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What happens to my pink ID & ID number if I'm removed from the yellow house book?


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3 hours ago, TigerandDog said:

Not according to my District Office. They say it's 10 years

I have a number of copies of ID cards dating from 2011.

They all have an 8 year expiry date aged under 60.

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The yellow house book is pretty simple to do yourself. Pop along to the local amphur and ask them.

The entry in the yellow book will stay there until either you are entered into a different yellow book; until the house master of your current residence goes to the district office and gets them to re

what can I say. My District Office says it's 10 years and the cards they issue ( Thai & Foreigner ) are all for 10 years if under 60. My wifes is for 10 years, her aunt is for 10 years.

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5 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

I have a number of copies of ID cards dating from 2011.

They all have an 8 year expiry date aged under 60.

it would seem that your district office/amphur is making up there own rules then.

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10 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

it would seem that your district office/amphur is making up there own rules then.

My wifes issued in 2016 is only for 8 years.

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Further to my previous posts, every google search I do ( and I've only looked at posts in the last 2 years ) say the pink ID cards expire after 10 years. Even all the pink ID card  images I've seen on google are clearly for 10 years.  So as I said earlier, it seems those amphurs/district offices putting 8 year expiry dates are definitely making up there own rules based on all the information I've been able to see, and that includes online law firms stating it's 10 years.

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On 5/5/2021 at 10:51 AM, Tanoshi said:

8 years if under 60.

From 60 they have no expiry date, being valid for life.

I am under 60 and mine is 10 years.

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On 5/6/2021 at 9:37 AM, Neeranam said:

They can't be used in any DLT.

I didn't say a pink card could be used at any DLT, I said a driving licence could be done at any DLT. Some accept the pink card/yellow book and some don't.

I use Muang Chonburi and they used to accept the pink card, I know someone who has his Thai ID on his driving licence from there. Coincidently his pink card was the one issued prior to mine some years ago.

When I went in August they said they no longer accept the pink card, passport/CoR only.

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19 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

My wifes issued in 2016 is only for 8 years.

Maybe she is 60 in 3 years time. 

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8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Maybe she is 60 in 3 years time. 

No

Just looked another card that was issued in 2015 and it expires in 2023. I think Thai ID's are still only issued for 8 years.

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30 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

No

Just looked another card that was issued in 2015 and it expires in 2023. I think Thai ID's are still only issued for 8 years.

My Pink Non Thai ID card was issued for a 10 year period. Still valid until next year.  Address was changed on it at the khet in Bangkok, while the number stayed the same with the date of expiration and it was added into my current yellow book for my condo here. My yellowbook for Udon Thani was then voided and the Khet kept it. Next year when it's up for expiration I will go back again to obtain a new one for another 10 year period as I am under 60.

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1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

No

Just looked another card that was issued in 2015 and it expires in 2023. I think Thai ID's are still only issued for 8 years.

these recent posts support what I've been saying as they're all for 10 years.  Some Amphurs/District Offices are making up there own rules as to how long a pink ID card is valid for.

I refer yo to this link from Isaan lawyers. Please refer to the 3rd last paragraph (copy & pasted - This card is valid for 10 years according to clause 8 of regulation in 2551. However, if you are over 60, it will be without an expiry date (also on same clause 8).

Pink ID Card for Foreigners in Thailand - Isaan Lawyers - Attorneys in Thailand|Divorce|Property|Custody|Company

 

Please note that the pink ID card displayed in the link article is a 10 year card. Now even though the commencement date isn't legible, the article author says he obtained the card in 2016 ( 5 years ago ) and it has an expiry date of 2569 ( 2026 ) which is another 5 years from now.  Total 10 years.

 

Here is another link from a law firm, posted Feb 2020 Pink ID Card for Foreigners - FRANK Legal & Tax (franklegaltax.com) and it also clearly states that the cards a good for 10 years.

 

I can produce heaps more of this kind of evidence proving that 8 years is incorrect, but the doubters still won't accept that.

 

Therefore in summary those Districts issuing cards for less than 10 years for under 60's are actually breaking the law. Surprise, surprise.

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3 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

 Some Amphurs/District Offices are making up there own rules as to how long a pink ID card is valid for.

That were Thai ID cards not the pink ID card.

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Just now, ubonjoe said:

That were Thai ID cards not the pink ID card.

We're not talking about Thai ID cards Joe, the whole topic is pink ID cards , and pink ID cards are supposed to be for 10 years.

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8 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

We're not talking about Thai ID cards Joe, the whole topic is pink ID cards , and pink ID cards are supposed to be for 10 years.

I think the fact that Thai ID cards is 8 years is relevant and it may explain why some Amphoes are issuing pink ID cards for 8 years.

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Just now, ubonjoe said:

I think the fact that Thai ID cards is 8 years is relevant and it may explain why some Amphoes are issuing pink ID card for 8 years.

maybe, maybe not. The only thing it does show is that those amphurs that issue pink ID cards for 8 years don't know the law, and need to be told that it's 10 years when a renewal for an under 60 is required.

