Thailand hasn't bought Pfizer or Moderna jabs, says doctor after deaths in Norway

[phantomfiddler]

Thailand wants to buy from China. Full stop !

[shdmn]

30 minutes ago, JerseytoBKK said:

Healthy doctor. 56 years old. Florida. I came across the article while searching for something else. Should have made headlines especially here in Florida where I've been the last 4 months, but it didn't. Wonder why?

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/12/health/covid-vaccine-death.html

 

The only possible conclusion is that it's a giant conspiracy, obviously.  That's why it's hidden away on some hard to find unknown news site ????

 

I'll save the rest of you a click.  As usual, the only takeaway from this story is buried near the end.

Quote

“Right now we’re guessing. It’s an association in time, but not necessarily a causal association.”

 

Edited January 18, 2021 by shdmn

[SupermarineS6B]

Typical, Thailand has to see which side's winning first...... But you can bet your bottom dollar the Hi-so's will be getting the western stuff and the proles will be getting the brake fluid from China.....    " I used to be indecisive but now i'm not sure ".......  

[SupermarineS6B]

16 minutes ago, phantomfiddler said:

Thailand wants to buy from China. Full stop !

Thailand's been told it's buying from China.......  Hence the announcement from the PM about " Safe guarding the Thai people "........ Utter tosh.........  All lined up and signed up already......   

[JerseytoBKK]

11 minutes ago, shdmn said:

The only possible conclusion is that it's a giant conspiracy, obviously.  ????

 

I'll save the rest of you a click.  As usual, the only takeaway from this story is buried near the end.

 

That's NOT the only takeaway , it's just just one comment from many doctors that were interviewed and the NY Times did a good job presenting multiple viewpoints. Of course you didn't quote the doctors that said it's a serious concern. Your attempt to smear this NY Times story is pathetic.

[SupermarineS6B]

Just been listening to the BBC world service, they gave the figures out in Norway for care home deaths in the hundreds per day and mentioned that the so called vaccine deaths had been misquoted by social media......  More media hysteria......   

[JerseytoBKK]

2 minutes ago, JerseytoBKK said:

That's NOT the only takeaway , it's just just one comment from many doctors that were interviewed and the NY Times did a good job presenting multiple viewpoints. Of course you didn't quote the doctors that said it's a serious concern. Your attempt to smear this NY Times story is pathetic.

From the NY Times story:

 

Dr. Jerry L. Spivak, an expert on blood disorders at Johns Hopkins University, who was not involved in Dr. Michael’s care, said that based on Ms. Neckelmann’s description, “I think it is a medical certainty that the vaccine was related.”

“This is going to be very rare,” said Dr. Spivak, an emeritus professor of medicine. But he added, “It happened and it could happen again.”

[onebir]

Seems like Thai people mostly just want a vaccine?:

 

Quote

According to the survey by YouGov, a marketing firm based in Britain, 83 percent of respondents in Thailand said they wouldn’t mind getting a vaccine, followed closely by U.K. (80 percent) and Denmark (70 percent). The survey was taken between Nov. 17 and Jan. 10, covering 2,088 participants in Thailand.

 

[shdmn]

13 minutes ago, JerseytoBKK said:

That's NOT the only takeaway , it's just just one comment from many doctors that were interviewed and the NY Times did a good job presenting multiple viewpoints. Of course you didn't quote the doctors that said it's a serious concern. Your attempt to smear this NY Times story is pathetic.

How about simple math.  You are probably about a million times more likely to die from the virus or have serious complications, than you are to have complications from a vaccine.  Not that any of that will ever sink in with the VacCINE baD crowd and the people who like to spread that FUD.

Edited January 18, 2021 by shdmn

[kingdong]

11 hours ago, Natai Beach said:

Good decision by the Thais to wait, use other countries as guinea pigs to test these rushed through vaccines and see how it panned out before giving it to Thai people.

. 

As the old saying goes, no flies on the Thais.

All governments should take a leaf out the thais book when it comes to looking after its citizens.

