Three dead as woman beheaded in knife attack at French church

[Morch 16,906]

5 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

We’re going in circles here, you just don’t want to get it! So, for the last time, in my opinion, yes, the ones that kill people are psychopaths, we know that, we know that they will continue to kill, it’s not alright for them to do, I’m not condoning it in any way, shape or form! But, since we know, that this is the way they react to it, we should stop enraging them on purpose under the cover of free speech to spare some people’s lives because the lives of those people are way more important than the ability to mock other people’s religion for no reason other than mocking them. 
 

If you still don’t get/don’t want to get it, then fine, let’s agree to disagree, but I done here! 

 

Basically, you give the killers are free pass, saying 'it is what it is'. The remedy you prescribe is self-placed censorship, limiting  civil rights and freedoms. That's pretty much what people like the killers want ....

[pacovl46 1,881]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

I've read your comments and found them wanting.

 

The 'issue at hand' is  not what you decide you want to focus on, while ignoring any other point of view. The way you present things is just your opinion. You don't get to dictate what other posters 'need' to focus on.

 

Demands are not necessarily imply an ordered list presented to the public. The demand, in this case, is to refrain from blasphemy when it comes to Islam. If you imagine caving in on this will make everything alright and that there will be no more 'demands' of this sort, we'll have to disagree.

 

You post that demands can be raised, but it does not mean that they will be accepted. And yet, your posts on this topic are all basically supportive of caving in to such a demand.

 

The trouble with your logic, IMO, is that you treat the religious violence involved as a given (something that needs to be accepted). Your posts are essentially about appeasement, in the form of placing the blame on parties who did not kill anyone. Sure, the magazine editors had a choice. So did the murderers who killed these people. You focus solely on the former, while apparently giving the latter a free pass.

 

Kinda doubt most Muslims worldwide, or even in France, subscribe or follow this magazine. Further, they are not obliged to read it, see the cartoons and so on. And yet, violence and death are offered. Go figure.

Stop putting words in my mouth!!! Please quote where I said that I blame only Hebdo for what happened! I never said that!

 

By the way, you’re not one hair better because you’re trying to force your point of view onto me!  
 

Again, lives of people more important than mocking a religion!

 

History has shown that every time they mock the prophet there’s an attack afterwards and Hebdo is explicitly stated as the reason for the attack. So again, you play with fire and you get burned. That’s the facts! Whether you want to believe that is up to you! 
 

 

[pacovl46 1,881]

5 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Basically, you give the killers are free pass, saying 'it is what it is'. The remedy you prescribe is self-placed censorship, limiting  civil rights and freedoms. That's pretty much what people like the killers want ....

Nope, I don’t give them a free pass! For the last fricking time now:

 

Every time they publish a cartoon mocking the prophet people get killed and they cite Hebdo’s cartoon as the reason for the attack! So, people get killed because of their cartoons, that’s the FACTS! 
 

Ergo, if you stop mocking their prophet people will stop getting killed because of these cartoons. 
 

It’s that simple! 

[vogie 24,613]

5 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Stop putting words in my mouth!!! Please quote where I said that I blame only Hebdo for what happened! I never said that!

 

By the way, you’re not one hair better because you’re trying to force your point of view onto me!  
 

Again, lives of people more important than mocking a religion!

 

History has shown that every time they mock the prophet there’s an attack afterwards and Hebdo is explicitly stated as the reason for the attack. So again, you play with fire and you get burned. That’s the facts! Whether you want to believe that is up to you! 
 

 

The people that need to change are the people that are cutting peoples heads off and not the people drawing cartoons, it is not difficult.

[Morch 16,906]

2 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Stop putting words in my mouth!!! Please quote where I said that I blame only Hebdo for what happened! I never said that!

 

By the way, you’re not one hair better because you’re trying to force your point of view onto me!  
 

Again, lives of people more important than mocking a religion!

 

History has shown that every time they mock the prophet there’s an attack afterwards and Hebdo is explicitly stated as the reason for the attack. So again, you play with fire and you get burned. That’s the facts! Whether you want to believe that is up to you! 
 

 

 

No words were put in your mouth - you repeatedly ask that posters focus solely on the magazine's 'responsibility'. I'm not 'forcing' anything - addressed your points already several times, and did not deny other points of view.

 

This is not about 'mocking religion'. It's about freedom of speech. Some would say it's a fine principal, and maybe one which is ought to be fought for, rather than tossed aside as per the wishes of religious nutters.

 

There were attacks associated with Islamic/Islamist/whatever perpetrators before that, and on other grounds. Maybe it's best just to accept their wishes on all things and live happily ever after?

[luckyluke 4,345]

18 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

f you still don’t get/don’t want to get it, then fine, let’s agree to disagree, but I done here! 

If you still don't get/don't want to get it, let's agree to disagree, and indeed it is better you done here than.

[Morch 16,906]

6 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Nope, I don’t give them a free pass! For the last fricking time now:

 

Every time they publish a cartoon mocking the prophet people get killed and they cite Hebdo’s cartoon as the reason for the attack! So, people get killed because of their cartoons, that’s the FACTS! 
 

Ergo, if you stop mocking their prophet people will stop getting killed because of these cartoons. 
 

It’s that simple! 

 

Giving a free pass as in treating this religious violence as something that needs to be accommodated, not fought against or resisted.

 

The killed before. They killed because of other 'provocations' (or whatever). It's not just about the cartoons.

[johnray 535]

Islam is Christianity done right.  Stoning homosexuals, no graven images, beating your wife and abusing children, wearing a hijab just like the Virgin Mary.  They are the perfect Christians.

Edited November 6, 2020 by johnray

[kingdong 4,988]

4 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Basically, you give the killers are free pass, saying 'it is what it is'. The remedy you prescribe is self-placed censorship, limiting  civil rights and freedoms. That's pretty much what people like the killers want ....

A bit off topic but that expression " it was what it is " gets right on my tits.

[kingdong 4,988]

Just now, kingdong said:

A bit off topic but that expression " it was what it is " gets right on my tits.

Another victory for my spellchecker i meant " it is what it is"

[balo 12,649]

All the churches in France should have police protection , imagine working inside a church, your life is at stake. 

[simple1 19,732]

6 hours ago, balo said:

All the churches in France should have police protection , imagine working inside a church, your life is at stake. 

 

Macron has committed extra security forces for schools and churches. Given there are tens of thousands of churches and schools in France would guess security is provided by way of localised risk assessment

[kingdong 4,988]

59 minutes ago, simple1 said:

 

Macron has committed extra security forces for schools and churches. Given there are tens of thousands of churches and schools in France would guess security is provided by way of localised risk assessment

The reality of migration.

[Thorgal 1,894]

44 minutes ago, kingdong said:

The reality of migration.

 

French media reports that the Tunisian immigrant has been tested positive for covid-19. His medical condition doesn’t allow him to be auditioned by French police.

 

He had been in contact with another Tunisian, with residence in Nice, the day prior to the attack.

 

Another Tunisian immigrant travelling with the attacker since Lampedusa has been arrested in Nice.

[kingdong 4,988]

1 minute ago, Thorgal said:

 

French media reports that the Tunisian immigrant has been tested positive for covid-19. His medical condition doesn’t allow him to be auditioned by French police.

 

 

What where the bold gendarmes " auditioning "? Him for the eurovision song contest?