placnx Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 11 hours ago, Autonuaq said: the vaccine only works for the SARS-CoV-2 that is has been deigned for. Just like the Flu vaccine does. Then the vaccines of each manufacturer work different and have different protection level as you could have red in the media the pas months. then we have that the vaccine works differently in for example Caucasians or Asians or Black people. and also worked differently in male and female as well there are age related differences and then you also have the way it works based on blood type and resus factor. this is also covered in the media Above this is the problem that the virus also has mutation the once know now are the British mutation, the South African mutation and the Brazilian mutation. The manufacturers think the vaccines will work for the British and the South African mutation. still they will adjust and tweak the vaccines. for the Brazilian they are not sure if the vaccines will work. so the have to adjust and tweak to cover this know mutation too. tweak and adjust is in this no protection guaranteed and also People who have got the vaccination are still capable off transmitting due to the level of protection when the vaccine is administered. 90% means that out of 100 people still 10 can spread the virus or get sick. we all know the virus is among us long before it is detected or begin diagnosed. the south African virus as well the British virus were already in place in november in some European countries. the Brazilian is just flown in by people who went to meet family. all will work when all have had the vaccine and still new mutation will travel with them if they have the change. we are just having super spreading high ways with tourism and party events. As the world population gets immunized, soon I hope, the rate of mutation will decrease. For now, it's the Virus From Hell. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placnx Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 10 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said: That's right it could be here for many years or it could fade like Sars 1.I'm sure I've had it though no test to confirm but had most of the classic symptoms and the pandemic has been bad ,a bit like 1958 and 1968 where about one million died when the global population was half of what it is today so in my view it's comparable.What science has managed to achieve in a short space of time is nothing short of astonishing (some might even say miraculous) though I will personally choose not to take the vaccine as I will treat it like most other viral infections I live with or die from it.I choose to not live in fear of it as the media and others seems to think I should.Enjoy life while you can because death is one of the certainties of life. Fade like SARS: That's wishful thinking. SARS did not spread the same way. With Covid, at first people were worried about infection by touching a surface contaminated with Covid. That's probably holdover thinking from SARS. Now we know that aerosol is the main means of infection, so much more infectious, not to mention the asymptomatic aspect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarFlungFalang Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 2 minutes ago, placnx said: Fade like SARS: That's wishful thinking. SARS did not spread the same way. With Covid, at first people were worried about infection by touching a surface contaminated with Covid. That's probably holdover thinking from SARS. Now we know that aerosol is the main means of infection, so much more infectious, not to mention the asymptomatic aspect. Simple hygiene helped Sars fade now that we have come a long way with science and with the aid of advanced vaccines I think it makes it quite possible to eliminate Sars Cov 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placnx Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 6 hours ago, JeezeLooeze said: Back in 2009 I took a return flight to Nairobi, Kenya from Bangkok but was afraid I wouldn't be let back into Thailand if I couldn't present evidence that I had been vaccinated against Yellow Fever as is current Thai regulation. The only place offering this vaccine in Thailand at the time was the Thai Red Cross. My only reason for getting the vaccine was not because I was afraid of getting sick but of being locked out of Thailand where I worked. Interestingly enough my vax status was not verified when checking in for the return flight, nor upon arrival in Bangkok. It turned out to be a much ado about nothing. My point being that "Vax Passports" already exist albeit on limited routes/locations. This time around though it's on a whole different scale and I suspect more to do with profiteering Big Pharma and the control of populations than it is about health. If it wasn't we would hear more promoting good diet, exercise and building a strong immune system, and proven remedies rather than propaganda about dodgy vaccines ad nauseam. The annual flu bug has now been re-branded as C19 with the fear-factor ramped up and from the comments one reads here it looks like the propaganda is working. I now read that "Merck scraps COVID-19 vaccines that produced ‘inferior’ immune response" as the vaccine candidates provoked immune responses weaker than those seen after someone was naturally infected with the virus. Maybe there is hope for us yet. The question of profiteering is concerning. United Airlines has gotten together some companies to do testing at the airport that offer unbelievable prices. This is a public health issue that should be handled by governments, and the "volunteer" organizations, while welcome to make suggestions, should not be creating confusion by ad hoc deals with the private healthcare sector, which has its own agendas. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobU Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 5 hours ago, placnx said: We have to separate the medical records concept (NHS) from public health issues. Privacy is one reason, but dealing with the software of complex health systems worldwide doesn't make sense. The public health solution is national databases that have common data fields and use the same digital standards for access. Agreed but my point was that a doctor's letter on headed notepaper cold be acceptable it could easily be checked. The NHS systems are fragmented to say the least the back end table structure varies from trust to trust, all the front ends made highly complex to create work and generate income for IT companies and employment for IT personnel. A new data system would fail all IT projects commissioned by HMG have failed because the people creating them build in unnecessary complexity and the PRINCE2 project management system used by the Civil Service to manage these projects is in itself totally fragmented and useless. It would take years for such a system you mention to come online in the UK and it would have massive teething troubles just like every other system commissioned by HMG including the track and trace app. I speak as a former information manager in the NHS (which I took up after I left Nursing) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofthemountain Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Wow 21 pages of comments when the 2 importants words in the headline are ''could'' and ''TAT'' wich must have as a result only a bunch of laughing smileys Who still remember the silly idea of the travel bubbles few months ago? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blumpie Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 1 minute ago, kingofthemountain said: Wow 21 pages of comments when the 2 importants words in the headline are ''could'' and ''TAT'' wich must have as a result only a bunch of laughing smileys Who still remember the silly idea of the travel bubbles few months ago? As if any of this is going to come to fruition. It's stunning how people can pick and choose what truth they wish to believe from a tourism agency touting sexy tourism. If they let people in before Thailands general population is inoculated I'll shave my head. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salerno Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 2 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said: Who still remember the silly idea of the travel bubbles few months ago? What's silly about it? The concept is solid, the timing of the second wave screwed it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofthemountain Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Just now, Salerno said: What's silly about it? The concept is solid, the timing of the second wave screwed it up. come on mate i don't want to start again the debate on this but how can you garantee someone is not at risk just because he is coming from a specific country or a specific part of a country? The recent Thailand actuality has proven even if you think that your country is safe, it's not always the case. It's absolutely impossible to control all the frontiers at 100%, there is no any country in the world able to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salerno Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Oh I'm sorry, I must have just been imagining all the Kiwis flying into Australia with no issues. The concept is solid, monitor the risks and amend as appropriate, as Australia has with the Kiwis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capriole Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 On 1/27/2021 at 3:37 AM, Geoffggi said: Do these type of passports actually exist other than in TAT eyes? also as has been pointed out by Tropicalevo the word could should be replaced by will if any sort of credence is to be associated to this post I don't think they are really talking about real passport but most likely they mean the certificate issued by the country's relevant authority (for example in bahrain is the National Health Regulatiory Authority) like the one we get here in bahrain where I reside. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofthemountain Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 53 minutes ago, Salerno said: Oh I'm sorry, I must have just been imagining all the Kiwis flying into Australia with no issues. The concept is solid, monitor the risks and amend as appropriate, as Australia has with the Kiwis. You are right, it could work between NZ and Australia the 2 countries being islands relatively far from any other country so the frontiers are more easy to control, plus they have an enough developped and good health system. Thailand isn't in the same case at all, and Thailand was of course the subject in my post about the silly idea from TAT and the bubbles. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salerno Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 9 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said: Thailand isn't in the same case at all, and Thailand was of course the subject in my post about the silly idea from TAT and the bubbles. Thailand's porous borders has nothing to do with it per se. The concept is about easing restrictions with countries that, at any given time, have covid under control - not whether the country borders Thailand. Hence, nothing silly about it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobinBKK Posted January 29, 2021 Share Posted January 29, 2021 (edited) On 27/01/2021 at 6:46 AM, richard_smith237 said: A reasonable approach. Although vaccinated people may still present a risk of transmission. Those who have been vaccinated and taken a pre-flight Covid-19 test have a minimal chance of carrying the virus in to Thailand. Other countries have a smaller ‘quarantine requirements’ i.e. a Covid-19 RT PCR test on arrival and quarantine for a day while awaiting test results. Not idea, but much better than what currently exists. The issue with any of the plans is that there is no water-tight solution and any easing brings additional risk of the spread of Covid-19. Confirmed vaccination along with pre-flight and arrival Covid-19 tests (and track and trace) should handle the vast majority of risk while allowing opening Thailands tourist sector back up. It is critical that Thailands tourism sector be allowed off its knees and take steps towards getting back on its feet - the potential devastation to millions without a robust social welfare safety net is essential not only to those individuals but the fabric of the nation. Yes, you