[kingdong]

34 minutes ago, phantomfiddler said:

Thailand wants to buy from China. Full stop !

And china will oblige,the first step towards colonisation.

[Peabody]

10 hours ago, timendres said:

 

 

Precisely. The mRNA approach is very new and, to my mind, a very big leap. I do expect that over time mRNA will prove to be a positive advancement in medicine, but I am certainly not interested in being at the front of the line in terms of testing it.

30 year old technology.  Now tested on multiple millions of people, with few adverse effects.

[at15]

very smart not worth the risk on an experimental vaccine in which many steps were skipped in the approval process. hopefully we will not see any kind of mass vaccination in thailand. I believe a year from now the current vaccines will be useless and we will likely learn to live with this.

[nkg]

 

Quote

Norway finds no direct link between elderly deaths and coronavirus shots

Norwegian health authorities concluded that the string of deaths among the elderly is not directly linked to the COVID-19 vaccines they received.

“Clearly, COVID-19 is far more dangerous to most patients than vaccination,” Steinar Madsen, medical director at the Norwegian Medicines Agency told Bloomberg on Monday. “We are not alarmed.”

 

 

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/norway-no-link-elderly-deaths-coronavirus-shots

Edited January 18, 2021 by nkg

[Scott]

Troll post reported and removed. 

 

[garyk]

Good , definitely wait until I and everyone else here gets vaccinated. Then buy if you want. Thanks Thailand

[Selatan]

9 hours ago, smedly said:

Hasn't there been some very dodgy incidents with  Sinovac from China, trials in S America halted etc, and who is using the Chinese Vaccine so that data can be equally scrutinised or is it only being used in China

Are you referring to this?

Suicide, not 'adverse effects,' halted Brazil's Sinovac trial

The major reason why developing countries are not choosing any mRNA vaccine is the difficult cold storage requirement. Inactivated vaccines such as Sinovac's Coronavac may be kept in ordinary refrigerators for months, and if taken out, may be kept for up to a week at room temperature.

[CG1 Blue]

1 hour ago, at15 said:

very smart not worth the risk on an experimental vaccine in which many steps were skipped in the approval process. hopefully we will not see any kind of mass vaccination in thailand. I believe a year from now the current vaccines will be useless and we will likely learn to live with this.

Which steps were skipped in the approval process? 

[Patong2021]

50 minutes ago, Selatan said:

Are you referring to this?

Suicide, not 'adverse effects,' halted Brazil's Sinovac trial

The major reason why developing countries are not choosing any mRNA vaccine is the difficult cold storage requirement. Inactivated vaccines such as Sinovac's Coronavac may be kept in ordinary refrigerators for months, and if taken out, may be kept for up to a week at room temperature.

The cold storage requirement is found with other vaccines as well.  Some of the countries you refer to do have some deep cold storage, enough to protect health care workers. Brazil and South Africa have. India have. India is a major manufacturer of API for the world, and has big facilities. The AZ requirement is 2-8C. The Moderna vaccine is 30 days at 2-8C once thawed.  It is an easy excuse to say the vaccine alone, when the reality is that most of the countries chose to develop military weapons, build palaces and loot the treasury instead of investing in health network or making purchase deposit and supporting development.  Look at what USA and Canada are doing. Pfizer vaccine for urban areas and Moderna for hard to reach rural/remote areas. If J&J Jansen vaccine to be made in Belgium approved, it is one dose and 2-8C characteristic and will fill big hole especially if report is true that more effective than Oxford AZ vaccine.

 

1 hour ago, at15 said:

very smart not worth the risk on an experimental vaccine in which many steps were skipped in the approval process. hopefully we will not see any kind of mass vaccination in thailand. I believe a year from now the current vaccines will be useless and we will likely learn to live with this.

