American expat charged with defamation after leaving multiple negative reviews online

[Huckenfell]

On 9/27/2020 at 1:15 AM, Orac said:

Barrow also put a response from the reviewer up to the resorts statement but I assume before this story was posted.

 

After reading the "full" facts, in my personal opinion, you deserve it.

[ChipButty]

I've just looked through T/A reviews on this hotel the review from the American has been removed and some notice at the top of the page, I went through 16 pages of their reviews and came across 1 bad review, experts say most people only read about 12 to 14 reviews either book or move on, I know from experience the bad reviews have a habit of dropping to the bottom of the pile.

One thing I did notice the bad review the hotel never responded to it like they did with all the others.

For all concerned I hope they can sort this amicably yep the American guy has no chance, the hotel I doubt would get any financial gain apart from seeing the guy get jail. 

Im all for sitting around the table and talking about this, 

[stevenl]

On 9/26/2020 at 10:11 PM, Orac said:

How do TripAdvisor reviews work as the ‘guest’ claims that his first review with the human slavery allegation was never published yet the resort have a screenshot of it in their statement - do hotels get to vet reviews before publication?

It gets published, the tourism business gets an email saying a review has been published. The business can object to it or react, but it stays published till objection has been deemed to be correct. Not many grounds to object, and not easy to get reviews removed.

 

That from someone who had fake reviews (non existing customers) on TripAdvisor.

 

The reviewer made a big mistake (legally) by encouraging others not to stay. That potentially costs money, and he is therefor liable for damages. Stating facts is different from his review.

Edited September 28, 2020 by stevenl

[Staxer]

Dumb American! 

[FarFlungFalang]

1 hour ago, connda said:

Going full court press with a criminal law-suit? 

Zone or man to man press?If I was a competing hotel or group of hotels I couldn't think of a better way to deliver a double team resulting in an ejection from the game due to a technical foul! It's a cut throat business and sometimes literally.

[Mr Meeseeks]

This has now made international news and made Thailand and the hotel in question look very bad indeed.  

 

The damage done to the tourism industry by arresting and prosecuting this American man will make the online reviews pale into utter insignificance in comparison.

 

Another case of Thais acting without thinking of the consequences of their actions. All too common here.

 

The elephant in the room is obviously the Thai criminal defamation laws. Everyone should have the right to leave a negative review without fear of criminal prosecution or vilification. Civil action should obviously still be an option of course if the affected party decides to sue. 

 

To those saying that the American man deserves his predicament, get a grip of yourselves.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

Not sure what to make of this. 

Some people can take a bad experience too personally and seriously. I think his complaints are a bit over the top .. corkage is normal and the slavery comment is silly. Would have thought removing the reviews would have done the job though. I can see why a hotel owner would not be happy at a recalcitrant reviewer ignoring requests to remove unfair posts. 

For what it's worth I have stayed there about 6 times with my Thai girlfriend. I could be there now if not for Covid. Surprisingly affordable in low season too. 

It is like a paradise with sloping hills in beautiful forest down to a beautiful private beach. Lots of monkeys, butterflies, old beautiful trees with amazing outlooks thus the name. Big waterfall in low season. The restaurant at the top where you have breakfast is sensational. Who knows if the buffet will come back with covid. Staff seemed nice and happy. Thai girls love it because photo opportunities abound. 

Stayed at over many hotels in Koh Chang and this is our current favourite though White Sand beach is the best beach. See my 5 star reviews on TripAdvisor.

 

 

Edited September 28, 2020 by Fat is a type of crazy

[Somtamnication]

A bit too far, but the guy was asking for trouble by posting after posting, clearly upset.

[HaleySabai]

The customer's all-ways wrong!

[Mick501]

13 hours ago, JensenZ said:

As a sophisticated evaluator of reviews. you might not take much notice of a 1 star review, but many would. At the very least, such a review might leave some undecided viewers uneasy, and they might move onto the next hotel in their search (which has no 1-star reviews) as there is never any shortage of options. "Why take the chance", they might think. It is a competitive market and hoteliers take 1 star reviews very seriously, as they should.

