Do you know of anyone on retirement visa "kicked out" of Thailand?

[madmen]

14 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

I don't live here in fear.  I have nothing I can't sell or donate and head to the airport within 36 hours.  Most I could loss is whatever is left on the month's rent.   This is by design.  

That's the definition of living in fear! 

[micmichd]

20 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

What big changes has there been since before 2014 ? Besides insurance for OA.

You always had to account for 800k one way or another, put it aside or top up each year for a retire extension. Marriage extensions I cant recall any changes.

The Thai Baht went up, or Western currencies declined resp. 

[EricTh]

17 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

I am not claiming I know much about PR in Thailand.  I would think anyone with PR would NOT fall under the Thai labour laws, but I do not know this for sure.  Perhaps another member may know.  

 

PR here does not interest me.  I have no intention of applying, now, or in the future.  

 

That is AFTER you get the PR.

 

One of the conditions of applying for PR is that you must earn a salary of 80K per month on legal jobs that isn't reserved for Thai. BEFORE and AFTER are two different things.

 

[BritManToo]

On 2/27/2021 at 12:17 PM, BangkokReady said:

Do people here long-term not ultimately aim for permanent residency?

And citizenship ......

Only available to male foreigners working here, I'm a pensioner so no forward options.

Different rules for women.

[Sheryl]

22 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

And citizenship ......

Only available to male foreigners working here, I'm a pensioner so no forward options.

Different rules for women.

 

As far as I know the rules for both permanent residency and citizenship are identical for men and women.

 

Where there is a difference in requirements by sex is for extension of stay based on marriage, foreign women married to Thais do not need to meet the financial requirement.

 

Returning to the OP topic, I think a lot depends on what one means by "kicked out".  Literally deported is pretty much limited to people who go on overstay or are arrested for another crime.

 

But a fair number of retirees have been unable to meet the financial requirements for extension in the wake of recent changes (in imm rules, Embassy policies and also in currency exchange rates) and some may emotively describe this as being "kicked out".

 

And indeed, further future changes could cause problems for more people, and this needs to be factored into planning especially given the recent precedent (contrary to prior practice) of making new financial requirements applicable to people already here for many years i.e. no grandfathering. Cannot assume just because one can meet current financial requirements that this will always be the case going forward. People living close to the wire in terms of current financial requirement for extension should be especially wary and have a clear Plan B.

 

For that matter same applies to cost of living.

 

I am always astounded by the people who post plans to retire here based on having calculated that their funds will just barely cover visa/extension requirement and current cost of living (the latter almost always calculated without taking any medical cots or other unexpected costs into account).  A "plan" that assumes that (1) immigration rules will never change,  (2) cost of living will not go up, (3) one will never have a major illness or accident, (4) currency exchange rates will stay the same...is no "plan" at all, it is wishful thinking.

[BritManToo]

58 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

As far as I know the rules for both permanent residency and citizenship are identical for men and women.

Well you're wrong.

The only requirement for citizenship to a foreign women is a Thai husband with an income of 25kbht/month.

The foreign woman has no need to work, have savings or earn money at all.

 

Personally,

I have no use for money for medical costs, beyond the most basic.

At 65 my life is over, I have no reason to try and extend it, death when it comes, will be welcome.

No need to plan for the future ...... I have none.

Edited February 28, 2021 by BritManToo

[Leaver]

8 hours ago, madmen said:

That's the definition of living in fear! 

 

Hardly.

 

That's the definition of freedom, not fear.  

[Leaver]

2 hours ago, EricTh said:

 

That is AFTER you get the PR.

 

One of the conditions of applying for PR is that you must earn a salary of 80K per month on legal jobs that isn't reserved for Thai. BEFORE and AFTER are two different things.

 

 

I did say the person I spoke to claiming to have PR was openly working in an occupation reserved for Thai's.  I didn't ask what job he had prior to being granted PR.    

[pacovl46]

14 hours ago, ericthai said:

Not that simple!  you need to be working and paying taxes, plus a bunch of hoops. Not impossible, I have several friends that have PR and a few that now have Thai citizenship. 

My friend was still working when he applied for it, but he has since retired and he still has his permanent residency. 

[ChipButty]

I know a few that need kicking out

[onebir]

On 2/25/2021 at 7:59 AM, CharlieH said:

tried fyling under the radar.