Nonsense.  You do not know what you talk about. The mRNA vaccine is not experimental. It has been worked on for 10+years. 100,000+ in clinical trials and no significant problems. Already 10 million dose since December and how many people died because of vaccine? HOW MANY? You do not know, so I tell you - No one. ZERO.  mRNA is the  vaccine preferred because it can be quickly reformulated to target new variant of virus. Much faster and easier than old types.  If we did not use new scientific development, we would still be giving mercury and arsenic as cures and bleeding to correct the humors. You please tell us what  steps were skipped, ok. Please. What do you think they were doing the  past 10 years? Playing cards in the laboratory? 

[Selatan]

3 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

The cold storage requirement is found with other vaccines as well.  Some of the countries you refer to do have some deep cold storage, enough to protect health care workers. Brazil and South Africa have. India have. India is a major manufacturer of API for the world, and has big facilities. The AZ requirement is 2-8C. The Moderna vaccine is 30 days at 2-8C once thawed.  It is an easy excuse to say the vaccine alone, when the reality is that most of the countries chose to develop military weapons, build palaces and loot the treasury instead of investing in health network or making purchase deposit and supporting development.  Look at what USA and Canada are doing. Pfizer vaccine for urban areas and Moderna for hard to reach rural/remote areas. If J&J Jansen vaccine to be made in Belgium approved, it is one dose and 2-8C characteristic and will fill big hole especially if report is true that more effective than Oxford AZ vaccine.

 

Yes, a viral vector vaccine such as AstraZeneca's AZD1222, is also an alternative for developing countries. China also has viral vector vaccine -Convidicea by CanSino Biologics. I was using the inactivated vaccine as one example, not the only example.

India is highly dependent on China for API:

Drug Industry’s China Habit Will Take Time to Kick
 

Quote

India has a strong generic-drug industry—it supplies more than 40% of generics in the U.S., according to Credit Suisse—but relies on China for the products’ ingredients.

China accounts for 68% of India’s imports of active pharmaceutical ingredients (API), according to Goldman Sachs, and close to 100% of inputs for certain drugs.

 

[Soikhaonoiken]

I don't think the doctor has actually read the report of the 23 death in Norway,  the Norwegian Authorities have said 23 elderly and frail people who received the vaccine have passed away, BUT there is no evidence at this stage, that it is because of the vaccine and further test are to be conducted,,  I personally think the answer is in the question.. "old and frail" 

And think the Thai Government is useing this as another excuse, as they have been pussy footing about over obtain the vaccine, will start in February, then June, then more will be vaccinated in 2022,  my opinion Thailand hasn't got the funds to purchase vaccine... ????

[at15]

2 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

The cold storage requirement is found with other vaccines as well.  Some of the countries you refer to do have some deep cold storage, enough to protect health care workers. Brazil and South Africa have. India have. India is a major manufacturer of API for the world, and has big facilities. The AZ requirement is 2-8C. The Moderna vaccine is 30 days at 2-8C once thawed.  It is an easy excuse to say the vaccine alone, when the reality is that most of the countries chose to develop military weapons, build palaces and loot the treasury instead of investing in health network or making purchase deposit and supporting development.  Look at what USA and Canada are doing. Pfizer vaccine for urban areas and Moderna for hard to reach rural/remote areas. If J&J Jansen vaccine to be made in Belgium approved, it is one dose and 2-8C characteristic and will fill big hole especially if report is true that more effective than Oxford AZ vaccine.

 

Nonsense.  You do not know what you talk about. The mRNA vaccine is not experimental. It has been worked on for 10+years. 100,000+ in clinical trials and no significant problems. Already 10 million dose since December and how many people died because of vaccine? HOW MANY? You do not know, so I tell you - No one. ZERO.  mRNA is the  vaccine preferred because it can be quickly reformulated to target new variant of virus. Much faster and easier than old types.  If we did not use new scientific development, we would still be giving mercury and arsenic as cures and bleeding to correct the humors. You please tell us what  steps were skipped, ok. Please. What do you think they were doing the  past 10 years? Playing cards in the laboratory? 