 

 

Every hotel has some 1 star reviews.  Just by observation but in Thailand more so than most other countries, many of those seem to be from competitors.  Easy to tell because they are always the first review by the person,  generally cluster in a short time frame, and have similar writing style.  

 

But yeah, it does reduce the overall rating, so if you simply look at how many stars the hotel has, then you would be decieved.  

[Sonyboy]

What I have seen with these travel firms, hotel companies is they make a big issue about you giving them your experience with the hotel you were staying, when you give an honest appraisal of your stay it's fine and dandy as long as it's never an honest bad appraisal, if it is a bad one you can expect to be removed from the comments section and get stick and threats from the hotel people, and that's for your stay all around the world not just Thailand, they shouldn't ask for your opinion if they only want the good ones.

[Sonyboy]

1 hour ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

This has now made international news and made Thailand and the hotel in question look very bad indeed.  

 

The damage done to the tourism industry by arresting and prosecuting this American man will make the online reviews pale into utter insignificance in comparison.

 

Another case of Thais acting without thinking of the consequences of their actions. All too common here.

 

The elephant in the room is obviously the Thai criminal defamation laws. Everyone should have the right to leave a negative review without fear of criminal prosecution or vilification. Civil action should obviously still be an option of course if the affected party decides to sue. 

 

To those saying that the American man deserves his predicament, get a grip of yourselves.

Know what you mean, different subject same sort of thing, I have bought many products from Lazada over the years and have received fantastic response from Lazada and the sellers, until the other day, I bought an electrical item and after a few days it broke, so contacted the sellers in Bangkok, they said they would refund my cash, on the condition I removed my review about the broken item, nothing bad just said it was a bit poor breaking so quick, I think it was the one star that got them upset, anyway I should have done the old 'yes sir, three bags full sir', it ended up after them getting very triggered after many messages still demanding I remove my comment, so I told them to keep my refund and I would give them a miss from now on, and to have a nice day, a lot of words for such a trivial thing but I just wanted to show how quick and angry some can get over a very tiny thing.

[sncoem]

Hotel owner and managers are liar and cheaters. They push google and tripadvisor to delete all reviews.

Sue me if you want, and if you can find me ????

 

 

[ujayujay]

Cheap Charlie bites the dust????

[Mike k]

On 9/26/2020 at 9:18 PM, 4evermaat said:

appx $17 USD .  It is to discourage people from bringing in outside drinks to their restaurant.   Of course you could probably consume it in the hotel room (or anywhere outside of that particular restaurant) without any problems.

 

Just go to a different restaurant if it really bothers you.

I stayed in a hotel that charges 30 bhat for water from the fridge in the room I bring my own water and have never had a problem but I drink it in the room

[Don Mega]

3 hours ago, Dustdevil said:

Did he cause damaging reputation loss?

several members of TVF have said in this thread they would not stay at this resort based upon these events, so yes the place has suffured a loss.

[sncoem]

6 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

several members of TVF have said in this thread they would not stay at this resort based upon these events, so yes the place has suffured a loss.

 

And it's just the beginning ! When google and other dixx who control the world will stop deleting all negatives reviews, people will keep posting and the resort is dead as it deserves it.

 

 

[ChipButty]

31 minutes ago, Mike k said:

I stayed in a hotel that charges 30 bhat for water from the fridge in the room 

30 Baht thats cheap I've seen 120 Baht ++

[JensenZ]

11 hours ago, RefinedGentleman said:

A tourist thrown in jail for posting a bad review? Imagine the losses this resort will see as a result of this story making international news. Now compare that to the corkage fee they wanted. Dumb! Add in the already difficult climate with Covid and tourism and it's even dumber. Whatever you might think of this American guy, the resort has completely screwed themselves with their actions.

 

In Thailand this is a criminal case, to be tried in a court of law. Tourism and what is good or bad for it is a political issue. They cannot change the laws just to help out one foreigner. Normal legal procedures are being followed here, so who exactly is being dumb and dumber? These laws have been around for a long time, long before covid struck, and of course the lawyers and the court are only considering the case, not any consequences it may have on tourism. That's an issue for the politicians to resolve, and would require the laws to be changed.

 

There is no free speech in Thailand. If they want that, they have to find another country to expat in.

