Retirement Visa/2 insurances required now for reentry?

[pattayamarc]

Double whammy insurance requirements face more expats abroad - Pattaya Mail

 

 

Is it true that you now need 2 insurances if you want to reenter Thailand as a retiree? Has anyone been denied COE without this additional Thai covid insurance?

[ubonjoe]

If you have a health insurance that meets the 40/400 baht coverage requirements and it also meets the $100,000 covid insurance you only need one insurance.

For example this one from Pacifica Cross. https://www.pacificcrosshealth.com/en/visa-friendly/

[pattayamarc]

Just now, ubonjoe said:

If you have a health insurance that meets the 40/400 baht coverage requirements and it also meets the $100,000 covid insurance you only need one insurance.

For example this one from Pacifica Cross. https://www.pacificcrosshealth.com/en/visa-friendly/

Are you sure about that? I have a German expat insurance that covers covid/inpatient/outpatient, unlimited coverage. According to the pattayamail article there is a new regulation that forces you to buy this special Thai covid insurance anyway, cost would be 23K per year for Germans, 43K for US citizens, apparently COE (certificate of entry) is denied if you dont have this additional insurance. 

 

Itinerary Detail : Gain Peace of Mind Get Online Coverage : Thai General Insurance Association (tipinsure.com)

 

[ubonjoe]

That article may not be all that accurate. 

Also the insurance coverage does not have to be for a year. If entering on a re-entry permit it would only needs to be valid for to the day it expires.

You can use insurance from your home country if you can get a them to sign this overseas insurance certificate.

https://longstay.tgia.org/document/overseas_insurance_certificate.pdf

It can also vary by the embassy or official consulate you apply at.

[pattayamarc]

4 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

That article may not be all that accurate. 

Also the insurance coverage does not have to be for a year. If entering on a re-entry permit it would only needs to be valid for to the day it expires.

You can use insurance from your home country if you can get a them to sign this overseas insurance certificate.

https://longstay.tgia.org/document/overseas_insurance_certificate.pdf

It can also vary by the embassy or official consulate you apply at.

I couldn't find any information other than the pattayamail article, also no information on any embassy websites, so hopefully you're right.

[Rhacsyn]

Hi. I received my COE towards the end of December 2020 and my AXA insurance policy from UK was accepted. As the insurance document is 10 pages long, AXA (or rather my insurance agent on behalf of AXA) issued a separate certificate which simply but clearly stated amounts for Covid insurance, inpatient and outpatient in Thai Baht currency equivalent. No other insurance or details required.

[Oldie]

Hard to understand. So if I come back to Thailand with a re-entry permit based on a retirement extension do I need more insurance than the Covid insurance? 

[Mavideol]

2 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

That article may not be all that accurate. 

Also the insurance coverage does not have to be for a year. If entering on a re-entry permit it would only needs to be valid for to the day it expires.

You can use insurance from your home country if you can get a them to sign this overseas insurance certificate.

https://longstay.tgia.org/document/overseas_insurance_certificate.pdf

It can also vary by the embassy or official consulate you apply at.

Joe, my wife (from China) is here on O visa that's was  given to her based on my retirement extension of stay permit/visa, she may need to go back home (family health problems) thus will need  to apply for a re-entry permit before leaving,  will she also need insurance to come back using her re-entry permit

[calbts2]

17 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Hard to understand. So if I come back to Thailand with a re-entry permit based on a retirement extension do I need more insurance than the Covid insurance? 

That is what the article implies but until I see actual reports from Non-O Retirement re-entry holders needing that useless 40k/400k insurance, I will not believe this to be true.

[userabcd]

It would be interesting to know if anyone has had an ailment that needed treatment and used this 40000/400000 compulsory Thai insurance to cover the hospital bills.

[calbts2]

 

5 minutes ago, userabcd said:

It would be interesting to know if anyone has had an ailment that needed treatment and used this 40000/400000 compulsory Thai insurance to cover the hospital bills.

 

Doubtful. The outpatient requirement is the real scam as it substantially increases the premiums for any policy when you add that in. I have an excellent in-patient plan which covers 1 million $US but here in Thailand most outpatient services can be paid for in cash as they are not too expensive - especially at a public hospital.  If they just eliminated this 40k outpatient requirement then I doubt many would have an issue - unless they prefer to go uninsured completely.

[ubonjoe]

39 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

Joe, my wife (from China) is here on O visa that's was  given to her based on my retirement extension of stay permit/visa, she may need to go back home (family health problems) thus will need  to apply for a re-entry permit before leaving,  will she also need insurance to come back using her re-entry permit

It would probably not be needed in her case. But her category for getting a COE is not listed.

[Oldie]

39 minutes ago, calbts2 said:

That is what the article implies but until I see actual reports from Non-O Retirement re-entry holders needing that useless 40k/400k insurance, I will not believe this to be true.