 

Please educate yourself. There is a hugely important step that was skipped for this coronavirus vaccine. In an unprecedented decision the FDA decided to allow moderna, pfizer and other companies to skip the most important step in vaccine testing which is the animal trials. The mainstream media will tell you otherwise but its a lie like everything else. Its common sense, a vaccine takes at least 10 years to bring to market.  There is a terrible safety record for coronavirus vaccines, for which we have been doing trials for the past 20-30 years. The problem is after vaccination , the immune system becomes hypersensitive causing it to over react when you encounter the wild virus again. This will cause a cytokine storm and your autoimmune response could possibly kill you. I have talked to thai citizens who are terrified of the vaccines and rightly so.

Edited January 18, 2021 by at15

[Fex Bluse]

15 hours ago, dcnx said:

But they bought the Chinese ones, that are only 50% effective with no real oversight on safety. Right. Good job, Thailand.

Thailand, as we all know, is effectively a Sino vassal run by Sino Thais. No surprise they will use any opportunity to discredit farang countries and praise China. They are obligated to do so. 

[Fex Bluse]

The reason Thailand didn't buy the Pfizer vaccine is because they didn't invest in it early on and are thus at the back of the queue and will get a higher price. It's why their vaccination programme is so late. 

 

What a clownish place 

[Albert Zweistein]

14 hours ago, PatOngo said:

Is that an old saying you just made up, I'm certainly not familiar with it!

You're right, I am not familiar with it either but this one I know for a long time ; when you deal with Thais your money flies.

[kiwikeith]

14 hours ago, Andyfez said:

23 deaths is hardly a large statistic when 23 million doses have been given worldwide so far

Literally one in a million.

13 deaths was latest news. 

On RT just now, Moderna vaccine has been suspended after a whole group of people has had adverse reactions to their vaccine in the USA. 

 

Another Pfizer patient was shown with uncontrollable leg shakes. Since then her son who posted video on Facebook has had over a 1000 replies of people who have suffered the same. 

Vaccine spokesmen have said that only 10/12 people per million suffer from side effects. 

It seems the Russian vaccine may become a better choice, only time will tell, but it does not look good for the Moderna vaccine at present. 

 

Also reported 1 in 8 people are dying of complications within 5 months of being discharged from hospital and 1 in 3 people are developing serious illness after having the virus. 

[RJRS1301]

15 hours ago, Olav Seglem said:

Im norwegian and follow norwegian tv news on tv daily.

Have not heard ANYTHING AT ALL about any norwegian dying after getting any kind of vaccine.....

It has certainly been on news services overseas.

Remember that these people were frail elderly with multi underlying health issues.

Also have to remember how many vaccines jabs have been administered.

 

[Albert Zweistein]

14 hours ago, Misab said:

I am Danish I just went through danish newspapers. Not one word about 23 dead in Norway.

Old style communist censorship, it's been in the news for several days in The Netherlands, the number is 33 now.

[shy coconut]

17 hours ago, RotBenz8888 said:

But will they be approved and available at private hospitals? 

They have been approved in most western countries and still being administered, even in 

Norway I believe.

 

There is always danger of problems with vaccination programs, and it isn't clear exactly 

what has happened in this case. My 80 year old mother has had both doses of the 

Pfizer jab and had less reaction than she felt with the annual flu jab.

 

Sorry I didn't answer the post that I quoted. Who knows whether private 

hospitals will use vaccines that haven't been officially approved, if I were

to pay top dollar for a vaccine, I would hope that it had been approved in 

the country I which it was administered and the private hospitals would 

want to avoid potential legal problems.

 

The government statement is one aimed at alleviating any potential "anti vacc" issues,

if a significant percentage of the population decide not to vaccinate due to fears of 

potential death, then any program would be practically useless.

 

Edited January 18, 2021 by shy coconut

[hotchilli]

17 hours ago, webfact said:

Thailand has gone for AstraZeneca and Sinovac from China that uses a different technology. 

Sinovac has been proven to have only a 50% effectiveness... just as worrying.