Thai immigration relaxes re-entry rules for foreigners with permanent residency

[tomazbodner]

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

That's what I di. Actually, you don't need to speak Thai this way, if you get enough points in other areas. 

True as well. It is a total score, which is a combination of many things. Each has a maximum number of points for that category and you're judged on each separately. What's important is that your total score exceeds the pass mark. That's the same as with the PR, though. Just categories may have different weights assigned, though I would doubt there's much of a difference.

[Neeranam]

4 minutes ago, Pro1Expat said:

Give an example? You probably cant but just want to disagree which is fine. Don't pretend though there is some really obvious reason for it when there isnt

Have you ever been in a tourist spot like Pattaya, for example? How many of the long-time men there do you think work? Working is the main criteria when a country allows spouses to get residency. I'm sure this is the same in your country. 

[Neeranam]

16 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Permanent residency is immigration to the country. Having a retirement visa states you are a NON-IMMIGRANT. You are in Thailand on a temporary basis. Your permission to stay needs to be extended regularly for another temporary stay. Permanent residence is when you get a stamp that states you can stay forever. There's nothing on the "Admitted until _________" line. It's blank. There's no expiry to your stamp. There's no need to extend anything. There's no need to report your whereabouts.

Did the government stop PRs having to do the 90 day reporting?

Do they not need re-entry permits these days?

 

[LukKrueng]

13 hours ago, jackdd said:

permanent resident can stay in Thailand as long as he wants without doing anything, as long as he doesn't leave.

Actually has to extend every 5 years

[impulse]

23 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Understand, but let's look at the graphic:

 

......

 

If you do not have one of the 2 books on the picture, and have received an endorsement which is also pictured there - then this doesn't apply to you.

 

Good catch and good point.  But wouldn't it have been easier and less open to confusion to just include the word permanent?

[LukKrueng]

6 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Good catch and good point.  But wouldn't it have been easier and less open to confusion to just include the word permanent?

Says so in the op title: 

Thai immigration relaxes re-entry rules for foreigners with permanent residency

[impulse]

Just now, LukKrueng said:

Says so in the op title: 

Thai immigration relaxes re-entry rules for foreigners with permanent residency

 

But not in the graphic.  So, unless you read Thai Visa, you wouldn't know...  The point of publishing the graphic is to inform the public. 

 

Some poor schlubb walking through his local immigration office may not understand the difference between tax residence, certificate of residence, proof of residence, just plain residence, etc.  Ditto for the poor foreigner located in London or Houston who just sees that graphic on the embassy website.  Clear as mud.  May be good news.  May be meaningless to him...

[LukKrueng]

22 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

But not in the graphic.  So, unless you read Thai Visa, you wouldn't know...  The point of publishing the graphic is to inform the public. 

 

Some poor schlubb walking through his local immigration office may not understand the difference between tax residence, certificate of residence, proof of residence, just plain residence, etc.  Ditto for the poor foreigner located in London or Houston who just sees that graphic on the embassy website.  Clear as mud.  May be good news.  May be meaningless to him...

If anyone waking through an immigration office - that would suggest he or she is in Thailand and this notice is irrelevant for them. If the poor foreigner sees the graphic on the embassy website and can't recognise the books in the pictures - that notice is still irrelevant for him or her. I'm pretty sure all those who are permanent residents know those books and are happy to know there status is not lost. 

[tomazbodner]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

Did the government stop PRs having to do the 90 day reporting?

Do they not need re-entry permits these days?

 

No 90 days reporting. If you want to leave country and return, you still need non-quota immigrant visa and endorsement, which lasts 1 year from application. This is what article is about - that even if it's beyond 1 year (so officially it's already expired), you can still return without losing PR.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

Did the government stop PRs having to do the 90 day reporting?

Do they not need re-entry permits these days?

 

Folks who hold Thai PR DON'T have to do 90 day reporting. I've had Thai PR for 23 years, never ever did a 90 day report. Also you/landlord DON'T need to report/re-report your address after every international or domestic trip.