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1 hour ago, TigerandDog said:

maybe, maybe not. The only thing it does show is that those amphurs that issue pink ID cards for 8 years don't know the law, and need to be told that it's 10 years when a renewal for an under 60 is required.

I think it depends on if you apply after your birthday or not. I got my Thai (blue) ID 1 month after my birthday and got 8 years plus 11 months. 

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Thanks everyone for the replies!

 

I have a certified translation of both the pink ID and yellow house book...

 

The yellow house book contains a "house code number" which is in the format of 1234-567890-1. This is the same number that's in the blue house book (I have a photocopy of that).

 

Then against my name in the yellow house book, it lists my "identification number" in the format of 1-234-56789-12-3. The identification number begins with "6" and it's the only number which appears on my pink ID along with the words "Alien Entry". The house code number isn't on my pink ID.

 

So I'm pretty certain that this identification number will stay with me for life and is registered with the Thai government. I think this must be true because I have linked my pink ID to my driving licence. So, rather than my passport number on my licence, it has my pink ID number and my name is also in Thai as well as English. I am going to switch this back to my passport though, because when your licence is linked to your pink ID, you cannot drive outside of your province (the notes mention this on the reverse).

 

Perhaps the ID number is originally generated based on the amphur where you first register at, but will move with you to a different province when you register at another amphur?

 

@WhiteBuffaloATM - you're quite right in that there's no real value to the pink ID but I also wanted one just to have it... You can't even use them to fly because your name has to be in English for some airlines. Actually, one airline let me board with the pink ID but the same airline refused it on my return, so if I didn't bring my passport or driving licence, I would have been in a tricky situation!

 

@blackcab & @Tanoshi, that's an interesting note about the form that is available to switch to another address. So, is it really as simple as finding a new landlord that is willing to go down to the amphur with me with just their blue house book and Thai ID card? How would they look me up on the system if I'm supposed to have surrendered the yellow house book and pink ID? I'm guessing via my passport number but even that could have in theory changed if I had lost it (I haven't)... I'm just playing devil's advocate and let's pretend I also didn't remember my Thai ID number... Perhaps I can be looked up by my full name, DOB and my mother's and father's name. I'm pretty sure they even asked for my blood type and religion! Is this what the form can help with? It lists my last known information on the database before the ID and yellow house book is surrendered?

 

It really was a long winded process to get the pink ID/yellow house book which included getting a notarised copy of my passport and getting it legalised by the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs, etc. Would I have to go through this process again or would the bulk of the previous process be due to the fact that I needed to be registered in the Thai government's system first? Like you said - hopefully I've already done the hard part... I'm not married, so I think this makes everything that little bit harder because I don't have a Thai spouse.

 

To confirm, I'm in my 30s and the pink ID is only valid for 10 years!

 

I've never heard that a yellow house book was needed for PR but I was under the impression that the time spent on a tabien baan gave you a number of "points" towards your application though!

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2 hours ago, Chris4466 said:

So, is it really as simple as finding a new landlord that is willing to go down to the amphur with me with just their blue house book and Thai ID card?

 

Yes.

 

2 hours ago, Chris4466 said:

How would they look me up on the system if I'm supposed to have surrendered the yellow house book and pink ID?

 

The easiest way would be if you had a picture or copy of your previous yellow book or pink ID card or if you know your non-Thai ID number.

 

If you don't have any of that they could check your previous address, but that is going to be quite slow and painful to do, so best advice is to try and help yourself as much as possible.

 

2 hours ago, Chris4466 said:

Would I have to go through this process again...

 

No. This process is to obtain your Non-Thai ID number. Now you have that, it can be changed between yellow books in a few minutes.

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@blackcab, excellent, thank you!

 

On a side note, the reason why I'm looking to move to Surat Thani is to try and see out COVID in a rented villa (8-9 months minimum, then switch to a rolling 1-month).

 

After a few initial enquiries, it seems most are likely foreign-owed but I'm guessing they will be owned by a Thai company with a Thai director. I would need this person to go to the amphur with me?

 

To be honest though, I don't think many owners are going to bother with the hassle so it might be that I wait and re-register when I ultimately return to Bangkok.

 

I'm still not sure why landlords are so against registering a tenant in the house book. I even made some enquires in Bangkok and it was a firm no. Perhaps because I'm foreign and maybe they don't understand the process (I didn't fully until now). But equally it also seems that the majority of Thais that I've asked just stay registered in their parents' blue book in their hometown, even if they're living somewhere else like Bangkok. So maybe landlords aren't even used to doing it for Thais..!

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I forgot to ask and this is one for way down the line..! But on my to-do list, I need to update the spelling of my Thai name. It's already been updated on my work permit and I only had to pay a small fee.

 

Could I do the same with the yellow house book and pink ID by just turning up at the amphur? I guess I would need to go with the house master though.

 

Or would I need to get my passport notarised and update the certified translation, to be stamped by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs first? I'm guessing this type of thing must happen if people get married but I wondered if anyone has experience of a name change? I'm only talking about a spelling correction of my Thai name though because the pronunciation is completely wrong as it currently is. My English name hasn't changed.

