4MyEgo Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Lacessit said: I think you are confusing calories with decibels. It's all energy related, calories in, calories out ???? Edited January 24, 2021 by 4MyEgo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2009 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 (edited) 28 minutes ago, 2009 said: Some amount of rubbish on this thread. As some have said : it is "calories in Vs calories out" It is the only way. Those saying fasting. How does it make you lose weight? Well, if you only have a short eating window....you are likely to also be in a calorie deficit. Try eating 2500 in one go. Intermittent fasting naturally cuts out a meal, therefore helping with eating less calories. To those who say running. What do you think you are doing? You are burning off calories, right? To those who say keto. You are still creating a calorie deficit cos you are cutting out a whole macro nutrient. Try eating 2500 calories of meat and lettuce a day. And also high protein is satiating so you eat less. Calorie deficit. To the raw veggie crowd. Same. You can fill your entire stomach on 400 calories of vegetables. All these fad diets do is......help create a calorie deficit. No magic. Yes, there are other benefits like cellular repair, lower blood sugar, lower cholesterol, healthy gut, lower blood pressure etc etc (depending on which of these diets you choose), but from a weight loss point of view, these fad diets only work by creating a calorie deficit. And to the lifters, it is the same. The more muscle you build the more calories you burn in a rested state. Calories in Vs calories out baby. And to give an example: Yesterday was my cheat day so I ate whatever I wanted. I had: Coffee with milk Papaya salad, sticky rice, a few grilled chicken wings A couple of beers, a handful of crisps, and a stick of chocolate, half a 7eleven sandwich too. About 1500 calories, total. I woke up today. On the scales. Weight loss (as usual). I still maintained a calorie deficit so I am not really "cheating", but it is my cheat day cos I just eat whatever my taste buds want while still counting calories. Every other day I try to eat healthy for the sake of disease prevention. My calories end up the same anyway, so from a weight loss point of view it makes no difference, but usually I eat foods with health in mind (oats, fruit, veggies, lentils, nuts, seeds, some meat, some carbs, some dairy maybe). In general I think it is best to eat low(er) calorie foods that fill you up for a while (foods with high water content, fiber content, or protein). Edited January 24, 2021 by 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2009 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 15 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said: It's all energy related, calories in, calories out ???? Exactly, to all these guys saying keto or fasting - they wouldn't lose and any weight if they were eating more calories than they were burning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2009 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 On 1/22/2021 at 11:19 PM, Jingthing said: Wrong. It's the way of failure. People can and do lose weight that way but over 99 percent regain the weight and more. Why is that? The metabolism is reset to burn fewer calories and it never recovers. Almost nobody can starve themselves for the rest of their lives. There are ways around this but they have nothing to do with calorie counting. Namely -- intermittent fasting. Nothing to do with calorie counting. You don't need to starve yourself for the rest of your life. When you are happy with your weight you eat enough calories to maintain that weight. Simple. Example, to maintain my current weight I need to eat 2600 calories, but I am overweight, so obviously that is too much. So, now I am eating significantly less, aiming at 1700 with exercise, 1500 without exercise. Once I get to a healthy weight, I will just eat enough to maintain it (which will still be like 2200 a day). How is that starving yourself? And for the record, I like intermittent fasting and have done it before. The cellular repair aspect fascinates me and I would like to get back into it for that. BUT intermittent fasting is literally starving yourself (more so that calorie counting anyway) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, 2009 said: You don't need to starve yourself for the rest of your life. When you are happy with your weight you eat enough calories to maintain that weight. Simple. Example, to maintain my current weight I need to eat 2600 calories, but I am overweight, so obviously that is too much. So, now I am eating significantly less, aiming at 1700 with exercise, 1500 without exercise. Once I get to a healthy weight, I will just eat enough to maintain it (which will still be like 2200 a day). How is that starving yourself? And for the record, I like intermittent fasting and have done it before. The cellular repair aspect fascinates me and I would like to get back into it for that. BUT intermittent fasting is literally starving yourself (more so that calorie counting anyway) It isn't starving yourself at all if you have successfully switched to fat burning mode during the fast periods. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4MyEgo Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 23 minutes ago, 2009 said: Exactly, to all these guys saying keto or fasting - they wouldn't lose and any weight if they were eating more calories than they were burning. Correct, fasting has a lot of benefits like bringing your insulin resistance down and gives your get a break from overworking, fasting is good, but 80% of the problem is in the kitchen, the rest is from exercise. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigStar Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 hour ago, jackdd said: First he basically says that reducing your calories is the wrong way, because it slows down your metabolism and you can't lose weight this way, but the way to lose weight is to choose the "right" food. Not what he says all, and the misinterpretation is yours. Whether it is the Mediterranean, the Atkins or even the old fashioned low-fat, low-calorie, all diets in the short term seem to produce weight loss. Sure, they differ by amount lost—some a little more, some a little less. But they all seem to work. However, by six to twelve months, weight loss plateaus, followed by a relentless regain, despite continued dietary compliance. In the ten-year Diabetes Prevention Program,1 for example, there was a 15.4-pound (7-kilogram) weight loss after one year. The dreaded plateau, then weight regain, followed. So all diets fail. The question is why. Now that some of your misinformation is out of the way, a TVF Nutritionist's classic explanation why will always fall back to the Seven Deadly Sins: sloth and gluttony. But no. So much more complicated than that. Anyway, you may recommend our ol' starve & sweat, calories in, calories out (without understanding the calories out bit ????) forever, as we have for many years on the forum, but they still ain't gon' work, long term, for most people. Never have, never will. I'll leave you now to chant the catechism. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackdd Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 35 minutes ago, BigStar said: Not what he says all, and the misinterpretation is yours. Actually he says this, just on other pages than what you quoted. The book is quite inconsistent and he contradicts himself several quite a few times, so not difficult to find something which says something different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2009 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Jingthing said: It isn't starving yourself at all if you have successfully switched to fat burning mode during the fast periods. Fat burning happens when you don't get enough calories to maintain body weight. Even on keto, if you consume more calories than you need -- you ain't burning ANY body fat. What you just said makes no sense. So, you aren't starving yourself, even though you are "fasting" lol? But you think watching calories is starving oneself? And the whole "starving yourself" is a silly way to put it. People really don't need 3 square meals and 2 snacks anything which you already know cos you do IF. How is burning into fat on IF or keto any different from burning into fat when reducing energy intake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 17 minutes ago, 2009 said: Fat burning happens when you don't get enough calories to maintain body weight. Even on keto, if you consume more calories than you need -- you ain't burning ANY body fat. What you just said makes no sense. So, you aren't starving yourself, even though you are "fasting" lol? But you think watching calories is starving oneself? And the whole "starving yourself" is a silly way to put it. People really don't need 3 square meals and 2 snacks anything which you already know cos you do IF. How is burning into fat on IF or keto any different from burning into fat when reducing energy intake? I never mentioned keto once. If you're not feeling hungry and your body is efficiently burning fat as fuel instead of from food you are not starving. Starvation leading to death happens if you run out of fat reserves. I'm not trying to sell anyone on a specific eating plan. One size doesn't fit all. Do your own research and experiments with your own body. But again weight control is not simple math. In reality it's complex and there is a lot more to it than any kind of math. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieH Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Jingthing said: I never mentioned keto once. If you're not feeling hungry and your body is efficiently burning fat as fuel instead of from food you are not starving. Starvation leading to death happens if you run out of fat reserves. I'm not trying to sell anyone on a specific eating plan. One size doesn't fit all. Do your own research and experiments with your own body. But again weight control is not simple math. In reality it's complex and there is a lot more to it than any kind of math. Agree, its a very personal thing and what can and does work for the individual and the lifestyle. In my opinion it needs an holistic type approach. I know I mixed n matched allsorts until I found "my" balance and what worked for me and my situation. There is no simple solution in my opinion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 3 hours ago, 4MyEgo said: It's all energy related, calories in, calories out ???? I leave you to sort out which is the heat of a chemical reaction, and which is kinetic energy. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyril sneer Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Though keto is sort of a fad diet I do find it one of the best for keeping off beer I’ll never be convinced that pork belly is better for you than fruit and vegetables, but maybe it is, if the latter has includes copious amounts of alcohol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 31 minutes ago, CharlieH said: Agree, its a very personal thing and what can and does work for the individual and the lifestyle. In my opinion it needs an holistic type approach. I know I mixed n matched allsorts until I found "my" balance and what worked for me and my situation. There is no simple solution in my opinion. I had a very simple solution offered to me by my Works Doctor many years ago. He said the best form of exercise for losing weight is pushing yourself away from the meal table before you feel full. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blumpie Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 hours ago, Lacessit said: I had a very simple solution offered to me by my Works Doctor many years ago. He said the best form of exercise for losing weight is pushing yourself away from the meal table before you feel full. This bears repeating. Remember, eating until you are "full" is white guys custom. IT's something that we are brought up with to feel. It's not normal. 80 percent full is what most people do. You should never feel full after eating. It sounds dreadful at first, but it works great. After dinner, brush your teeth which signifies the end of putting anything in your body other than water. It really works, and you won't feel hungry either. Small meals with much variety works. Your life should not be about worrying about food. Eat and enjoy! Just moderately. It does wonders for your self esteem and looks. You can do it - just have a positive attitude, and don't be too hard on yourself. IT's a lifelong skill to learn as we age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4MyEgo Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 12 hours ago, Lacessit said: I leave you to sort out which is the heat of a chemical reaction, and which is kinetic energy. It's also good for testing your daily sense of smell during the pandemic, albeit it can be a little rough depending on what you consumed earlier and how well your stomach digests it, I know with stuff like cabbage, is a no no no unless I want the bed to myself for a change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieH Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 20 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said: It's also good for testing your daily sense of smell during the pandemic, albeit it can be a little rough depending on what you consumed earlier and how well your stomach digests it, I know with stuff like cabbage, is a no no no unless I want the bed to myself for a change. Sprouts do that for me. Toxic gas !....aarrgghhhh. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patman30 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 21 hours ago, cyril sneer said: Is coffee with sweetener allowed on this? Sweetner is your choice personally i would lose the sweet tooth as you are just setting yourself up to fail later not to mention the bad effects of sweetners i am pretty sure aspartame is responsible for my gut issues i too suffer from acid reflux but i do just fine with pork until you start eating just 1 food a day etc, it can be hard to pin point how each food affects you 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belubettlo Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 This book goes beyond 'eat less, move more' https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/24945404 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, belubettlo said: This book goes beyond 'eat less, move more' https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/24945404 That does sound like a good source but the reality is that most people that believe in the calories simple math model will never even consider looking at it another way. Its kind of like religious or political dogma and the simple math myth is taught to most people as children. Its also very simple. People like simple answers to complex problems. Edited January 25, 2021 by Jingthing 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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