can still (be asymptomatic) get and transmit Covid-19 after vaccination. The vaccine only aids in "hopefully" not becoming seriously ill yourself. Although not as deadly, it's very similar to being able to spread influenza after being vaccinated. I see absolutely no point in "vaccine passports". https://www.healthline.com/health-news/you-can-still-spread-develop-covid-19-after-getting-a-vaccine-what-to-know Edited January 29, 2021 by BobinBKK Spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placnx Posted January 29, 2021 Share Posted January 29, 2021 15 hours ago, RobU said: Agreed but my point was that a doctor's letter on headed notepaper cold be acceptable it could easily be checked. The NHS systems are fragmented to say the least the back end table structure varies from trust to trust, all the front ends made highly complex to create work and generate income for IT companies and employment for IT personnel. A new data system would fail all IT projects commissioned by HMG have failed because the people creating them build in unnecessary complexity and the PRINCE2 project management system used by the Civil Service to manage these projects is in itself totally fragmented and useless. It would take years for such a system you mention to come online in the UK and it would have massive teething troubles just like every other system commissioned by HMG including the track and trace app. I speak as a former information manager in the NHS (which I took up after I left Nursing) Doctor's letter wouldn't work well at Thai immigration! Imagine all the fakes! The national vaccination databases would originate with existing software. Most countries (except Russia, China, and similar) would not have a problem with Oracle, for example. The point is not to get bogged down in national healthcare databases which are unique and idiosyncratic. These healthcare systems could establish data links with the national vaccination database so that vaccine records at NHS can be updated, wherever a person gets a new jab (and this card would cover vaccinations against other pathogens, too). To be operable internationally, the data on the QR card should have these essentials: name, date of birth, ID/passport number, sex, email address or other contact info, vaccine used, lot/batch, administration site + date, eventually the code of person giving the jab. Testing data would be useful for immunological/epidemiological analysis, but this need not be put on the physical card. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastendanto Posted January 29, 2021 Share Posted January 29, 2021 On 1/27/2021 at 11:31 AM, Encore said: I'll have 100 pls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jomtienisgood Posted January 29, 2021 Share Posted January 29, 2021 15 hours ago, kingofthemountain said: You are right, it could work between NZ and Australia the 2 countries being islands relatively far from any other country so the frontiers are more easy to control, plus they have an enough developped and good health system. Thailand isn't in the same case at all, and Thailand was of course the subject in my post about the silly idea from TAT and the bubbles. BUT ..... GB is also an island....I agree closer to EU but still an island .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janner1 Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 On 1/28/2021 at 4:22 PM, Blumpie said: If they let people in before Thailands general population is inoculated I'll shave my head. No loss there then! Probably bald anyway 555 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofthemountain Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 On 1/29/2021 at 3:52 PM, jomtienisgood said: BUT ..... GB is also an island....I agree closer to EU but still an island .... Please ask to Salerno to explain you why bubbles are a good idea Me? i am done with it, i am out of this topic too busy fighting my endless 522 errors lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 On 1/29/2021 at 3:22 AM, Blumpie said: As if any of this is going to come to fruition. It's stunning how people can pick and choose what truth they wish to believe from a tourism agency touting sexy tourism. If they let people in before Thailands general population is inoculated I'll shave my head. It's also stunning how many people don't read the details, just the headline and from there make big assumptions, often wrong and misleading, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jomtienisgood Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 8 hours ago, kingofthemountain said: Please ask to Salerno to explain you why bubbles are a good idea Me? i am done with it, i am out of this topic too busy fighting my endless 522 errors lol Maybe get a bottle of Champagne, full of bubbles... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLW Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 A lot of water will be flowing down the Chao Phraya river and several backflips will be done until this scheme finally gets approval and is implented. I believe it when I see it. My parents longing to come to Thailand but I've told them not to book a flight until they removed the 14 day qurantine 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiochaser Posted February 28, 2021 Share Posted February 28, 2021 I read this topic when it was only a few pages (but admit I did not read all the pages) and have not been back since that first or second day after it was posted. But, there may be some hope that inoculated visitors (I think a long shot though) may be getting a waiver and not be required to be in quarantine. My wife spoke to a family friend last night, who is a senior Thai Government employee. He says that we may not need to go in quarantine when we arrive in Thailand, perhaps in April, if we have had a covid vaccination. I have the opinion of, I will believe it when it happens. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herfiehandbag Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 On 1/27/2021 at 6:31 PM, Encore said: Vaccine passports eh? Anyone know where all the "entrepreneurs" from Khao Sanh Road moved to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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