for the first extension application but most offices want 12 months of transfers.

That police order was rescinded in August of 2014 when order 327/2557 went into effect.

 

[Our Man in the Tropics]

5 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

What is your nationality. If from the UK, US or Australia they do not do them. Most other will issue them.

 

Many office want a 12 months of transfers. The immigration order allowing them issued in 2018 states 2 is enough for the first extension application but most offices want 12 months of transfers.

That police order was rescinded in August of 2014 when order 327/2557 went into effect.

 

1_

 

1_1_

I prefer not to disclose my nationality to the forum ;

Suffice to say that it is neither of UK nor USA nor Australia.

My own Dept. of Foreign Affairs [ generic name ] are renowned [ too polite a word ] worldwide for being trucculent, & worse, to righteous "non-connected" -- & moreso when vulnerable -- indigenous citizens ;

So,- I prefer to avoid approaching them.

And,- I wish to avoid them being privy to my details.

 

1_2_

All proofs from Thai bank are very clear that my monthly funds is :

a_

my personal income only [ not joint account & for my receiving only ]

b_

sent directly from foreign country AND not earned in Thailand

c_

regular amount in that foreign currency

d_

now above THB 40k

 

2_

My mention of some 3 months of this over-the-threshold income was not objected to as being too few a number of months for 12 Mnt. Extension.

i.e.

it was reasonably understood thus as being sufficient number of Mnt.s for this Immigration office.

 

3_

Thank u for this update ;

That police order* was rescinded in August of 2014 when order 327/2557 went into effect

*777/2551

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Apologies for delay in replying ;

My device is acting up.

 

 

[BritTim]

If, for whatever reason, you cannot risk letting your embassy know you are here, the embassy letter confirming income will obviously not be an option. As @ubonjoe informed you, many immigration offices, in the absence of the letter, want to see 12 months of transfers for an extension of stay based on income. They may or may not relax the requirement if you have proof of transfers for each month you have been here even though less than one year. I understand that you do not want to hear this, and feel it is unfair, but you either follow the rules set by your local immigration office or use an agent or leave Thailand.

[Our Man in the Tropics]

22 minutes ago, BritTim said:

If, for whatever reason, you cannot risk letting your embassy know you are here, the embassy letter confirming income will obviously not be an option. As @ubonjoe informed you, many immigration offices, in the absence of the letter, want to see 12 months of transfers for an extension of stay based on income. They may or may not relax the requirement if you have proof of transfers for each month you have been here even though less than one year. I understand that you do not want to hear this, and feel it is unfair, but you either follow the rules set by your local immigration office or use an agent or leave Thailand.

 

My embassy & consulate know very well that I am here ;

Indeed,- I had to correct them inside & outside the premises on mal-behavior more than once.

And,- atimes successfully so.

 

Still,- it would be proper that I avoid contacting them for income letter request ;

Not least because I wish to avoid them self-humiliating themselves in providing it for me ;

And,- it FREE of cost to me because of my special circumstances ;

And,- that established by precedents to me.

Other than the prohibitive costs for me in travelling to, & fro, Bangkok, & staying overnight etc.

Magnanimity is a virtue I refuse to flout even in C-19...demic chaotic times ;

 

I very much welcome quality relevant information even if I feel, or accordingly "know", that the implications of the information is "unfair" to me & my little family.

 

Thanks for ur thoughtful reply BritTim.

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Apologies to u too for delay in responding ;

Again,- my device & internet connection, are acting-up.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

RICIPROCAL RIGHTS [ GIVEN TO LOS IMMIGRANTS ] FOR FALANGS START WITH OUR CONSULATES BEING RIGHTEOUS TO ITS CITIZENS

 

Regards,

Our Man in the Tropics

 

[Max69xl]

2 hours ago, Our Man in the Tropics said:

1_

 

1_1_

I prefer not to disclose my nationality to the forum ;

Suffice to say that it is neither of UK nor USA nor Australia.

My own Dept. of Foreign Affairs [ generic name ] are renowned [ too polite a word ] worldwide for being trucculent, & worse, to righteous "non-connected" -- & moreso when vulnerable -- indigenous citizens ;

So,- I prefer to avoid approaching them.

And,- I wish to avoid them being privy to my details.

 

1_2_

All proofs from Thai bank are very clear that my monthly funds is :

a_

my personal income only [ not joint account & for my receiving only ]

b_

sent directly from foreign country AND not earned in Thailand

c_

regular amount in that foreign currency

d_

now above THB 40k

 

2_

My mention of some 3 months of this over-the-threshold income was not objected to as being too few a number of months for 12 Mnt. Extension.

i.e.

it was reasonably understood thus as being sufficient number of Mnt.s for this Immigration office.

 

3_

Thank u for this update ;

That police order* was rescinded in August of 2014 when order 327/2557 went into effect

*777/2551

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Apologies for delay in replying ;

My device is acting up.

 

 

Most immigration offices do require an income letter from your embassy/consulate if you're using the monthly income method. Just because you don't like your embassy won't help you at all.