 

Put aside Covid 19, yes Thai PR holders do need to get a single entry exit/re-entry stamp before every international trip or can elect to get a multiple entry exit/re-enter stamp good for one year from date of getting the stamp, no limit on the number or trips.  

[tomazbodner]

55 minutes ago, LukKrueng said:

Actually has to extend every 5 years

Not PR booklet, though. That's replaced only when it's full. But alien registration - the red book, yes, every 1 or 5 years, for the next 1 or 5 years. And if you have pink ID, every I think 5 years as well. Thanks for reminder. Need to extend the red book in next few months. Was told by police lady that it can be done up to 3 months before expiry and 1 month after.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, my friend you said:

I think permanent residency is NOT the same as retirement visa? Can someone enlighten me please?

True, not the same.

 

- Retirement visa holders need to re-apply every year with no guarantee it will automatically be extended. Plenty of reports here on TV of folks who have had a so called retirement visa for many, lodge their application for renewal for extension but have had a very small shortfall in the required deposit funds and it's been denied.

 

Also, a so-called retirement visa CANNOT ever be converter to Thai PR.

[scorecard]

27 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Not PR booklet, though. That's replaced only when it's full. But alien registration - the red book, yes, every 1 or 5 years, for the next 1 or 5 years. And if you have pink ID, every I think 5 years as well. Thanks for reminder. Need to extend the red book in next few months. Was told by police lady that it can be done up to 3 months before expiry and 1 month after.

True. There are 2 books:

 

1. The actual 'Certificate of Residence' book; on first issue the cover is white. When full* the replacement book** has a white cover and any further replacements also white cover.

*Full because every time the holder exit/re-enters the passport office puts the Immigration stamps in both the holders passport and in the Certificate of Residence book, so eventually it does get full. I initially got the Dark blue covered book, then the white cover book and now on the third white cover replacement book.

**Replacement of the Certificate of Entry book is totally simple/mechanical, the holder DOESN'T have to re-apply for PR and DOESN'T have to supply bank statements or any other supporting document other than copy of passport, copy of Tabien Baan etc. There is no interview. 

The replacement of the Certificate of Residence book is done at a Thai Immigration office. It CANNOT be handled at a police station.

 

2. The RED Police registration book. Yes this does have to have a re-endorsement every five years. This is handled at a suitable police station (not every small police station). It CANNOT be handled at an Immigration office. At the same time the foreign holder also advises the police officer any change of address and this is entered in the RED police registration book. 

 

3. The pink card. This is issued/replaced at the local amphur office, the same office where Thai nationals go to get their National ID card or a replacement of same. 

 

[scorecard]

15 hours ago, jackdd said:

A permanent resident's extension doesn't expire, it's "permanent".

In other words, a Certificate of Residence / Permanent Residence when granted is for life and never needs re-renewal, it expires when the holder dies. Therefore extensions is not in the picture.  

[sas_cars]

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

In other words, a Certificate of Residence / Permanent Residence when granted is for life and never needs re-renewal, it expires when the holder dies. Therefore extensions is not in the picture.  

 

Did you return last year to renew your PR? Or let it lapse? If I remember correctly, your re entry was expiring late last year? For me, I decided to bite the bullet and returned in order to save my PR. And now this news.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, sas_cars said:

 

Did you return last year to renew your PR? Or let it lapse? If I remember correctly, your re entry was expiring late last year? For me, I decided to bite the bullet and returned in order to save my PR. And now this news.

Please see my PM to you in a few minutes.

[scorecard]

4 hours ago, scorecard said:

True. There are 2 books:

 

1. The actual 'Certificate of Residence' book; on first issue the cover is white. When full* the replacement book** has a white cover and any further replacements also white cover.

*Full because every time the holder exit/re-enters the passport office puts the Immigration stamps in both the holders passport and in the Certificate of Residence book, so eventually it does get full. I initially got the Dark blue covered book, then the white cover book and now on the third white cover replacement book.

**Replacement of the Certificate of Entry book is totally simple/mechanical, the holder DOESN'T have to re-apply for PR and DOESN'T have to supply bank statements or any other supporting document other than copy of passport, copy of Tabien Baan etc. There is no interview. 

