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Sometime in the next couple of years we will probably replace our car with something more current. I would consider buying a plug-in hybrid, so if I am going to change my set-up to include a back-up generator, maybe it would be a good time to also prepare for somewhere to put the charging station.  

 

Out car port is not too far from where I will put the new box for the change-over switch, over current device etc., so it will be fairly simple to run new wiring from the box to the future charging station. Running supply to the charging station from our main CU would be much more complicated. I would think that 6 sq.mm. wiring would be enough, or is a heavier gauge required (I have read that chargers for electric cars typically are 16/32 Amp)?  I do have normal outlets in the water tank room next to the car port, but they are only supplied via 2.5 sq.mm. wiring and protected by a 20 Amp breaker, so insufficient for an electric vehicle fast charger.

 

I would have to split the incoming supply, so is there some kind of DIN rail "two-way splitter" device, that I could install in the new box in preparation for a possible future charging station? I will not do the rest of the wiring until I know for sure that my next car will be plug-in. Would such a device go before or after the change-over switch for the generator? I will not need to charge the car when running the generator (the generator probably couldn't handle it anyway).

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Thanks Crossy.

 

When you say "a couple of these" I assume you mean one for the live wire and one for neutral? Some of the devices looks a little confusing to me (more than one input), and others seem over the top for what I need (e.g. supporting up to 120 sq.mm. wires). Would the JUT11-80 be the most suitable one for me, since my incomer is 16 sq.mm and I would need 16 sq.mm (to the main CU) and 10 sq.mm (to the charging station) wires coming out?

 

So this splitter would go before the generator change-over switch, and I assume with it's own dedicated breaker between the splitter and the new charging station?

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Yeah, one for each L and N. Best bet is to sketch out what you intend doing and we can review and modify.

 

It is probably best to split the incoming unless you intend having a big genset.

 

I'd go for the 125, they're only a buck more expensive.

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It's not about the price, but I'm not sure I understand how the JUT11-125 is supposed to work:

image.png.1f1c18269131b2c91b79c25217155f4e.png

Why is there two incoming ports, is it just so to support different wire thicknesses? And what does the outgoing "x6 ... x4" mean? I understand that it supports wires between 2.5 sq.mm. and 16 sq.mm., but I can see six tightening screws, so where does the "x4" come in.

 

Edit: I just noticed that the U.S. description is different, it doesn't include the "x4" part.

Edited by Sophon
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A relevant video about EV vehicle earthing systems and the interesting ways (sometimes deadly ways) you can screw up by not knowing what you can and should do

 

 

Edited by sometimewoodworker
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10 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

A relevant video about EV vehicle earthing systems and the interesting ways (sometimes deadly ways) you can screw up by not knowing what you can and should do

 

John Ward does some excellent videos definitely worth watching.

 

Thailand is TN-C-S with MEN (equivalent to UK PME) so your charge point should be TT earthed and bonded to any metalwork of the car port to keep everything at the same potential if something goes awry.

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I was thinking something like this:913748626_OutsideCU2.jpg.8c16e2c9dc8b7daa9551d68f9d5e99db.jpg

 

I am fairly confident that I don't understand how the surge protection device works, so I have almost certainly got that part wrong. I have put the generator changeover switch first, because I currently don't have any means of isolating the mains, if I need to make changes to the parts of the CUs that are live, other than pulling the live wire at the meter. So I wanted to use the changeover switch for that, turning it to generator power (when the generator is not running), would turn everything off.

 

However, thinking about it, I should for safety reasons probably have a RCBO in the new box, and use that as a means of turning everything off instead.

Edited by Sophon
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Looks pretty OK.

 

I would put an isolator/MCB between the transfer switch and the grid supply. So you can isolate everything for service.

 

Do NOT connect your charge port to the grid earth, bang in a local rod well away from any other rod. Connect that rod to any exposed metalwork in your car port too. Did you watch the above video?

 

Does your genset have an earth terminal? Connect it.

 

Be careful with any RCBO in front of a N-E (MEN) link.

 

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10 minutes ago, Crossy said:

Looks pretty OK.

 

I would put an isolator/MCB between the transfer switch and the grid supply. So you can isolate everything for service.

 

Do NOT connect your charge port to the grid earth, bang in a local rod well away from any other rod. Connect that rod to any exposed metalwork in your car port too. Did you watch the above video?

 

Does your genset have an earth terminal? Connect it.

 

Be careful with any RCBO in front of a N-E (MEN) link.

 

 

How far is "well away"? The car port is about ten meters away from our current earth rod, and it doesn't have any exposed metalwork.

 

I haven't bought a generator yet, so I don't know if it will have an earth terminal or not.

 

No, I didn't watch the video yet but will do. I will not do any of the wiring for the EV charging port until I know that I will be buying a plug-in hybrid. That will probably be at least a couple of years down the line. But if I am going to rewire for the generator, O/U voltage protection and surge protection, I want to prepare the connections in the box (and only that) for a potential charge station.

 

It's not that we really need a generator, we probably only have an average of one black-out per month (mostly in the rainy season), and they seldom lasts more than an hour. But life gets boring and uncomfortable very quickly when the power is out, so it's a luxury that we would be prepared to pay for (within reason).

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This is our carport:
DSCI1308.thumb.JPG.1d143b75149808f837dc5c7699daf037.JPG

 

The charging port would probably be somewhere on the wall to the right of where the car is parked. The water tank room on the left already have plugs, but only supports up to 20A. Maybe that would be enough anyway, the car would always be charged at night so quick charging is not a priority. We only drive an average of about 600km per month.

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1 hour ago, Sophon said:

How far is "well away"? The car port is about ten meters away from our current earth rod, and it doesn't have any exposed metalwork.

 

I haven't bought a generator yet, so I don't know if it will have an earth terminal or not.

 

No, I didn't watch the video yet but will do.

Your proposed wiring has the potential to have the car live at 230V so as a minimum can encourage some very interesting sensations all the way to you or others being the central feature in the local cremation ceremony.

 

I posted the video with the warning for a good reason, and that is to prevent such excitement. WATCH the video and some or all your questions will be answered in more detail than you can easily get from even the qualified people here. After watching it we will be happy to answer questions.

Edited by sometimewoodworker
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10 hours ago, Sophon said:

How far is "well away"? The car port is about ten meters away from our current earth rod, and it doesn't have any exposed metalwork.

I haven't bought a generator yet, so I don't know if it will have an earth terminal or not.

 

Sorry I wasn't clearer, "well away" is usually accepted as 2 x rod length, so with the standard Thai 2.4m rod that's about 5m. Your genset will have an earth terminal, I was just surprised you didn't draw it which made me wonder why.

 

The safety of EV ports it a hot subject in the UK with plenty of discussions in the IET forums. The regulations are still in a certain amount of flux with issues around failed PEN conductors and RCDs (there's potential for large DC components in fault currents which can swamp the usual devices - similar issues exist in solar power systems). The John Ward video addresses the common pitfalls.

 

I doubt there are any Thai regulations on EV ports yet, I'll ask my power-supply man, if he doesn't know nobody will, but I doubt they would be much different to the Western regs.

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It surprises me that a plug-in electric car does not include on on-board charger such that you can just plug the car into a typical 220 receptacle. 
 

Would the size or weight of the charger be prohibitive? 
 

It could be that the UL/CE listing requirements could take too long or (less likely) cost too much.

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