I think further. If we expats need a health insurance to stay here then it is time to sell my condo and move to a different country. A nightmare if I am too old to get an insurance and have to leave... For sure not only for me. 

[ubonjoe]

40 minutes ago, calbts2 said:

That is what the article implies but until I see actual reports from Non-O Retirement re-entry holders needing that useless 40k/400k insurance, I will not believe this to be true.

There have been people that have needed it to get a COE.

It is shown on the embassy and official consulate website.

After the need for a COE is over it will not be needed.

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, Oldie said:

I think further. If we expats need a health insurance to stay here then it is time to sell my condo and move to a different country. A nightmare if I am too old to get an insurance and have to leave... For sure not only for me. 

It is only a temporary requirement to get a certificate of entry (COE) to enter the country due to covid 19.

[calbts2]

13 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

There have been people that have needed it to get a COE.

It is shown on the embassy and official consulate website.

After the need for a COE is over it will not be needed.

And I will not travel out of Thailand until they abolish the COE and quarantine - hopefully later this year.

[Oldie]

Just now, ubonjoe said:

It is only a temporary requirement to get a certificate of entry (COE) to enter the country due to covid 19.

Why do you know that it is only temporary? I think they are aware of the fact that some older retirement extension holders will have a problem to return because of this insurance requirement. And their answer is? Forget your retirement extension? 

[UKresonant]

37 minutes ago, userabcd said:

It would be interesting to know if anyone has had an ailment that needed treatment and used this 40000/400000 compulsory Thai insurance to cover the hospital bills.

So would I, especially if it did not pay out because the claimant had not been in Thailand for 6 months (perhaps in the small print of the policy). 

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Why do you know that it is only temporary?

As I wrote is only needed to get a certificate of entry. That is the rules set by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Immigration does not require it.

[Oldie]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

As I wrote is only needed to get a certificate of entry. That is the rules set by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Immigration does not require it.

I understood this. But expats with retirement extensions want to be able to leave the country AND to come back. Obviously if they cannot get an insurance the only option will be a tourist visa. Not really a retirement location then - or?! 

[UKresonant]

10 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

As I wrote is only needed to get a certificate of entry. That is the rules set by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Immigration does not require it.

 

That is the problem, the MFA and the immigration at the Airport are about the only people we have had dealings with, if it is the case that the MFA do not drop the requirement, once there is better news, it could be game over, if you can't even get there, never mind apply for an extension ????.

 

It is a worry but if Dad at age 87 is not going to be able to get a visa from the MFA group, due to the insurance issue.  Perhaps it is a consideration that the support to maintain his status-quo, at the Thai end may need review.  Are we 99% confident that it will be dropped in due course?

 

I am interested in the success with the AXA broker noted earlier, but I still get the impression that is not the most likely response! ????

 

As I can't seem to stop getting older, we have to worry the downhill slope that really got steeper from mid- 2019, may still continue, or has continued, as we come out the other side of the pandemic.

[jimn]

Not new at all. Many embassys around the world have been imposing these extra 40k baht out patient and 400k in patient for months now on new Non O retirement applications and existing retirement extensions with a re entry permit. This is in addition to the $100K Covid Insurance. The UK is one of the few countries that does not require the extra insurance on existing retirement extensions but it does for new Non O retirement. Looks like the Pattaya Mail have only just picked up on it. Many people on here unaware as well. This extra requirement is to get the COE (Certificate of Entry)

[Speedhump]

Anyone know how much COVID cover is through a Thai immigration approved insurer? I really can not believe that it's correct that you need to spend 25k to get COVID cover of 100k. but that's what I thought I read in a thread on this forum recently. 

[Mavideol]

17 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

It would probably not be needed in her case. But her category for getting a COE is not listed.

thanks for the info, do appreciate

[Scouse123]

19 hours ago, Oldie said:

Why do you know that it is only temporary? I think they are aware of the fact that some older retirement extension holders will have a problem to return because of this insurance requirement. And their answer is? Forget your retirement extension? 

 

I can only guess as, like you, I am only a retiree in the country but I think it would be a bit like ' shooting themselves in the foot ' to begin making life difficult for those here on retirement extensions when they know they are one of the few groups actually contributing to the economy, although not as much as some posters like to imply.

 

However, we have seen on many occasions the powers-that-be in this country make knee jerk reactions, only to walk back on them days later after public outrage.

 

This thread actually applies to me as I am a retiree based on a Non-O and have full insurance with Pacific Cross covering everything except this fairly recent addition of 40,000 out patient demand,

 

Because I like many others, would pay OPD in cash like I always do.

 

If I leave the country I would obviously have to apply and purchase a cheap,  probably worthless 40K policy for OPD that gets me a COE for Re Entry.

[calbts2]

1 hour ago, Scouse123 said:

 

I can only guess as, like you, I am only a retiree in the country but I think it would be a bit like ' shooting themselves in the foot ' to begin making life difficult for those here on retirement extensions when they know they are one of the few groups actually contributing to the economy, although not as much as some posters like to imply.