The replacement of the Certificate of Residence book is done at a Thai Immigration office. It CANNOT be handled at a police station.

 

2. The RED Police registration book. Yes this does have to have a re-endorsement every five years. This is handled at a suitable police station (not every small police station). It CANNOT be handled at an Immigration office. At the same time the foreign holder also advises the police officer any change of address and this is entered in the RED police registration book. 

 

3. The pink card. This is issued/replaced at the local amphur office, the same office where Thai nationals go to get their National ID card or a replacement of same. 

 

 

•  

Posted 4 hours ago (edited)

  4 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

Not PR booklet, though. That's replaced only when it's full. But alien registration - the red book, yes, every 1 or 5 years, for the next 1 or 5 years. And if you have pink ID, every I think 5 years as well. Thanks for reminder. Need to extend the red book in next few months. Was told by police lady that it can be done up to 3 months before expiry and 1 month after.

I am re-sending this whole message because I made an error in the first few words. I said "...the first issue of the Certificate of Residence is white."

 

That's wrong, it's dark blue colour; my error, my apology

Message below corrected:

 

True. There are 2 books:

 

1. The actual 'Certificate of Residence' book; on first issue the cover is dark blue. When full* the replacement book** has a white cover and any further replacements also white cover.

*Full because every time the holder exits/re-enters the passport office puts the Immigration stamps in both the holders passport and in the Certificate of Residence book, so eventually it does get full. I initially got the Dark blue covered book, then the white cover book and now on the third white cover replacement book.

**Replacement of the Certificate of Entry book is totally simple/mechanical, the holder DOESN'T have to re-apply for PR and DOESN'T have to supply bank statements or any other supporting document other than copy of passport, copy of Tabien Baan etc. There is no interview. 

The replacement of the Certificate of Residence book is done at a Thai Immigration office. It CANNOT be handled at a police station.

 

2. The RED Police registration book. Yes this does have to have a re-endorsement every five years. This is handled at a suitable police station (not every small police station). It CANNOT be handled at an Immigration office. At the same time the foreign holder also advises the police officer any change of address and this is entered in the RED police registration book. 

 

3. The pink card. This is issued/replaced at the local amphur office, the same office where Thai nationals go to get their National ID card or a replacement of same. 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by scorecard

[S0S]

Though this is good news for those Thai Permanent Residents still stuck outside Thailand, there is an important catch in all this.

 

On returning to Thailand, Immigration at the airport will recognize your re-entry visa (which expired after 26 March 2020) as being valid for entry, and for non-loss of Permanent Residence status.

 

The catch is that, when applying for a COE at a Thai embassy, the embassy most probably will not accept the expired re-entry Non-Quota Immigrant Visa as a valid visa for entry, and force you to apply for a Non-Immigrant O visa based on your work permit. This appears to be because Immigration and the Foreign Ministry have not updated each other, as COE application criteria state a "valid visa" as one of its requirements.

 

The fact that you are forced to get this visa means you must apply for this visa in your home country, or in a country you have legal residence (essentially meaning one in which you are not a tourist/visitor).

 

The danger of this procedure is that , on arrival in Thailand, if the immigration officer at the point of entry is unaware of what has happened, it is possible that your entry details might reflect you entered on the new Non-Immigrant O visa. If that happens, you will lose your Permanent Residency.

 

It is very important for returning Permanent Residents who are in this situation to bring to the attention of a senior entry-point Immigration officer that you want to enter the country on the expired (but still accepted) Non-Quota Immigrant re-entry visa - and NOT the new (but de facto unnecessary) Non-Immigrant O visa.

 

It would also be prudent to ask the senior entry-point immigration officer to write a small hand written note below the 1 year extension stamp in the Certificate of Residence book stating that entry was allowed under COVID exemptions.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, S0S said:

Though this is good news for those Thai Permanent Residents still stuck outside Thailand, there is an important catch in all this.

 

On returning to Thailand, Immigration at the airport will recognize your re-entry visa (which expired after 26 March 2020) as being valid for entry, and for non-loss of Permanent Residence status.