[ChipButty]

2 minutes ago, sncoem said:

 

And it's just the beginning ! When google and other dixx who control the world will stop deleting all negatives reviews, people will keep posting and the resort is dead as it deserves it.

 

 

Calm down Lad 

[JensenZ]

3 hours ago, hellohello123 said:

for the record food poisoning takes anything between 8-48 hours for symptons to show, unless the food is laced with cyanide

Symptoms can arrive as soon as 30 minutes in some cases.

[Ohyesuare]

16 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

several members of TVF have said in this thread they would not stay at this resort based upon these events, so yes the place has suffured a loss.

The same members that probably subsist off other people's leftovers in Big C food courts like I've seen a few expats doing and considering the American said he was paying 6000 baht a night, I don't think it's any loss from those members saying they won't stay there.

[JensenZ]

3 hours ago, ChipButty said:

I've just looked through T/A reviews on this hotel the review from the American has been removed and some notice at the top of the page, I went through 16 pages of their reviews and came across 1 bad review, experts say most people only read about 12 to 14 reviews either book or move on, I know from experience the bad reviews have a habit of dropping to the bottom of the pile.

One thing I did notice the bad review the hotel never responded to it like they did with all the others.

For all concerned I hope they can sort this amicably yep the American guy has no chance, the hotel I doubt would get any financial gain apart from seeing the guy get jail. 

Im all for sitting around the table and talking about this, 

No, this will only be resolved (stay out of jail) by a monetary settlement and the money grab will happen twice. First in a courthouse mediation session (basically pay up or go to jail), and later on in a civil case to claim damages which always follows criminal defamation cases. They don't give a sh*t if he goes to jail or not - they want money. The lawyer and the plaintiff, and in civil cases the lawyer gets at least 10% of the settlement amount.

[John Drake]

19 hours ago, Rockbottom said:

I've been here 25 years and worked for and hired Thai people. Seems to me after 16 years you still don't get it. Take 10 more.

Well, I came over during the Pleistocene! I knew Bangkok when there was ice covering Soi 33.

[JensenZ]

5 hours ago, Boomer6969 said:

This isn't "All it is".

It was until you deleted 2 of my 3 paragraphs, and changed the context of my reply.

[StefanBBK]

6 hours ago, rkidlad said:

Well, your experience of a hotel can be subjective. 
 

You think the receptionist was rude, or the service wasn’t up to your standard, etc. That’s why when I read reviews I can spot the unreasonable looking ones and the ones that seem to make sense. Good or bad. 

Exactly. Only few performances can be measured with some degree of objectivity. To wait 20 minutes for a beverage, or to get cold food is objectively bad. But friendliness for example comes in many facettes. What one thinks is friendly, some else may considers plainly rude. Depending on the cultural background.  

Anyway, I will continue to review as objective as I can, and be nice about it. If I don't like something, I will also say so. 

 

[Ratcher]

1 hour ago, JensenZ said:

In Thailand this is a criminal case, to be tried in a court of law. Tourism and what is good or bad for it is a political issue. They cannot change the laws just to help out one foreigner. Normal legal procedures are being followed here, so who exactly is being dumb and dumber? These laws have been around for a long time, long before covid struck, and of course the lawyers and the court are only considering the case, not any consequences it may have on tourism. That's an issue for the politicians to resolve, and would require the laws to be changed.

 

There is no free speech in Thailand. If they want that, they have to find another country to expat in.

The American imo went overboard with what he did. If there is a chance that this could happen again the answer is simple. DO NOT REVIEW ANY HOTELS, RESTAURANTS etc. while in Thailand. Keep a low profile. If you've had a bad experience vote with you feet and boycott the establishment 

[KhunFred]

This is what happens when you forget that there is no guarantee of free speech in Thailand.

[CorpusChristie]

Just now, KhunFred said:

This is what happens when you forget that there is no guarantee of free speech in Thailand.

Many Countries have laws which stop people attacking Companies/other people

[Berkshire]

23 hours ago, nervona81732 said:

I'll never go there now. There just XXXX canned my BIZ. 

Hmmm....and you would have stayed there if management let the crappy review stand?  That doesn't make much sense.