Maybe they fynally fyled through the bars? ????

(Sorry!)

[Curt1591]

On 2/27/2021 at 11:46 AM, nickmondo said:

my plan B is ready and waiting for me in the Philippines

Do you really have "a plan"? Have you really investigated living in the Philippines or just think it would be a good choice?

[FritsSikkink]

On ‎2‎/‎26‎/‎2021 at 10:28 PM, Leaver said:

 

One may meet the financial requirements this year, but there's no guarantee one will be able to meet the financial requirements next year. 

 

800k can become 1.5 million, or 120k baht a month,  with the stoke of a pen in Bangkok. 

 

Whilst I would like to think I can meet any any future requirements, you can never feel stable here.   

 

I think it's only a matter of time before compulsory health insurance, attached to a retirement visa, is introduced.  No health insurance, no visa.

 

You could have a Thai wife, a car, a condo, a farm, a bar, children etc, but you will NEVER have a right to live here.  All farang should have a Plan B alternative to living in Thailand.  

You could apply for permanent residency or get a Thai passport

[metisdead]

Troll posts have been removed. 

[connda]

On 2/27/2021 at 8:14 AM, pacovl46 said:

Well, if you’ve lived in Thailand legally for at least 5 years you can apply for permanent residency.

No you can't.  I'm not sure where you got your information from but it's incorrect. Take it from someone who as supported a Thai wife and family for the last 14 years.  There is no path to permanent residency based on "living in Thailand legally for at least 5 years" for any of us men married to Thai women.  Now for foreign women married to Thai men?  Yeah, they may be able to seeing that rules for male foreigner spouses and female foreign spouse are as different as night and day.

[ivor bigun]

I have no plan B i have a wife a son ,who runs a company , if my money ran out ,my family or my wifes would help , i could not even imagine leaving them and going back to the UK at my age ,although a home would be no problem luckily my UK  family are quite well off  , 

but i would prefer to be poor and with my wife ,

[Sheryl]

 

15 minutes ago, connda said:

No you can't.  I'm not sure where you got your information from but it's incorrect. Take it from someone who as supported a Thai wife and family for the last 14 years.  There is no path to permanent residency based on "living in Thailand legally for at least 5 years" for any of us men married to Thai women.  Now for foreign women married to Thai men?  Yeah, they may be able to seeing that rules for male foreigner spouses and female foreign spouse are as different as night and day.

The rules for PR and citizenshop are the same for foreign women as for foreign men. Only the requirements for temporary extension of stay based on marriage differ.

[BritManToo]

35 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

The rules for PR and citizenshop are the same for foreign women as for foreign men. Only the requirements for temporary extension of stay based on marriage differ.

https://www.thaicitizenship.com/thai-citizenship-based-on-marriage-to-a-thai-husband/

Complete details here, I was wrong about the Thai husbands income, 20Kbht/month or 15kbht/month if a civil servant. (Although they can work with the foreign woman's income if required)

 

Original Thai here ... Thai special Branch Website.

https://www.sbpolice.go.th/page/การถือสัญชาติไทยของหญิงต่างด้าวโดยการสมรส_125.html

 

Income requirement .......

(9) Income certificate Specify position, job duties and salary income. By the authorized person to sign the certificate of that agency (governmental state enterprise) private company registration certificate Or a limited partnership And if self-employed, must sign self-certification With enough income to support the family Have an income of at least 20,000 baht per month and in the case of the applicant for occupation can combine his income with her husband's income to reach 20,000 baht per month

 

length of marriage requirement .........

(3) The applicant and her husband must have been married for not less than 3 years in the absence of children. And must not be less than 1 yearIn case of having a child (From the date of marriage registration to the date of application submission)

 

If I'd been a foreign woman, I'd have become a Thai citizen in 2012.

Edited February 28, 2021 by BritManToo

[Leaver]

47 minutes ago, ivor bigun said:

I have no plan B i have a wife a son ,who runs a company , if my money ran out ,my family or my wifes would help , i could not even imagine leaving them and going back to the UK at my age ,although a home would be no problem luckily my UK  family are quite well off  , 

but i would prefer to be poor and with my wife ,

 

So, you do have a Plan B.

 

What if the Company's money ran out also?  