 

The catch is that, when applying for a COE at a Thai embassy, the embassy most probably will not accept the expired re-entry Non-Quota Immigrant Visa as a valid visa for entry, and force you to apply for a Non-Immigrant O visa based on your work permit. This appears to be because Immigration and the Foreign Ministry have not updated each other, as COE application criteria state a "valid visa" as one of its requirements.

 

The fact that you are forced to get this visa means you must apply for this visa in your home country, or in a country you have legal residence (essentially meaning one in which you are not a tourist/visitor).

 

The danger of this procedure is that , on arrival in Thailand, if the immigration officer at the point of entry is unaware of what has happened, it is possible that your entry details might reflect you entered on the new Non-Immigrant O visa. If that happens, you will lose your Permanent Residency.

 

It is very important for returning Permanent Residents who are in this situation to bring to the attention of a senior entry-point Immigration officer that you want to enter the country on the expired (but still accepted) Non-Quota Immigrant re-entry visa - and NOT the new (but de facto unnecessary) Non-Immigrant O visa.

 

It would also be prudent to ask the senior entry-point immigration officer to write a small hand written note below the 1 year extension stamp in the Certificate of Residence book stating that entry was allowed under COVID exemptions.

 

Sure, it's a must to have several sets of photocopies of everything that's been in the media ensuring there are references where possible. also copies of the Thai Immigration Bureau facebook site. I've got a consolidated file ready to print.

 

I'm a bit lost with your post, if your suggesting that PR holders who are O/S Thailand and their re-entry date has finished now need to get another visa to be able to enter (but ultimately don't lose their PR) I don't believe that's true. 

 

https://www.facebook.com/ImmigrationBereau/

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, S0S said:

Though this is good news for those Thai Permanent Residents still stuck outside Thailand, there is an important catch in all this.

 

On returning to Thailand, Immigration at the airport will recognize your re-entry visa (which expired after 26 March 2020) as being valid for entry, and for non-loss of Permanent Residence status.

 

The catch is that, when applying for a COE at a Thai embassy, the embassy most probably will not accept the expired re-entry Non-Quota Immigrant Visa as a valid visa for entry, and force you to apply for a Non-Immigrant O visa based on your work permit. This appears to be because Immigration and the Foreign Ministry have not updated each other, as COE application criteria state a "valid visa" as one of its requirements.

 

The fact that you are forced to get this visa means you must apply for this visa in your home country, or in a country you have legal residence (essentially meaning one in which you are not a tourist/visitor).

 

The danger of this procedure is that , on arrival in Thailand, if the immigration officer at the point of entry is unaware of what has happened, it is possible that your entry details might reflect you entered on the new Non-Immigrant O visa. If that happens, you will lose your Permanent Residency.

 

It is very important for returning Permanent Residents who are in this situation to bring to the attention of a senior entry-point Immigration officer that you want to enter the country on the expired (but still accepted) Non-Quota Immigrant re-entry visa - and NOT the new (but de facto unnecessary) Non-Immigrant O visa.

 

It would also be prudent to ask the senior entry-point immigration officer to write a small hand written note below the 1 year extension stamp in the Certificate of Residence book stating that entry was allowed under COVID exemptions.

 

Quote:  "...The catch is that, when applying for a COE at a Thai embassy, the embassy most probably will not accept the expired re-entry Non-Quota Immigrant Visa as a valid visa for entry, and force you to apply for a Non-Immigrant O visa based on your work permit.  ..."

 

That's not quite true. I applied for a COE mentioning that I hold Permanent Residency and my re-entry stamp was expiring.

 

I submitted the COE application on line then quickly called the Thai Consulate in Sydney. The Thai officer (perfect English/very pleasant lady, good listener) said 'don't worry about your re-entry stamp expiring, you are still in a category authorized to join a repat. flight, no other documents needed'. 

 

A few minutes later I got an e.mail confirming that my COE application had been accepted and outlining the next steps about flights, insurance, ASQ hotel booking, Fit to Fly, negative Covid 19 test.

 

I was still worried about this so I called the Foreign Affairs ministry on Sri Ayuthaya Rd in Bkk, luckily spoke to a senior Thai official, perfect English, he quickly clearly confirmed what the Sydney consulate officer had said. 