 

However, we have seen on many occasions the powers-that-be in this country make knee jerk reactions, only to walk back on them days later after public outrage.

 

This thread actually applies to me as I am a retiree based on a Non-O and have full insurance with Pacific Cross covering everything except this fairly recent addition of 40,000 out patient demand,

 

Because I like many others, would pay OPD in cash like I always do.

 

If I leave the country I would obviously have to apply and purchase a cheap,  probably worthless 40K policy for OPD that gets me a COE for Re Entry.

 LMG does offer a cheaper "fulfill visa requirements" policy that has a 200,000 deductible for 400,000 coverage. If you are under 70 is goes from 7,700 baht down.

 

[Peter Denis]

On 2/10/2021 at 12:29 PM, calbts2 said:

That is what the article implies but until I see actual reports from Non-O Retirement re-entry holders needing that useless 40k/400k insurance, I will not believe this to be true.

Of course it is a scam initiated by the Thai insurers lobby, but e.g. when in UK and applying for the CoE you are now required to subscribe to that 400K/40K in/out patient insurance not only for a Non Imm O-A Visa or an STV, but also when wanting to return on a still valid Re-Entry Permit based on the 1-year retirement extension of your original Non Imm O Visa.

Several reports confirming the above.

But luckily it does not need to be a costly undertaking to comply with that requirement, as the LMG Plan-1 400k/40K IO-approved health-insurance policy (with 200K deductible) can be subscribed to for 6.000 THB to 11.400 THB annual premium in the age categories of 51 to 75 years of age.  And that policy does not require a medical to subscribe to it.

[Peter Denis]

On 2/10/2021 at 2:22 PM, UKresonant said:

That is the problem, the MFA and the immigration at the Airport are about the only people we have had dealings with, if it is the case that the MFA do not drop the requirement, once there is better news, it could be game over, if you can't even get there, never mind apply for an extension ????.

 

It is a worry but if Dad at age 87 is not going to be able to get a visa from the MFA group, due to the insurance issue.

...

When over 75 years of age it becomes indeed problematic to find an insurer willing to provide coverage for the 400K/40K in/out-patient treatment.

Of course there is always the option of returning to Thailand VisaExempt or an 60-day Tourist Visa, and once here apply at the local IO for a 90-day Non Imm O Visa and subsequent 1-year extensions from that Visa.  When following that route, there are no insurance requirements to be met (except the current - as part of the CoE requirements - 100.000 US $ covid-19 treatment insurance for the period of the permission to stay you will receive on entry > but TGIA does provide covid-19 only insurance designed to cover this, and which can be subscribed to till 99 years of age).

[jonnyscot]

Very interested in this issue since I still have to exit the country a few times in the year on business, many uncertainties, as example covid insurance I’d assume to satisfy COE requirements I will have to provide covid insurance cover for the full duration of my stay (extension)on returning, I guess up to a year since I have no confirmed planning on my next trip ?

[Peter Denis]

58 minutes ago, jonnyscot said:

Very interested in this issue since I still have to exit the country a few times in the year on business, many uncertainties, as example covid insurance I’d assume to satisfy COE requirements I will have to provide covid insurance cover for the full duration of my stay (extension)on returning, I guess up to a year since I have no confirmed planning on my next trip ?

Hi Jonny,

 

For the 100.000 US $ covid-19 treatment coverage insurance (currently required for EVERYBODY wanting to enter Thailand), you only need to cover the period of the permission to stay you will receive by border immigration when entering Thailand.  So depending on which Visa you enter you will need either 45 days (Visa Exempt entry), 60 days (60-day Tourist Visa), 90 days (STV or Non Imm O Visa), 1 year (Non Imm O-A Visa).  Or when entering on a Re-Entry Permit protected permission to stay from the 1-year extension based on your Non Imm O or O-A Visa, it would need to cover that remaining period of stay.

 

SafetyWing travel-insurance <  https://safetywing.com/nomad-insurance > which includes such covid-19 coverage as part of their generous travel-insurance package, would - depending on your age (under 70) and nationality - most probably be your best option to meet that requirement.  Alternatively you could opt for the TGIA covid-19 only insurance < https://covid19.tgia.org/ > and take that for the required period of stay (= your permission to stay).  But if the difference in cost is small, obviously SafetyWing provides far better value.

 

When you fly with Emirates to return to Thailand, they currently provide FREE covid-19 insurance on your flights with them (30 days for one-way flights, but full coverage of your return flight period).  However, you would need to check with your home-country's Thai Embassy, whether they accept that free airline covid-19 insurance to meet that CoE requirement.  There are reports from applicants at the London Thai Embassy where such Emirates covid-19 insurance was approved, but also from Dubai Thai Embassy that did not accept it (they actually have no ground for not accepting it as it fully meets the requirements, but Thai Embassies and Imm Offices are notorious for twisting or making up the rules as they see fit).