 

It's not a big deal but one issue I'd like to fix before I apply for PR at some stage...

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On 5/6/2021 at 3:34 AM, inThailand said:

Keep using your pinky card that is no longer valid. See what happens when they catch up with you. 

Nothing bc it's absolutely useless.

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1 hour ago, Chris4466 said:

I would need this person to go to the amphur with me?

 

You need the house master to go with you. A juristic person cannot be a house master. It may be that there is no house master, in which case it will have to be the owner. If the owner is a juristic person it will have to be one of the directors, although some District Offices will allow the director to send someone in their place with a letter of authority.

 

1 hour ago, Chris4466 said:

I'm still not sure why landlords are so against registering a tenant in the house book.

 

Because it does nothing for the landlord and can create severe problems. I was involved with a property where a Bangkok District Office refused to issue a new blue house book to the owner of the property because the house master wasn't present to authorise it.

 

The house master was the previous owner, who had lost the blue book prior to the property being sold to the new owner. After the sale the previous owner went to live in a forest temple and could not attend the District Office in Bangkok.

 

For the new owner to get a new blue book it took several months and a formal investigation by the District Office. Both the previous owner and the new owner were Thai.

 

People hear about situations like this and they do not want to put themselves at risk when there is nothing in it to benefit them.

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Thanks @blackcab, sounds like a nightmare..!

 

As someone who is listed in the yellow house book (or if you're Thai, in the blue house book) but you're not the house master, what is the worst you can do out of curiosity? I'm genuinely intrigued because it seems like the house master always overrules.

 

The properties I'm looking at aren't exactly cheap in terms of rental on a monthly basis, so it does beg the question, why they immediately reject such a request, especially during these times of COVID, etc when it's not easy to find a tenant willing to pay the full asking price and commit for a reasonable term.

 

In all honesty, my gut feeling is that they don't know anything about the process, so they so no by default. Maybe it's the agent who relays it incorrectly because on one occasion, the agent did come back and told me they'd be happy to submit a TM30 for me. 🤦‍♂️

 

But I guess I'm just doing some digging here to see if I can find a good angle of persuasion for the future 😆 

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8 hours ago, Chris4466 said:

Is this what the form can help with? It lists my last known information on the database before the ID and yellow house book is surrendered?

That's exactly what the form is for.

A new Amphur would issue a new TB and ID card pertaining to your new registered address.

 

7 hours ago, Chris4466 said:

Or would I need to get my passport notarised and update the certified translation, to be stamped by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs first?

No, not if your transferring details of your registration to a different address/Amphur.

 

If you deregister at the old Amphur (removed from database) then yes, no doubt the new Amphur would require translated and legalised copy of your Passport again.

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7 hours ago, Chris4466 said:

I'm still not sure why landlords are so against registering a tenant in the house book

Concur with @blackcab for so many different reasons.

 

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17 hours ago, TigerandDog said:

maybe, maybe not. The only thing it does show is that those amphurs that issue pink ID cards for 8 years don't know the law, and need to be told that it's 10 years when a renewal for an under 60 is required.

Interesting, but have you considered perhaps the Amphurs issuing 10 year ID cards are the non compliant party?

 

According to my wife the law was changed many years ago.

As with everything in Thailand changes are never made to the original, but separate amendments are issued to the laws. No where is that more evident to a foreigner than with Immigration.

She suggests that in fact the Amphurs still issuing a 10 year ID card are the one's not complying with the new requirements.

 

Regardless, it is what it is in Thailand.

Of course as with the issue of new ID cards (and driving licences), it's merely to update with a new photo so the resemblance remains similar, unless your changing to a new registered address.

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16 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I think it depends on if you apply after your birthday or not. I got my Thai (blue) ID 1 month after my birthday and got 8 years plus 11 months. 

we're discussing the duration of PINK ID cards not blue.

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2 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

we're discussing the duration of PINK ID cards not blue.

It should be the same duration regardless.

Both Thai and ID cards for foreigners are issued under the Civil Registration Act.

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15 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Interesting, but have you considered perhaps the Amphurs issuing 10 year ID cards are the non compliant party?

 

According to my wife the law was changed many years ago.

As with everything in Thailand changes are never made to the original, but separate amendments are issued to the laws. No where is that more evident to a foreigner than with Immigration.

She suggests that in fact the Amphurs still issuing a 10 year ID card are the one's not complying with the new requirements.

 

Regardless, it is what it is in Thailand.

Of course as with the issue of new ID cards (and driving licences), it's merely to update with a new photo so the resemblance remains similar, unless your changing to a new registered address.

The law with regards to PINK ID cards has not changed, it is STILL 10 years for those under 60. I even posted links to 2 online law companies ( both posted within the past 2 years ) and they BOTH clearly state 10 years duration. EVERY Google search I've looked at, and again only posts within the last 2 years, ALL say 10 years for PINK ID cards. The change that your wife is referring to is most likely for the Thai BLUE ID card. My wife's previous BLUE ID card was actually for 6 years, now it is for 8 years.

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