[jackdd]

6 hours ago, sas_cars said:

For me, I decided to bite the bullet and returned in order to save my PR. And now this news.

This "news" was announced by the cabinet in April last year, see the first replay in this topic, maybe you missed it back then.

[ubonjoe]

10 hours ago, LukKrueng said:

Actually has to extend every 5 years

No they do not need to do a extension ever. They only need to report to the police every 5 year to confirm where they are living.

[LukKrueng]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

No they do not need to do a extension ever. They only need to report to the police every 5 year to confirm where they are living.

The red book which you get from the police station in your area has an expiration date which must be extended. First time you get 1 year which you can immediately extend for 5 more years to a total of 6 years, then 5 years every time. It's not the same process as extending a permit to stay at immigration, and no documents needed, but you still have to go to the police station and get the stamp in the red book. 

[jackdd]

1 minute ago, LukKrueng said:

The red book which you get from the police station in your area has an expiration date which must be extended. First time you get 1 year which you can immediately extend for 5 more years to a total of 6 years, then 5 years every time. It's not the same process as extending a permit to stay at immigration, and no documents needed, but you still have to go to the police station and get the stamp in the red book. 

Will they deport you if you don't extend this book?

[jomtienisgood]

On 1/21/2021 at 8:02 AM, jackdd said:

Somebody on a non-immigrant visa/extension is considered a temporary visitor, not a resident.

If immigration talks about "permitted to take up residency" it refers to people with permanent resident status.

 

Indeed, in your Passport it doesn't say NON-Immigr..... Stamped IMMIGRANT as in PR...

[jomtienisgood]

36 minutes ago, LukKrueng said:

The red book which you get from the police station in your area has an expiration date which must be extended. First time you get 1 year which you can immediately extend for 5 more years to a total of 6 years, then 5 years every time. It's not the same process as extending a permit to stay at immigration, and no documents needed, but you still have to go to the police station and get the stamp in the red book. 

That... would indeed be a good question???? For PR's in that case.

[jomtienisgood]

18 hours ago, MasterBaker said:

i wonder how many those PR willing to get back to Thailand

If not, they wouldn't be PR in the first place.....

[jomtienisgood]

13 minutes ago, jomtienisgood said:

That... would indeed be a good question???? For PR's in that case.

Will they deport you if you don't extend this book?

[scorecard]

12 hours ago, scorecard said:

True, not the same.

 

- Retirement visa holders need to re-apply every year with no guarantee it will automatically be extended. Plenty of reports here on TV of folks who have had a so called retirement visa for many, lodge their application for renewal for extension but have had a very small shortfall in the required deposit funds and it's been denied.

 

Also, a so-called retirement visa CANNOT ever be converter to Thai PR.

So called Retirement Visas are gained through an application to the Thai Immigration Bureau with proof of a certain level of cash deposits or proof of a certain level of pension etc., income every month. and there are other considerations. The visa is good for 12 months and the holder must reapply every 12 months.

 

PR is gained through a different set of parameters, mostly focused on having made an actual contribution to the development of Thailand with a Thai work permit. By the book foreigners who have been in such a job, with a Thai work permit for 3 continuous years can apply for PR. But must also provide proof that they have submitted their personal Thai taxation returns for the same period and those personal tax returns have been processed and finalized and all appropriate taxes have been paid. 

 

"...actual contribution to the development of Thailand..." means something like advanced engineering or something of similar value. Teaching English to the neighborhood kids is not accepted nor is supporting a Thai family accepted, regardless of how much cash or building of houses etc., is involved.

 

PR applicants also have to show proof of advanced education and proof of long-term personal financial support, provide a police clearance from Thailand and from their home country and there are Thai language tests. Also there's an interview with a panel. The interview is normally not conducted until several months after lodging the PR application. The number of applications approved is quite small.

 

[ubonjoe]

35 minutes ago, jomtienisgood said:

Will they deport you if you don't extend this book?

No

Only a small fine is charged for doing it late. I don't think extend is the correct word for it.