[Leaver]

1 hour ago, FritsSikkink said:

You could apply for permanent residency or get a Thai passport

 

No need.  I have no interest in either.  I have no financial, business, or emotional ties here.  This is by choice, and suits Thailand's visa system quite well.  ???? 

[Leaver]

1 hour ago, connda said:

There is no path to permanent residency based on "living in Thailand legally for at least 5 years" for any of us men married to Thai women. 

 

I would think not, otherwise, hundreds of thousands of expats, from all around the world, would already have PR.  

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

 

If I'd been a foreign woman, I'd have become a Thai citizen in 2012.

 You may think that, but the women I know who have gone through this had to jump through complicated hoops for a good 10 years to complete it. It is not easy.

[BritManToo]

Just now, Sheryl said:

 You may think that, but the women I know who have gone through this had to jump through complicated hoops for a good 10 years to complete it. It is not easy.

The lady on the first link I gave said it took her 3.5 years, which is considered the normal length of time.

[Sheryl]

That link is NOT an authoritatiev source and contains many inaccuracies.

 

I know of no one who did it in that little time.

 

A good command of Thai IS required. The entire interview is conducted in Thai.

 

You DO have to sing the national anthem at the interview.

 

And even meeting all requirements, approval is far from guaranteed.

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, Sheryl said:

That link is NOT an authoritatiev source and contains many inaccuracies.

 

I know of no one who did it in that little time.

 

A good command of Thai IS required. The entire interview is conducted in Thai.

 

You DO have to sing the national anthem at the interview.

 

And even meeting all requirements, approval is far from guaranteed.

According to the Thai Special Branch website, none of those are required.

https://www.sbpolice.go.th/page/การถือสัญชาติไทยของหญิงต่างด้าวโดยการสมรส_125.html

 

Maybe you should give Special Branch a call and tell them their website is wrong.

[connda]

3 hours ago, ivor bigun said:

who runs a company , if my money ran out ,my family or my wifes would help

If you money ran out, you wife's income would not satisfy the monetary requirement for you to remain in Thailand and you'd be kicked out.  Well, unless you are a woman.  Then it's all different and you can stay as their are no financial requirement for foreign women married to Thai men. 
You do understand that the Thai government doesn't consider a foreign man and a Thai woman to have a family unit that is important.  Your family means nothing as it's not seen as a "real" Thai family.
The Thai government considers a foreign woman married to a Thai man to have a family unit that is important.  That family with a foreign woman and a Thai man as head of the household is considered a "real" marriage and the foreign woman never has to worry about being kicked out of the country. 
So do realize that you are a financial downturn away from being kicked out of the country and having your family "administratively dissolved" and permanently separated simply because you are a male.  Sucks.  But it's reality.  And no, the Thai government isn't going to let you stay if your wife is supporting you.  You'll be removed and separated from your family.

[connda]

58 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 You may think that, but the women I know who have gone through this had to jump through complicated hoops for a good 10 years to complete it. It is not easy.

As least foreign women married to Thai men have the option Sheryl.  I've been married to the same woman for 13+ years and raised her son as my own.  Do I get that option after 10 years?  No.  How about after 20 years?  No.  30?  No.
I'm so sorry to hear it's not easy.  I'd as least like to have the option.  I'd be more than estatic to go through the process.  So, how it's fair?  How's it equitable?  How's it even humane?

[elliss]

On 2/25/2021 at 11:59 AM, coastguard said:

I know so many guys that worry they will arbitrarily be kicked out of Thailand.

Do you know anyone that has been kicked out, if so, for what reason. I don't know anyone, nor have I heard any stories of anyone.

 

  Lets be certain of one thing . 

   We are visitors to Thailand .

    Nothing more , nothing less .

   At the stroke , of a pen . Time changes , everything ..

  Bon Voyage .. 

[Leaver]

10 minutes ago, elliss said:

 

  Lets be certain of one thing . 

   We are visitors to Thailand .

    Nothing more , nothing less .

   At the stroke , of a pen . Time changes , everything ..

  Bon Voyage .. 

 

Correct.  Yet, many see that 1 year retirement visa as basically Permanent Residency, when the reality is it's far from it.  It's basically just a 1 year tourist visa.  

 

Edited February 28, 2021 by Leaver

[ericthai]

11 hours ago, pacovl46 said:

My friend was still working when he applied for it, but he has since retired and he still has his permanent residency. 

Once you get PR there is no requirement to keep working.